Reco writes:
> Hi.
>
> On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 20:34:28 +0200
> lee wrote:
>
>> > My biggest problem is I can't yet get qemu to run Debian or Ubuntu VMs
>> > on OpenBSD, for those few programs that don't run on OpenBSD.
>>
>> And you can't use xen?
>
> You're probably mistook NetBSD (which can ser
Hi.
On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 20:34:28 +0200
lee wrote:
> > My biggest problem is I can't yet get qemu to run Debian or Ubuntu VMs
> > on OpenBSD, for those few programs that don't run on OpenBSD.
>
> And you can't use xen?
You're probably mistook NetBSD (which can serve as dom0 for xen) with
OpenB
Steve Litt writes:
> On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 15:11:50 +0200
> lee wrote:
>
>> Martin Read writes:
>>
>> > On 13/09/14 20:54, lee wrote:
>> >> Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without
>> >> systemd" means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> > The b
Steve Litt writes:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 00:24:10 +0200
> lee wrote:
>
>> Steve Litt writes:
>>
>
>> And who knows what kind of problems you run into when you switch to
>> some BSD. Are there NVIDIA drivers for some BSD? Is everything I'm
>> using now available for some BSD?
>
> My biggest p
On Tue, 16 Sep 2014 00:24:10 +0200
lee wrote:
> Steve Litt writes:
>
> And who knows what kind of problems you run into when you switch to
> some BSD. Are there NVIDIA drivers for some BSD? Is everything I'm
> using now available for some BSD?
My biggest problem is I can't yet get qemu to r
Lisi Reisz writes:
> On Saturday 13 September 2014 21:46:31 lee wrote:
>> You users, and the community members,
>> whoever they are, need to speak as well.
>
> Perhaps, just perhaps, many of them don't agree.
Well, I've now seen two people speaking up in response, and 0% of them
spoke in favour
Steve Litt writes:
> On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 21:54:56 +0200
> lee wrote:
>>
>> Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without systemd"
>> means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
>
> But in answer to your question, my official answer is "I don't know."
> Now I'll give you a gu
On 13/09/14 22:46, lee wrote:
I'd be happy to see some support. I cannot speak for "the users" or for
"the free software community". You users, and the community members,
whoever they are, need to speak as well.
OK, so I'll "speak as well". :-)
But first of all I'd like to thank you and some
On 9/15/2014 3:27 AM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Sunday 14 September 2014 19:42:40 Steve Litt wrote:
>> Every time you tell one of us to keep silent, three more of us speak
>> up. I don't know whether we're a minority, but if you and your cohorts
>> keep shushing us, we just might be the majority prett
On 09/15/2014 03:27 AM, Lisi Reisz wrote:
On Sunday 14 September 2014 19:42:40 Steve Litt wrote:
Every time you tell one of us to keep silent, three more of us speak
up. I don't know whether we're a minority, but if you and your cohorts
keep shushing us, we just might be the majority pretty soon
Ahoj,
Dňa Sat, 13 Sep 2014 13:46:51 -0300 Andre N Batista
napísal:
> The way I see it, there is a large amount of doubt on who's
> insterested in systemd and there is no doubt that many users are
> being forced into using it and, according to your recent post on the
> subject, those users have c
Ahoj,
Dňa Sat, 13 Sep 2014 21:46:43 +0200 lee napísal:
> Slavko writes:
>
> > BTW, if someone is interested in, while this investigation i
> > generated graphs of dependencies on some systemd packages on my
> > system, they will be accessible for some time here:
> >
> > http://anfo.slavino.sk/
On Sunday 14 September 2014 19:42:40 Steve Litt wrote:
> Every time you tell one of us to keep silent, three more of us speak
> up. I don't know whether we're a minority, but if you and your cohorts
> keep shushing us, we just might be the majority pretty soon.
