will map the ANSI bytestring to
a Unicode filename via the active code page, and call CreateFileW
accordingly. The active code page cannot be set to something as useful
as UTF-8, so given any actual code page (1252, 932, etc.) there are
Unicode strings that cannot be represented with a bytestrin
on ctypes would be
enormously useful for PyPy, IronPython and Jython, but ctypes is not yet
as portable as Python itself which could be an issue (although one worth
resolving).
Michael Foord
[1] http://code.google.com/p/ironclad
[2] Strictly speaking they are managed objects of unmanaged t
ems) simply turn to other languages.
All the best,
Michael Foord
I worry, if it is ever actually removed, that I won't be able to
convince these people that you really don't need to spawn twenty
threads to write an IRC bot.
On Fri, Oct 31, 2008 at 2:24 AM, Nick Coghlan <[EMA
o automate
testing all the installers in various scenarios - each running
simultaneously in a VM.
Michael
[1] Doesn't Windows have a way to send synthetic GUI events to a
program? There ought to be a way to really script that, as the Python
installer process presumbly doesn't change m
:-)
It would work well with the files being generated from an XML templating
language like Mako which is what we will be switching to at Resolver
Systems.
http://wix.sourceforge.net/
Michael Foord
I'm sure the
Python Software Foundation would easily get a free license of one of
ere the idea of encoding filenames and environment
> variables any other way is seen as crazy, then the Python 3 approach
> will work seamlessly.
>
> In the meantime, raw bytes APIs will provide an alternative for those
> that disagree with that philosophy.
And until that
ey're still bytes no matter how much we
want them to be characters.
This difference, and secondarily the way python 3 tries to sweep it
under the rug, seem to be the roots of the problem.
--
Michael Urman
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Adam, for sending this only to you the first time]
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Michael Urman
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his really belongs on Python-ideas and not Python-dev.
The main reason why not is that someone(s) from the Python core team
would then need to 'own' maintaining Psyco (which is x86 only as well).
Psyco is so hard to maintain that even the original author wants to drop
it. :-)
Mich
x27;s needed, it has it's uses,
just not the one *you* want.
That's an interesting assertion about what threads were designed for. Do
you have anything to back it up?
Michael
--
http://www.ironpythoninaction.com/
http://www.voidsp
knows we're trying to exit anyway?".
Because finalizers are only called when an object is destroyed presumably.
Michael
--
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http://www.voidspace.org.uk/blog
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, get the code set
up to be run by regrtest, and then check the code in! I am going to
set PyCon as a hard deadline such that no matter how much more file
churn I have left I will still check it into py3k by then (along with
importlib.import_module() into 2.7).
+1
:-)
Michael
On Thu, Jan 8
This is something of a bugbear on Vista in general. Doing local
web-development with localhost can be really painful until you realise
that switching to 127.0.0.1 solves the problem...
Michael
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o make the changes permanent
unless they are particularly intrusive.
Michael Foord
Alternatively, is it reasonable to create a new branch solely
for the purpose of tracking down one particular problem?
Again, I don't see this sort of thing happening, but it seems
like an attractive strategy, since it a
) and this is presumed to
apply to parts of software like header files and interface descriptions
- which could easily apply to ABCs in Python.
I recommend his book by the way - I'm about half way through so far and
it is highly readable
Michael Foord
--
http://www.ironpythonin
n there are real
annotations you have a conflict on how to indicate that in the
documentation.
Michael
-Brett
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r for anyone who incorporates Python in an existing
MSVC-based development environment.
When in Rome...
There would also be a significant performance cost. The PGO (Profile
Guided Optimisation) compilation of Visual Studio is impressive.
Michael
--
http://www.ironpythoninactio
Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
M.-A. Lemburg writes:
> On 2009-01-20 11:02, Michael Foord wrote:
> > Mere collections of facts are not copyrightable as they are not
> > creative (the basis of copyright)
That's incorrect in the U.S.; what is copyrightable is an *original
work
til a clear winner springs up.
