Re: social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-15 Thread Jonathan Dowland
As others have suggested you should file a bug report. The Chromium maintainers do appear to take privacy seriously and have made several privacy-oriented changes already (see e.g. this bug: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=783999) If you need to find out how to file a bug, please

Re: social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-15 Thread tomas
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 05:47:06PM +0200, pm...@laposte.net wrote: > Hi, the Debian social contract should mandate to warn users of internet > tracking by debian packages like chromium. I do agree that this should be filed as a bug. Please com

Re: social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-14 Thread Bob Bernstein
On Sun, 14 Jun 2015, Sven Arvidsson wrote: On Sun, 2015-06-14 at 17:47 +0200, pm...@laposte.net wrote: debian-user is probably not the right place for this. The linux-elitists list is very involved with these issues, and the list archives are open to public examination: http://zgp.org/m

Re: social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-14 Thread Riley Baird
> Hi, the Debian social contract should mandate to warn users of internet > tracking by debian packages like chromium. The social contract isn't easy to change, but it isn't normally necessary to do so. > I tried everything and I can't turn off some internet tracking

Re: social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-14 Thread Sven Arvidsson
On Sun, 2015-06-14 at 17:47 +0200, pm...@laposte.net wrote: > Hi, the Debian social contract should mandate to warn users of > internet tracking by debian packages like chromium. > > I tried everything and I can't turn off some internet tracking > features of chromium like g

social contract should mandate to warn users of tracking by packages like chromium

2015-06-14 Thread pm190
Hi, the Debian social contract should mandate to warn users of internet tracking by debian packages like chromium. I tried everything and I can't turn off some internet tracking features of chromium like gcm which connects to google servers several times per hour. Anyway, there should

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-14 Thread Andrei POPESCU
quot;up" there, even if we ignore the Social > Contract. This seems to come up from time to time so I have to say: The vote against sysvinit was 7:1 Sysvinit didn't even beat Further Discussion (4:4), which in Debian's voting system means "we would rather restart

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-13 Thread Zenaan Harkness
On 8/13/14, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 09:10:19PM +0200, Slavko wrote: >> Ahoj, >> >> Dňa Mon, 11 Aug 2014 18:01:05 +1200 Chris Bannister >> napísal: >> >> > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: >> > > >> > > Our priorities are our users and free software

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-13 Thread Joel Rees
user base, not a call for one member of the committee to make an arbitrary decision. Things are not functioning correctly "up" there, even if we ignore the Social Contract. Technical issues cannot be claimed to be inherently superior to social issues in any system that is in regular,

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-13 Thread Chris Bannister
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 12:19:09AM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: > On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 8:56 PM, Chris Bannister > wrote: > > On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 03:09:24PM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: > >> Well, yeah, but ask any marriage counselor what tends to happen when > >> one partner decides arbitrarily what

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-13 Thread Chris Bannister
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 09:10:19PM +0200, Slavko wrote: > Ahoj, > > Dňa Mon, 11 Aug 2014 18:01:05 +1200 Chris Bannister > napísal: > > > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: > > > > > > Our priorities are our users and free software > > > > > > We will be guided by the nee

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-11 Thread Slavko
Ahoj, Dňa Mon, 11 Aug 2014 18:01:05 +1200 Chris Bannister napísal: > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: > > > > Our priorities are our users and free software > > > > We will be guided by the needs of our users and the free software > ^ >

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-11 Thread Joel Rees
;> I consider these posts as not OT. Consider Debian social contract: >> > >> > Think again. >> > >> > >> >> Our priorities are our users and free software >> >> >> >> We will be guided by the needs of our users and the

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-11 Thread Zenaan Harkness
On 8/11/14, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 03:09:24PM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: >> On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 3:01 PM, Chris Bannister >> wrote: >> > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: >> >> >> >> I consider these

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-11 Thread Chris Bannister
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 03:09:24PM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: > On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 3:01 PM, Chris Bannister > wrote: > > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: > >> > >> I consider these posts as not OT. Consider Debian social contract: > &g

Re: Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-10 Thread Joel Rees
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 3:01 PM, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: >> >> I consider these posts as not OT. Consider Debian social contract: > > Think again. > > >> Our priorities are our users and free software >

Social Contract (was ... Re: Irony)

2014-08-10 Thread Chris Bannister
On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 09:37:24AM +0200, Slavko wrote: > > I consider these posts as not OT. Consider Debian social contract: Think again. > Our priorities are our users and free software > > We will be guided by the needs of our users and th

Re: Debian social contract - who reports bugs upstream?