I wasn't telling anyone to keep sile
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 16:06:35 -0400
Doug wrote:
> On 09/14/2014 01:00 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
> > By the way, if you wonder why I'm being so hard on KDE, these three
> > articles explain:
> >
> > http://troubleshooters.com/lpm/201202/201202.htm#_editors_desk
>
> I didn't read any further than this
On 09/14/2014 01:00 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 21:54:56 +0200
lee wrote:
Steve Litt writes:
/snip/
Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without systemd"
means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
LOL, If I were the kinda guy who used KDE, I'd *love*
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 17:22:16 +0100
Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Saturday 13 September 2014 21:46:31 lee wrote:
> > I'd be happy to see some support. I cannot speak for "the users"
> > or for "the free software community".
>
> No, you can't.
>
> > You users, and the community members,
> > whoever t
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 11:52:24 -0400 (EDT)
david...@ling.ohio-state.edu wrote:
> On Sun, 14 Sep 2014, B wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 22:46:31 +0200
> > lee wrote:
> > All interesting things you said, plus a bunch of other readings
> > confort me in my first impression: Linux was becoming t
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 15:11:50 +0200
lee wrote:
> Martin Read writes:
>
> > On 13/09/14 20:54, lee wrote:
> >> Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without
> >> systemd" means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > The best place to ask would be the user
On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 21:54:56 +0200
lee wrote:
> Steve Litt writes:
>
> > When Jessie goes stable, I'm actually going to try Jessie to see
> > whether it will work reasonably, and if so I'll hold my nose and
> > use the monolithic entanglement.
>
> FWIW, I can tell you that it works for Fedora.
On Saturday 13 September 2014 21:46:31 lee wrote:
> I'd be happy to see some support. I cannot speak for "the users" or for
> "the free software community".
No, you can't.
> You users, and the community members,
> whoever they are, need to speak as well.
Perhaps, just perhaps, many of them do
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014 11:52:24 -0400 (EDT)
david...@ling.ohio-state.edu wrote:
> for those unfamiliar with the french figurative use of the term gas
> refinery ("usine à gaz"):
>
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rube_Goldberg_machine#Similar_expressions_worldwide
Oops, thanks Wes; I sometimes
On Sun, 14 Sep 2014, B wrote:
On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 22:46:31 +0200
lee wrote:
All interesting things you said, plus a bunch of other readings
confort me in my first impression: Linux was becoming too much
secured for the taste of agencies (and which better candidate
than a gas plant
for tho
Martin Read writes:
> On 13/09/14 20:54, lee wrote:
>> Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without systemd"
>> means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
>
> [...]
>
> The best place to ask would be the user community discussion spaces
> (mailing lists / web forums / IRC ch
On 13/09/14 20:54, lee wrote:
Can you have, say, KDE on Gentoo without systemd? "Without systemd"
means *all* of systemd, like systemd-login0 etc..
Many components of the KDE Software Collection have no identifiable
dependency on systemd's support libraries. (Indeed, a significant
fraction o
On Sat, 13 Sep 2014 22:46:31 +0200
lee wrote:
All interesting things you said, plus a bunch of other readings
confort me in my first impression: Linux was becoming too much
secured for the taste of agencies (and which better candidate
than a gas plant that hammers its looong claws down to… dbus,
Slavko writes:
> BTW, if someone is interested in, while this investigation i generated
> graphs of dependencies on some systemd packages on my system, they
> will be accessible for some time here:
>
> http://anfo.slavino.sk/libpam-systemd.png
> http://anfo.slavino.sk/libsystemd-daemon0.png
> htt
Steve Litt writes:
> When Jessie goes stable, I'm actually going to try Jessie to see whether
> it will work reasonably, and if so I'll hold my nose and use the
> monolithic entanglement.
FWIW, I can tell you that it works for Fedora. So with a new
installation, it can potentially work for Debi
Slavko writes:
> Ahoj,
>
> Dňa Thu, 11 Sep 2014 20:15:59 +0200 lee napísal:
>
>> Supporting systemd violates Debians' social contract.
