Re: idea for project machines

2006-03-26 Thread Laszlo Boszormenyi 
On Sun, 2006-03-26 at 00:48 -0500, Steve M. Robbins wrote:
> Laszlo said:
> >  I was in this situation some time already. But it isn't a solution to
> > get sudo apt-get install rights. Someone who may have a build-conflict
> > with your build-depends won't be happy if you install that package(s).
> > Also your build-depends may conflict with others build-depends and those
> > would be removed. Again a someone is not happy situation.
> 
> All true.  But the current situation is similar.
 Not really, you miss a couple of points.

>   I may ask
> Mr. build-machine-admin to install package X that conflicts with
> package Y that someone else needs.  If Mr. admin is not aware
> that Y is currently in use, someone is unhappy.
 Would be true, but Mr. admin has his rights to check if the other user
is building his/her package or not. Mr. admin can even remember that
other user asked for these build-depends less than a week ago, so he can
choose to install your conflicting build-depends on an other buildd if
other is availble for that arch. Mr. admin can even make his decision on
the other user's dir contents. Does s/he still have that source package
under his/her account that needed the previous build-depends? If yes,
how long is it untouched by now? You won't know who installed those
build-dependencies and when or is it still needed or not.

> My suspicion is that this won't happen often enough to worry about.
 OK, I ACK that your way may be better for us. Let's try it on less used
arch and see if Mr. admin agrees.

Cheers,
Laszlo/GCS


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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Peter Samuelson 

> On Tue, Mar 21, 2006 at 07:08:02AM +0100, Christian Perrier wrote:
> > Well, I have one very little argument against doing so: why do it
> > for Dzongkha and why not do it for, say, French...:-)

[Lionel Elie Mamane]
> Because "French" is the adjective in English (the language the
> package description is written in) for "from France". The same, I
> would not expect it to be done if the language were called
> "Bhutanese".

OTOH, if you have no idea what language or what country the font
pertains to, why would you want that font?  I think a good default
assumption when reading package descriptions is "If you don't have any
idea what this is, you don't need it."  Package descriptions should be
written so that people who would want the package will understand them;
for the rest of the world, it's nice to have some idea what the package
is, but it's much less important.  In the present case, communicating
that this is a font for some specific language (which a person may
never have heard of) seems sufficient.


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Re: idea for project machines

2006-03-26 Thread Reinhard Tartler 
>> Create a new custom chroot with the packages preinstalled on demand.
> Sounds like a use-case for combining pbuilder and cowdancer (or lvm
> snapshots). No time-consuming tarball extraction, disk usage is reduced
> and the original chroot is untouched.

Or just plain schroot on lvm snapshots. It even has some functionality
of sudo to grad specific users administrative priviledges in the chroots.

Greetings,
Reinhard



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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Lars Wirzenius 
su, 2006-03-26 kello 04:11 -0600, Peter Samuelson kirjoitti:
> > On Tue, Mar 21, 2006 at 07:08:02AM +0100, Christian Perrier wrote:
> > > Well, I have one very little argument against doing so: why do it
> > > for Dzongkha and why not do it for, say, French...:-)
> 
> [Lionel Elie Mamane]
> > Because "French" is the adjective in English (the language the
> > package description is written in) for "from France". The same, I
> > would not expect it to be done if the language were called
> > "Bhutanese".
> 
> OTOH, if you have no idea what language or what country the font
> pertains to, why would you want that font?

It is not inconceivable that one could stumble on a document from
Bhutan, and want to install a font to be able to view it. It is a bit
more convenient to be able to find the correct package by only having to
search for "Bhutan", and not have to know that the language is
"Dzongkha".

This is not what I would call a common use case, but it exists. I've
been in the situation once searching for a "Russian" font, when I
should've been looking for a "Cyrillic" font, for example. I should've
known better, but sometimes it is difficult to come up with the right
search terms even when you supposedly know the right ones.

