On 2022-10-17 09:38:41 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> Seems like MathML output was dropped from mathjax because it is not
> poratble:
> https://docs.mathjax.org/en/latest/output/mathml.html#mathml-output
The real solution would have been to use MathML on browsers that
support it and use a fallback
On Sun, Oct 16, 2022 at 10:08:17PM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> Hmm, my default browser is Firefox. The output looks right, but I didn't
> check to see how it was actually rendered. I think texinfo 6.8 mathjax
> uses the SVG output instead of CHTML. Not sure why that is and if it
> really matters
On Sun, Oct 16, 2022 at 10:08:17PM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > I'm wondering why MathML (presentation markup) isn't available,
> > as according the test at
> >
> > http://eyeasme.com/Joe/MathML/MathML_browser_test.html
> >
> > it seems to be well supported by Firefox. It is as nice as SVG,
> >
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:43 PM Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-14 08:40:58 -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > For one example of a texinfo doc using Mathjax, see
> > https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/. In particular, you can look at
> > https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/docs/maxima_79.html. A maxima
On 2022-10-15 18:34:16 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > > Arguably, this (having only a text terminal for reading the manual)
> > > is the use case for Info.
> >
> > The user may want to choose the HTML version for
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 07:14:04PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Since @math is defined to use TeX syntax in its argument, would it be better
> to extend the other Texinfo processors to recognize \var inside @math and do
> whatever is needed to make it act as @var in that case?
@var already seem
Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
when invoked in math mode. Are there other macros that wou
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-15 12:04:18 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
configuration to make @ introduce commands, like backslash does in plain
TeX), w
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
[...]
* mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:43:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:20:22PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > Should be done for latex2html too. I still haven't finished handling
> > @latex blocks correctly, but should be done soon.
>
> I doubt it is correct to convert the con
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 03:20:22PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> Should be done for latex2html too. I still haven't finished handling
> @latex blocks correctly, but should be done soon.
I doubt it is correct to convert the contents of @latex and @tex
blocks when outputting HTML unless --iflatex o
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 01:52:57PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 02:28:54PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > >
> > > l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> > > '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 02:28:54PM +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> >
> > l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> > '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH=1'. I'm going to spend some time
> > investigating this.
>
> I think
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> * Concerning t4h,
> @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @var doesn't work (while it is needed
> to ensure exactly the same typography/code as outside @math, e.g.
> base) and there is a spurio
On Sat, Oct 15, 2022 at 12:32:00PM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
>
> l2h and t4h settings still output "@var" literally even with
> '-c CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH=1'. I'm going to spend some time
> investigating this.
I think that I fixed it. CONVERT_TO_LATEX_IN_MATH is set in the default
case if HTM
On 2022-10-15 12:32:00 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
> > other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
> > when invoked in math
On 2022-10-15 12:04:18 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> > Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
> > configuration to make @ introduce commands, like backslash does in plain
> > TeX), would the correct synt
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> TeX has an \ifmmode conditional that is true in math mode; @var/\var and
> other marking macros could be adjusted to mark their arguments appropriately
> when invoked in math mode. Are there other macros that would be appropriate
>
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 09:27:22PM -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > > All of them are
On 2022-10-14 21:27:22 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > I assumed that this was for commands that exist in plain TeX, which
> > is not the case of @var.
>
> Since "var" actually is a TeX macro (Texinfo works by adjusting TeX's
> configuration to make @ introduce commands,
On 2022-10-14 21:11:19 -0500, Jacob Bachmeyer wrote:
> Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > [...]
> > > > * mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
> > > Not a bug, working as
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
All of them are buggy:
* Concerning t4h,
@math{@var{base} \le 16},
yields "@varbase ≤
Vincent Lefevre wrote:
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
[...]
* mathjax is not compatible with text browsers.
Not a bug, working as designed.
Also broken design as there is no correct fallb
On 2022-10-14 20:52:38 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> Rendering mathematical notation in a text terminal can work well for
> very simple formulae but breaks down for more complex formulae, like
>
> J_v(z) = \sum_{k=0}^{\infty }{{{\left(-1\right)^{k}\,\left(z\over
> 2\right)^{v+2\,k}
> }\over{k!\,\G
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 04:33:54PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> Wikipedia has an article about kerning, but not with a good example
> of how ugly and disturbing the lack of kerning can be. I suggest
> that you look at
>
>
> https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/448069/fix-ugly-kerning-in-e
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 07:06:04AM +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > > but given that there is now good s
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 08:40:58AM -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> > I tested the page
> > https://mathjax.github.io/MathJax-demos-web/tex-chtml.html
> > with lynx (there are no Texinfo manuals with mathjax enabled I know of,
> > if anybody knows about one, please tell me), and the result seems good
>
On 2022-10-14 08:40:58 -0700, Raymond Toy wrote:
> For one example of a texinfo doc using Mathjax, see
> https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/. In particular, you can look at
> https://maxima.common-lisp.dev/docs/maxima_79.html. A maxima user (who
> might be blind?) says that the MathJax-enabled formul
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 7:02 AM Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > >
> > > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many
> drawbacks
> > > > (do n
On 2022-10-14 16:08:59 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> I was probably unclear, I just wanted to add an information on
> ligatures, it was not related to kerning (I do not actually really
> know what kerning is...).