>
> Can you be more verbose about this, please? Why? How? By what?
I'm finding it pretty obvious. The social contract says:
"Our priorities are our users an
On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 07:52:28PM +0200, Slavko wrote:
> Ahoj,
>
> Dňa Thu, 11 Sep 2014 20:15:59 +0200 lee napísal:
>
> > Supporting systemd violates Debians' social contract.
>
> Can you be more verbose about this, please? Why? How? By what?
>
Item 4 says: "We will be guided by the needs o
Ahoj,
Dňa Thu, 11 Sep 2014 20:15:59 +0200 lee napísal:
> Supporting systemd violates Debians' social contract.
Can you be more verbose about this, please? Why? How? By what?
regards
--
Slavko
http://slavino.sk
signature.asc
Description: PGP signature
On Thu, Sep 11, 2014 at 08:15:59PM +0200, lee wrote:
>
> Supporting systemd violates Debians' social contract.
Hogwash!!
> Has this bug report already been filed?
https://www.debian.org/Bugs/
--
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, an
On Thu, 11 Sep 2014 18:45:10 +0200
Slavko wrote:
> Ahoj,
>
> Dňa Mon, 08 Sep 2014 13:14:01 +0100 Martin Read
> napísal:
>
> > Some components of XFCE have a hard dependency on dbus (and this is
> > conceptually legitimate). dbus has a build-time-optional dependency
> > on libsystemd-login, an
Slavko wrote:
> Ahoj,
>
> Dňa Thu, 11 Sep 2014 18:45:10 +0200 Slavko napísal:
>
> > I did small investigation. The dbus seems only a half of problem,
> > because there is the same dependency in the libpulse0 (no, i don't use
> > pulse audio, but dependencies...) and a lot of my applications
> >
Chris Bannister writes:
> On Tue, Sep 09, 2014 at 09:21:57PM +0200, lee wrote:
>> John Hasler writes:
>>
>> > It appears that there is a good chance that the "upgrade" to Systemd
>> > when upgrading to Jessie will not be automatic (or at least not silent).
>>
>> I would be majorly pissed if a
Ahoj,
Dňa Thu, 11 Sep 2014 18:45:10 +0200 Slavko napísal:
> I did small investigation. The dbus seems only a half of problem,
> because there is the same dependency in the libpulse0 (no, i don't use
> pulse audio, but dependencies...) and a lot of my applications
> depends on it. I am afraid, th
Ahoj,
Dňa Mon, 08 Sep 2014 13:14:01 +0100 Martin Read
napísal:
> Some components of XFCE have a hard dependency on dbus (and this is
> conceptually legitimate). dbus has a build-time-optional dependency
> on libsystemd-login, and a quick experimental check on my system
> confirms that the most
On Tue, Sep 09, 2014 at 09:21:57PM +0200, lee wrote:
> John Hasler writes:
>
> > It appears that there is a good chance that the "upgrade" to Systemd
> > when upgrading to Jessie will not be automatic (or at least not silent).
>
> I would be majorly pissed if a distribution upgrade would force m
Martin Read writes:
> On 08/09/14 22:46, lee wrote:
> [proposed social-contract bug against general]
>> That's the bug report we need to file, accompanied by a detailed list of
>> the reasons. The most likely outcome would be that we are being banned.
>
> There is at least one member of the tech
John Hasler writes:
> It appears that there is a good chance that the "upgrade" to Systemd
> when upgrading to Jessie will not be automatic (or at least not silent).
I would be majorly pissed if a distribution upgrade would force me to
suddenly use systemd and not give me a choice.