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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread David Weinehall 
On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 02:02:43PM +0300, Lars Wirzenius wrote:
> su, 2006-03-26 kello 04:11 -0600, Peter Samuelson kirjoitti:
> > > On Tue, Mar 21, 2006 at 07:08:02AM +0100, Christian Perrier wrote:
> > > > Well, I have one very little argument against doing so: why do it
> > > > for Dzongkha and why not do it for, say, French...:-)
> > 
> > [Lionel Elie Mamane]
> > > Because "French" is the adjective in English (the language the
> > > package description is written in) for "from France". The same, I
> > > would not expect it to be done if the language were called
> > > "Bhutanese".
> > 
> > OTOH, if you have no idea what language or what country the font
> > pertains to, why would you want that font?
> 
> It is not inconceivable that one could stumble on a document from
> Bhutan, and want to install a font to be able to view it. It is a bit
> more convenient to be able to find the correct package by only having to
> search for "Bhutan", and not have to know that the language is
> "Dzongkha".
> 
> This is not what I would call a common use case, but it exists. I've
> been in the situation once searching for a "Russian" font, when I
> should've been looking for a "Cyrillic" font, for example. I should've
> known better, but sometimes it is difficult to come up with the right
> search terms even when you supposedly know the right ones.

Wouldn't it be enough to have something like

"Dzongkha, a language spoken in Bhutan" in the long package description?
apt-cache search will pick that up.


regards: David
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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Lars Wirzenius 
su, 2006-03-26 kello 13:19 +0200, David Weinehall kirjoitti:
> On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 02:02:43PM +0300, Lars Wirzenius wrote:
> > This is not what I would call a common use case, but it exists. I've
> > been in the situation once searching for a "Russian" font, when I
> > should've been looking for a "Cyrillic" font, for example. I should've
> > known better, but sometimes it is difficult to come up with the right
> > search terms even when you supposedly know the right ones.
> 
> Wouldn't it be enough to have something like
> 
> "Dzongkha, a language spoken in Bhutan" in the long package description?
> apt-cache search will pick that up.

Yes, that would be enough, and that is what was suggested earlier in the
thread by Drew Parsons[1] and argued against others. I presented my use
case in support of Drew's suggestion. (Christian Perrier already changed
the description, so the problem is solved for this package.)

[1] http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=358003;msg=10

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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Adam Borowski 

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006, Lars Wirzenius wrote:

su, 2006-03-26 kello 04:11 -0600, Peter Samuelson kirjoitti:

OTOH, if you have no idea what language or what country the font
pertains to, why would you want that font?


It is not inconceivable that one could stumble on a document from
Bhutan, and want to install a font to be able to view it. It is a bit
more convenient to be able to find the correct package by only having to
search for "Bhutan", and not have to know that the language is
"Dzongkha".


Why would viewing the document matter if you don't know the language or 
even the script in the first place?



This is not what I would call a common use case, but it exists. I've
been in the situation once searching for a "Russian" font, when I
should've been looking for a "Cyrillic" font, for example. I should've
known better, but sometimes it is difficult to come up with the right
search terms even when you supposedly know the right ones.


This is a bad example, as cyrillic is used by more than 200 languages 
other than Russian; this includes both a number of southern slavic 
languages (Serbian, Bulgarian, etc) and mosts nations that have been 
conquered by Russians at some point in their history.  According to 
your argument, we would have to mention all of these in the description

of every cyrillic font.

Learning a language is quite a time-consuming task, I don't believe that 
anyone can learn even an alphabet without knowing its name.  A bit of 
synergy exists (like, you can perhaps decipher some place names in 
cyrillic if you know both latin and greek scripts), but I believe that 
it's better to keep descriptions short and sweet, as they are useless for 
anyone who don't know the language in the first place.


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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Lars Wirzenius 
su, 2006-03-26 kello 15:07 +0200, Adam Borowski kirjoitti:
> Why would viewing the document matter if you don't know the language or 
> even the script in the first place?

To get out of it what I can. Sometimes it is surprisingly much, even
when one doesn't understand the language or the script. To find, say,
the place that looks like the correct table of place names so that I can
copy and paste it somewhere to be translated.

> This is a bad example, as cyrillic is used by more than 200 languages 
> other than Russian; this includes both a number of southern slavic 
> languages (Serbian, Bulgarian, etc) and mosts nations that have been 
> conquered by Russians at some point in their history.  According to 
> your argument, we would have to mention all of these in the description
> of every cyrillic font.

