Running webservices during build

[Henrique de Moraes Holschuh]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015, at 02:38, Marc Haber wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 00:08:32 +0200, Mattia Rizzolo
> >https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-main
> >policy section 2.2.1
> >"packages in main must not require or recommend a package outside of
> >main for compilation or execution (thus, the package must not declare
> >a "Pre-Depends", "Depends", "Recommends", "Build-Depends", or
> >"Build-Depends-Indep" relationship on a non-main package),"
> >
> >this also includes resources over the internet.
> 
> It is mildly weird to define arbitrary Internet resources as
> "package". This is in dire need of clarification.

That clarification is already being worked on debian-policy.

The fact is that you cannot use webservices during build, even if they're 
non-interactive. The very specific case of starting one on localhost for the 
build would be fine as far as policy goes, I think (I didn't check), but it 
could easily cause operational problems in the autobuilders, so it is likely to 
be a very bad idea anyway.

We had issues in large numbers of packages in the past due to that. I recall 
validating XML parsers that would attempt to download schemans or DTDs even 
when they were already in the local catalog, for example.  And that was not 
even something that could change the build result, as at most it could cause 
the build to stop.  The one where the XML parsers were downloading external 
entities during build, well, THAT one was much worse as it could cause the 
build results to change.

It is fine to have a source package that has a *properly documented in 
debian/README.source* preparation phase that must be done by the maintainer 
when downloading a new upstream version, though.  It is not a problem if the 
maintainer has to run a manual debian/rules target that will hit the net, use 
webservices, whatever (even if he has to do it interactively, although that's 
obviously sub-optimal).  As long as the maintainer can check the results for 
any trojans that might have crept in (i.e. there is no difference from what one 
is already supposed to do with any new source release from upstream), there is 
no problem.

-- 
  "One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring
  them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond
  where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot
  Henrique de Moraes Holschuh 


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Bug#782697: ITP: murasaki -- homology detection tool across multiple large genomes

[Andreas Tille]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Andreas Tille 

* Package name: murasaki
  Version : 1.68.6
  Upstream Author : Kris Popendorf 
* URL : http://murasaki.dna.bio.keio.ac.jp/wiki/
* License : GPL
  Programming Lang: C++, Perl
  Description : homology detection tool across multiple large genomes
 Murasaki is a scalable and fast, language theory-based homology
 detection tool across multiple large genomes. It enable whole-genome
 scale multiple genome global alignments. Supports unlimited length
 gapped-seed patterns and unique TF-IDF based filtering.
 .
 Murasaki is an anchor alignment software, which is
  * exteremely fast (17 CPU hours for whole Human x Mouse genome (with
40 nodes: 52 wall minutes))
  * scalable (Arbitrarily parallelizable across multiple nodes using MPI.
Even a single node with 16GB of ram can handle over 1Gbp of sequence.)
  * unlimited pattern length
  * repeat tolerant
  * intelligent noise reduction


The package will be maintained by the Debian Med team at
  Vcs-Svn: svn://anonscm.debian.org/debian-med/trunk/packages/murasaki/trunk/


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RE: Debian Outreach Team Delegation

[Chapman, April L]

Please remove me from your distribution list.  I am retiring at the end of the 
month!

Regards,

April Chapman 
Product Manager, Retail Operating Systems/Platform Software 
NCR Corporation 
office: 770/813-3896  
april.chap...@ncr.com  |  www.ncr.com

NCR Drivers and Patches Support Website: 
http://www5.ncr.com/support/support_drivers_patches.asp?Class=External\display

Follow us on Twitter: @NCRCorporation, @NCR_Retail
Like us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/ncrcorp, 
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Connect with us on LinkedIn: http://linkd.in/ncrgroup, 
https://www.linkedin.com/company/6454 
Watch us on YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/ncrcorporation, http://bit.ly/1jg5v7w
Visit us online: www.ncr.com

This message, including any attachments or follow on correspondence, are 
proprietary and confidential property of NCR. Any unauthorized use or 
disclosure of this information without written permission from NCR is 
prohibited.

-Original Message-
From: Lucas Nussbaum [mailto:lea...@debian.org] 
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2015 7:35 AM
To: debian-devel-annou...@lists.debian.org
Subject: Debian Outreach Team Delegation

Dear Developers,

I am happy to announce the creation of the Debian Outreach Team. As highlighted 
below in the official delegation, the Outreach Team is responsible for 
coordinating Debian's participation in outreach programs such as Google Summer 
of Code and Outreachy[1] (formerly GNOME's Outreach Program for Women) -- but 
not limited to those two.

Initially, the team will be composed of Nicolas Dandrimont, Sylvestre Ledru, 
Molly de Blanc and Tom Marble. Most of them have previous experience as Debian 
GSOC and/or OPW admins. They can be reached at  (or will 
be -- pending DSA creation of the alias), and will have a web page soon at 
.

