Re: How to do this ?

2014-10-12 Thread Jonathan Dowland
On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 09:40:44PM +0200, Erwan David wrote: > The mount unit requires the device to mount. How to do this with a luks > disk ? And how to mount hen, with the password entered in the ssh > session and not on the console ? It would be something like 'sudo systemctl start my-mount-se

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Reco
Hi. On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 02:53:37 +0200 lee wrote: > Reco writes: > > > 3) User Alice goes away, but keeps her session in place, locking the > > screen. > > > > 4) User Bob logs in another X session. > > How does Bob log in while the screen is locked? Either by selecting 'Switch session' in

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Jonathan Dowland
On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 09:05:14PM -0400, Jerry Stuckle wrote: > Among other things, legitimate MTAs have MX records. Not necessarily. In the absence of an MX record an A record is perfectly legitimate. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubsc

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 1:38 PM, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 07:53:03AM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: >> 2014/10/13 2:14 "Andrei POPESCU" : >> > >> > On Du, 12 oct 14, 10:30:52, The Wanderer wrote: >> > > On 10/12/2014 at 10:07 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: >> > > >> > > > Any program t

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Chris Bannister
On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 07:53:03AM +0900, Joel Rees wrote: > 2014/10/13 2:14 "Andrei POPESCU" : > > > > On Du, 12 oct 14, 10:30:52, The Wanderer wrote: > > > On 10/12/2014 at 10:07 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > > > > > > Any program that requires additional scripting just to get it running > > > >

Re: Prolem with external monitor

2014-10-12 Thread Bret Busby
On 12/10/2014, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 23:09:20, Bret Busby wrote: >> > >> > Definitely, I'm using my TV as external monitor sometimes. Could you >> > please attach your Xorg.0.log? Inlining works as well if you take care >> > not to break long lines. >> >> What is the path to th

Re: Problem with external monitor

2014-10-12 Thread Bret Busby
On 10/10/2014, Bret Busby wrote: > This will probably show as a new thread, due to me correcting a > spelling error in the Subject field of the message. > > On 08/10/2014, Joe wrote: >> On Wed, 8 Oct 2014 15:23:55 +0800 >> Bret Busby wrote: >> >>> Hello. >>> >>> I have a 23" monitor, that I want

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Jerry Stuckle
On 10/12/2014 10:24 PM, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > >> Among other things, legitimate MTAs have MX records. Anti-spam routines > > Who prevents a MUA from having an MX record and sending a HELO that > matches the RDNS entry? And what are these "other things" you're > referring to? >

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Jerry Stuckle writes: >> On 10/12/2014 9:56 AM, lee wrote: >>> Jerry Stuckle writes: >> >>> If you don't know the difference between an MTA and an MUA, there is no >>> way I can help you. >> >> I'm not asking what the difference is but what difference it makes when >> this setting is involved.

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Jerry Stuckle writes: > Among other things, legitimate MTAs have MX records. Anti-spam routines Who prevents a MUA from having an MX record and sending a HELO that matches the RDNS entry? And what are these "other things" you're referring to? -- Again we must be afraid of speaking of daemon

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Harry Putnam writes: > lee writes: > > [...] > > Thanks for the tips. > >>> SMTP>> EHLO 2xd > >> That's an invalid helo string. > > Is a valid one made up of just the full fqdn? See https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2821#section-4.1.1.1 It says to either use the fqdn or, if not possible, an IP

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Harry Putnam writes: > Martin Read writes: > >> On 12/10/14 14:52, lee wrote: >>> Harry Putnam writes: >>> Can any of you experienced exim4 hands interpret this output? >>> >>> Reading RFC-821 would tell you more. >> >> Reading RFC 2821 would be even better, since RFC 821 is obsoleted by >

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Jonathan Dowland writes: > On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 02:45:44PM -0400, Harry Putnam wrote: >> > And if so, is that not acquired from /etc/hosts? > snip >> Egad ... I just noticed that was from a different machine... but the >> format is the same on all of mine. So still should stand as something

