Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Neil Canham]

  BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px;
}I've been using Eclipse for Java and Webapp development for years,
initially using IBMs hugely enhanced versions (originally WebSphere
Application Developer, then Rational Application Developer.  I've
used both CVS and SVN as source code repositories.  I actually found
moving to SVN kinda challenging after CVS, but now I've got used to
the model I'm fine with it - what I struggle with with eclipse is the
way it tries to wrap those tools, I actually find the command line or
tortoiseSvn in windows easier to use and understand that SubClipse.
 Thanks for the reminder about LSL Plus.  I'd been thinking about
using a bot to automate the extraction of scripts for versioning
using SVN.  There is still the issue that for most projects the LSL
scripts are just one part of the code base, with PHP, C#, DB schemas
etc - we need to concept of an SlOpenSim project in Eclipse :-)
 By the way i really recommend www.assembla.com for online code
project management and SVN repo.
 Let me know if I can assist with any of your projects
 Neil Canham
 KnowSense Limited
 CTO Flying Island
 On Wed 03/03/10  4:09 AM , Fire f...@b3dmultitech.com sent:
 Hi everyone
 I have been using LSL Plus [1], and eclipse for the longest time to
develop LSL code.  I love it due to its auto-completion abilities,
and the general user interface. I recently installed Subversion using
this site as a guide:
http://www.vogella.de/articles/EclipseSubversive/article.html [2] and
am now uploading my code and versioning it using a private SVN at
http://unfuddle.com/ [3]
 What a great little dev environment!!!
 To commit code now to my SVN repository, I just press -
control-alt-c and BOOM - my version is saved!  Very sweet!  I am
wondering who else on this list uses eclipse, and am particularly
interested in how and if you use this in a team environment. 
 Ie: Have you used eclipse to work on the same lsl project with
another dev?  if so, what eclipse plugins have you used to share team
information, issues etc?  Please let me know! Cheers!  BTW, if any
pro-scripters out there are interested in working in profitable SL
projects, let me know. Cheers 
 Fire 


Links:
--
[1] http://lslplus.sourceforge.net/
[2] http://www.vogella.de/articles/EclipseSubversive/article.html
[3] http://unfuddle.com/
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Boroondas Gupte]

Hi Fire

If you're interested in who uses Eclipse and SVN specifically for LSL,
you might want to ask at secondlifescript...@lists.secondlife.com

(https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters)
instead of here.

cheers
Boroondas
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Fire]

Thanks Boroondas! I will!

Cheers! :)

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 4:07 AM, Boroondas Gupte
wrote:

> Hi Fire
>
> If you're interested in who uses Eclipse and SVN specifically for LSL,
> you might want to ask at secondlifescript...@lists.secondlife.com
> 
> (https://lists.secondlife.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/secondlifescripters
> )
> instead of here.
>
> cheers
> Boroondas
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Re: [opensource-dev] Snowglobe as an mixed reality platform

[Aleric Inglewood]

Yes, we should concentrate on a general API for plugins before
adding all kinds of specialized code that could and should have
been implemented through that API.

More specifically regarding Kantonen's request to have
"some parts of our work incorporated into the Snowglobe
sources", that would just put the maintenance problem
with us: we have to deal with an "upstream" (Linden Lab)
too, weird as that may sound. Snowglobe is no different
than your code base in that regard (as we recently and
painfully have become aware).

Therefore the only workable option is to create this plugin
API, so you can use that as stable interface.

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 2:41 AM, Morgaine wrote:

