Re: have you seen this inside....

On Sat, 20 Jun 2020 at 10:43, Seeds Notoneofmy wrote: > On 6/20/20 2:26 AM, Anders Andersson wrote: > > Also, next time please respect the time of the thousands of people who > > are going to read this message live or search for it during the next > > years by selecting a more descriptive title..

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Friday 19 June 2020 22:57:44 Dan Ritter wrote: > Weaver wrote: > > I think it's possible to get too politically correct. > > Try this phrase: > > "I think it's possible to get too polite." > > I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone. > > > Why are we attaching a concept lik

Re: technical terms overhaul

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 How about yesList, noList? Or for fans off Cisco IOS ACLs, permitList, denyList? With short aliases ylist, nlist or plist, dlist -- all blessed in an RFC so everybody but Microsoft will include them in their configuration language? -- Glenn Engli

Re: technical terms overhaul

Weaver wrote: > > I think it's possible to get too politically correct. Try this phrase: "I think it's possible to get too polite." I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone. > Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a > serious proposition? Exactl

Re: problems with installer

On [5], 2020-06-19 at 23:12 -0300, Michel Vale Ferreira wrote: > hello. i tried to install a debian 10.4 virtual machine on a debian > 10.4 host. the installer stops at finding mirrors to download you cloud update your packages after install debian. > packages because it doesn't set the dns. pi

problems with installer

hello. i tried to install a debian 10.4 virtual machine on a debian 10.4 host. the installer stops at finding mirrors to download packages because it doesn't set the dns. ping works, but no name resolution

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Sat, 20 Jun 2020, davidson wrote: [snip] Blacklist/whitelist are folksy names for the dual concepts of filter/ideal, respectively. This is false, and I am duly embarrassed. I will see myself out now. -- @almightygenie 8 Jun 2020 | @Windex Thanks, Windex. That’s a relief. Your drink is e

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 20/06/2020 11:19, Larry Martell wrote: On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 7:08 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: I really like "redlist" and "greenlist". Offensive to Native Americans and Martians. And also culturally confusing to some Chinese in which red is a happy colour. As I understand it, Chinese stock

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 20/06/2020 09:45, davidson wrote: On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Dan Ritter wrote: Most things described as master/slave aren't actually very well matched by that metaphor. Source/sink, boss/worker, Woah there. "Team Leader" / "Team Member", please. "Secretary of the Workers' Revolutionary Committee

Re: Buster System hangs, requires hard reboot

I've added my experience to the existing bug 846296. #846296 [e2fsprogs] ext4 checksum error https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=846296

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 20/06/2020 07:14, Eike Lantzsch wrote: instead of (for example on disk drives) "master" and "slave" I like to propose the terms This discussion reminds me of the PC gaming supremacists on the pcmasterrace subreddit . The term "master" has a long his

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Eike Lantzsch wrote: On Friday, 19 June 2020 17:42:51 -04 davidson wrote: On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Eike Lantzsch wrote: On the danger of starting a flame war ... thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian Link? https://gwolf.org/2020/06/on-masters-and-slave

Re: technical terms overhaul

Eike writes: > instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: > "allowlist" and "rejectlist" Yes, that improves communications. The words are no longer and express their meanings quite directly. > instead of (for example on disk drives) "master" and "slave" I like to >

Re: have you seen this inside....

On 6/20/20 2:26 AM, Anders Andersson wrote: Also, next time please respect the time of the thousands of people who are going to read this message live or search for it during the next years by selecting a more descriptive title... Thank you. I will do that next time. Sorry to everyone. Best

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 20-06-2020 06:14, David Wright wrote: > Passlist and faillist, perhaps? Pass list already exists as a two word > phrase, so people are used to saying it. Oh, I don't know. This introduces judgement and the concept of failure. This could negatively impact on any number of personalities. (tongue

Re: have you seen this inside....

On Sat, Jun 20, 2020 at 12:51 AM Seeds Notoneofmy wrote: > > a debian buster machine? > > ATI Radeon HD5450 PCI-e > > https://www.amazon.de/Sapphire-Radeon-HD5450-Grafikkarte-Speicher/dp/B0036DD4CO > > If so, how did you get it working, please? 1. Insert into computer. 2. Boot. If this doesn't w

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 7:34 PM Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020, 6:20 PM Larry Martell > wrote: > >> On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 7:08 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: >> >>> >>> I really like "redlist" and "greenlist". >> >> >> Offensive to Native Americans and Martians. >> > > Are you N

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020, 6:20 PM Larry Martell wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 7:08 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: > >> >> I really like "redlist" and "greenlist". > > > Offensive to Native Americans and Martians. > Are you Native American, like my son? >

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 7:08 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > I really like "redlist" and "greenlist". Offensive to Native Americans and Martians. >

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:12:27 -0600, Tom Dial wrote: > I notice that tasksel (= /usr/bin/tasksel) is a Perl program in which it > appears the "cmd" to be executed once selections are made (line 24 from > the end) is > > apt-get -q -y -o APT::Install-Recommends=true -o \ > APT::Get::AutomaticRemo