Besides, how
The Wanderer writes:
> On 09/08/2014 at 05:46 PM, lee wrote:
>
>> Rob Owens writes:
>>
>>> I'm smart enough to understand that a desktop environment (or a
>>> cd burner) depending on a particular init system doesn't make
>>> sense. But I have not yet figured out which package to file a bug
>>>
Ahoj,
Dňa Mon, 08 Sep 2014 23:31:25 +0100 Martin Read
napísal:
> Part of the underlying problem is that systemd-logind >= 205,
> delivered in Debian as part of the systemd binary package, relies on
> calls to a dbus interface of systemd in order to perform operations
> that systemd-logind < 204
Ahoj,
Dňa Tue, 09 Sep 2014 08:35:48 -0500 John Hasler
napísal:
> After reading some (extensive and very heated) discussions on
> debian-devel I've changed my mind. File the bugs directly against
> Systemd whenever justifiable.
Please, can you point me? Or provide (really very) short descripti
lee writes:
> It would seem kinda logical to file the bug against the cd-burning
> software because it depends on an init system.
>
> However, this is probably a more general issue in that a yet
> unknown amount of packages suddenly somehow depends on a particular
> init system. So it would seem
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On 09/08/2014 at 05:46 PM, lee wrote:
> Rob Owens writes:
>
>> I'm smart enough to understand that a desktop environment (or a
>> cd burner) depending on a particular init system doesn't make
>> sense. But I have not yet figured out which package
lee writes:
> That's the bug report we need to file, accompanied by a detailed list
> of the reasons. The most likely outcome would be that we are being
> banned.
Your bug might be closed but you won't be "banned".
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email t
On 08/09/14 22:46, lee wrote:
It would seem kinda logical to file the bug against the cd-burning
software because it depends on an init system.
Sort of. It's perfectly reasonable for brasero to Depends: gvfs
(brasero's part of GNOME and gvfs is the "standard" way for GNOME
applications to acc
Rob Owens writes:
> I'm smart enough to understand that a desktop environment (or a cd burner)
> depending on a particular init system doesn't make sense. But I have
> not yet figured out which package to file a bug with. I suspect the package
> maintainers are smart enough to realize this as
On Mon, Sep 08, 2014 at 03:47:50PM -0500, John Hasler wrote:
> Rob Owens writes:
> > I agree with you that this is a bug. But it is not simple to assign
> > this to a particular package. It's a bug which is the result of the
> > relations between many packages. But in order to get it fixed, we'r
Rob Owens writes:
> I agree with you that this is a bug. But it is not simple to assign
> this to a particular package. It's a bug which is the result of the
> relations between many packages. But in order to get it fixed, we're
> going to have to file a bug *somewhere*.
Make your best guess an
On Mon, Sep 08, 2014 at 01:21:49AM +0200, lee wrote:
>
> A "desktop system" is merely a "desktop system", and an init system is
> merely an init system. It is a bug when a "desktop system" like xfce
> depends on a particular init system, or parts thereof, no matter if
> directly or indirectly, es
Martin Read writes:
> On 08/09/14 15:51, lee wrote:
>> If the problem is so easy to solve as you describe, i. e. by compiling
>> software appropriately, it boils down to that Debian would have to have
>> different versions of packages, compiled with appropriate options, which
>> are picked from d
On 08/09/14 15:51, lee wrote:
If the problem is so easy to solve as you describe, i. e. by compiling
software appropriately, it boils down to that Debian would have to have
different versions of packages, compiled with appropriate options, which
are picked from depending on which init system the
Ahoj,
Dňa Mon, 08 Sep 2014 13:14:01 +0100 Martin Read
napísal:
> Perhaps you should consider this option.
>
> (This is where I mention that Debian's binary packages of the Xorg X
> server Depends: udev, and that the udev in Debian is the udev
> maintained by the systemd maintainers in the syst
Martin Read writes:
> [...]
> Perhaps you should investigate this approach in more detail; you seem
> to have a legitimate and praiseworthy requirement for a higher level
> of control over what runs on your system than a binary distribution
> can realistically provide.