> Merov, further to Kantonen+Suzy and Lawson's posts about Snowglob
> extensions, once the 2.0 code merges settle down, can we please get back to
> the topic of client-side scripting that was rudely interrupted by the TPV
> debacle?
>
> It is precisely that kind of generic scriptable extension mechanism that
> will allow easy integration into Snowglobe of industry-sponsored projects
> such as that of VTT+IBM and well as community projects such as Saijanai's
> work with Cobalt, instead of requiring each new application to be grafted on
> as special cases.
>
> Every special external plugin will need to communicate with an effective
> API in the viewer, and expanding the viewer API for each such external
> plugin is clearly not scalable nor even viable, not to mention inflexible.
>
> This is why a generic viewer API for communicating with pluggable
> extensions is extremely important for the future of Snowglobe as an
> extensible application.  The number of possible extensions is unbounded, but
> the hundreds of eyes focussed on this mailing list are probably sufficient
> to come up with a suitably generic API and a good infrastructure design for
> managing these kinds of extensions.
>
>
> Morgaine.
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 10:48 PM, Lawson English  wrote:
>
>> I'm working on mixing Cobalt with SL via the media plugin. Here's a bit
>> of discussion of how it (and future plugins) might work:
>>
>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/User:Saijanai_Kuhn/Plugins_discussion
>>
>> Lawson
>>
>> Suzy Deffeyes wrote:
>> > I'm very interested in this work ( full disclosure, IBM is one of the
>> > sponsors of the work), Moriz, I agree that today's head mounted
>> > displays are a bit bulky for widespread use.  It is great foundational
>> > work, and there are some aspects that we could integrate into
>> > Snowglobe that would be useful *today*.  One of those is the gesture
>> > recognition code. It's towards the end of Tuomas' video. It uses a
>> > webcam to detect a user nodding yes/no, and then plays an in world
>> > animation based on detecting the gesture.
>> >
>> > Merov, once the Snowglobe 2.0 code settles down, can we discuss a way
>> > to have a pluggable framework that people could use for things like
>> > AR? Might make a good topic for a Hippo meeting.
>> > Suzy
>> >
>> > On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 9:10 AM, Moriz Gupte > > > wrote:
>> >
>> > This is very neat. Still a bit bulky for immediate use but a great
>> > foundation for future.
>> > R
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 3:31 AM, Kantonen Tuomas
>> > mailto:tuomas.kanto...@vtt.fi>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hello,
>> >
>> > I've been working on a project using Second Life as a platform
>> to
>> > develop mixed reality teleconferencing/-collaboration system.
>> > A brief
>> > intro about the project can be found at
>> > http://www.vtt.fi/multimedia/projects/mrconference.html
>> > and a video demo of our work so far is at
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNB0_c-5TSk .
>> >
>> > The project, continuing also in 2010, is split into two parts:
>> > overlaying a video image with avatars and virtual objects
>> > (augmented
>> > reality; AR) and using hand and head gestures to control
>> > avatars and
>> > interact with virtual objects (augmented virtuality; AV).
>> >
>> > We have agreed to release our work as open source. However,
>> > lack of
>> > continuous "forward porting" would soon render the released code
>> > unusable. It would therefore be better to have some parts of our
>> > work incorporated into the Snowglobe sources.
>> >
>> > I've tried to keep all our modifications as small as possible.
>> The
>> > project is separated to our own ACME (Augmented Collaboration
>> > in Mixed
>> > Environments) module, vanilla Snowglobe code and an interface
>> > between
>> > the two.
>> >
>> > I'd be ready to invest some time to implement a generic AR/AV
>> > support
>> > for Snowglobe if we could come up with a design that could be
>> > accepted
>> > by the Snowglobe develop

Re: [opensource-dev] patch porting to SL2

[Aleric Inglewood]

You could pay the original author(s) to do it AGAIN I guess.
Or hope that they for some insane reason are interested to use 2.0
themselves
and are willing to redo that patch AGAIN for themselves.

I usually ask 50 euro per hour for coding that I don't like.

It's time Linden Lab starts to pay us for our skills (in L$ if they wish).
After all they make this advertisement with "that Second Life allows
you make money with Real Life skills".

I spend a whole DAY doing SNOW-84 AGAIN, now I need another
month to cool off again.

Can anyone tell me why so many freaking CRASH bug fixes have
been completely ignored by Linden Lag? I mean, I already had the
feeling the internal devs don't LIKE the Snowglobe project, but
now I know so.

I don't think that SG as a project makes sense anymore. We could
and probably should put our time and effort into helping other
viewers. What is the use of scattering all the devs over so many
different forks? Yes, snowglobe is just another Third Party fork,
and each time LL changes their code, we have to work hard to
the full merge until we can't keep up anymore.

On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 11:05 PM, Tayra Dagostino
wrote:

> is there a way to port the login database patch to SL2?
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Vex Streeter]

Absolutely!  You've described my preferred setup exactly. Any script
longer than a few lines, and I do it with Eclipse, LSLPlus and
Subversive.  I also use PHP and C/C++ plugins for SLish work. Sadly,
the last time I tried the C# plugin, things broke horribly, but perhaps
it is time to try again.

All assets for my projects go into svn, including textures,
documentation, configuration information, etc for both in- and
out-world components.  W/rt team work - I wouldn't consider even
attempting a cooperative project without a setup like this - just too
many ways for things to break.  For *big* projects, you can use eclipse
system design plugins, requirements, bugtracking, etc.