2009-01-02 Thread Osamu Aoki
Hi, On Thu, Jan 01, 2009 at 02:34:12PM +1030, Arthur Marsh wrote: > I read this at http://www.debian.org/social_contract : > > 2 We will give back to the free software community YES! ... > It appears that there have been problems with gnu-fdisk that weren't > passed upstream to the mailing lis

Re: Debian social contract - who reports bugs upstream?

2009-01-01 Thread Eugene V. Lyubimkin
Arthur Marsh wrote: [snip] > Are there any ways to improve the reporting of bugs upstream without > over-burdening either the Debian package maintainers or the Debian end > users? Push Debian maintainers to report bugs upstream. We all are volunteers, and not everyone has enough time to maintain s

Debian social contract - who reports bugs upstream?

2008-12-31 Thread Arthur Marsh
I read this at http://www.debian.org/social_contract : 2 We will give back to the free software community When we write new components of the Debian system, we will license them in a manner consistent with the Debian Free Software Guidelines. We will make the best system we can, so that free w

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-02 Thread Johannes Wiedersich
All your assumptions about me and the licence in question are plainly wrong. I don't know how you come around knowing about my licence, European and German law and apparently everything else better than anyone else on the list (and probalby on earth.) Mike McCarty wrote: Johannes Wiedersich w

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-01 Thread Roberto C. Sanchez
Mike McCarty wrote: > Mumia W wrote: > >> >> It's not Social Security that's failing. It's your Republican President >> and Congress that have failed. The entire problem with Social Security's >> funding is that the President cut taxes five times. > This is another one of those myths perpetrated

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-01 Thread Mike McCarty
Mumia W wrote: Social Security is a government program. There's nothing wrong about using taxes to support a government program. There is something wrong with taking money away from one person and giving it to another when the government has no authority (see the Constitution) to do so. And

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-01 Thread Mike McCarty
Steve Lamb wrote: Mumia W wrote: Perhaps, Steve, you should have read this section: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme#Are_national_retirement_programs_Ponzi_schemes.3F That section explains why national retirement schemes are *not* ponzi schemes. What makes you think I didn't

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-01 Thread Mike McCarty
Mumia W wrote: Wulfy wrote: Steve Lamb wrote: Wulfy wrote: Erm. What does "ponzi" mean? I can't find it in any of my dictionaries, so I assume it's American Slang... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme Thanks, Steve. Indeed, thanks Steve. Perhaps, Steve, you should have re

Re: Social Contract

2006-05-01 Thread Erik Persson
han for example windows xp are. As you say, the windows tcpip stack uses bsd licensed code and WHERE NAILED for not producing a the notice. If the code was fully free, how could anyone be nailed in anyway when using it? The fact that the bsd license follows some sort of social contract on how to behav

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-30 Thread hendrik
On Sat, Apr 29, 2006 at 01:34:29PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > Nice way to avoid the point. > > Nope, didn't avoid a thing. As you admit your case was constructed. > Furthermore it did not address what I said. > > > You said, and I quote: > >>> The short, sho

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
Mumia W wrote: > Social Security is not highly suspect. It's not even suspect. It's > simply the most popular social program in U.S. history. Just because it is popular doesn't mean people don't find it suspect. > How does protecting the poor and elderly destroy society? Vote pandering,

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Paul Johnson
On Saturday 29 April 2006 14:51, Steve Lamb wrote: > Because of the Californians stampeding over the border to pay > our state income taxes, pay us for room and board while they do it and in > the end, thank us for the opportunity. Maybe you Oregonians should take > that as a pointer? :P We let

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Mumia W
Steve Lamb wrote: Mumia W wrote: Social Security is a government program. There's nothing wrong about using taxes to support a government program. There is when the program is highly suspect. Like the Alaskan bridge to nowhere. Social Security is not highly suspect. It's not even suspe

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
Paul Johnson wrote: > No, the locals are more than capable of doing that. However, we aren't able > to defend ourselves against large swarms of Californians overrunning us. Ahhh yes, the tired ol' "Blame the Californians" game. Tsk. See, down here in Vegas we got that problem licked. Ever

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Andrew Sackville-West
On Sat, Apr 29, 2006 at 01:34:29PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > Nice way to avoid the point. > > Nope, didn't avoid a thing. As you admit your case was constructed. > Furthermore it did not address what I said. > > > You said, and I quote: > >>> The short, sho

