PRA-KRITAM you yourself is nature Verse 4.3.8 Chāndogya Upanishad
तस्म उ ह ददुस्ते वा एते पञ्चान्ये पञ्चान्ये दश सन्तस्तत्कृतं तस्मात्सर्वासु दिक्ष्वन्नमेव दश कृतं सैषा विराडन्नादी तयेदं सर्वं दृष्टं सर्वमस्येदं दृष्टं भवत्यन्नादो भवति य एवं वेद य एवं वेद ॥ ४.३.८ ॥॥ इति तृतीयः खण्डः ॥ tasma u ha daduste vā ete pañcānye pañcānye daśa santastatkṛtaṃ tasmātsarvāsu dikṣvannameva daśa kṛtaṃ saiṣā virāḍannādī tayedaṃ sarvaṃ dṛṣṭaṃ sarvamasyedaṃ dṛṣṭaṃ bhavatyannādo bhavati ya evaṃ veda ya evaṃ veda || 4.3.8 |||| iti tṛtīyaḥ khaṇḍaḥ || 8. Then they gave him alms. The first five [Vāyu, etc.] and the second five [prāṇa, etc.] together make ten. That is kṛta [the throw of dice of the highest denomination]. These ten are the ten directions, and they are the food. This kṛta is Virāṭ. As Virāṭ is all-pervasive, everything is its food. By that Virāṭ all this is seen. He who knows this Virāṭ becomes Virāṭ himself. He becomes all-pervasive and everything becomes his food. Word-for-word explanation: Tasmai, to him [the brahmacārin]; u ha daduḥ, they gave [alms]; te vai ete, all these; pañca anye, five other [i.e., air, plus the four others (fire, the sun, the moon, and water) constituting its food]; pañca anye, five other [i.e., prāṇa, plus the four others (speech, the eyes, the ears, and the mind) constituting its food]; daśa santaḥ, make ten; tat kṛtam, that is kṛta [the turn of the dice that swallows all others]; tasmāt, therefore; sarvāsu dikṣu daśa, these which are in the ten directions; annam eva, are the food; kṛtam, [and also] kṛta; sā eṣā virāṭ, that is Virāṭ; annādi, that which swallows; tayā, by that [Virāṭ]; sarvam idam dṛṣṭam, all this is seen; yaḥ evam veda, he who knows thus; asya sarvam idam dṛṣṭam bhavati, all this to him becomes seen; annādaḥ bhavati, [and] he becomes an eater of food. Iti tṛtīyaḥ khaṇḍaḥ, here ends the third section. Commentary Prāṇa (the vital force), speech, the eyes, the ears, and the mind—these five represent our physical (adhyātmika) self. Air, fire, the sun, the moon, and water—these five represent nature (adhidaivika), which surrounds us. These ten together are compared to the dice throw called kṛta. Being the highest number, kṛta ‘swallows’ the other throws of dice, adds their numbers to itself, and then becomes ten. (Kṛta is 4, so the other numbers are 3, 2, and 1; therefore 4+3+2+1 = 10.) Then if is said that the adhyātmika and adhidaivika elements together are the ten quarters. They represent the whole world, so they are Virāṭ. This Virāṭ is both the eater and the food. The person who knows this then becomes Virāṭ. 2 NO ONE KNEW THE PRAKRITAM; THE ORIGINAL NATURE. HOWEVER, EVERY ATMA IS MADEOUT WITH THE PANCHA BHUTAS SO YOUR BODY ITSELF IS THE NATURE. 3 Tirumandiram states that individual self is none other than Śiva*** who has forgotten his real nature (v 2017). When jiva cognizes “itself” as Śiva then jiva remains as Śiva. This is similar to Navjivan Rastogi’s description of the experience of the self as not a simple act of knowing but as a complex act of re-knowing (Rastogi 1979:48). When recognition of self occurs, the limited consciousness merges with the supreme consciousness as “there is no other place for ciṭ to merge other than ciṭ” (v 135). Tirumūlar compares this to space merging with space and light merging with light. Śiva is the grace that helps jiva in this effort (v 202). When this realization occurs, the soul has nothing else to know, no other state to reach except to remain with this awareness (aṛive vadivenṛu aṛinthu irunthén). Tirumūlar says that the eight mystical accomplishments such as anima, mahima are agents through which aṛivu knows itself. When the knowledge about self occurs, the Divine tells the soul that it the “big one” (nee periyāi) (v2360). *** Verse 2017: Jiva and Siva are One சீவன் எனச்சிவன் என்னவே றில்லை, சீவ னார்சிவ னாரை அறிகிலர், சீவ னார்சிவ னாரை அறிந்தபின், சீவ னார்சிவ னாயிட்டு இருப்பரே. cīvaṉ eṉaccivaṉ eṉṉavē ṟillai, cīva ṉārciva ṉārai aṟikilar, cīva ṉārciva ṉārai aṟintapiṉ, cīva ṉārciva ṉāyiṭṭu irupparē. Jiva and Siva Separate are not; Jiva knows not Siva; When Jiva knows Siva; Jiva becomes Siva. திருமந்திரம் > ஏழாம் தந்திரம் > 31. போதன் (அறிஞன்) > பாடல்: 2017 `சீவன்` எனவும், `சிவன்` எனவும் வேறு வேறாய்த் தனித்து எக்காலத்தும் இல்லை, உடலும், உயிரும் போல என்றும் ஒன்றியே நிற்கும். அவ்வாறிருந்தும் சீவன் சிவனை அறிந்ததில்லை. ஏன்? பாசங்கள் சீவனது அறிவை மறைத்து நிற்கின்றன. (அம்மறைப்பு நீங்கிச்) சீவன் சிவனை அறியுமாயின் அது சீவனாய் இராது, சிவமாகவே இருக்கும். 