-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 On 09/08/2014 at 08:14 AM, Martin Read wrote:
> On 08/09/14 00:21, lee wrote: >> On the Debian VM, it says that dbus depends on >> libsystemd-login0, so how could I remove that without having to >> remove xfce? > > You can't. Well, you could 'apt-get source' the package which declares the dependency, modify it to build without that dependency, remove the declaration from the package's control file(s), build the package, and install the locally-built package - but then you'd have to keep up with updating it every time a new version came out in Debian, which would be a royal pain. (I know - I've tried it, with other software, once or twice. It never worked well, or for very long.) > And thus, you see the central tradeoff of binary vs. source > distributions. In a binary distribution, the pain entailed in > coping with combinatorial explosion means that even if a program > *does* have a build system which allows extensive changes to which > features get built into it, the distribution will probably only > provide one configuration (typically, the most featureful, since > "why does this depend on $LIBRARY_I_HATE?" is a rarer complaint > than "why does this exclude 75% of the featureset?") out of the > myriad possible configurations. > > In a source distribution, the end user has the freedom to configure > their builds how they please. On the other hand, they need a much > more extensive understanding of their system, and they have to > devote more labour and computational resources to building their > system. > > Perhaps you should consider this option. <snip> >> This bug just shows again how systemd is taking everything over, >> which is a bad thing. Systemd has become a single piece of >> software for a very limited purpose without which more and more >> totally unrelated software for totally different purposes isn't >> going to work anymore. That's like you're required to have, >> let's say, MS Windows installed on your hardware to be able to >> use it. >> >> Others have said this before. I finally realise what they mean. >> Why aren't all distributions standing up against this but >> instead embrace it? > > Last time I looked, systemd was not the default init system in > Gentoo. I believe that they even facilitate the use of alternative > /dev managers in place of systemd-udevd. > > Perhaps you should investigate this approach in more detail; you > seem to have a legitimate and praiseworthy requirement for a higher > level of control over what runs on your system than a binary > distribution can realistically provide. I've been running Debian since I first switched from Windows (98SE) to Linux, I think sometime around 2001. (I actually thought it was earlier, but I remember 2001/09/11 happening while I lived in a place before the place where I lived when I switched to Linux.) In all that time, I've never seriously considered running a different distribution. I've tried out a couple for one reason or another (including work purposes), but never seen enough relative advantages to potentially justify a switch, although Gentoo always seemed interesting. I am now seriously considering switching to Gentoo. I will at the very least be building a Gentoo machine to try out its current incarnation, and see what the differences and/or downsides may be for myself. The systemd transition - and specifically the dependencies involved, and the attitudes of the maintainers towards those dependencies - are pretty much the entire reason. I even *like* what systemd is apparently capable of doing, in terms of practical results. I just don't like its design, or its project philosophy, or the attitudes (in terms of relation to other software, and in a few cases to other people) of its developers. With a few relatively fundamental changes relatively near to the core of the systemd project, 99% or more of its problems could be eliminated, and I'd probably be not only willing but glad to use it. But the odds of those changes being made - at all, much less just because someone asks for them - are so slim as to be virtually nonexistent. - -- The Wanderer Secrecy is the beginning of tyranny. A government exists to serve its citizens, not to control them. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJUDaDjAAoJEASpNY00KDJrfmAP/0Nohndq+VhV68ePzTrhXWy+ WIZaHuFAJeAS+iHbLAvxz5dAF1mByLVfNYV2ZDJhB03ERgSfVjyQwkunGbf78J1a A7KSK7TkD4cODQhAuDxSOYpufr6xXt9aD2JGTGETBFZOxRylTUyfhZglgT9q39cF hWPzqKWY+eNvt477ffXz1FIGzrq0AF9vgfesqsLQMiXXImD5tKJMttIzg0++jwLc eqyGKntBT5uda2H5tH2NHghGc4K7kk+6WGRcvfhmgOro0bONuF8vV2Txc2ETt6z/ uSCFuwnkAfhlAFrdTY08uzC/Sb6FDQAIAKHz9VdH3vAw7Lr41ncz03aSC+QBarQ9 9nb7U8rRzmO7jm7zT+bc0hSgKyi+lQUVZysgmt4j6PkkzJ5kKcb5vLS6FlOUyIFc nWIPGTjwmKGA7CI3PcckrVfOVoh7nQDFJQDPl8nEHM1x+McDTNmx3/t9Q0MWnfGl ygWT4FGuXDzt4oifdwI7pYeETQzSdTC3n/QUz4RuBH3JU+3BasDxXEixh2XcFDzC gA+zRSfq3DBbcQBlsDXBqc5EFPit8j2z2IEe8kk7RSKki+h5K6feI6fWYCsPaLqp E8ElVoMebMiYRRWoiTqeDnTSaAhvg0Idf0IaJns0FhvbXA2WjpzFyLMOzPmUDX9o xnkDQoukt9FSKIvjHqZy =u4mh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/540da0e3.3050...@fastmail.fm