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Paul Johnson
On Saturday 29 April 2006 12:20, Steve Lamb wrote: > Paul Johnson wrote: > > Nice attitude. Vast portions of Oregon and parts of rural Washington led > > the continent in unemployment for the first half of this decade. I'm > > sure you would have rather let one in five people in the pacific > > n

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > Nice way to avoid the point. Nope, didn't avoid a thing. As you admit your case was constructed. Furthermore it did not address what I said. > You said, and I quote: >>> The short, short form is that EICs are issued for people being >>> irresponsible (like, h

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > If I recall correctly when I looked at the Baen site last year, they usually > release on book in a series online. Those that read the first book and like > it > will have to buy the rest of the series. Has this changed? This is up to the author. They can put t

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
Paul Johnson wrote: > Nice attitude. Vast portions of Oregon and parts of rural Washington led the > continent in unemployment for the first half of this decade. I'm sure you > would have rather let one in five people in the pacific northwest die of > starvation instead. Of course not. B

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Steve Lamb
Mumia W wrote: > Social Security is a government program. There's nothing wrong about > using taxes to support a government program. There is when the program is highly suspect. Like the Alaskan bridge to nowhere. > It's part of the upkeep of the society. Don't buy that one, either. Qu

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread hendrik
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 05:45:06PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > > However when an author had the audacity to actually test the theory that > releasing the books for free would increase sales that is exactly what > happened. That author was Eric Flynt published by Baen. Since that day Baen > ha

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Andrew Sackville-West
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 09:00:48PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > how exactly is my employee, who lost his job when his company > > outsourced his job to the far east, being irresponsible? He was a > > model employee, good time in, liked by all etc. Had two kids and a >

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Paul Johnson
On Friday 28 April 2006 14:03, Mike McCarty wrote: > Paul Johnson wrote: > > On Friday 28 April 2006 12:24, Steve Lamb wrote: > >>Yes, and that's why the largest government programs in history have > >>been enacted by a Republican controlled Congress with a sitting > >> Republican President. >

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-29 Thread Paul Johnson
On Friday 28 April 2006 21:00, Steve Lamb wrote: > Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > how exactly is my employee, who lost his job when his company > > outsourced his job to the far east, being irresponsible? He was a > > model employee, good time in, liked by all etc. Had two kids and a > > wife. No

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mumia W
Steve Lamb wrote: Mumia W wrote: Perhaps, Steve, you should have read this section: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme#Are_national_retirement_programs_Ponzi_schemes.3F That section explains why national retirement schemes are *not* ponzi schemes. What makes you think I didn't.

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mumia W
Roberto C. Sanchez wrote: Mumia W wrote: What's not to love about Ben? He was an atheist too. Franklin? An athiest? I don't think so. [...] I stand corrected. I heard it someplace. Maybe it was about one of the other founding fathers, and I got it confused. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email t

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Mumia W wrote: > Perhaps, Steve, you should have read this section: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme#Are_national_retirement_programs_Ponzi_schemes.3F > That section explains why national retirement schemes are *not* ponzi > schemes. What makes you think I didn't. I read the entir

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mumia W
Wulfy wrote: Steve Lamb wrote: Wulfy wrote: Erm. What does "ponzi" mean? I can't find it in any of my dictionaries, so I assume it's American Slang... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme Thanks, Steve. Indeed, thanks Steve. Perhaps, Steve, you should have read this section: http

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > how exactly is my employee, who lost his job when his company > outsourced his job to the far east, being irresponsible? He was a > model employee, good time in, liked by all etc. Had two kids and a > wife. Now he's shlepping burgers for me and gets EIC. How exactly i

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Kevin Mark
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 03:18:57PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: > Paul D. Smith wrote: > >What the GPL is all about is maximizing the amount of available free > >software (where "free" is defined by the traditional freedoms to > >examine, modify, and redistribute, as discussed on the FSF's web site).

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Chris Metzler
On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 23:24:23 -0400 Chris Metzler wrote: > >On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 13:53:17 -0500 >Mike McCarty wrote: >> >> I claimed that you did not have a license, and you state that you did >> not. You used your employer's license, which, if you were doing work >> for your employer, is quite pro

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Kent West
Kent West wrote: Mumia W wrote: What's not to love about Ben? He was an atheist too. Sorry about the messed up attribution. Mumia did not write the "From"; Kent did. From http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/john_remsburg/six_historic_americans/chapter_4.html "In conversation wit