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Jerry Stuckle
On 10/12/2014 2:11 PM, Brian wrote: > On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 18:45:42 +0200, lee wrote: > >> Martin Read writes: >> >>> On 12/10/14 15:53, lee wrote: And when they are filtered, does the sender get a message telling him that their message hasn't been delivered? >>> >>> The requirement in

Re: MTAs denying messages (was: Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 9:24 AM, lee wrote: > Joel Rees writes: > >> (But in this case, absolutely requiring a response would be building a >> DOS and potential privacy vulnerability into the message >> infrastructure. The RFCs really should be stored with a summary of >> relevant comments.) > >

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Jerry Stuckle
On 10/12/2014 1:37 PM, Brian wrote: > On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 15:56:05 +0200, lee wrote: > >> Jerry Stuckle writes: >> >>> If you don't know the difference between an MTA and an MUA, there is no >>> way I can help you. >> >> I'm not asking what the difference is but what difference it makes when >>

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Jerry Stuckle
On 10/12/2014 10:18 AM, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > >> On 10/8/2014 8:42 PM, lee wrote: >>> Jerry Stuckle writes: >>> On 10/6/2014 7:30 PM, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > >> For instance, MUAs typically connect on port 587 (at least that is the >> recommendat

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 1:39 AM, Martin Read wrote: > On 12/10/14 01:43, lee wrote: >> >> Reco writes: >> >>> >>> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/tree/src/core/dbus-manager.c?id=3731acf1acfb4a6eb68374a5b137f3b368f63381#n638 >> >> >> Ah, this is a wonderful example :) My assumptions a

MTAs denying messages (was: Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Joel Rees writes: > (But in this case, absolutely requiring a response would be building a > DOS and potential privacy vulnerability into the message > infrastructure. The RFCs really should be stored with a summary of > relevant comments.) Could you explain how an MTA would create a privacy vul

Re: piece of mind (Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
On Mon, Oct 13, 2014 at 7:04 AM, lee wrote: > Bas Wijnen writes: > >> [Moving this to -project, where it belongs; please follow up only >> there, not on -user or -devel.] Uhm, might I ask, ${what}-project ? Oh. https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2014/10/ Is that going to be appreciated?

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 11:28 PM, lee wrote: > Steve Litt writes: > >> A) Tell everyone it's a moderated list >> B) Send the poster a short reason why his post has been moderated. > > It would be against RFC-821 to silently drop messages. That's why RFCs aren't/shouldn't be consider hard standar

Re: Synaptic slow when Caribou is running after Gnome-shell update

2014-10-12 Thread Michael Biebl
Am 13.10.2014 um 00:21 schrieb Michael Biebl: > Am 12.10.2014 um 19:01 schrieb Luca Perico: >> Hi >> After 3,14 gnome shell update (i use debian jessie) i have see synaptic >> p.m, very slow to show the package list at startup and also when i change >> the package list (i.e "all" to "removable" ev

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Marty
On 10/08/2014 09:36 AM, The Wanderer wrote: On 10/08/2014 at 09:18 AM, Steve Litt wrote: On Wed, 8 Oct 2014 12:16:25 +0300 Andrei POPESCU wrote: I was specifically asking about a reference for "Thorsten Glaser was ordered not to bring up alternate inits...". I'll restate the URL I gave in

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
2014/10/13 2:45 "Steve Litt" : > > On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 09:33:43 +0100 > Martin Read wrote: > > > On 12/10/14 04:12, Peter Zoeller wrote: > > > But the nice > > > thing is shell scripting is simplistic easy to learn and understand. > > > > I refer the audience to David A. Wheeler's essay[1] on how

Re: piece of mind (Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Bas Wijnen writes: > [Moving this to -project, where it belongs; please follow up only > there, not on -user or -devel.] > > On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 06:18:01PM +0200, lee wrote: >> Why doesn't Debian just do a GR on this issue? > > Because for a GR, a member of Debian has to request it and it nee