There are also some Debian-only mentorship programs, such as the Debian Women 
Mentoring Program[2], and DebianMed's Mentoring of the Month (MoM)[3]. Those 
programs are currently outside of the scope of this delegation, as they do not 
have the same needs in terms of coordination, funding, selection and ranking.

[1] https://www.gnome.org/outreachy/
[2] https://www.debian.org/women/mentoring
[3] https://wiki.debian.org/DebianMed/MoM

Cheers,

- Lucas



Debian Outreach Team delegation
===

I hereby appoint the following developers as members of the Debian Outreach
Team:

- Nicolas Dandrimont (olasd)
- Sylvestre Ledru(sylvestre)

Additionally, even though not officially delegated as they are not DDs yet, Tom 
Marble and Molly de Blanc are also members of the Debian Outreach Team

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debian github organization ?

[Jérémy Lal]

Hello,

i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, where
maintainers could be added.

This is a scary pandora box, though :)

Jérémy.

Re: debian github organization ?

[Jonas Smedegaard]

Quoting Jérémy Lal (2015-04-16 15:45:34)
> i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, 
> where maintainers could be added.

Wouldn't surprise me, but I don't know (not interested).


> This is a scary pandora box, though :)

If you add that remark to appeace those disliking non-free services: It 
doesn't work on me, and I doubt it works on others either.

If you mention because you dislike it yourself: Easier to ignore it!

Enjou the ride...


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private


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Re: Python 2, Python 3, Stretch & Buster

[Cyril Brulebois]

Paul Tagliamonte  (2015-04-16):
> Background
> ==
> 
> Python 2 is scheduled to be EOL'd upstream officially and for good in 2020.
> We're in 2015 now (wow, that went quickly), and keeping our release cadence up
> (3 years a pop) puts Stretch up in 2018, and Buster in 2021.

Wheezy was first released in May 2013. Jessie gets hopefully released in
April 2015. That doesn't make it 3 years between releases. You should
stop trying to replace 2's with 3's. ;p

> after Python 2 is EOL -- that's right, EOL! Nuts, right?

(Last time EOL approached, it was pushed back by 5 years, so…)


Mraw,
KiBi.


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Dimitri John Ledkov]

I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

Which is similar in spirit to ask.debian.net.

PS. Sorry for top reply from mobile phone.
On 16 Apr 2015 7:46 am, "Jérémy Lal"  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, where
> maintainers could be added.
>
> This is a scary pandora box, though :)
>
> Jérémy.
>
>

Re: debian github organization ?

[Alessio Treglia]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 4:04 PM, Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:
> I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

Good one Dimitri!

I started to use Gitlab for serious work only recently, and well I love it.
So +1 from me, I volunteer to help out with that.

Cheers!

-- 
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Debian Developer | ales...@debian.org
Ubuntu Core Developer|  quadris...@ubuntu.com
0416 0004 A827 6E40 BB98 90FB E8A4 8AE5 311D 765A


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Mattia Rizzolo]

On 16 Apr 2015 7:46 am, "Jérémy Lal"  wrote:
> i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, where
> maintainers could be added.

there is: https://github.com/debian

> This is a scary pandora box, though :)

indeed. it could be nice, but i'd rather avoid it.

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 5:04 PM, Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:
> I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

yeah, me too. i love it.
i'd help to run it (i don't have so much experience running gitlab
(yes, i run an instance), but i definitely want to join a team setting
it up + keeping it running.

-- 
regards,
Mattia Rizzolo

GPG Key: 4096R/B9444540 http://goo.gl/I8TMB
more about me: http://mapreri.org
Launchpad User: https://launchpad.net/~mapreri
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Re: debian github organization ?

[mudongliang]

On Thu, 2015-04-16 at 17:11 +0200, Mattia Rizzolo wrote: 
> On 16 Apr 2015 7:46 am, "Jérémy Lal"  wrote:
> > i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, where
> > maintainers could be added.
> 
> there is: https://github.com/debian
> 
> > This is a scary pandora box, though :)
> 
> indeed. it could be nice, but i'd rather avoid it.
> 
> On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 5:04 PM, Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:
> > I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)
> 
> yeah, me too. i love it.
> i'd help to run it (i don't have so much experience running gitlab
> (yes, i run an instance), but i definitely want to join a team setting
> it up + keeping it running.
I like github very much ,too! And linux kernel have a display on github!
I really want to see Debian in the github! If this can be true , I will
follow it quickly!
But I know that debian does not manager source code by git !
How can it??
mudongliang



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Re: debian github organization ?

[Dmitry Yu Okunev]

On 04/16/2015 06:09 PM, Alessio Treglia wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 4:04 PM, Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:
>> I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

I'm not a DD, but I'd suggest to consider "Gogs", too. It's pretty new
and unfinished, but potentially is much better than "GitLab", IMHO.