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Chris Metzler
On Fri, 28 Apr 2006 13:53:17 -0500 Mike McCarty wrote: > > I claimed that you did not have a license, and you state that you did > not. You used your employer's license, which, if you were doing work > for your employer, is quite proper. If you were doing your own work, > then you probably used i

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Kent West
Mumia W wrote: What's not to love about Ben? He was an atheist too. From http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/john_remsburg/six_historic_americans/chapter_4.html "In conversation with familiar friends he called himself a Deist or Theist, and he resented a sentence in Mr. Whitefield's j

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andrew Sackville-West
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 07:34:42PM -0700, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 02:42:32PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > > The short, short form is that EICs > > are issued for people being irresponsible (like, having kids while well > > below > > the poverty level), > > > how exa

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Roberto C. Sanchez
Mumia W wrote: > Andy Streich wrote: > >> On Friday 28 April 2006 08:34 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: >> >>> 'll respond to the very last sentence first. I don't know. But >>> you might ask Benjamin Franklin, because he put everything he >>> did into the Public Domain, and lobbied hard to have neither >

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andrew Sackville-West
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 02:42:32PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > The short, short form is that EICs > are issued for people being irresponsible (like, having kids while well below > the poverty level), how exactly is my employee, who lost his job when his company outsourced his job to the far east,

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mumia W
Andy Streich wrote: On Friday 28 April 2006 08:34 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: 'll respond to the very last sentence first. I don't know. But you might ask Benjamin Franklin, because he put everything he did into the Public Domain, and lobbied hard to have neither Copyright nor Patent Law in the USA.

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Gene Heskett wrote: > So would I. But I'll be damned if I'll sit back and let them fix it by > breaking the promise I was made in 1947 when I got an SS card so I > could go to work the first time. If they can do it without upsetting > the systems results, then I'm pretty much all for it.

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Andy Streich wrote: > That does not seem accurate. Royalties from radio play and sales are > significant to many artists. The songwriter I heard said she makes $0.09 > (some sort of average figure) each time a song of hers is played on the radio > and that sort of income was essential for her

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mumia W
Steve Lamb wrote: Paul Johnson wrote: You know nothing of my party or it's politics. Socialists are progressive, not conservative. Socialists are thieves who pass off their practice under a veneer of intellectual doublespeak. No, Republicans are not the least bit socialist. They're anti

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Gene Heskett
On Friday 28 April 2006 20:00, Steve Lamb wrote: >Gene Heskett wrote: >> The pols of course. They are the ones who set this ponzi scheme, >> one that would jail you or I for an extended period if we were >> caught doing it. > >Then your aim is off. They are supposed to answer to the > populat

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andy Streich
On Friday 28 April 2006 03:34 pm, Steve Lamb wrote: > Andy Streich wrote: > > Just the other day I was watching a Senate > > hearing where a songwriter was saying she could not make a living without > > the copyright and IPR laws. And I've wondered a long time about how the > > economy might have

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Gene Heskett wrote: > The pols of course. They are the ones who set this ponzi scheme, one > that would jail you or I for an extended period if we were caught doing > it. Then your aim is off. They are supposed to answer to the population so your beef is with me. > But thats not my proble

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Gene Heskett
On Friday 28 April 2006 17:42, Steve Lamb wrote: >Gene Heskett wrote: >> Are you saying that the social security I get every month is somehow >> free? > >To you? Sure is. Social Security is the only legal ponzi scam > allowed in the US. Your Social Security payments are paid by present > day

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Wulfy
Steve Lamb wrote: Wulfy wrote: Erm. What does "ponzi" mean? I can't find it in any of my dictionaries, so I assume it's American Slang... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme Thanks, Steve. -- Blessings Wulfmann Wulf Credo: Respect the elders. Teach the young. Co-operate with the

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Wulfy wrote: > Erm. What does "ponzi" mean? I can't find it in any of my > dictionaries, so I assume it's American Slang... > "Divided by a common language..." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme -- Steve C. Lamb | But who decides what they dream? PGP Key: 8B6E

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Erik Persson wrote: > As stated earlier, the BSD-licence requires, among other things, that: > 1. Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright > notice, this list of conditions and the following disclaimer. > 2. Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyrigh

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Andy Streich wrote: > Just the other day I was watching a Senate > hearing where a songwriter was saying she could not make a living without the > copyright and IPR laws. And I've wondered a long time about how the economy > might have to change if there were no IPR. The idea has appeal in so

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Erik Persson
Steve Lamb wrote: Christopher Nelson wrote: My biggest problem with BSD-style licenses is that someone can take your work, use it, and then restrict other's access to their improvements. So the GPL restricts their freedom to do just that. That has been my main point from the onset. It is