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrei POPESCU
On Du, 12 oct 14, 18:47:09, lee wrote: > Andrei POPESCU writes: > > > On Mi, 08 oct 14, 16:01:37, Jonathan Dowland wrote: > >> > >> The tech-ctte exploration was extremely thorough, entirely transparent and > >> I > > > > In addition, the tech-ctte took special precautions to make sure their >

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
2014/10/13 2:14 "Andrei POPESCU" : > > On Du, 12 oct 14, 10:30:52, The Wanderer wrote: > > On 10/12/2014 at 10:07 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > > > > Any program that requires additional scripting just to get it running > > > is insufficiently advanced. > > > > > > (you can quote me on that) > > >

Re: Newbie friendly security and firewall docs (cookbook?)

2014-10-12 Thread songbird
just as a general comment, ufw is workable almost out of the box, it has a gui interface gufw. a while ago i used the arno-iptables- firewall script as that also did what i needed to have done. my problem is that i tend to not do much with things once they are set up and working so whatever

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Joel Rees
2014/10/12 23:07 "Andrei POPESCU" : > > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 21:40:49, Steve Litt wrote: > > > > From my viewpoint, shellscripts were never intended to be big, huge > > programs. To me, they just glue together commands, and have a few > > rudimentary branching and looping constructs. > > Isn't that li

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Andrei POPESCU
On Du, 12 oct 14, 14:24:32, Steve Litt wrote: > > Because it can run in the foreground, it's a prime candidate for > daemontools (or one of the daemontools-inspired programs like nosh, > etc). $ apt-cache show nosh E: No packages found > So if you don't like brand new top level directories, igno

Re: Synaptic slow when Caribou is running after Gnome-shell update

2014-10-12 Thread Michael Biebl
Am 12.10.2014 um 19:01 schrieb Luca Perico: > Hi > After 3,14 gnome shell update (i use debian jessie) i have see synaptic > p.m, very slow to show the package list at startup and also when i change > the package list (i.e "all" to "removable" even with a short package list). > If i stop Caribou S

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 07:42:58 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > On 13/10/2014 5:48 AM, Brian wrote: > > Not a single one of these people have a *genuine* problem with systemd > > on Debian. The first port of call for genuine problems with systemd is > > the mailing list at pkg-systemd-maintainers

Re: question about s ystemd

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 22:34:22 +0100, Brian wrote: Having a body to a mail is much better. (Or maybe not if the content is of no interest. :)) On Sat 11 Oct 2014 at 21:37:50 -0700, koanhead wrote:

Re: question about s ystemd

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
-- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https://lists.debian.org/12102014223323.1fb1b60c1...@desktop.copernicus.demon.co.uk

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 14:45:44 -0400, Harry Putnam wrote: > Harry Putnam writes: > > > lee writes: > > > > [...] > > > > Thanks for the tips. > > > >>> SMTP>> EHLO 2xd > > > >> That's an invalid helo string. > > > > Is a valid one made up of just the full fqdn? > > > > And if so, is that not

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 19:56:08 +0100, Jonathan Dowland wrote: > On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 02:45:44PM -0400, Harry Putnam wrote: > > > And if so, is that not acquired from /etc/hosts? > snip > > Egad ... I just noticed that was from a different machine... but the > > format is the same on all of min

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Miles Fidelman
On 10/11/2014 12:49 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: On Sb, 11 oct 14, 12:19:29, Marty wrote: >Could it be that a modular design for such complex tasks becomes too >difficult to *do it right*? I don't know, but I think given its history, the burden of proof is on monolithic, not modular design. A bet

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrew McGlashan
On 13/10/2014 5:48 AM, Brian wrote: > On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 05:02:15 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > Not a single one of these people have a *genuine* problem with systemd > on Debian. The first port of call for genuine problems with systemd is > the mailing list at pkg-systemd-maintainers.lists.