Well, that sounds like an ideal situation to end up in. Is there a
downside other than the work it creates for you?
Michael
-Brett
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27;t think we do users any favours by being cautious in removing /
fixing things in the 3.0 releases.
Michael Foord
--
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http://www.voidspace.org.uk/blog
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for Python 2.7, too.
Don't we have a pretty-print API - and isn't it spelled __str__ ?
Michael Foord
--
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http://www.voidspace.org.uk/blog
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Feldman
"""
I suspect that the use of significant whitespace is too deeply ingrained
in Python for us to change it now - even in Python 3. ;-)
Michael
Raymond
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>>> f(**{'1':2})
{'1': 2}
Is this behavior required somewhere by the Python language spec, or is
it an error that just doesn't happen to be checked, or is it
intentionally undefined whether this is allowed?
Michael
__
TIME
> technically inaccurate?
>
It does mean that users will expect to be able to call with an explicit
timeout=None and get the default behaviour. Just use the numeric value of the
global timeout perhaps?
MIchael Foord
> FWIW, I see similar style (...,[,timeout], kw=val) adopte
TestCase and main and everything should
work fine. Using "import *" is not recommended except at the interactive
interpreter and it doesn't play well with unittest.main which does magic
introspection to find tests to run.
Michael
> class MyTest(TestCase):
>def tes
On 3 Aug 2011, at 22:58, Ethan Furman wrote:
> Michael Foord wrote:
>> On 3 Aug 2011, at 21:36, Ethan Furman wrote:
>>> My apologies for posting here first, but I'm not yet confident enough in my
>>> bug searching fu, and duplicates are a pain.
>>>
>
mented behavior.
http://docs.python.org/dev/library/os.html#os.walk shows a similar example:
for root, dirs, files in os.walk('python/Lib/email'):
# ...
dirs.remove('CVS') # don't visit CVS directories
--
Michael Urman
__
is too late for Python 2.x, it *is* (in my opinion) worth removing
unused and unneeded APIs. Even if the effort to remove them is more than any
effort saved on the part of users it helps other implementations down the road
that no longer need to provide these APIs.
All the best,
Michael Foord
; 'Aaaa Bbbb'
> >>> k[0].swapcase()+k[1:].lower()
> 'Aaaa '
>
>
>> If k is uppercase, previous .upper() is redundant. If k is mixed case, code
>> may have problems.
>
> "May" have problems?
>
>
> pERSONNALLY,
which I don't expect until 2020.
We still have our standard deprecation policy that we can follow in Python 3.
We don't have to wait until Python 4 to remove things. Changing semantics or
syntax is harder because you can't really deprecate. Just removing methods is
straightforward
Does anyone *actually* use .title() for this? (And why not just use the
correct casing in the string literal...)
Michael
> You might say that the protocol "has" to be case-insensitive so
> this is a silly frill:
Not me, sir. My whole point about the "bytes should b
whole branch.
This works pretty well.
All the best,
Michael Foord
Another question: What about the docs? Can we just point people to
docs.python.org and tell them to mentally replace packaging with
distutils2? If that is judged unacceptable, then I’ll synchronize the
docs in the d2 repo, but t
On 15/09/2011 17:23, Éric Araujo wrote:
Le 13/09/2011 18:34, Michael Foord a écrit :
On 13/09/2011 16:57, Éric Araujo wrote:
(IIRC PyPI will require us to play games to have both
2.x and 3.x versions of distutils2.)
What I'm doing for unittest2.
[...]
2) I have a pypi project c
;m not a big fan of skipUnless, but there you go. I find "skip if not"
readable too and always have to "work out" what skipUnless means. It's
probably just that "if" and "if not" are such Python idioms and "unless"
isn't.
Michael
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xception
do_something()
All the best,
Michael Foord
Thanks
Wilfred
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seful distinction... I'm becoming more sympathetic to that view.
