On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 7:40 PM, Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote: > +1
Voting to terminate a project through lack of success sends a very clear message. Being 'terminated' is a very clear and public punishment, both for Mentors and for the project. IMO termination should be used only as a sanction for podlings which break our rules The key service which Foundations like Apache provide is legal paperwork. Unless backed by a corporate entity, this takes a lot of volunteer energy. For volunteer led podlings, getting all the release and legal side right limits time for community building. All this work is wasted when a podling is terminated. Being 'parked' would mean this work would not be wasted when temporary external factors prevent continuation. IMO where a podling is otherwise satisfactory but fails to reach critical mass for sustainability in a reasonable period, this is not a failure but a success. The IPMC should offer an alternative form of graduation to a destination outside official Apache which preserves the legal and release work. Robert > On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 2:31 PM, Ross Gardler > <rgard...@opendirective.com> wrote: >> +1 >> >> Sent from my mobile device, please forgive errors and brevity. >> On Jan 15, 2012 6:18 PM, "Joe Schaefer" <joe_schae...@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>> I wish we could get past the whole idea that we are punishing >>> a podling by insisting that they take their work to say github >>> instead. They probably can keep the name since we have no interest >>> in it ourselves. >>> >>> We maintain an open-door policy for new projects, and I think that >>> is a good thing that we should keep. What we lack is a sensible >>> mechanism for reviewing longstanding projects in terms of their >>> projected future in this place. We did NOT promise anyone free >>> project hosting, and if they want that there are lots of places >>> to get that. We merely provide an opportunity that with a little >>> luck, hard work, and determination, they can join the ASF and >>> become an Apache project. But they deserve an answer at some point. >>> >>> >>> Purgatory is not what we were designed to offer, never. >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> > From: Mohammad Nour El-Din <nour.moham...@gmail.com> >>> > To: general@incubator.apache.org; antel...@apache.org >>> > Cc: >>> > Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 1:09 PM >>> > Subject: Re: Actively retiring projects >>> > >>> > On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 6:01 PM, ant elder <ant.el...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> > >>> >> On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 1:57 PM, Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> >>> > wrote: >>> >> >>> >> > Now to go back and answer Ant's question directly, >>> >> >>> >> Sam, what you replied doesn't really answer my question directly. The >>> >> issue with the long term poddlings which I know about is not that >>> >> their reports are not read, they are in fact read so something else is >>> >> wrong if there is in fact a problem at all. I'm sorry that you're >>> > not >>> >> happy with how Kato went, as i said here [1] i expect that to be >>> >> resolved shortly and they will have done that themselves rather than >>> >> being pushed out by Incubator PMC which i think is a good outcome. >>> >> >>> >> <big snip> >>> >> >>> >> > >>> >> > Speaking as an individual Director here, but we have a board meeting >>> >> > in a few days and I can obtain an Official Word™ on the matter if >>> >> > that's what people here would like, but I'm highly confident >>> > that the >>> >> > outcome (directed at the chair) will be something along the lines of >>> >> > "see to it that podling reports are adequately vetted before >>> >> > forwarding them to the board" >>> >> > >>> >> >>> >> I'd prefer to have an official response from the board on if in fact >>> >> it matters if incubation takes longer than a year. Podlings like Nuvem >>> >> or Wink or Photark or Kato or which ever else are just small and slow, >>> >> so what? >>> >> >>> > >>> > +1 about "... small and slow, so what?" >>> > >>> > It is true some podlings are just slow and small regarding attracting >>> *new* >>> > blood to the podling's community, but the community itself is active, and >>> > IMHO it is not fair to punish them for that. >>> > >>> > On the other hand we still need to answer the question "OK, so till when >>> we >>> > should keep them in the Incubator ?" which is a very valid question, >>> > honestly I don't have a definitive answer for that, but I would give a >>> lead >>> > to an answer/discussion in a form of a question >>> > >>> > "Is the Incubator the right place for such podlings ?" >>> > >>> > If the answer is *yes* then we should find a way to manage the increasing >>> > number of accepted podling into the incubator relative to the number of >>> > active/available mentors, and also we should keep a list of podlings >>> which >>> > are not small and they should be doing good and hence being in the >>> > Incubator for some long time indicates that there is something wrong. >>> > >>> > If the answer is No, then: >>> > - We should ask them to retire, which is not fair IMHO as I mentioned >>> > above >>> > - Or Can we create another level of incubtion like, which can be the >>> same >>> > as the normal Incubator but we can lessen down the number of initially >>> > assigned mentors to 1 and recommend one of the initial committers to >>> become >>> > an active Mentor, provided that they have shown that they adapted to the >>> > ASF rules very well. This is just a suggestion. >>> > >>> > Thoughts ? >>> > >>> > >>> >> >>> >> (and please note that there is no disrespect intended here. the ideas >>> >> and suggestions in this thread and others recently do seem like good >>> >> stuff to be trying, regardless of the age of a poddling) >>> >> >>> >> ...ant >>> >> >>> >> [1] http://apache.markmail.org/message/trurg7pnt5yk7tei >>> >> >>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >>> >> >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Thanks >>> > - Mohammad Nour >>> > ---- >>> > "Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep >>> > moving" >>> > - Albert Einstein >>> > >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >>> >>> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