Re: alternative file systems (was: Re: lvm: creating a snapshot)

2014-10-12 Thread John Holland
http://zfsonlinux.org/faq.html#WhatKernelVersionsAreSupported On October 10, 2014 9:20:50 PM EDT, lee wrote: >John Holland writes: > >> I'm having very good results using their repo and DKMS system to >build >> support into kernel modules. It's very easy to set up. I'm using it >> with Linux 3.2

Re: alternative file systems

2014-10-12 Thread John Holland
I've been running Zfsonlinux.org zfs on debian for maybe two years. I don't have root fs on zfs. I keep a working copy of the system dirs I have mounted on zfs on ext3. (Var and usr). ONE time, the dkms had problems and I was glad I had those extra copies (rsync from the zfs ones in a cron job)

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Marty
On 10/11/2014 12:49 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: On Sb, 11 oct 14, 12:19:29, Marty wrote: >Could it be that a modular design for such complex tasks becomes too >difficult to *do it right*? I don't know, but I think given its history, the burden of proof is on monolithic, not modular design. A bet

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Harry Putnam
Joe writes: [...] >> (I'm not sure if this output means it worked or it failed. I can tell >> you that nothing is showing up at the other end) >> >> Can any of you experienced exim4 hands interpret this output? >> Did the Authentication work or fail? > > The message was transmitted and accepte

Re: How to do this ?

2014-10-12 Thread Erwan David
Le 11/10/2014 18:45, Steve Litt a écrit : > On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 13:38:05 +0300 > Andrei POPESCU wrote: > >> On Vi, 10 oct 14, 19:51:50, Erwan David wrote: >>> I want to have a system which boots, and starts a subset of daemons. >>> >>> Then afterward I ssh to it, do something which 1) mount an enc

Re: How to do this ?

2014-10-12 Thread Erwan David
Le 11/10/2014 20:20, Jonathan Dowland a écrit : >> On 10 Oct 2014, at 18:51, Erwan David wrote: >> >> how can I do this with systemd ? > You'd write a systemd unit for the mount operation (there's a mount type) > which wasn't hooked into the default multiuser target. The mount unit requires the

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Joe
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 19:48:29 +0100 Brian wrote: > > Not a single one of these people have a *genuine* problem with systemd > on Debian. The first port of call for genuine problems with systemd > is the mailing list at > pkg-systemd-maintainers.lists.alioth.debian.org. > I don't expect this on

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Joe
On Sun, 05 Oct 2014 19:18:33 -0400 Harry Putnam wrote: Sorry, I missed this thread originally. > > (I'm not sure if this output means it worked or it failed. I can tell > you that nothing is showing up at the other end) > > Can any of you experienced exim4 hands interpret this output? > Did t

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 21:07:11 +0200, Erwan David wrote: > Le 12/10/2014 21:01, Brian a écrit : > > > > http://lists.alioth.debian.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo > > > > Do you have a link which says otherwise? > > > I did a mismatxh with the liste on freedesktop.org > > However my point stays th

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Jonathan Dowland
On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 09:07:11PM +0200, Erwan David wrote: > However my point stays the saem : those are not lists for system > administrators, but foir systemd maiuntainers. I am not a systemd > maintainer, thus this list is not for me. > > systemd is of interedt for ALL debian users, do you th

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:16:54 -0700 Don Armstrong wrote: > On Sun, 12 Oct 2014, Steve Litt wrote: > > This essay practically screams out for somebody to write a C program > > that takes an argument of an arbitrary string, finds all files in a > > directory, and returns a long string with those fil

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Erwan David
Le 12/10/2014 21:01, Brian a écrit : > On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 20:50:00 +0200, Erwan David wrote: > >> Le 12/10/2014 20:48, Brian a écrit : >>> On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 05:02:15 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: >>> > You seem to be ignoring some facts: Believe me, I tried to ignore all the noise