SVN hosting shouldn't be expensive - I use a combination of personal
(LAN in my home), RL work (outside corporate firewall but still
managed), and private hosted (ATM, I use dreamhost but there are lots
of options).

IMHO, Git and mercurial are the other SVN alternatives that come to
mind - possibly better choices depending on your development model and
teammates.

Fire wrote:
Hi
everyone
  
  
  I have been using LSL Plus, and eclipse for the
longest time to develop LSL code.  I love it due to its auto-completion
abilities, and the general user interface.
  
  
  What a great little dev environment!!!
  



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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Carlo Wood]

On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 08:09:53PM -0800, Fire wrote:
>  I am wondering who else on this list uses
> eclipse, and am particularly interested in how and if you use this in a team
> environment.

I've tried eclipse several times over the years, each time I came
to the same conclusion: it's written and maintained by java developers,
and the support for C++ was extremely hard to find, if at all (that
may have improved).

The main reason I never started to use it is that it has (or had?)
an integrated editor. They wish syntax highlighting (me too), they
wish being able to collapse functions (I think) (I don't care,
I navigate differently than by scrolling over my code, lol) and
so on... resulting in a heavily integrated editor that you can't
replace with one of your own. My demand for an IDE is that I can
use vim and ctags, and that was not possible when I tried it
(or so badly documented that I couldn't find out how).

I doubt that my own developing environment is worse than eclipse.
I use my shell functions and aliases to speed up things, still
working from the commandline but at least as efficient and
powerful. Yes, I have to type "vi " a lot, and then double-click
and paste and hit return to get to the source file and line where
the last compile error is, but that takes me 0.5 seconds and it
never bothered me in the least. Overview of classes and inheritance
is delivered by doxygen if you need it, syntax highlighting and
code navigation is integrated in vim (plus a whole lot more) etc,
and top that off, I use good old grep to find anything and
everything in a code base no matter how large that is.

-- 
Carlo Wood 
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Jo Grant]

>What a great little dev environment!!!
I eat, breathe and drink Eclipse for my day job. I love it. 
But for Second Life, I've found that the benefits of the dev environment 
are outweighed by the pain of having to cut and paste the code into Second 
Life each time I want to try it out. Only 10% of the average software 
development cycle is spent authoring code. The rest is spent debugging, 
etc. In a tight change-compile-rerun cycle, it is extremely awkward to use 
it. So, sadly, until we can integrate Eclipse into the SL viewer, I'm not 
likely to use it for SL development.
Cheers,
Jo

***
Jo Grant, jo_gr...@us.ibm.com
Senior Software Engineer,
IBM,
4112, 1 Rogers Street, Cambridge MA 02142
tel: 978-399-6024

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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Jonathan Irvin]

I do often hear complaints and wishes for new build tools, what about us LSL
devs?  Some things I would like are:

   1. Better IDE in SL Viewer
   2. API for compiling in LSL using various IDEs already available
   3. Going along with #1, as suggested, integrating Eclipse or equivalent
   in SL.
   4. LSL Wiki built into the editor
   5. Detachable script editing window (To develop on one monitor & test in
   the other)
   6. Entity relationship diagram system in SL viewer for visual coding.
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Neil Canham]

  BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }I'd
second the need for LSL editing and scripting improvements in the
client:
 1. Autocomplete in existing LSL editor
 2. Expand/collapse fuctions/events
 3. Integrated debugger!
 Neil
 On Wed 03/03/10  3:03 PM , Jonathan Irvin djfoxys...@gmail.com sent:
 I do often hear complaints and wishes for new build tools, what
about us LSL devs?  Some things I would like are:
*Better IDE in SL Viewer
*API for compiling in LSL using various IDEs already available 
*Going along with #1, as suggested, integrating Eclipse or
equivalent in SL.
*LSL Wiki built into the editor
*Detachable script editing window (To develop on one monitor &
test in the other)
* Entity relationship diagram system in SL viewer for visual
coding.
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Re: [opensource-dev] Eclipse Guru's

[Brandon Husbands]

LSL plus has one fatal flaw...
No brace completion matching.