Yes, I'd like that. ;-)

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Re: Bug#358003: ITP: ttf-dzongkha -- TrueType fonts for Dzongkha language

2006-03-26 Thread Darren Salt 
I demand that Adam Borowski may or may not have written...

[snip]
> I don't believe that anyone can learn even an alphabet without knowing its
> name.

I was going to say that you're wrong, but then it occurred to me that the
first one that most of us learn is called "the alphabet". ;-)

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When to drop/split/summ changelog files

2006-03-26 Thread Nico Golde 
Hi,
what would be the appropriate way to handle large and old 
debian changelog files. I mean there are package with very 
active upstream and years old changelog which grew and grew 
over the years.

Is there a way to handle these changelog entries which bloat 
the package and contain only information which are too old 
to be useful or is it ok if for example a changelog file 
would grow more than the source files of the package?
May split the changelog and insert an entry which points to
http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main//olderpackage_version-revision/changelog.html
where oldpackage_version-revision includes all information 
which is older than split date.

Regards Nico

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Re: When to drop/split/summ changelog files

2006-03-26 Thread Joerg Jaspert 
On 10605 March 1977, Nico Golde wrote:

> what would be the appropriate way to handle large and old 
> debian changelog files.

Keep.

> Is there a way to handle these changelog entries which bloat 
> the package and contain only information which are too old 
> to be useful or is it ok if for example a changelog file 
> would grow more than the source files of the package?

You know they are gzipped?

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Re: How (not) to write copyright files - take two

2006-03-26 Thread Florian Weimer 
* Joerg Jaspert:

> As *many* rejects out of the NEW-Queue[2] are still due to broken or
> incomplete copyright-files - lets refresh that information.

Just for clarification, since there seems to be this increased
interest in copyright notices: Do developers need to verify that these
copyright notices are accurate?


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Re: When to drop/split/summ changelog files

2006-03-26 Thread Nico Golde 
Hi,
* Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:32]:
> On 10605 March 1977, Nico Golde wrote:
[...]
> > Is there a way to handle these changelog entries which bloat 
> > the package and contain only information which are too old 
> > to be useful or is it ok if for example a changelog file 
> > would grow more than the source files of the package?
> 
> You know they are gzipped?

Yes for sure, but useless zipped information is useless 
anyway.
I thought about changelogs like:
2001-04-06   mitch  20:18:29Michael Natterer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Files:  .cvsignore (1.1) ( )
directfb.pc.in (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
directfb.pc.in (1.1) ( )
directfb-config.in (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
directfb-config.in (1.1) ( )
configure.in (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
configure.in (1.1) ( )
autogen.sh (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
autogen.sh (1.1) ( )
acconfig.h (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
acconfig.h (1.1) ( )
TODO (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
TODO (1.1) ( )
README.screenshots (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
README.screenshots (1.1) ( )
README (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
README (1.1) ( )
NOTES (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
NOTES (1.1) ( )
NEWS (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
NEWS (1.1) ( )
Makefile.am (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
Makefile.am (1.1) ( )
ChangeLog (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
ChangeLog (1.1) ( )
COPYING (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
COPYING (1.1) ( )
BUGS (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
BUGS (1.1) ( )
AUTHORS (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)
AUTHORS (1.1) ( )
.cvsignore (1.1.1.1) (+0 -0)

Initial revision

Why not to keep it on another place? Or what would be a scenario in which 
someone could
use them for something?
I mean I dont want to just drop them I really just wondered why to keep 
something in the package
if it doesn't seem to be useful.
Regards Nico

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Maintainers Guide (was: How (not) to write copyright files - take two)

2006-03-26 Thread Nico Golde 
Hi,
* Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:31]:
> A while ago Peter 'weasel' Palfrader wrote a nice little "How (not) to
> write copyright files"[1]. Please read that *now*.
> 
> [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg7.html 

[...]
Why not add this to the New Maintainers Guide instead of 
forcing Applicants to search the mailing list archive for 
this?
Regards Nico
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Re: When to drop/split/summ changelog files

2006-03-26 Thread Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho 

Nico Golde wrote:

I thought about changelogs like:
2001-04-06   mitch  20:18:29Michael Natterer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


This is not a Debian changelog, and your original question talked about 
those.