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 20:50:00 +0200, Erwan David wrote: > Le 12/10/2014 20:48, Brian a écrit : > > On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 05:02:15 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > > > >>> You seem to be ignoring some facts: > >> Believe me, I tried to ignore all the noise of the systemd threads, then > >> I decid

Re: piece of mind (Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread Bas Wijnen
[Moving this to -project, where it belongs; please follow up only there, not on -user or -devel.] On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 06:18:01PM +0200, lee wrote: > Why doesn't Debian just do a GR on this issue? Because for a GR, a member of Debian has to request it and it needs to be seconded by at least 5

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Jonathan Dowland
On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 02:45:44PM -0400, Harry Putnam wrote: > > And if so, is that not acquired from /etc/hosts? snip > Egad ... I just noticed that was from a different machine... but the > format is the same on all of mine. So still should stand as something > to critique/ Debian's exim4 wil

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 19:02:08 +0100 Martin Read wrote: > On 12/10/14 18:13, John Hasler wrote: > > Martin Read writes: > >> I'm not seeing a serious problem with that function. > > > > You have no problem with an 1800 line function? > > The thing that you are asking me if it is the case is not th

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Harry Putnam
Harry Putnam writes: > lee writes: > > [...] > > Thanks for the tips. > >>> SMTP>> EHLO 2xd > >> That's an invalid helo string. > > Is a valid one made up of just the full fqdn? > > And if so, is that not acquired from /etc/hosts? > > /etc/hosts > > 127.0.0.1dv.local.lan dvl

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Erwan David
Le 12/10/2014 20:48, Brian a écrit : > On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 05:02:15 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > >>> You seem to be ignoring some facts: >> Believe me, I tried to ignore all the noise of the systemd threads, then >> I decided to look a bit further -- perhaps you should too. >> >>> - you don't

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Mon 13 Oct 2014 at 05:02:15 +1100, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > > You seem to be ignoring some facts: > > Believe me, I tried to ignore all the noise of the systemd threads, then > I decided to look a bit further -- perhaps you should too. > > > - you don't speak for the users, at least not for

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Ansgar Burchardt
Don Armstrong writes: > On Sun, 12 Oct 2014, Steve Litt wrote: >> This essay practically screams out for somebody to write a C program >> that takes an argument of an arbitrary string, finds all files in a >> directory, and returns a long string with those files separated by the >> arbitrary strin

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Harry Putnam
Martin Read writes: > On 12/10/14 14:52, lee wrote: >> Harry Putnam writes: >> >>> Can any of you experienced exim4 hands interpret this output? >> >> Reading RFC-821 would tell you more. > > Reading RFC 2821 would be even better, since RFC 821 is obsoleted by > RFC 2821. Thanks. I pounded thr

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Harry Putnam
lee writes: I accidentally let my prior response get away before I remembered to ask these questions. [...] >> LOG: MAIN >> <= ha...@2xd.local.lan U=harry P=local S=569 >> $ delivering 1Xauru-0003TT-Fh >> R: smarthost for rea...@newsguy.com >> T: remote_smtp_smarthost for rea...@newsguy.com

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 17:07:01 +0300 Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 21:40:49, Steve Litt wrote: > > > > From my viewpoint, shellscripts were never intended to be big, huge > > programs. To me, they just glue together commands, and have a few > > rudimentary branching and looping constru

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Harry Putnam
lee writes: [...] Thanks for the tips. >> SMTP>> EHLO 2xd > That's an invalid helo string. Is a valid one made up of just the full fqdn? And if so, is that not acquired from /etc/hosts? /etc/hosts 127.0.0.1dv.local.lan dvlocalhost 10.0.0.9 dv.local.lan dv

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 15:33:48 +0300 Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 17:41:28, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 22:28:31 +0300 > > Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > > > > > > Really? How do you write an initscript that restarts your daemon > > > automatically in case it fails for som