If the problem is so easy
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On 09/08/2014 at 08:14 AM, Martin Read wrote:
> On 08/09/14 00:21, lee wrote:
>> On the Debian VM, it says that dbus depends on
>> libsystemd-login0, so how could I remove that without having to
>> remove xfce?
>
> You can't.
Well, you could 'apt
On 08/09/14 00:21, lee wrote:
I don't have gnome-settings-daemon installed on Fedora, which uses
systemd.
Indeed; on Fedora, systemd is IIRC the *only* init system.
On the Debian VM, it says that dbus depends on libsystemd-login0, so how
could I remove that without having to remove xfce?
Yo
2014/09/08 9:19 "John Hasler" :
>
> The Wanderer writes:
> > "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach,
> > teach gym"
>
> "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach
> teachers"
It was a PE teacher from whom I first heard that neo-proverb.
It
The Wanderer writes:
> "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach,
> teach gym"
"Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach
teachers"
We're gonna get flamed for being off-topic...
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
--
To UNS
Martin Read writes:
> On 07/09/14 18:31, lee wrote:
>> As to console-kit, it was awful in that it might create a ridiculous
>> number of processes, and I used to disable it because I never needed
>> it. Can you disable logind?
>
> If you don't need anything that depends on gnome-settings-daemon,
Steve Litt writes:
> On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 19:01:11 +0100
> Martin Read wrote:
>
>> If you aren't using a GUI, or your choice of GUI on Debian uses a
>> traditional window manager (and doesn't use gdm3 or lightdm as its X
>> display manager if it even has one) rather than being one of the
>> "d
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On 09/07/2014 at 06:38 PM, Steve Litt wrote:
> On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 16:10:47 -0500 John Hasler
> wrote:
>
>> Patrick Bartek writes:
>>> Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
>>
>> Those who fail to learn from history doom t
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 16:10:47 -0500
John Hasler wrote:
> Patrick Bartek writes:
> > Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
>
> Those who fail to learn from history doom the rest of us to repeat it.
Those who fail history are doomed to become engineers or cab drivers.
Stev
Patrick Bartek writes:
> Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
Those who fail to learn from history doom the rest of us to repeat it.
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org
with a subject of
On Sunday 07 September 2014 20:14:36 Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Sun, 07 Sep 2014, Chris Bannister wrote:
> > On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > > will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014, Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
>
> "Silence is golden."
> "Better to remain silent and be thoug
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 19:01:11 +0100
Martin Read wrote:
> If you aren't using a GUI, or your choice of GUI on Debian uses a
> traditional window manager (and doesn't use gdm3 or lightdm as its X
> display manager if it even has one) rather than being one of the
> "desktop environments",
My rese
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 08:57:30 -0700
Carl Johnson wrote:
> Steve Litt writes:
>
> > On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 09:31:46 +0200
> > Sven Joachim wrote:
> >
> >> > The concept of free software has become a myth :(
> >>
> >> There is always Gentoo if libraries you consider useless bother
> >> you. Binary
On 07/09/14 18:31, lee wrote:
As to console-kit, it was awful in that it might create a ridiculous
number of processes, and I used to disable it because I never needed
it. Can you disable logind?
If you don't need anything that depends on gnome-settings-daemon,
libpam-systemd, lighttpd, live-
Sven Joachim writes:
> On 2014-09-07 02:30 +0200, lee wrote:
>
>> Slavko writes:
>>
>>> Ahoj,
>>>
>>> Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee napísal:
>>>
Doug writes:
> It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
Debian has decided to feature severa
Slavko writes:
> AFAIK, the logind is replacement for consolekit and this dependecy can
> be good, when the logind will be able to work without systemd and with
> the cmanager- but it is not working yet.
How can it be good when your system depends on something you don't want
to have on your syst
Steve Litt writes:
> On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 09:31:46 +0200
> Sven Joachim wrote:
>
>> > The concept of free software has become a myth :(
>>
>> There is always Gentoo if libraries you consider useless bother you.