All the best,
Michael
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ce for
support would be the pywin32 bug tracker and mailing lists (as they're
not part of core Python).
Michael
I'd like to connect directly with a developer on the project so
that we can work closesly to resolve this issue.
There aren't many Windows devs around here,
correctly as admin (without an obvious good reason).
It would seem that for this use case it is more important that all tests
pass when run as a *non-admin* user.
Michael
Therefore builders should be set up in both configurations, running
the full test suite, to ensure that all code runs
support for older
versions of python at will.
Ditto. unittest2 and the mock test suite both have a subset of this in
for some of the newer Python standard library features they use (plus
putting back into Python 3 some of the things that disappeared like
callable and apply).
All the best,
Mic
file that contains all the bits they need to
> install a distribution.
Just to agree with Paul, a typical Windows Python user will not be able to
install a non-binary version of a distribution that includes C code. Even on
the Mac it is common to distribute binaries.
Michael
>
> My expectation
+ features then projects that also
support Python 3 can still use new features without having to worry
about compatibility (it solves the same problem).
All the best,
Michael Foord
--- Giampaolo
http://code.google.com/p/pyftpdlib/
http://code.google.com/p/psutil/
__
been backported to Python 2.4
(although use of the with statements in the tests themselves will have
to be changed still).
All the best,
Michael Foord
-Toshio
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Hey folks,
The title of the "Global Module Index" for 3.2 documentation is "Python
3.1.3 documentation".
http://docs.python.org/py3k/modindex.html
See the report below (attached screenshot removed).
All the best,
Michael Foord
Original Message
Subjec
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 17:15, Mark Hammond wrote:
> How about abusing the existing flags for this purpose - eg:
>
> % py -3?
> % py -2.7?
I would have expected that to launch an interactive python shell of
the appropriate version. Does it do something else tod
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 20:58, Mark Hammond wrote:
> On 24/10/2011 12:56 PM, Michael Urman wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 17:15, Mark Hammond
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> How about abusing the existing flags for this purpose - eg:
>>>
>>> %
e overrides the hardcoded align property of that type?
--
Michael
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lass__
There must be something else going on here.
All the best,
Michael Foord
Thanks and regards,
Vinay Sajip
[1] http://goo.gl/1Jlbj
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On 19 November 2011 23:11, Vinay Sajip wrote:
> Michael Foord voidspace.org.uk> writes:
>
> > That works fine in Python 3 (mock.Mock does it):
> >
> > >>> class Foo(object):
> > ... @property
> > ... def __class__(self):
> > ... retur
stand correctly, ABCs are great for allowing classes of objects to
pass isinstance checks (etc) - what proxy, lazy and mock objects need is to be
able to allow individual instances to pass different isinstance checks.
All the best,
Michael Foord
> --Guido
>
> On Sat, Nov 19, 2011 at 6
On 20/11/2011 21:41, Guido van Rossum wrote:
On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 10:44 AM, Michael Foord
wrote:
On 20 Nov 2011, at 16:35, Guido van Rossum wrote:
Um, what?! __class__ *already* has a special meaning. Those examples
violate that meaning. No wonder they get garbage results.
The correct
On 25/11/2011 00:20, Jesus Cea wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
When mailing there, I get this error. Not sure where to report.
The address works fine. It would be nice if someone fixed the annoying
bounce however. :-)
Michael
"""
Final-Recipie
ially unwise to base benchmarks on it working :-))
Note that this string optimization hack is still present in Python 3,
but it now acts on *unicode* strings, not bytes.
Ah, yes. That makes sense.
Although for concatenating immutable bytes presumably the same hack
would be *possible*.
ecode instructions: http://bugs.python.org/issue11816
Is it necessary to test parts of PEP 380 through bytecode structures rather
than semantics? Those tests aren't going to be usable by other implementations.