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Miles Fidelman
Andrei POPESCU wrote: On Sb, 11 oct 14, 21:40:49, Steve Litt wrote: From my viewpoint, shellscripts were never intended to be big, huge programs. To me, they just glue together commands, and have a few rudimentary branching and looping constructs. Isn't that like buying IKEA furniture, but whe

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 18:47:09 +0200, lee wrote: > Andrei POPESCU writes: > > > On Mi, 08 oct 14, 16:01:37, Jonathan Dowland wrote: > >> > >> The tech-ctte exploration was extremely thorough, entirely transparent and > >> I > > > > In addition, the tech-ctte took special precautions to make su

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Don Armstrong
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014, Steve Litt wrote: > This essay practically screams out for somebody to write a C program > that takes an argument of an arbitrary string, finds all files in a > directory, and returns a long string with those files separated by the > arbitrary string. You seem to be looking fo

Re: implicit linkage (was: Re: Effectively criticizing decisions you disagree with in Debian)

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 19:06:11 +0900 Joel Rees wrote: > Hmm. Let's comment that for people newer to scripting than I am. > > On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 6:28 AM, Steve Litt > wrote: > > ### RUN THE DAEMON ### > > exec envuidgid slitt envdir ./env setuidgid slitt \ > > /d/at/python/littcron/l

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 18:45:42 +0200, lee wrote: > Martin Read writes: > > > On 12/10/14 15:53, lee wrote: > >> And when they are filtered, does the sender get a message telling him > >> that their message hasn't been delivered? > > > > The requirement in RFC 2821 (the successor to RFC 821 which

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrew McGlashan
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 13/10/2014 4:22 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Lu, 13 oct 14, 02:50:18, Andrew McGlashan wrote: >> There is an amazing level of resistance to care what us users and >> sysadmins think of the changes dictated by the vote of the Tech CTTE and >> suc

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Martin Read
On 12/10/14 18:13, John Hasler wrote: Martin Read writes: I'm not seeing a serious problem with that function. You have no problem with an 1800 line function? The thing that you are asking me if it is the case is not the thing I said. I have a problem with 1800 line functions in general; th

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread The Wanderer
On 10/12/2014 at 01:42 PM, Steve Litt wrote: > On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 09:33:43 +0100 Martin Read > wrote: > >> On 12/10/14 04:12, Peter Zoeller wrote: >> >>> But the nice thing is shell scripting is simplistic easy to learn >>> and understand. >> >> I refer the audience to David A. Wheeler's essa

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Andrei POPESCU writes: > On Mi, 08 oct 14, 16:01:37, Jonathan Dowland wrote: >> >> The tech-ctte exploration was extremely thorough, entirely transparent and I > > In addition, the tech-ctte took special precautions to make sure their > decision is over-ridable by simple majority (50% + 1), des

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Martin Read writes: > On 12/10/14 15:53, lee wrote: >> And when they are filtered, does the sender get a message telling him >> that their message hasn't been delivered? > > The requirement in RFC 2821 (the successor to RFC 821 which you've > recently been referring to) section 4.2.5 that a serve

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrew McGlashan
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 13/10/2014 3:45 AM, The Wanderer wrote: > My understanding is that the only filtering which has been stated to be > being used is not keyword-based, but thread-based. That is, if the post > is in a thread which has been added to the filter list, t

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 09:33:43 +0100 Martin Read wrote: > On 12/10/14 04:12, Peter Zoeller wrote: > > But the nice > > thing is shell scripting is simplistic easy to learn and understand. > > I refer the audience to David A. Wheeler's essay[1] on how to handle > filenames correctly in shell scrip

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Brian
On Sun 12 Oct 2014 at 15:56:05 +0200, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > > > If you don't know the difference between an MTA and an MUA, there is no > > way I can help you. > > I'm not asking what the difference is but what difference it makes when > this setting is involved. Can you provide