>> Binary distributions tend to enable all possibly useful features.
>>
>> Cheers,
>
Ahoj,
Dňa Sun, 07 Sep 2014 02:30:42 +0200 lee napísal:
> Slavko writes:
>
> > Ahoj,
> >
> > Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee
> > napísal:
> >
> >> Doug writes:
> >>
> >> > It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
> >>
> >> Debian has decided to feature several in
Ahoj,
Dňa Sun, 7 Sep 2014 21:12:47 +1200 Chris Bannister
napísal:
> On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
>
> "Silence is golden."
Not always, on
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 08:35:55 -0500
John Hasler wrote:
> Joe writes:
> > Sometimes it is the fool who points out that the Emperor has no
> > clothes...
>
> Chris writes:
> > Or a wise tailor?
>
> The wise tailor siezes the opportunity to get in on the ground floor
> in the imaginary clothing mar
On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 12:01:54 +0100
Joe wrote:
> On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 21:12:47 +1200
> Chris Bannister wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance
> > > someone will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014 09:31:46 +0200
Sven Joachim wrote:
> > The concept of free software has become a myth :(
>
> There is always Gentoo if libraries you consider useless bother you.
> Binary distributions tend to enable all possibly useful features.
>
> Cheers,
>Sven
Gentoo isn't the o
On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 21:12:47 +1200
Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
>
> "Silence is golden."
> "Better to remain silen
Joe writes:
> Sometimes it is the fool who points out that the Emperor has no
> clothes...
Chris writes:
> Or a wise tailor?
The wise tailor siezes the opportunity to get in on the ground floor in
the imaginary clothing market.
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
--
To UNSUBSC
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On 09/07/2014 at 01:27 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> Well, Jessie is a long way from being Stable. (Some say next
> May.)
But the "release freeze" date isn't nearly as far away; it was announced
a long time ago as being, IIRC, November 5th, and I th
On Sun, Sep 07, 2014 at 12:01:54PM +0100, Joe wrote:
> On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 21:12:47 +1200
> Chris Bannister wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > > will hear. The squeaky wheel get
On Sun, 7 Sep 2014 21:12:47 +1200
Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> > will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
>
> "Silence is golden."
> "Better to remain silen
On Sat, Sep 06, 2014 at 10:27:58PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> it will be the only. The more noise made, the better chance someone
> will hear. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
"Silence is golden."
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and
remove all doubt."
--
"
On 2014-09-07 02:30 +0200, lee wrote:
> Slavko writes:
>
>> Ahoj,
>>
>> Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee napísal:
>>
>>> Doug writes:
>>>
>>> > It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
>>>
>>> Debian has decided to feature several init systems, so any dependency
>>>
On Sun, 07 Sep 2014, lee wrote:
> Slavko writes:
>
> > Ahoj,
> >
> > Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee
> > napísal:
> >
> >> Doug writes:
> >>
> >> > It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
> >>
> >> Debian has decided to feature several init systems, so any
> >> d
Slavko writes:
> Ahoj,
>
> Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee napísal:
>
>> Doug writes:
>>
>> > It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
>>
>> Debian has decided to feature several init systems, so any dependency
>> on an init system you're not using because you're u
Ahoj,
Dňa Sat, 06 Sep 2014 02:08:47 +0200 lee napísal:
> Doug writes:
>
> > It didn't need systemd before, so why should it need it now?
>
> Debian has decided to feature several init systems, so any dependency
> on an init system you're not using because you're using another one
> is a bug t
Doug writes:
> On 09/02/2014 07:35 PM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
>> On Tue, 02 Sep 2014, Rob Owens wrote:
>>
>>> - Original Message -
From: "Michael Biebl"
Am 02.09.2014 22:18, schrieb Rob Owens:
> I removed the systemd package from my Jessie system, and it took
> bras
On Thu, 4 Sep 2014 12:06:29 -0300
Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
> https://lwn.net/Articles/405346/
> https://lwn.net/Articles/484203/
> https://lwn.net/Articles/580194/
> https://lwn.net/Articles/537017/
> https://lwn.net/Articles/551969/
Thanks for these very interesting links.