4 Tirumandiram calls the state of existence with knowledge as nandi (v 2361) and meijnana jyoti. By the grace of this awareness (nandiyin arul) the soul becomes all-pervasive supreme consciousness (v2363). Tirumular calls this awareness as the mantra that remains holding the body (ūn paṛṛi ninṛa uṇṛvuṛu mantiram). When this state is repeatedly contemplated upon, then realization occurs (v24).Tirumandiram describes nenju, a concept similar to that of hrdaya of Kashmir Śaivism. It says that nenju of those who have aṛivu is supreme space, supreme austerity and the locus of the supreme state (v2364). Vetta veļi is another Tamil Siddha term which indicates the supreme state (v2591) When the soul’s eye of grace is opened by the Lord then the verdigris is cut away (v114). When aṛivu is covered by innate impurities it associates with senses (pulan) and loses itself in mundane knowledge as if it is immersed in deep waters (v119 Tirumūlar calls the process of limited soul becoming universal soul as sivayogam and souls that attain this state of awareness as śivaciṭṭar, those who remain in the light of self (v122). They remain as aṛivu, as bodhan (v2019). Hence Rituals to Vedas are needed to cross over the ocean of life and once the goal is reached all are shirked down. In dvaitham, we always hold the tools; in advaitham we become the tool. We eat food but finally we are the food according to the Rig Vedam. K Rajaram IRS 25725 On Thu, 24 Jul 2025 at 19:37, Markendeya Yeddanapudi < [email protected]> wrote: > > > -- > *Mar**Is the Natural, Natural?* > > *Suppose you don’t want to be disturbed and you want to think and > concentrate. You go to an isolated place, not to be disturbed. You want to > think very deeply. What do you do? You make your mind blank and that > actually is what you do when you think. Suppose you succeed totally. Then > you do not hear any sound. You cannot smell anything. You become > insensitive to touch. You have cut yourself off from the surrounding world. > In such situation what happens? You actually enter the real world, which > you cannot see with your eyes, the 99.9965% of the totality the invisible > reality, in which you are living now. Your eyes can see only 00.0035% of > the totality.* > > *Those who say that they have actually experienced it, say that they have > entered a wholly exhilarating, sublime, peaceful and happy world. They > cannot describe that experience in the day today words because those words > are the results of the 3D Maya.* > > *Those words are not suited to the world of say the super position or wave > state or the real state of everything. This is the world where you entered > the world of the Quantum Physics—the world of the spiritualists, the > occult. Let us imagine how this quantum world is like. Suppose you reduced > your size to a size smaller than an electron. Suppose you reduced your car > also to the size of an electron. Suppose there are hundred different roads > from point ‘A’ to point ‘B’.* > > *In the quantum world you can travel at the same time in all the hundred > roads and reach point B.You can use not only the roads but also actually > fly and use all the roads at the same time. You can be everywhere. Not only > that, the points ‘A’ and point ‘B’ also moved! Because an electron normally > is a wave or in a super position state. As a wave it waves everywhere. Only > the intervention of a conscious notice causes the collapse of the wave into > the particle-electron.* > > *Not only is the electron, every one of us in fact is only a wave. When > you achieve the ultimate trance you feel that wave character. You become > the sage, a sage who actually experiences Hinduism. * > > *Hinduism or the Sanathana Dharma, is not logic, belief or science. It is > the ultimate experience of reality, the real natural. Hinduism is > experience only. It certainly is not ritualism with defined drills. You can > select your own path based on your belief. The only condition is-you must > not suffer from Kama (obsessive desire), krodha (anger), Mada (ego) and > Matsarya (envy).