Re: segfaults and error 4 in ld-2.13.so with soffice.bin and kate

2014-10-12 Thread Don Armstrong
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014, Gary Roach wrote: > Thanks for your help. As suggested, I first ran debsum on kate and > libreoffice. All check sums were OK. It's most likely not libreoffice or kate itself, but one of its dependencies. Something like: aptitude search -F '%p' '?reverse-Depends(libreoffice)~i

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrei POPESCU
On Lu, 13 oct 14, 02:50:18, Andrew McGlashan wrote: > I've also put it to that person (assuming the one > whom email me is the list-master), that we need a list where we can talk > more freely about our concerns -- this list seems to have been over > reaching on it's goals since ... forever, now th

HTML5 videos in Jessie

2014-10-12 Thread Proxy
Hello, I just installed Jessie on one of my partitions. Most of the stuff works just fine, but I'm having problem playing HTML5 videos on Youtube in Iceweasel. I can't even watch webm videos from here: http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/debian-meetings/2014/debconf14/webm/ It looks like video is playing i

Synaptic slow when Caribou is running after Gnome-shell update

2014-10-12 Thread Luca Perico
Hi After 3,14 gnome shell update (i use debian jessie) i have see synaptic p.m, very slow to show the package list at startup and also when i change the package list (i.e "all" to "removable" even with a short package list). If i stop Caribou Synaptic work very good I have also noted this : 1) Car

Re: Newbie friendly security and firewall docs (cookbook?)

2014-10-12 Thread Andrei POPESCU
On Du, 12 oct 14, 17:18:10, Joe wrote: > > You basically have two options, to use a firewall tool, or to hack a > script yourself. The existing tools, last time I looked, aren't really > that versatile, they are intended to make simple firewalls using a GUI. > That's reasonable, because once you w

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread John Hasler
Martin Read writes: > I'm not seeing a serious problem with that function. You have no problem with an 1800 line function? -- John Hasler jhas...@newsguy.com Elmwood, WI USA -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact li

Re: Bash usage: was implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Andrei POPESCU
On Du, 12 oct 14, 10:30:52, The Wanderer wrote: > On 10/12/2014 at 10:07 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > > > Any program that requires additional scripting just to get it running > > is insufficiently advanced. > > > > (you can quote me on that) > > Part of the tradeoff for power is responsibility -

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 03:05:59 +0200 lee wrote: > Steve Litt writes: > > > pingaddr=8.8.8.8 > > pingaddr=192.168.100.96 > > Why is this is defined multiple times? Mistake! The 8.8.8.8 isn't needed. That's a test of Internet connectivity, when what I wanted was to test LAN connectivity, which

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread The Wanderer
On 10/12/2014 at 12:30 PM, Joe wrote: > On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 02:50:18 +1100 Andrew McGlashan > wrote: >> I could be speaking too soon, but either the list has died down a >> little on systemd as a result of people having enough of trying to >> bang their head against a brick wall -- or the filter

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread Martin Read
On 12/10/14 01:43, lee wrote: Reco writes: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/tree/src/core/dbus-manager.c?id=3731acf1acfb4a6eb68374a5b137f3b368f63381#n638 Ah, this is a wonderful example :) My assumptions about the code were right. Does all/most of systemd look like that? I'm n

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread lee
david...@ling.ohio-state.edu writes: > Or, in other words, threads deemed off-topic by listmaster@l.d.o may > be frozen, or locked. It's just another very short-sighted thing because depending on the viewpoint expressed, the post may be off-topic or not. -- Again we must be afraid of speaking

piece of mind (Re: Moderated posts?)