Many upstreams split their own changelogs occasionally. If you like, 
suggest to yours that they do this; don't do it on your own.




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Re: Maintainers Guide

2006-03-26 Thread Joerg Jaspert 
On 10605 March 1977, Nico Golde wrote:

> * Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:31]:
>> A while ago Peter 'weasel' Palfrader wrote a nice little "How (not) to
>> write copyright files"[1]. Please read that *now*.
>> [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg7.html 
> [...]
> Why not add this to the New Maintainers Guide instead of 
> forcing Applicants to search the mailing list archive for 
> this?

Feel free to submit patches to wherever it may get added.

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Re: How (not) to write copyright files - take two

2006-03-26 Thread Raphael Hertzog 
On Sun, 26 Mar 2006, Joerg Jaspert wrote:
> In many packages there is more than one author, more than one
> copyright-holder and more than one license. Do not miss to list them
> all, even if that other license is just for one file. Yes, any single
> file is important.

Each package with translations has several dozens of copyright holder,
we don't have to keep that list in the copyright file, do we ?

I understand that we have to be picky for packages where problems can be
expected, but in general the copyright file should not reproduce the list
of all the copyright holders. I suggest that it points to the relevant
files (AUTHORS and similar).

Cheers,
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Re: When to drop/split/summ changelog files

2006-03-26 Thread Nico Golde 
Hallo Antti,

* Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:52]:
> Nico Golde wrote:
> >I thought about changelogs like:
> >2001-04-06   mitch  20:18:29Michael Natterer 
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> This is not a Debian changelog, and your original question 
> talked about those.

Urgs yes, I also wondered why I have never seen a changelog 
like this :)
Regards Nico
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Re: Maintainers Guide (was: How (not) to write copyright files - take two)

2006-03-26 Thread Jeremy Stanley 
On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 08:48:31PM +0200, Nico Golde wrote:
> * Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:31]:
> > A while ago Peter 'weasel' Palfrader wrote a nice little "How (not) to
> > write copyright files"[1]. Please read that *now*.
> > 
> > [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg7.html 
> 
> [...]
> Why not add this to the New Maintainers Guide instead of 
> forcing Applicants to search the mailing list archive for 
> this?

Furthermore, the format given in the message is dissimilar from what
dh_make (0.40) gives right now. The default is...

   This package was debianized by Jeremy Stanley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on
   Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:12:01 +.

   It was downloaded from 

   Copyright Holder: 

   License:

   

...with no dates of copyright and no implication (in the template)
that they should be included either (related to "resolved" bug
336982). If the bulk of new maintainers are creating their packages
based on dh_make's templates, I expect many copyright files will
lack years (well, one would hope their sponsors would catch this). I
would happily submit a (trivial) patch for it, except that this
appears to be intentional for reasons I'm currently unable to
fathom. The original submitter indicates (among other things):

   This has to include a copyright year, also.

...and following additional discussion, the resolution is:

   After considering the suggestion, I have decided to close this
   bug.

Section 4.2 of maint-guide (1.2.7) shows the slightly different
"Copyright:" in place of "License:" and gives an example including
"the complete copyright notice," so hopefully more clueful
first-time packagers won't be bitten by the vagueness in the
template.
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Bug#359137: general: Box does not switch of on halt

2006-03-26 Thread Andreas Tille 
Package: general
Severity: important

Hi,

I tried to clarify in a discussion on debian-devel what
package might be responsible for the problem I face on
*all* three machines I updated to testing at a date I
do not exactly remember in February this year (sorry
for the vague description).  I just copy the introductory
mail to debian-devel

   http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/03/msg00240.html

here.  See for comments the other mails of the thread and
no neither of the responses in this thread nor private
mails helped.

--- >8 -
since about three weeks I observe problems when issuing halt
on three different testing-boxes (two older desktops without ACPI
and one laptop with ACPI).  The computer just does not switch off.
If I try to reboot it is also impossible, because the shutdown
process stops at the same point where halt stops.  The last
messages on the console are:


  Shutdown: hda
  System halted.