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Wulfy
Steve Lamb wrote: the only legal ponzi scam Erm. What does "ponzi" mean? I can't find it in any of my dictionaries, so I assume it's American Slang... "Divided by a common language..." -- Blessings Wulfmann Wulf Credo: Respect the elders. Teach the young. Co-operate with the pack. Play w

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Paul D. Smith
%% Mike McCarty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: >> What the GPL is all about is maximizing the amount of available free >> software (where "free" is defined by the traditional freedoms to >> examine, modify, and redistribute, as discussed on the FSF's web site). >> That goal means that some in

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andy Streich
On Friday 28 April 2006 08:34 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: > 'll respond to the very last sentence first. I don't know. But > you might ask Benjamin Franklin, because he put everything he > did into the Public Domain, and lobbied hard to have neither > Copyright nor Patent Law in the USA. He lost his ba

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Gene Heskett wrote: > Are you saying that the social security I get every month is somehow > free? To you? Sure is. Social Security is the only legal ponzi scam allowed in the US. Your Social Security payments are paid by present day workers. Your withholdings were spent as you earned th

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andy Streich
On Friday 28 April 2006 08:18 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: > [snip] > > >   mm> If the fit is good, then fine. For me, the fit is not good, so I > >   mm> don't use it. For people who try to make a living writing > >   mm> software, who are not members of the idle rich, and who cannot > >   mm> afford t

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Christopher Nelson wrote: > My biggest problem with BSD-style licenses is that someone can take your > work, use it, and then restrict other's access to their improvements. So the GPL restricts their freedom to do just that. That has been my main point from the onset. It is not free. It is

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Gene Heskett
On Friday 28 April 2006 15:29, Steve Lamb wrote: >Gene Heskett wrote: >> Well, he could, because its worse than that, 1% of the people here >> control 90% of the wealth according to some figures I heard on >> C-SPAN tonight in congressional testimony. Thats not right, and its >> sure not a democra

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Christopher Nelson wrote: On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 03:18:57PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: You are looking at this incorrectly. The FSF isn't against anyone making money. There are many ways to make money on software that does NOT involve using a proprietary license. Umm, do you presume to

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Christopher Nelson
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 01:40:44PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > Christopher Nelson wrote: > > With Free software, you have the right to modify, pass along code, fork, > > distribute, and feed upstream. The only restriction on those rights is > > that with GPL and similiar you grant them to others. >

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Paul Johnson wrote: On Friday 28 April 2006 12:24, Steve Lamb wrote: Yes, and that's why the largest government programs in history have been enacted by a Republican controlled Congress with a sitting Republican President. Roosevelt was a Republican in name only and nobody disagrees with

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Steve Lamb wrote: Christopher Nelson wrote: With Free software, you have the right to modify, pass along code, fork, distribute, and feed upstream. The only restriction on those rights is that with GPL and similiar you grant them to others. And there's the rub, innit. The only restrict

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Christopher Nelson
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 03:18:57PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: > >You are looking at this incorrectly. The FSF isn't against anyone > >making money. There are many ways to make money on software that does > >NOT involve using a proprietary license. > > Umm, do you presume to speak for the FSF?

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Christopher Nelson wrote: > With Free software, you have the right to modify, pass along code, fork, > distribute, and feed upstream. The only restriction on those rights is > that with GPL and similiar you grant them to others. And there's the rub, innit. The only restriction means that you

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Andy Streich wrote: On Thursday 27 April 2006 09:05 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: You seem very angry that someone doesn't like GPL. If you want to make your software free, then do so. But don't hamper the freedom of those to whom you give it. And don't live under the illusion that GPL'd software is

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Christopher Nelson
On Fri, Apr 28, 2006 at 12:32:11PM -0700, Steve Lamb wrote: > Christopher Nelson wrote: > > Okay. The DFSG are more supportive of developer's rights. > > Again, not true. How exactly is a developer who releases under a non-DSFG > license somehow lower on the totem pole of rights? Both prote

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Paul Johnson
On Friday 28 April 2006 12:24, Steve Lamb wrote: > Yes, and that's why the largest government programs in history have > been enacted by a Republican controlled Congress with a sitting Republican > President. Roosevelt was a Republican in name only and nobody disagrees with that. -- Paul Jo

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Paul D. Smith wrote: %% Mike McCarty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: mm> Isn't that one of the claims of most people who support the use of mm> the GPL? That, since everyone just labors on it for love, or mm> whatever, and that the source is available, then the quality will mm> be better? I