Michael
>
> I find Meador's suggestion to change the name of the new AP
On 26/11/2011 07:46, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote:
On Sat, Nov 26, 2011 at 6:39 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
On Sat, Nov 26, 2011 at 8:14 AM, Michael Foord
wrote:
On 24 Nov 2011, at 04:06, Nick Coghlan wrote:
On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 10:28 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
Mea culpa for not keeping
APIs around can require effort just to keep them
working and may actively *prevent* other changes / improvements.
All the best,
Michael Foord
So, I think we should have a clear and working deprecation policy, and
Ezio's suggestion sounds good to me. There should be a clean way to
state, i
issue it's
not clear to me what needs to be done for it to be accepted (or rejected),
beyond a general "it's a big change".
All the best,
Michael Foord
--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/
May you do good and not evil
May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others
tion (and
even found bugs in Python 3 because of it).
The exception handling is the worst - no compatible syntax between 2.4-5 and
Python 3. So you have to use sys.exc_info. Other than that it isn't too hard /
bad.
All the best,
Michael
> -Barry
> __
rts code that doesn't need converting". Could you
clarify?
Thanks,
Michael
Laurence
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something else?
Michael
--
Nick Coghlan (via Gmail on Android, so likely to be more terse than usual)
On Dec 13, 2011 11:46 PM, "Michael Foord" <mailto:fuzzy...@voidspace.org.uk>> wrote:
On 13/12/2011 13:33, Laurence Rowe wrote:
On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 22
On 13/12/2011 14:28, Laurence Rowe wrote:
On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 14:42:12 +0100, Michael Foord
wrote:
On 13/12/2011 13:33, Laurence Rowe wrote:
On Mon, 12 Dec 2011 22:18:40 +0100, Chris McDonough
wrote:
On Mon, 2011-12-12 at 09:50 -0500, PJ Eby wrote:
As someone who ported WebOb
of Benjamin Peterson's support
package to help write code that works on both 2 and 3. So the idea is
that the conversion isn't just a straight syntax conversion - but that
it [could] generate code using this library.
All the best,
Michael
[1] http://packages.python.org/six/
Beyond t
Hi Guys,
We've been analyzing CPython with our static analysis tool (Sentry)
and a NULL pointer dereference popped up the other day, in
Objects/descrobject.c:
if (descr != NULL) {
Py_XINCREF(type);
descr->d_type = type;
descr->d_name = PyUnicode_InternFromString(name);
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 5:02 AM, Benjamin Peterson wrote:
> 2011/12/17 Michael Mueller :
>>
>> Hopefully someone can take a look and determine the appropriate fix.
>
> Fixed.
>
> --
> Regards,
> Benjamin
Excellent!
--
Mike Mueller
Phone: (401) 405-1525
Ema
still supporting 2.4. The *major* syntax feature you lose
by targeting 2.4 is the with statement, so it will be nice to drop 2.4 support.
The next releases of mock and unittest2 will still support 2.4, but the ones
after that will be 2.5+.
Thankfully tox makes testing across multiple versions
for research projects. They switched to using Python 3 a while ago.
All the best,
Michael Foord
> Mark
>
> On 21/12/2011 6:16 PM, Chris Withers wrote:
>> What's the python-dev view on this?
>>
>> Original Message
>> Subject: Anyone still
original report didn't make it
onto the security list because it was held in a moderation queue).
The same vulnerability was reported against various languages and web
frameworks, and is already fixed in some of them.
Their recommended fix is to randomize the hash function.
All the best
made it a de-facto feature.
But what of the discrepancy between the 'type' metaclass and any other
Python metaclass?
There are many discrepancies between built-in types and any Python
class. Writable attributes are (generally) one of them.
Michael
Given that we haven't had a
to be that way, but it's fine by me as
>> both ways work fine.
>
> I am not sure, that was just try and worked for me, with first option
> suggested by you was throwing same compile error then I tried with this that
> worked :)
The problems compiling Python 3 on th
On 22 Jan 2012, at 17:43, Łukasz Langa wrote:
> Wiadomość napisana przez Michael Foord w dniu 22 sty 2012, o godz. 14:14:
>
>> ./configure CC=gcc-4.2 --prefix=/dev/null --with-pydebug
>
> Why the phony prefix?