At one single time I managed to observe at the console

  Saving random seed ... done
  Usage: grep [OPTION] ... PATTERN [FILE] ...
  Try `grep --help` for more information
  Shutdown: hda
  System halted.
  Unmounting remote and non-toplevel virtual filesystems ... done


The log of one of this machine does not uncover something
interesting:


Mar  6 22:43:35 energija kernel: nfsd: last server has exited
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija kernel: nfsd: unexporting all filesystems
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija kernel: RPC: failed to contact portmap (errno -5).
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija mountd[1175]: Caught signal 15, un-registering and 
exiting.
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija kernel: Kernel logging (proc) stopped.
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija kernel: Kernel log daemon terminating.
Mar  6 22:43:35 energija exiting on signal 15



At Linux-Tage Chemnitz I discussed this problem with other
developers:


   1. One of them has observed the same (no solution)
   2. One visitor had the same problem. Installing Debians
  own linux kernel image package helped
   3. One hint was to load APM module


Remarks: I tried different kernels (I had originally installed
self-made 2.6.9 / 2.6.11, upgraded to self-made 2.6.15 and even
tried official 2.6.15 kernel image - see item 2.) but the
situation did not changed.  I suspected a change in the apmd
package and tried to downgrade the apmd package on the apmd
machines which also did not helped.


So the question is: what package might be responsible that
entered testing for about three weeks and how can I get my
boxes working as expected again.  I would love to write a
reasonable bug report but I have no idea against which package
so I could only issue this against general which is a little
bit naive.
--- 8< -

I'm absolutely clueless and it seems the readers of
debian-devel and [EMAIL PROTECTED]
are it as well and I heard that others had similar
observations.  I hope somebody will at least be able to
identify the package in question to track down the problem
and seek for more detailed information.

Kind regards

 Andreas.


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Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers testing
  APT policy: (499, 'testing'), (50, 'unstable')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.15
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Bug#359141: ITP: enemylines7 -- first person 3d-shooter game

2006-03-26 Thread Gonéri Le Bouder 
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: "Gonéri Le Bouder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: enemylines7
  Version : 0.5 
  Upstream Author : Raphael Pikrin
* URL : http://raum1.memebot.com/enemylines/part7.html
* License : GPL
  Description : first person 3d-shooter game

Enemy Lines 7 is a Single-player game. You have to Shoot down enemy 
bombers threatening your city.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers testing
  APT policy: (500, 'testing')
Architecture: sparc (sparc64)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.14-2-sparc64-smp
Locale: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (charmap=ANSI_X3.4-1968) (ignored: 
LC_ALL set to C)

project machine architecture aliases

2006-03-26 Thread Steve M. Robbins 
Hi,

I have another "wishful thinking" idea for build machines to float.

Suppose I get a bug report saying my package has failed to build on
architecture glooble.  I don't personally have a globle machine.  To
debug the problem, I need to fire up www.debian.org/devel, find the
link to the list of project machines, scan the list for the name of a
glooble machine (which is likely to be the name of a completely
unrelated composer of music).  Finally, I can log in.

Wouldn't it be nice if I could just do: "ssh glooble.dev.debian.org"
and have that be an alias to some machine of architecture glooble?
I'm assuming that there's a way to do fancy DNS load balancing amongst
the machines of type glooble that are currently available.

My idea is that there be one alias for each architecture, preferably
something easy to remember, such as ${arch}.dev.debian.org.  It would
be an alias for "any available machine of class ${arch}".  It's not
intended to be a replacement for the list on www.debian.org/devel, so
if I need to get to a specific machine, I still can consult the list.

Thoughts?
-Steve


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Re: idea for project machines

2006-03-26 Thread Christoph Berg 
Re: Steve M. Robbins 2006-03-25 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Wouldn't it be nice if you could simply "sudo apt-get install "
> yourself?  Is it feasible to have at least some of the sid chroots
> allow this?  Alternatively, how about "sudo pbuilder login ..."?

I was ranting about that on irc before, and was told that this is 1)
considered to be a security risk and 2) not worth the effort. The
additional concern I had was that an automatic solution would put less
load on DSA.

Joey is happy to manually install packages for developers in the
chroots, and did so almost instantly every time I needed it.