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Steve Lamb wrote: Gene Heskett wrote: Well, he could, because its worse than that, 1% of the people here control 90% of the wealth according to some figures I heard on C-SPAN tonight in congressional testimony. Thats not right, and its sure not a democracy. Of course it's not a democr

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Steve Lamb wrote: Christopher Nelson wrote: Okay. The DFSG are more supportive of developer's rights. Again, not true. How exactly is a developer who releases under a non-DSFG license somehow lower on the totem pole of rights? Both protect the developer's rights. Both describe exactl

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Paul D. Smith
%% Mike McCarty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: mm> Isn't that one of the claims of most people who support the use of mm> the GPL? That, since everyone just labors on it for love, or mm> whatever, and that the source is available, then the quality will mm> be better? I don't know about what

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Christopher Nelson wrote: > Okay. The DFSG are more supportive of developer's rights. Again, not true. How exactly is a developer who releases under a non-DSFG license somehow lower on the totem pole of rights? Both protect the developer's rights. Both describe exactly what is and is not a

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Gene Heskett wrote: > Well, he could, because its worse than that, 1% of the people here > control 90% of the wealth according to some figures I heard on C-SPAN > tonight in congressional testimony. Thats not right, and its sure not > a democracy. Of course it's not a democracy. Anyone wh

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Steve Lamb
Paul Johnson wrote: > You know nothing of my party or it's politics. Socialists are progressive, > not conservative. Socialists are thieves who pass off their practice under a veneer of intellectual doublespeak. > No, Republicans are not the least bit socialist. They're anti-public > heal

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Johannes Wiedersich wrote: I was just going to pass this over, but you have requested that I reply, so I will. [snip included stuff] Mike, as I explained in another message, I used the software legally. If I claimed that you did not have a license, and you state that you did not. You used y

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Paul Scott
Gene Heskett wrote: No, Republicans are not the least bit socialist. They're anti-public healthcare, anti-public education, and think laissez-faire economics benefits everyone instead of just the richest 3% that control 80% of the country's wealth. Republicans are pretty much the Socialist anti

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andy Streich
On Thursday 27 April 2006 09:05 pm, Mike McCarty wrote: > You seem very angry that someone doesn't like GPL. If you want > to make your software free, then do so. But don't hamper the > freedom of those to whom you give it. And don't live under > the illusion that GPL'd software is free. Mike, sur

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: On Thu, Apr 27, 2006 at 09:31:19PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Apr 27, 2006 at 03:53:25PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: There are employers who tolerate this kind of thing, even encourage it to a limited extent. I've spoke to managers w

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Mike McCarty
Mumia W wrote: Mike McCarty wrote: [...] I do not and have not claimed ever that Linux+GNU hamper anyone's freedom. How can an OS hamper anyone's freedom? It seems an impossibility to me. Mike There you go again--bearing false witness--this time to your own words: Look, if I make a mistak

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Johannes Wiedersich
Mike McCarty wrote: Steve Lamb wrote: Mike McCarty wrote: Johannes Wiedersich wrote: I once couldn't read or view my old work after switching employer, because I suddenly didn't have a licence for a certain program any more and all work that was done with that program was more or less lost

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Johannes Wiedersich
Mike McCarty wrote: Steve Lamb wrote: Mike McCarty wrote: Johannes Wiedersich wrote: I once couldn't read or view my old work after switching employer, because I suddenly didn't have a licence for a certain program any more and all work that was done with that program was more or less lost

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Johannes Wiedersich
Mike McCarty wrote: "Social contract" machts nichts here. In fact, for me, the "social contract" aspect of all Linux distros is a drawback to them. I don't want to "change the social order" or "be the downfall of capitalism", or "kill Micr

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Andrew M.A. Cater
On Thu, Apr 27, 2006 at 09:31:19PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >On Thu, Apr 27, 2006 at 03:53:25PM -0500, Mike McCarty wrote: > > > >There are employers who tolerate this kind of thing, even encourage it > >to a limited extent. I've spoke to managers who tell me they'd

Re: Social Contract

2006-04-28 Thread Gene Heskett
On Friday 28 April 2006 02:16, Hal Vaughan wrote: >On Friday 28 April 2006 02:01, Paul Johnson wrote: >> On Thursday 27 April 2006 22:14, Mike McCarty wrote: >> > Well, that's really the context in which I replied. The Right Wing >> > today in the USA are Socialists. >> >> You know nothing of my pa

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