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Jonathan Dowland writes: > The tech-ctte exploration was extremely thorough, entirely transparent and I > cannot think of any example of a more transparent decision making process in > any other Linux community. Not only that, but the entire decision could be > overridden by a GR, which *any* de

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread lee
When something is antiquated or junk, becomes a troubleshooting problem or leaves room for mockery, or sucks, then there is no reason not to say it. Straining to bend everything into a stream of euphemisms is counterproductive, and nobody can know what is being talked about because it's buried un

Re: Installer does not detect ethernet card

2014-10-12 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Saturday 11 October 2014 11:43:05 Andrei POPESCU wrote: > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 00:28:24, helpseekingtour...@gmx.net wrote: > >Hi > >Tried to re-install Debian 7.6 wheezy from USB-Stick on a Lenovo > >ThinkPad T420. At the step 'Detect network hardware' pops up the > >message 'No Eth

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Joe
On Mon, 13 Oct 2014 02:50:18 +1100 Andrew McGlashan wrote: > > Yes, but I think the mail is properly delivered and not filtered by > the receiving mail list server; it is later checked over by some > process of the list-master [automatic, scripted, manual or a > combination thereof] -- yes, we n

Re: segfaults and error 4 in ld-2.13.so with soffice.bin and kate

2014-10-12 Thread Gary Roach
On 10/11/2014 06:28 PM, Don Armstrong wrote: On Tue, 07 Oct 2014, Gary Roach wrote: After cloning my bad drive to a new one and installing the new drive (see previous messages titled excessive CPU usage) i am left with the following problem: Kate and libreoffice.writer refuse to open and give t

Re: find out why a package was installed

2014-10-12 Thread Lisi Reisz
On Friday 10 October 2014 14:31:26 Marius Gavrilescu wrote: > Rob Owens writes: > > Is there an apt command that will tell me why package X was installed? > > For instance, was it manually installed, or installed as a > > dependency/recommends of package Y? > > aptitude why I like to look (again

Re: Newbie friendly security and firewall docs (cookbook?)

2014-10-12 Thread Joe
On Sun, 12 Oct 2014 15:20:27 +0100 Lisi Reisz wrote: > > Quite. It is ALL there. I keep hoping that something will be the > basics for beginners (which is where we started on this thread). > Teaching notes for college sounded great. > You basically have two options, to use a firewall tool,

Re: segfaults and error 4 in ld-2.13.so with soffice.bin and kate

2014-10-12 Thread Gary Roach
On 10/11/2014 06:28 PM, Don Armstrong wrote: On Tue, 07 Oct 2014, Gary Roach wrote: After cloning my bad drive to a new one and installing the new drive (see previous messages titled excessive CPU usage) i am left with the following problem: Kate and libreoffice.writer refuse to open and give t

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Andrew McGlashan
On 13/10/2014 2:34 AM, Martin Read wrote: > On 12/10/14 15:53, lee wrote: >> And when they are filtered, does the sender get a message telling him >> that their message hasn't been delivered? > > The requirement in RFC 2821 (the successor to RFC 821 which you've > recently been referring to) secti

Re: Moderated posts?

2014-10-12 Thread Martin Read
On 12/10/14 15:53, lee wrote: And when they are filtered, does the sender get a message telling him that their message hasn't been delivered? The requirement in RFC 2821 (the successor to RFC 821 which you've recently been referring to) section 4.2.5 that a server which issues a 2yz completio

Re: [exim4] Testing and making sense of smtp output

2014-10-12 Thread Martin Read
On 12/10/14 14:52, lee wrote: Harry Putnam writes: Can any of you experienced exim4 hands interpret this output? Reading RFC-821 would tell you more. Reading RFC 2821 would be even better, since RFC 821 is obsoleted by RFC 2821. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.deb

Re: [exim4] mixed up about terminology

2014-10-12 Thread Jerry Stuckle
On 10/12/2014 9:56 AM, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > >> On 10/8/2014 8:17 PM, lee wrote: >>> Jerry Stuckle writes: >>> On 10/6/2014 7:10 PM, lee wrote: > Jerry Stuckle writes: > >>>dc_relay_nets >>> A list of machines for which we serve as smarthost. >>

Re: implicit linkage

2014-10-12 Thread lee
Steve Litt writes: > pingaddr=8.8.8.8 > pingaddr=192.168.100.96 Why is this is defined multiple times? -- Hallowed are the Debians! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: https

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