Christoph
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Re: project machine architecture aliases

2006-03-26 Thread Thiemo Seufer 
On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 03:09:11PM -0500, Steve M. Robbins wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I have another "wishful thinking" idea for build machines to float.
> 
> Suppose I get a bug report saying my package has failed to build on
> architecture glooble.  I don't personally have a globle machine.  To
> debug the problem, I need to fire up www.debian.org/devel, find the
> link to the list of project machines, scan the list for the name of a
> glooble machine (which is likely to be the name of a completely
> unrelated composer of music).  Finally, I can log in.
> 
> Wouldn't it be nice if I could just do: "ssh glooble.dev.debian.org"
> and have that be an alias to some machine of architecture glooble?

You can setup something similiar with a local ssh config (and maintain
and publish that config snippet).

> I'm assuming that there's a way to do fancy DNS load balancing amongst
> the machines of type glooble that are currently available.

Well, probably you want to re-login to the same machine...


Thiemo


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Re: How (not) to write copyright files - take two

2006-03-26 Thread Christoph Berg 
Re: Raphael Hertzog 2006-03-26 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Each package with translations has several dozens of copyright holder,
> we don't have to keep that list in the copyright file, do we ?

And we ignore any (C) FSF in generated autofoo stuff.

Christoph
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Re: project machine architecture aliases

2006-03-26 Thread Michael Banck 
On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 03:09:11PM -0500, Steve M. Robbins wrote:
> Wouldn't it be nice if I could just do: "ssh glooble.dev.debian.org"
> and have that be an alias to some machine of architecture glooble?

Questions/Proposals like these are not concerning Debian development per
se and would be better suited for debian-project.


Thanks for considering,

Michael

-- 
Michael Banck
Debian Developer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.advogato.org/person/mbanck/diary.html


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Re: project machine architecture aliases

2006-03-26 Thread Hamish Moffatt 
On Mon, Mar 27, 2006 at 12:59:34AM +0200, Michael Banck wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 03:09:11PM -0500, Steve M. Robbins wrote:
> > Wouldn't it be nice if I could just do: "ssh glooble.dev.debian.org"
> > and have that be an alias to some machine of architecture glooble?
> 
> Questions/Proposals like these are not concerning Debian development per
> se and would be better suited for debian-project.

I disagree. It certainly does concern development.

lists.debian.org describes these as:

debian-devel: "Development of Debian"
debian-project: "Discussions about non-technical issues in the project"

Threads about which list to use are even more wasteful than threads that
are on the wrong list. Please let's stop now.

Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


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Bug#359137: general: Box does not switch of on halt

2006-03-26 Thread Micha Lenk 
Hi Andreas,

uh, it's not that common to get general linux support using the debian BTS, 
isn't it?

Andreas Tille wrote:
> [...]
> since about three weeks I observe problems when issuing halt
> on three different testing-boxes (two older desktops without ACPI
> and one laptop with ACPI).  The computer just does not switch off.
> If I try to reboot it is also impossible, because the shutdown
> process stops at the same point where halt stops.  The last
> messages on the console are:
> 
>   Shutdown: hda
>   System halted.

Some time ago I had a similar problem on my notebook. It didn't power down, 
but it was able to reboot. For my notebook I solved the problem using the 
kernel boot parameter nolapic. Maybe this might help against your problem 
too.

Yours
  Micha


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Re: How (not) to write copyright files - take two

2006-03-26 Thread Charles Plessy 
On Sun, Mar 26, 2006 at 08:29:48PM +0200, Joerg Jaspert wrote :
> 
> In many packages there is more than one author, more than one
> copyright-holder and more than one license. Do not miss to list them
> all, even if that other license is just for one file. Yes, any single
> file is important.

Dear Joerg,

I am packaging a program for debian, and wrote a manpage and two patches
for making it compile with libwxwindows. I am not very interested in
being the author list: I would be a bit ashamed that my name would
appear more frequently that the author's for a work which is not mine.
Also, I feel a bit lazy and do not want the burden of changing the
copyright file whenever one of my modifications is accepted or
obsoleted.

Is it OK if I release the patches and the manpages in the public domain,
and I do not mention the manpage and the patches in the copyright file?