Heh, it's what I've always done - I think copied
rts of the standard library after first being a third party library
(sometimes under a different name, e.g. simplejson -> json):
try:
from __preview__ import thing
except ImportError:
import thing
So no need to target a very specific version of Python.
Michael
chee
accessible through __preview__ too?
+1
The point about pickling is one good reason, minimising code breakage
(due to package name changing) is another.
Michael
Benefits for the core development team
--
Currently, the core developers are really reluctant to add
t
will graduate at some point - __preview__ is a place for apis to
stabilise and mature, not a place for dubious libraries that we may or
may not want in the standard library at some point.
Michael
--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/
May you do good and not evil
May you find forgiveness for yourself an
ept ImportError:
import json as json
It's trivial to wrap in a function though - or do the import in one
place and then import the package from there.
Michael
Perhaps the versioned import stuff could be implemented (whatever the
syntax may be), in order that something like this can
view__ adds nothing to the
process.
Sure. __preview__ is for things that *need* previewing.
All the best,
Michael Foord
Even when there are candidates for inclusion with relatively stable
APIs, like regex, we should *assume* that there will be API
differences between __preview__.regex and
f use cases it works fine
(simplejson and json aren't *identical*, but it works for most people).
Michael
try:
result = thing.foo(a, b, c) + thing.bar(x)
except AttributeError:
# Must be the preview version
result = thing.foobar(a, c, b, x)
--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk
tees
in the next release".
+1.
Yep, nice way of putting it - and summing up the virtues of the
approach. (Although I might say "most likely it will move into the main
part of the standard library with full backwards compatibility
guarantees in a future release".)
Michael
Paul.
_
eeds to change because the version of some library has now changed.)
Plus having a package in __preview__ has no bearing on whether or not
the system packages the third party version, so I think it's a bit of a
red-herring.
Michael
On the other hand, __preview__ would clearly signal that
know where you got that impression. :-)
One of the reasons for __preview__ is that it means integrating
libraries with the Python build and test systems, for all platforms.
Packaging for [some-variants-of] Linux only doesn't do anything for this.
All the best,
Michael
-- stuffing the
ard
library is distributed or versioned.
A separate proposal about standard library versioning has been floated
but is *much* more controversial and therefore much less likely to
happen. So I wouldn't hold your breath on it...
All the best,
Michael Foord
___
On 28/01/2012 04:44, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
Michael Foord writes:
> >> Assuming the module is then promoted to the the standard library
proper in
> >> release ``3.X+1``, it will be moved to a permanent location in the
library::
> >>
e for
instances, which may be overridden by an instance attribute on *some*
instances.
All the best,
Michael Foord
Chris
--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/
May you do good and not evil
May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others
May you share freely, never taking more than you giv
is 12% faster.
2to3, which seems to be the only "realistic" benchmark that runs on Py3,
shows no change in speed and uses 10% less memory.
In your first version 2to3 used 28% less memory. Do you know why it's
worse in this version?
Michael
All benchmarks and tests perform
eleases
could include similar links in future.
All the best,
Michael
--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/
May you do good and not evil
May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others
May you share freely, never taking more than you give.
-- the sqlite blessing
http://www.sqlite.org/
gs. There is no single *syntax* that
is compatible with both Python 2 and Python 3 that permits this. (If you use
"u" for Unicode in Python 2 and no prefix for native strings then your code is
Python 3 incompatible, if you use the future import so that your strings are
unicode in
Hello all,
At the Python Language Summit adding the "mock" library to the Python Standard
Library was discussed and agreed. Here is a very brief PEP covering the
decision and rationale.
All the best,
Michael Foord
PEP: 417
Title: Including mock in the Standard Library
Version:
s a context manager). Beyond
that the api is stable. A bunch of Python 2 compatibility code can also be
removed in the standard library version.