> Be sure
On Thu, 4 Sep 2014 02:42:33 +0200
B wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Sep 2014 09:26:48 +0900
> Joel Rees wrote:
>
> [SNIP]
>
> So, where is the solution then?
Bzzz, what I'm about to say is a genuine question, not a snide remark:
What's the problem needing a solution?
I would guess the problem is pro
On Wed, 3 Sep 2014 21:38:47 +0100
Jonathan Dowland wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 03:54:06AM +0200, B wrote:
> > Hehe, because it sinks his claws deep and everywhere (it also
> > plans to implant dbus _into_ the kernel (WTF? A kernel is
> > here to kernelling and nothing else AFAIK),
>
>
On Thu, 04 Sep 2014, Joel Rees wrote:
> dbus/kdbus is actually another case of re-inventing bad solutions, and
> getting things more wrong the second time.
>
> Admitted, it's often better to do something not-quite-right than do nothing
> at all, but forgetting that there is a better way is not a g
- Original Message -
> From: "Martin Read"
>
> On 03/09/14 15:40, Rob Owens wrote:
> > xfburn is apparently aware that my cd drive is currently empty. Does
> > anybody know what it uses to detect this? It is not using gvfs.
>
> Looking up xfburn in aptitude's interactive interface, I s
On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 9:46 PM, Jonathan Dowland wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 04, 2014 at 08:03:29PM +0900, Joel Rees wrote:
>> Where? indeed.
>> What problem are we trying to solve with dbus and kdbus?
>
> I think Bzzz interpreted your assurance that dbus and kdbus were bad fits for
> 'the problem' as im
On Thu, Sep 04, 2014 at 08:03:29PM +0900, Joel Rees wrote:
> Where? indeed.
> What problem are we trying to solve with dbus and kdbus?
I think Bzzz interpreted your assurance that dbus and kdbus were bad fits for
'the problem' as implying you were aware of what was a better fit. He's clearly
quite
2014/09/04 9:43 "B" :
>
> On Thu, 4 Sep 2014 09:26:48 +0900
> Joel Rees wrote:
>
> [SNIP]
>
> So, where is the solution then?
Where? indeed.
What problem are we trying to solve with dbus and kdbus?
Joel Rees
Computer memory is just fancy paper,
CPUs just fancy pens.
All is a stream of text
On Thu, 4 Sep 2014 09:26:48 +0900
Joel Rees wrote:
[SNIP]
So, where is the solution then?
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2014/09/04 6:02 "B" :
>
> On Wed, 3 Sep 2014 21:38:47 +0100
> Jonathan Dowland wrote:
>
> Thanks for your very clear explanation, Jonathan.
>
> > kernel support is pretty much essential to improve the performance of
> > dbus. Lots of data is being passed over dbus by apps nowadays, and
> > bec
On Wed, 3 Sep 2014 21:38:47 +0100
Jonathan Dowland wrote:
Thanks for your very clear explanation, Jonathan.
> kernel support is pretty much essential to improve the performance of
> dbus. Lots of data is being passed over dbus by apps nowadays, and
> because it's an entirely userspace solution t
On 03/09/14 15:40, Rob Owens wrote:
xfburn is apparently aware that my cd drive is currently empty. Does anybody
know what it uses to detect this? It is not using gvfs.
Looking up xfburn in aptitude's interactive interface, I see that xfburn
Depends: libgudev-1.0-0, which is a GObject-based
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 03:54:06AM +0200, B wrote:
> Hehe, because it sinks his claws deep and everywhere (it also
> plans to implant dbus _into_ the kernel (WTF? A kernel is
> here to kernelling and nothing else AFAIK),
Plans to move bits of dbus into the kernel predate systemd. The first s
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