Best Regards,

-- 
Charles Plessy
Wako, Saitama, Japon


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Re: Maintainers Guide (was: How (not) to write copyright files - take two)

2006-03-26 Thread Yaroslav Halchenko 
I just can't locate copyright statement anywhere within the package --
only license file (MPL 1.1/GPL 2.0/LGPL 2.1)

is copyright assumed to belong to upstream author? what years then
should be mentioned?

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   Linux User^^-^^[17]




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Re: How (not) to write copyright files - take two

2006-03-26 Thread Russ Allbery 
Charles Plessy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> I am packaging a program for debian, and wrote a manpage and two patches
> for making it compile with libwxwindows. I am not very interested in
> being the author list: I would be a bit ashamed that my name would
> appear more frequently that the author's for a work which is not mine.
> Also, I feel a bit lazy and do not want the burden of changing the
> copyright file whenever one of my modifications is accepted or
> obsoleted.

> Is it OK if I release the patches and the manpages in the public domain,
> and I do not mention the manpage and the patches in the copyright file?

I recommend always adding an additional section to debian/copyright giving
an explicit statement about the copyright of the packaging work.  It's
just good copyright "hygiene," since otherwise people have to make guesses
and assumptions that may not be correct.

Here's an example from one of my packages:

Debianized by Robert S. Edmonds <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>1998-03-21
Adopted by Chad C. Walstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 2001-02-06
Adopted by Martin O. Hicks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  2003-11-02
Adopted by Russ Allbery <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>2005-04-18

It was downloaded from:



although the current home page appears to be:



Upstream author:

Craig Knudsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Debian packaging copyright:

Changes by Robert S. Edmonds, Chad C. Walstrom, and Martin O. Hicks
did not have explicit copyright statements.  See the Debian changelog
for the dates of changes.  Presumably all their changes may be
redistributed under the same terms as GTimer itself.

Changes by Russ Allbery are copyright 2005, 2006 Russ Allbery and may
be redistributed and/or modified under the terms of the GNU General
Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either
version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.

Copyright:

(C) 1999 Craig Knudsen, [EMAIL PROTECTED]

This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify
it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by
the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at
your option) any later version.

This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful, but
WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the GNU
General Public License for more details.

You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
along with this program; if not, write to the Free Software
Foundation, Inc., 51 Franklin St, Fifth Floor, Boston, MA 02110-1301,
USA.

The full text of the GNU General Public License is available on Debian
systems in /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL.

-- 
Russ Allbery ([EMAIL PROTECTED])   


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Re: project machine architecture aliases

2006-03-26 Thread Raphael Hertzog 
On Mon, 27 Mar 2006, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> > Questions/Proposals like these are not concerning Debian development per
> > se and would be better suited for debian-project.
> 
> I disagree. It certainly does concern development.

The line is blur, and when don't know really of which side it should be, I
agree that we shouldn't recommend one over the other (or by private mail
only).

> Threads about which list to use are even more wasteful than threads that
> are on the wrong list. Please let's stop now.

Michael, please don't. I think Michael's efforts are useful to increase
the quality of -devel.

It's just this particular answer that he could have avoided.

Cheers,
-- 
Raphaël Hertzog

Premier livre français sur Debian GNU/Linux :
http://www.ouaza.com/livre/admin-debian/


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Re: Maintainers Guide

2006-03-26 Thread Frank Küster 
Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On 10605 March 1977, Nico Golde wrote:
>
>> * Joerg Jaspert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006-03-26 20:31]:
>>> A while ago Peter 'weasel' Palfrader wrote a nice little "How (not) to
>>> write copyright files"[1]. Please read that *now*.
>>> [1] http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg7.html 
>> [...]
>> Why not add this to the New Maintainers Guide instead of 
>> forcing Applicants to search the mailing list archive for 
>> this?
>
> Feel free to submit patches to wherever it may get added.

I suggest to add it to the Developer's Reference instead, or
additionally ( a section "best practices for debian/copyright"). 

Regards, Frank
-- 
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Single Molecule Spectroscopy, Protein Folding @ Inst. f. Biochemie, Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer (teTeX)