On Tuesday 20 August 2013 08:14:51 Duncan wrote: > Dave posted on Tue, 20 Aug 2013 00:21:15 +0100 as excerpted: > > Is anyone seeing newsgroup theading issue with Pan 0.139? > > It's natively compiled on FreeBSD 9.1 > > I use pan built from live-git, here (as can be seen from my headers, since > I'm posting with pan via the gmane list2news service), so I'm a but past > 0.139 release, but I don't believe there have been any threading changes > in quite some time... several versions, tho not being a C++ coder (tho I > can do sysadmin's level coding, that is, the occasional patch) I go more > by the git commit comments than the code. > > I suppose it's possible that it's a library issue, however. What version > of gmime? (FWIW, 2.6.16, here on gentoo/~amd64.)
I appear to have two version of gmime installed gmime-24-2.4.33 gmime-26-2.6.16 I just did a pkg_delete -f gmime-24-2.4.33, which did not report any dependancies as it normally would if something required that version. I'll test again now that's gone. > > On the group in question: > > newsgroup: free.virginmedia.test > > subject: Testing custom User Agent header > > date: 19th Aug, 11pm local (GMT/UTC+1) > > > > There are replies I've made to myself but they don't thread properly, > > showing up as replies to the original post rather than the one it's > > actually in reply to. Others, using other newsreaders including OE > > and Agent have commented on the threading problems. > > > > I've tested replies with full automatic message quoting, highlighting > > text then reply to only quote specific test, switched off/on body pane > > word wrap, and wondered if the splitting of headers in replies might be > > a cause, eg References: header splits in the middle of references > > instead of at the end, ie at a comma. Likewise,the User Agent: header > > is huge and gets split across line. > > It'd have to be the references header. None of the rest of the things you > mention should have anything at all to do with threading. It's worth > noting that (AFAIK) pan threads exclusively via message-id as found in > the references header, while certain other news and/or mail clients, > including OE at one point (altho I'm not sure it still applies, I > switched to freedomware instead of crossing the eXPrivacy line, tho back > in the day I ran IE/OE betas so I know more than average about historical > versions), fall back to subject line threading as well -- they'll thread > identical (but for Re: etc) subject lines together even in the absence of > references headers. > > The RFCs (Internet Request For Comments documents, which ultimately > become STDs, Standards, but by that point everybody is used to referring > to them by the RFC number, so RFCs is how they're normally referenced) > are the definitive standard here, specifying the contents and format of > the references header as up-thread message-IDs, as well as the proper > method for "header folding." > > > On the other hand, looking at the "Testing custom User Agent header" > > thread using knode, everything looks just fine with all messages > > threaded and indented correctly. > > ... Which means the information must be there in the references header > for knode to use. It's apparently a bit less strict in its header > parsing, however, or unfolding folded headers differently (maybe without > an added space/comma at the split?), tho my memory of the internet > messaging RFCs is fuzzy enough I couldn't tell you which would be > "correct" without looking it up. > > > If you can't access that newsgroup but have some ideas/help/advice, I > > can post headers here if required. > > That would be helpful. Probably just the references headers, perhaps > with one header on either side just to be sure we keep the context, if it > happens to be important. Be sure to retain verbatim header folding, as > that's almost certainly the issue. > > (I very likely technically have access to the group as I have an > unexpiring block account, but I don't regularly use it (so the unexpiring > bit is good! =:^), and if the information I need is all there I tend to > reply immediately, where as if I have to look, I'll often skip it (not > often) or mark it unread again, to reply to later (the usual case)... > which can be MONTHS (!!) later, at which point I may well decide it's not > likely to be relevant any longer and ultimately skip it then. Posting > the headers is thus likely to be in practice the fastest way to a proper > reply, at least from me.) > > Heinrich (who would likely be creating the fix if needed) or others may > well reply in the mean time. > > > Meanwhile, based on the evidence so far (your mention of "folded" > references header, header folding being the term used in the RFCs, and > knode apparently getting it right) I strongly suspect that it's down to > that, tho whether it's on the posting end, folding the references header > incorrectly according to the RFCs, or the receiving end, unfolding them > incorrectly, I can't say. > > What I CAN