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Friday, 19 June 2020 17:42:51 -04 davidson wrote: > On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > On the danger of starting a flame war ... > > thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian > > Link? https://gwolf.org/2020/06/on-masters-and-slaves-whitelists-and-blacklists.html I th

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Friday, 19 June 2020 16:32:19 -04 Paul Johnson wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 2:14 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > On the danger of starting a flame war ... > > thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian > > > > instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the te

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Friday, June 19, 2020 05:42:51 PM davidson wrote: > On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > On the danger of starting a flame war ... > > thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian > > Link? I'm not the OP (I'm sitting in the peanut gallery). Google worked, sort of -- ap

have you seen this inside....

a debian buster machine? ATI Radeon HD5450 PCI-e https://www.amazon.de/Sapphire-Radeon-HD5450-Grafikkarte-Speicher/dp/B0036DD4CO If so, how did you get it working, please? Best wishes

Re: technical terms overhaul

Gene Heskett wrote: > On Friday 19 June 2020 15:37:51 Brian wrote: > > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > > What do you think? > > > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? > > I got the impression the target is a more PC terminology in todays

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Friday 19 June 2020 15:37:51 Brian wrote: > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > What do you think? > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? I got the impression the target is a more PC terminology in todays environment. Cheers, Gene Heskett -

Re: How long will this take?

On 2020-06-18 19:13, David Wright wrote: On Fri 12 Jun 2020 at 07:51:30 (-0400), Michael Stone wrote: On Thu, Jun 11, 2020 at 08:52:10PM -0500, David Wright wrote: The only unaddressed point in my use case is the prevention of a high-water mark, because zeroing the drive achieves precisely th

Re: technical terms overhaul

> Most things described as master/slave aren't actually very well > matched by that metaphor. Source/sink, boss/worker, > dispatcher/receiver may be more accurate. In my understanding, master/slave and boss/worker describe pretty much the same (a relationship of power asymmetry, being generous, an

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Dan Ritter wrote: [snip] Most things described as master/slave aren't actually very well matched by that metaphor. Source/sink, boss/worker, Woah there. "Team Leader" / "Team Member", please. -- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12518471 alexk already addressed your con

Re: technical terms overhaul

https://mywiki.wooledge.org/BashProgramming/04?action=diff&rev2=10&rev1=9 I went with "blocklist" because it's so close to the original term that it should be easily understood. Then, to match that, I chose "passlist" for the other one. It's a less obvious choice, and a different winner may even

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, 19 Jun 2020, Eike Lantzsch wrote: On the danger of starting a flame war ... thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian Link? instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: "allowlist" and "rejectlist" shitlist and shortlist. Santa's naugh

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 16:03:24 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:56:06PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike La

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020, 15:14 Eike Lantzsch wrote: > On the danger of starting a flame war ... > thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian > > instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: > "allowlist" and "rejectlist" > instead of (for example on disk

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On 19.06.20 23:12, Tom Dial wrote: On 6/19/20 09:28, Brian wrote: On Thu 18 Jun 2020 at 14:15:00 -0500, David Wright wrote: On Wed 17 Jun 2020 at 20:48:50 (+0100), Brian wrote: AFAICT, it appears Recommends are *always* installed using the Installer, irrespective of preseeding. Not *someti

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On 6/19/20 09:28, Brian wrote: > On Thu 18 Jun 2020 at 14:15:00 -0500, David Wright wrote: > >> On Wed 17 Jun 2020 at 20:48:50 (+0100), Brian wrote: >>> >>> AFAICT, it appears Recommends are *always* installed using the Installer, >>> irrespective of preseeding. Not *sometimes*. >> >> One or tw

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 6/19/2020 4:28 PM, Marco Möller wrote: On 19.06.20 21:14, Eike Lantzsch wrote: On the danger of starting a flame war ... thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: "allowlist" and "rejectlist" inste

Re: technical terms overhaul

Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > > > > What do you think? > > > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? > > If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 2:14 PM Eike Lantzsch wrote: > On the danger of starting a flame war ... > thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian > > instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: > "allowlist" and "rejectlist" > instead of (for example on d

Re: technical terms overhaul

On 19.06.20 21:14, Eike Lantzsch wrote: On the danger of starting a flame war ... thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: "allowlist" and "rejectlist" instead of (for example on disk drives) "master" and

Re: "NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT"

On 6/19/20 9:28 PM, Seeds Notoneofmy wrote: Thanks a lot. And here's that output: 05:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: NVIDIA Corporation G73 [GeForce 7600 GT] [10de:0391] (rev a1) Best I guess Hans was right, after all. This is what Debian asked to do Version 304.137 (legacy

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 16:03:24 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:56:06PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzs

Re: How to build GCC for a specific machine using pbuilder?