All the best,
Michael Foord
> Good luck!
>
> --Guido
>
> On Mon, Mar 12, 2012 at 4:01 PM, Gregory P. Smith wrote:
>&g
thon2 'unicode'
> python3 'bytes' -> python2 '__builtins__.bytes object'
>
It does seem unfortunate that by default it is impossible for a developer to
"do the right thing" as regards pickling / unpickling here. Binary data on
Python 2 being unpickl
I want the highest resolution cross platform measure of
wallclock time - and time.wallclock() looked ideal. If monotonic may not exist
or can fail why would that be better?
Michael
> --
>
> monotonic() has 3 implementations:
> * Windows: QueryPerformanceCounter() with Qu
or pointing it out.
I'm maintaining a "clean" (no Python 2 compatibility code) version in the
standard library. I'll be maintaining mock, so I'd like to be assigned any
issues on it and at least talked to before changes are made. I am maintaining a
backport still, but th
On 14 Mar 2012, at 12:33, Georg Brandl wrote:
> On 14.03.2012 20:25, michael.foord wrote:
>> http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/2fda048ee32a
>> changeset: 75632:2fda048ee32a
>> user:Michael Foord
>> date:Wed Mar 14 12:24:34 2012 -0700
>&
On 14 Mar 2012, at 13:46, Terry Reedy wrote:
> On 3/14/2012 4:22 PM, Michael Foord wrote:
>>
>> On 14 Mar 2012, at 13:08, Terry Reedy wrote:
>>
>>> On 3/14/2012 3:25 PM, michael.foord wrote:
>>>> +# mock.py +# Test tools for mocking and patching
vailable. If *strict* is True, raise an :exc:`OSError` on error or
>> + :exc:`NotImplementedError` if no monotonic clock is available.
>
> This is not clear to me. Why wouldn't it raise OSError on error even with
> strict=False? Please clarify which exception is raised
On 17 Mar 2012, at 15:04, Georg Brandl wrote:
> On 03/17/2012 09:47 PM, Michael Foord wrote:
>>
>> On 17 Mar 2012, at 08:49, Georg Brandl wrote:
>>
>>> On 03/15/2012 01:17 AM, victor.stinner wrote:
>>>> http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/27441e0d6a
On 16 Mar 2012, at 11:54, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 6:27 AM, Michael Foord
> wrote:
>> On the topic of docs mock documentation is about eight pages long. My
>> intention was to strip this down to just the api documentation, along with a
>> lin
hen the text next to it reflows to a new length, the bar can become
longer or shorter than necessary.
On the one hand this makes it hard to get the sidebar content to show
at the bottom of the page; on the other, I believe it mitigates
potential problems if sidebar content is t
On 26 Mar 2012, at 08:11, Georg Brandl wrote:
> On 26.03.2012 00:13, michael.foord wrote:
>> http://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/adc1fc2dc872
>> changeset: 75938:adc1fc2dc872
>> user:Michael Foord
>> date:Sun Mar 25 23:12:55 2012 +0100
>>
ule and pybench
program).
It is this always-having-to-manually-fallback-depending-on-os that I was
hoping your new functionality would avoid. Is time.try_monotonic()
suitable for this usecase?
Michael
As well, certain
kinds of scheduling/timeouts would be better implemented with the C++0x
y) would need to be modified to use the system
database on Windows. This is my (potentially flawed) understanding, anyway.
Michael
>
> //Lennart
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r systems
where another user has locked the clock. Thus the exception cannot
tell you anything more than None tells you. (Of course, if my
assumption is wrong, I'm not sure whether my reasoning still applies.)
--
Michael Urman
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Python
bottom of
> pages). We develop CPython but do not directly manage the website.
Not true. The download pages are administered by the release managers not the
web team.
For the record, the best way of contacting the web team (such as it is) is the
pydotorg-w
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