say, however, is that the RFCs have a very well known general > policy of being strict in observance with what you send, but rather more > tolerant when parsing what you receive. So it's quite likely that the > information is all there (as can be seen from knode getting it right), > but either pan isn't being sufficiently RFC-strict in how it folds the > references header when it sends the message, and knode is simply being > tolerant in reconstruction as it should be (while other clients including > pan aren't quite that tolerant), or pan is using an RFC allowed but > relatively uncommon and thus not often tested mid-ID split, and due to > the relative rarity of the case, few clients are properly coping with an > RFC-folding-compliant references header. > > I may just go lookup the RFC and see what it says as that's an > interesting question regardless, but I'll send this off first, in case I > don't get to that. Thanks Duncan, I knew you'd be first and comprehensive :-) Xnews, Outlook MesNews and Thunderbird never wrap the References: header, Turnpike does, but never splits mid-reference. Here's a new thread showing three replies, all of which thread in Pan as if they are replies to the original post but, as shown by the quoted text indentations are a sequence of replies to each preceding post. Path: not-for-mail From: DaveG <nos...@nospam.dgmm.net> Subject: thread test1 Newsgroups: free.virginmedia.test User-Agent: Pan/0.139 (Sexual Chocolate; GIT bf56508 git://git.gnome.org/pan2) Message-ID: <pan.2013.08.20.12.41...@nospam.dgmm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Lines: 8 NNTP-Posting-Host: 92.238.71.115 X-Complaints-To: http://netreport.virginmedia.com X-Trace: 1377002508 92.238.71.115 (Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 UTC) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 UTC Organization: virginmedia.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 GMT X-Received-Bytes: 905 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit test 1 ###################### Path: not-for-mail From: DaveG <nos...@nospam.dgmm.net> Subject: Re: thread test1 Newsgroups: free.virginmedia.test References: <pan.2013.08.20.12.41...@nospam.dgmm.net> User-Agent: Pan/0.139 (Sexual Chocolate; GIT bf56508 git://git.gnome.org/pan2) Message-ID: <pan.2013.08.20.12.42...@nospam.dgmm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Lines: 12 NNTP-Posting-Host: 92.238.71.115 X-Complaints-To: http://netreport.virginmedia.com X-Trace: 1377002540 92.238.71.115 (Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:20 UTC) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:20 UTC Organization: virginmedia.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:20 GMT X-Received-Bytes: 934 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 +0000, DaveG wrote: > test 1 reply 1 ############################ Path: not-for-mail From: DaveG <nos...@nospam.dgmm.net> Subject: Re: thread test1 Newsgroups: free.virginmedia.test References: <pan.2013.08.20.12.41...@nospam.dgmm.net> <pan.2013.08.20.12.42. 2...@nospam.dgmm.net> User-Agent: Pan/0.139 (Sexual Chocolate; GIT bf56508 git://git.gnome.org/pan2) Message-ID: <pan.2013.08.20.12.42...@nospam.dgmm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Lines: 16 NNTP-Posting-Host: 92.238.71.115 X-Complaints-To: http://netreport.virginmedia.com X-Trace: 1377002564 92.238.71.115 (Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:44 UTC) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:44 UTC Organization: virginmedia.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:44 GMT X-Received-Bytes: 1052 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:20 +0000, DaveG wrote: > On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 +0000, DaveG wrote: > >> test 1 > > reply 1 reply 2 #################################### Path: not-for-mail From: DaveG <nos...@nospam.dgmm.net> Subject: Re: thread test1 Newsgroups: free.virginmedia.test References: <pan.2013.08.20.12.41...@nospam.dgmm.net> <pan.2013.08.20.12.42. 4...@nospam.dgmm.net> User-Agent: Pan/0.139 (Sexual Chocolate; GIT bf56508 git://git.gnome.org/pan2) Message-ID: <pan.2013.08.20.12.43...@nospam.dgmm.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: 92.238.71.115 X-Complaints-To: http://netreport.virginmedia.com X-Trace: 1377002590 92.238.71.115 (Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:43:10 UTC) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:43:10 UTC Organization: virginmedia.com Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:43:10 GMT X-Received-Bytes: 1128 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:44 +0000, DaveG wrote: > On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:42:20 +0000, DaveG wrote: > >> On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 12:41:48 +0000, DaveG wrote: >> >>> test 1 >> >> reply 1 > > reply 2 reply 3 _______________________________________________ Pan-users mailing list Pan-users@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/pan-users