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 9:18 AM, Neil Canham  wrote:

> I'd second the need for LSL editing and scripting improvements in the
> client:
>
> 1. Autocomplete in existing LSL editor
> 2. Expand/collapse fuctions/events
> 3. Integrated debugger!
>
> Neil
>
>
>
> On Wed 03/03/10 3:03 PM , Jonathan Irvin djfoxys...@gmail.com sent:
>
> I do often hear complaints and wishes for new build tools, what about us
> LSL devs?  Some things I would like are:
>
>1. Better IDE in SL Viewer
>2. API for compiling in LSL using various IDEs already available
>3. Going along with #1, as suggested, integrating Eclipse or equivalent
>in SL.
>4. LSL Wiki built into the editor
>5. Detachable script editing window (To develop on one monitor & test
>in the other)
>6. Entity relationship diagram system in SL viewer for visual coding.
>
>
>
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[opensource-dev] Detecting mouse over sky or water

[Lockwood, Nick]

I'm working on a project to track what object is currently rendered at the 
current mouse screen coordinate. There was a recent thread I found 
(http://www.mail-archive.com/sl...@lists.secondlife.com/msg04380.html) that 
highlights the cursorIntersect function in the LLViewerWindow class. That is 
exactly what I've been using, and it seems to be working just fine. The only 
problem is that I can't seem to capture sky, clouds, or water. The function 
just returns with a null value when I'm hovering over any of those objects. I 
tried changing the depth parameter, but that hasn't helped. I also double 
checked the gObjectList array, and there are, in fact, sky and water pcodes in 
there. Does anyone know of any reason why I can't retrieve those objects then?

Thanks!
Nick

P.S. As a follow-up to this challenge, I am also looking to log whether the 
mouse is hovering over a dialog box (i.e., inventory, map, chat window, etc.). 
I tried using the cursorIntersectIcon function, but that doesn't seem to be 
giving me what I want. Any guidance on that would be great too!
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Re: [opensource-dev] Detecting mouse over sky or water

[Gigs]

IIRC the touch picking code can tell you if you touched water sky or 
terrain.  I don't think it's well abstracted though and may need to be 
moved into a new class.

-Jason

Lockwood, Nick wrote:
> I’m working on a project to track what object is currently rendered at 
> the current mouse screen coordinate. There was a recent thread I found 
> (http://www.mail-archive.com/sl...@lists.secondlife.com/msg04380.html) 
> that highlights the cursorIntersect function in the LLViewerWindow 
> class. That is exactly what I’ve been using, and it seems to be working 
> just fine. The only problem is that I can’t seem to capture sky, clouds, 
> or water. The function just returns with a null value when I’m hovering 
> over any of those objects. I tried changing the depth parameter, but 
> that hasn’t helped. I also double checked the gObjectList array, and 
> there are, in fact, sky and water pcodes in there. Does anyone know of 
> any reason why I can’t retrieve those objects then?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Nick
> 
>  
> 
> P.S. As a follow-up to this challenge, I am also looking to log whether 
> the mouse is hovering over a dialog box (i.e., inventory, map, chat 
> window, etc.). I tried using the cursorIntersectIcon function, but that 
> doesn’t seem to be giving me what I want. Any guidance on that would be 
> great too!
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [opensource-dev] Detecting mouse over sky or water

[Lockwood, Nick]

Thanks for the tip Jason. Which class are you referring to when you say "touch 
picking code?"


-Original Message-
From: Gigs [mailto:gigstagg...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:27 PM
To: Lockwood, Nick
Cc: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Detecting mouse over sky or water

IIRC the touch picking code can tell you if you touched water sky or 
terrain.  I don't think it's well abstracted though and may need to be 
moved into a new class.

-Jason

Lockwood, Nick wrote:
> I'm working on a project to track what object is currently rendered at 
> the current mouse screen coordinate. There was a recent thread I found 
> (http://www.mail-archive.com/sl...@lists.secondlife.com/msg04380.html) 
> that highlights the cursorIntersect function in the LLViewerWindow 
> class. That is exactly what I've been using, and it seems to be working 
> just fine. The only problem is that I can't seem to capture sky, clouds, 
> or water. The function just returns with a null value when I'm hovering 
> over any of those objects. I tried changing the depth parameter, but 
> that hasn't helped. I also double checked the gObjectList array, and 
> there are, in fact, sky and water pcodes in there. Does anyone know of 
> any reason why I can't retrieve those objects then?
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Nick
> 
>  
> 
> P.S. As a follow-up to this challenge, I am also looking to log whether 
> the mouse is hovering over a dialog box (i.e., inventory, map, chat 
> window, etc.). I tried using the cursorIntersectIcon function, but that 
> doesn't seem to be giving me what I want. Any guidance on that would be 
> great too!
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
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