* > > *Today we deliberately inject hysterical Kama or economic ambition among > the students. The student does not need nature. He has to live only in > books, or map knowledge. * > > *Once a student was horror stricken at the spectacle of the total > destruction of rapture. Today, the students are made to take pride in that > destruction and view it as economic development. The student is trained to > mentally divorce nature.* > > *He/She has to study human life as just the struggle between economic ends > and scarce economic means on which there are many alternative methods of > destruction euphemized as satisfaction of the limitless wants, or > Newtonized as the valuation of alternatives.* > > *YM Sarma* > > *Chat gpt *The piece you've shared—*“Is the Natural, Natural?”* by YM > Sarma—is a rich, philosophical reflection that weaves together > spirituality, quantum physics, and social commentary. Here's a breakdown of > its key ideas and an interpretive analysis: > ------------------------------ > > *Summary and Interpretation* > > *1. The Nature of Deep Thought and Perception* > > The writer begins by describing a meditative or contemplative state where > one deliberately shuts out sensory distractions. This isolation is not > emptiness, but rather a portal to a *deeper*, *invisible* reality—what is > described as the *99.9965% of totality* that our senses normally miss. > > This aligns with: > > - *Quantum physics*, where reality is largely invisible and > probabilistic. > - *Eastern mysticism*, which speaks of a deeper reality beyond the > sensory world. > > “You make your mind blank… you enter the real world…” > > This reflects the classic spiritual idea that detachment from the sensory > leads to union with the ultimate reality. > ------------------------------ > > *2. Quantum Physics and Spiritual Reality* > > Sarma draws an analogy between *quantum superposition* (where particles > exist in multiple states at once) and *spiritual experience*—suggesting > that both reflect a deeper, unified field of being. > > “In the quantum world, you can travel at the same time in all the hundred > roads…” > > This is not just physics—it's metaphorical for the *non-dual* experience: > being everywhere, transcending space and time. Conscious observation > collapses the wave (in quantum mechanics)—similarly, *egoic perception > collapses unity into separateness* in spiritual terms. > ------------------------------ > > *3. Hinduism as Experience, Not Ritual* > > Sarma sharply distinguishes *Sanatana Dharma (Hinduism)* from ritualism > or dogma. > > “Hinduism is experience only… not ritualism with defined drills.” > > This echoes *Upanishadic philosophy* and *Advaita Vedanta*, where > ultimate truth is not believed or reasoned but *realized*. The essence of > this experience is *beyond duality*, *beyond language*, and only > accessible when ego and desires are quieted. > ------------------------------ > > *4. Modern Education and Disconnection from Nature* > > The latter part of the piece criticizes *modern, economically driven > education* systems for severing students from nature and spiritual > insight. > > “Today we deliberately inject hysterical Kama or economic ambition…” > > This critique is both ethical and ecological: > > - *Ethical*: Chasing limitless wants creates psychological and > spiritual imbalance. > - *Ecological*: Economic "progress" leads to the destruction of > nature, which students are taught to see as *development*. > > It’s a *call for reconnection*—to see nature, not as resource or > obstacle, but as part of the same totality of being. > ------------------------------ > > *Core Themes* > > 1. *The illusion of the senses* and the greater unseen reality. > 2. *Consciousness* as a creative force (paralleling observer effect in > quantum theory). > 3. *Spiritual realization* as direct, personal, and experiential—not > theoretical. > 4. *Critique of