Mikhail Morfikov wrote: > I know, but have you ever seen the debian/ dir in the gcc sources? Take a > look here[1]. > Until now I have not, but what is exactly the problem? You have what you need in the beginning include debian/rules.defs include debian/rules.unpack include debian/rules.patch

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:09:36PM +, ghe2001 wrote: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA256 > > Alist and Flist? "A-list" already has a different meaning. (I've also heard "B-list" in that same context.) "A" and "F" as antonyms is too US-centric as well. Other school systems d

Re: technical terms overhaul

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Alist and Flist? -- Glenn English -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: ProtonMail wsBcBAEBCAAGBQJe7Rt5AAoJEJ/XhjGCrIwyqZ8IAKkZjpfw1m4Gu1ssBp3Q SeL1uf3eaclgrqPYWPG/Nr5jcvDhcMrbFLnBC8mDHs9t0hiykju6QTUfdLuI cLL4uVaiC/Ef+ESQdn3gEPdQd/EFlrb1xOFyUeYkaL

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:56:06PM +0100, Brian wrote: > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > > > > > > What do you think? > > > > > > If we kne

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > > > > What do you think? > > > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? > > If Eike is tryi

Re: technical terms overhaul

Greetings! I think that's a wonderful idea! It's about time we got rid of terms like that. The terms might need some work but they are definitely an improvement on the previous ones. And this matters regardless of context. Cheers, Francisco On Fri, 2020-06-19 at 15:14 -0400, Ei

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote: > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > > > What do you think? > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is... well, it's something. But you'll

Re: technical terms overhaul

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote: > What do you think? If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link? -- Brian.

Re: How to build GCC for a specific machine using pbuilder?

On 19/06/2020 18:36, deloptes wrote: > Mikhail Morfikov wrote: > >> I've read something about setting flags like: --enable-languages= or >> --disable-multilib , which I think would speed the whole process up, but >> unfortunately I have no idea which file in the debian/ dir I should change >> to b

Re: "NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT"

On 6/17/20 1:52 PM, Greg Wooledge wrote: Because you didn't use "lspci -nn". See alsohttps://bugs.debian.org/929984 Thanks a lot. And here's that output: 05:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: NVIDIA Corporation G73 [GeForce 7600 GT] [10de:0391] (rev a1) Best

technical terms overhaul

On the danger of starting a flame war ... thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms: "allowlist" and "rejectlist" instead of (for example on disk drives) "master" and "slave" I like to propose the terms: "lea

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 06:23:00 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote: > On 06/18/2020 10:25 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > On Mi, 17 iun 20, 06:51:18, Richard Owlett wrote: > > > > > > The purpose is to determine if I want to do future installs debootstrap. > > > I attempted to use debootstrap a few years a

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

Hello, On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 09:30:30AM -0500, David Wright wrote: > Why not start with a minimal working system, even adding a few > select tools, and then see what isn't necessary for your own > minimalist system. Now you can try removing them from a *working* > system and, should you go too f

Re: How to build GCC for a specific machine using pbuilder?

Mikhail Morfikov wrote: > I've read something about setting flags like: --enable-languages= or > --disable-multilib , which I think would speed the whole process up, but > unfortunately I have no idea which file in the debian/ dir I should change > to build the GCC for my machine only. Any suggest

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On Thu 18 Jun 2020 at 14:15:00 -0500, David Wright wrote: > On Wed 17 Jun 2020 at 20:48:50 (+0100), Brian wrote: > > > > AFAICT, it appears Recommends are *always* installed using the Installer, > > irrespective of preseeding. Not *sometimes*. > > One or two counterexamples are: > > openssh-server

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 06:15:48 +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Mi, 17 iun 20, 20:48:50, Brian wrote: > > > > debootstrap is only run during the installation of the base system. It > > installs recommended packages. That is in contradiction to what the > > Manual says. > > For "regular" use deb

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 06:23:00 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote: > On 06/18/2020 10:25 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > On Mi, 17 iun 20, 06:51:18, Richard Owlett wrote: > > > > > > The purpose is to determine if I want to do future installs debootstrap. > > > I attempted to use debootstrap a few years

How to build GCC for a specific machine using pbuilder?

I wanted to change the GCC source a little bit by adding some patches that aren't available in Debian. I downloaded the Debian GCC source via "apt-get source" . I tried to build the source in the Debian way (using pbuilder) just to test how much time would it take. I gave up after 2h because pro

Re: Disabling recommends - was [Re: bash-completion pros/cons]

On 06/18/2020 10:25 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: On Mi, 17 iun 20, 06:51:18, Richard Owlett wrote: The purpose is to determine if I want to do future installs debootstrap. I attempted to use debootstrap a few years ago and understand it will take some time/effort to learn it. If you are going to

Re: KDE run Dolphin as root?

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 05:54:38AM +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Mi, 17 iun 20, 10:55:55, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > > > Making things user friendly (something we *gotta* do) means sometimes > > taking decisions for the user. Where's the limit? Where's too much > > (authoritarian software)? W