Wikipedia has an article about kerning, but not with a good example
of how ugly and d
On 2022-10-14 16:01:58 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > >
> > > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many drawbacks
> > > > (do not wo
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 03:50:51PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > No, it is for all the @-commands, and, in my opinion, the sentence is
> > clear as is. But do not hesitate to propose changes in the manual if
> > you think it can be ameliorated.
>
> What I thought was that plain TeX was render
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:31:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > >
> > > * l2h generates image files as documented, which have many drawbacks
> > > (do not work with text browsers, not accessible, font size issues
> > >
On 2022-10-14 15:15:40 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:41:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > "In general, the contents of @math or @displaymath should be plain TeX
> > > only, with no interspersed Texinfo command
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 01:41:20PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > "In general, the contents of @math or @displaymath should be plain TeX
> > only, with no interspersed Texinfo commands."
>
> I assumed that this was for commands that exist in
On 2022-10-14 11:30:33 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > All of them are buggy:
> > * Concerning t4h,
> > @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> > yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @v
On 2022-10-14 07:06:03 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > > but given that there is now good support of Te
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> All of them are buggy:
> * Concerning t4h,
> @math{@var{base} \le 16},
> yields "@varbase ≤ 16 ,", so @var doesn't work (while it is needed
> to ensure exactly the
On Fri, Oct 14, 2022 at 12:40:08AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> > I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> > but given that there is now good support of TeX math in texi2any for
> > HTML with any of the 3 HTML_MA
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:20:24PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> is not true. More precisely, I would expect
>
> @macro ttie
> @end macro
>
> to generate nothing, but inserting @ttie{} in a TeX expression
> modifies the spacing in the generated PDF.
Please provide a minimal example showing the
On 2022-10-13 21:15:57 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> I agree with Gavin, you should not use @math if you want normal text,
> but given that there is now good support of TeX math in texi2any for
> HTML with any of the 3 HTML_MATH option,
All of them are buggy:
* l2h generates image files as docum
On 2022-10-13 19:17:13 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > The GMP manual has the following:
> >
> > @c @m{T,N} is $T$ in tex or @math{N} otherwise. Commas in N or T don't
> > work,
> > @c but @C{} can be used instead.
> > @iftex
> >
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The GMP manual has the following:
>
> @c @m{T,N} is $T$ in tex or @math{N} otherwise. Commas in N or T don't work,
> @c but @C{} can be used instead.
> @iftex
> @macro m {T,N}
> @tex$\T\$@end tex
> @end macro
> @end iftex
> @ifn
On Thu, Oct 13, 2022 at 11:57:26AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2022-10-13 06:48:49 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> > This is the default if MathJax is not turned on or tex4ht or latex2html
> > are not used. The tag marks the text as separate. There is not
> > much more that could be done - te
On 2022-10-13 06:48:49 +0100, Gavin Smith wrote:
> This is the default if MathJax is not turned on or tex4ht or latex2html
> are not used. The tag marks the text as separate. There is not
> much more that could be done - texi2any does not itself interpret
> TeX math notation at all and is not go
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The Texinfo manual says
>
>The '@math' command has no special effect on the Info output or (by
> default) the HTML output, merely outputting the contents verbatim.
>
> However, as said later, the contents are emphasized (with
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 11:34:45AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> >
> > There are now other options for math formatting in HTML, but they are
> > suitable for TeX/LaTeX math, not much for text describing math. If I
> > understand well your need, I think that using CSS to change how @math is
> >
On 2022-10-12 11:22:22 +0200, Patrice Dumas wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > Moreover, using is incorrect because things like digits should
> > not be in italics. For instance, with the GMP manual, one has about
> > mpz_mul_2exp (since r3083): "op1 time
On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 12:40:12AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> The Texinfo manual says
>
>The '@math' command has no special effect on the Info output or (by
> default) the HTML output, merely outputting the contents verbatim.
>
> However, as said later, the contents are emphasized (with
The Texinfo manual says
The '@math' command has no special effect on the Info output or (by
default) the HTML output, merely outputting the contents verbatim.
However, as said later, the contents are emphasized (with ).
So the description is inconsistent.
Moreover, using is incorrect because
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