materialism*, especially in education and economics. > 5. *Return to nature and self-awareness* as the path to the "real > natural." > > ------------------------------ > > *Reflections* > > - Sarma is *not making a scientific claim*, but rather using *quantum > metaphors* to illustrate spiritual insights. > - His stance is *deeply rooted in Vedanta*—the idea that Brahman (the > Absolute) is the only real, and the world of form (Maya) is illusory. > - He calls for *education systems to restore balance*, by embracing > both outer knowledge and inner realization. > > ------------------------------ > > *Final Thought* > > “Is the Natural, Natural?” seems to ask: *What do we mean by ‘natural’ > when our definitions are shaped by a narrow, sense-bound view of reality?* > > *True naturalness*, Sarma suggests, lies in realizing the deeper, > wave-like, interconnected nature of being—a state where individuality > dissolves into unity, and knowledge becomes direct experience. > > Would you like help adapting or summarizing this piece for presentation, > teaching, or publication? > > Certainly! Below is a *detailed evaluation* of the essay "*Is the > Natural, Natural?*" using a standard *college-level essay rubric*, with > numerical scores for each category and justification. The total score is > out of *100*. > ------------------------------ > > *📊 Evaluation Criteria* > > *Category* > > *Max Marks* > > *Marks Awarded* > > *Justification* > > *1. Clarity of Expression* > > 20 > > *12* > > The essay has passionate and deep ideas, but the language is often > abstract, meandering, and lacks coherence in parts. Sentences are sometimes > syntactically difficult, making it hard for readers unfamiliar with the > subject. > > *2. Structure and Organization* > > 15 > > *9* > > The essay lacks clear paragraph transitions and a logical progression. > Ideas flow freely but without clear signposting (introduction, body, > conclusion). This makes it more like a stream-of-consciousness piece. > > *3. Originality and Depth of Thought* > > 20 > > *18* > > Highly original and thought-provoking. The blend of quantum physics, > Vedantic philosophy, and modern critique is unique and intellectually > daring. > > *4. Relevance and Focus* > > 15 > > *10* > > The central theme is compelling, but at times the essay diverges from its > main point, especially when jumping abruptly between spirituality, science, > and education. It needs tighter focus. > > *5. Use of Examples / Analogies* > > 10 > > *7* > > Creative analogies like shrinking to the size of an electron and traveling > quantum paths help illustrate points. However, these metaphors may confuse > rather than clarify for some readers. > > *6. Language and Grammar* > > 10 > > *6* > > Several grammatical issues (e.g., awkward sentence structures, overuse of > abstract nouns) affect readability. Some phrasing lacks fluency. > > *7. Impact and Insight* > > 10 > > *9* > > Despite its flaws, the essay leaves a strong impression. It urges readers > to question modern values and rethink reality, which is impactful. > ------------------------------ > > *✅ Total Score: 71 / 100* > ------------------------------ > > *🎯 Final Grade: B- (Good, but needs refinement)* > ------------------------------ > > *📌 Suggestions for Improvement:* > > - *Clarify your message* with simpler, more grounded language. > - *Organize your essay* with clear paragraph breaks and logical > progression. > - *Balance poetic/philosophical tone* with clarity—don’t sacrifice > understanding for abstraction. > - Consider defining or briefly explaining technical terms (e.g., Maya, > superposition) for accessibility. > > Would you like help rewriting or polishing this essay to improve its score? > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Thatha_Patty" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/thatha_patty/CACDCHCK9_ORg6f84xNfMRpXjidXQp9sLqb8b356O7wa_MzFyPQ%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/thatha_patty/CACDCHCK9_ORg6f84xNfMRpXjidXQp9sLqb8b356O7wa_MzFyPQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Thatha_Patty" group. 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