Best regards, Dmitry.



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Re: (My last) bits from the DPL

[Adam Majer]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 04:47:19PM +0200, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
>
> Libdvdcss and ZFS soon in Debian?
> =
> 
> We received legal advice from Software Freedom Law Center about the
> inclusion of libdvdcss and ZFS in Debian, which should unblock the
> situation in both cases and enable us to ship them in Debian soon.

Hello,

Could this legal advice be posted to debian-legal or elsewhere in
public?

Thanks,
Adam

-- 
Adam Majer
ad...@zombino.com


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Paul Wise]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 9:45 PM, Jérémy Lal wrote:

> i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization, where
> maintainers could be added.

It would probably better to use free tools instead?

http://mako.cc/writing/hill-free_tools.html

-- 
bye,
pabs

https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Andrew Shadura]

> I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

Why Gitlab when there's Kallithea? :)

-- 
Cheers,
  Andrew

Re: debian github organization ?

[Sven Bartscher]

On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 09:04:07 -0600
Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:

> I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)

I don't  a reason to have gitlab/github/someother git stuff for debian,
since we already have alioth.
Maybe someone can enlighten me.

Regards
Sven


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Alexander Alemayhu]

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 06:15:07PM +0300, Dmitry Yu Okunev wrote:
> 
> I'm not a DD, but I'd suggest to consider "Gogs", too. It's pretty new
> and unfinished, but potentially is much better than "GitLab", IMHO.
> 

I'm not a DD either but +1 :) I tried it out awhile back from the try site[0]and
it just has a much better feel to it IMHO. Have you tried installing it?

[0]: https://try.gogs.io/

--
Mit freundlichen Grüßen

Alexander Alemayhu


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Neil Williams]

On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 17:11:29 +0200
Mattia Rizzolo  wrote:

> On 16 Apr 2015 7:46 am, "Jérémy Lal"  wrote:
> > i was wondering if debian had a github account as an organization,
> > where maintainers could be added.
> 
> there is: https://github.com/debian

I've already got a bunch of other stuff on github (some on Alioth too
but github is more reliable, easier to find related stuff and easier
for people outside Debian to fork and use to contribute) as well as
mirrors of my work stuff for Linaro. How do people (DD's) go about
getting invites to the Debian organisation on github? (Ping me off-list
if the potential number of enquirers would be unmanageable.)

-- 


Neil Williams
=
http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/



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Re: debian github organization ?

[Dmitry Yu Okunev]

On 04/16/2015 09:19 PM, Alexander Alemayhu wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 06:15:07PM +0300, Dmitry Yu Okunev wrote:
>> I'm not a DD, but I'd suggest to consider "Gogs", too. It's pretty new
>> and unfinished, but potentially is much better than "GitLab", IMHO.
> 
> I'm not a DD either but +1 :) I tried it out awhile back from the try 
> site[0]and
> it just has a much better feel to it IMHO. Have you tried installing it?

Yes, We are trying it in our University (NRNU MEPhI).

Example repository:
https://devel.mephi.ru/dyokunev/tasks

I can say, that "Gogs" is not production ready. A lot of tiny bugs (with
avatars etc), no "Pull request" support and so on. But it developing
very fast.

Gogs is much more GitHub-like than GitLab as for me, so it's much more
usual for GitHub users, IMHO.

> [0]: https://try.gogs.io/

Best regards, Dmirty.



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Re: Minified javascripts in packages

[Andreas Noteng]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256

Den 15. april 2015 11:45, skrev Riley Baird:
> While I still maintain my previous position that concatenated js
> is DFSG-free, even if it is not what upstream requires, I'm just
> wondering - what is your .orig.tar.gz? You might not need to repack
> it if you can concatenate the files with a debhelper override in
> d/rules. And you're still distributing source the way upstream
> wants it, so everyone's happy.

My upstream simply includes the minified copy of the js's, I exclude
these files in a repacked tarball using the exclude field of
d/copyright. This is no problem. My problem is that building the
javascript libs the way upstream's upstream intended requires grunt.

Guess I'll have to start over again and figure out how to manually
concatenate the separate upstream files into one huge file. I can see
how it makes sense, but it also seems like a lot of work for very
little gain…

Andreas

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Bug#782734: ITP: power-calibrate -- power calibration tool

[Colin Ian King]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Colin Ian King 

* Package name: power-calibrate
  Version : 0.01.13
  Upstream Author : Colin Ian King 
* URL : http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~cking/power-calibrate/
* License : GPL-2+
  Programming Lang: C
  Description : power calibration tool

Power-calibrate calibrates the power consumption of a mobile device
that has a battery power source or a recent Intel processor using the
RAPL (Running Average Power Limit) interface. It will attempt to 
calibrate the power usage of 1% of CPU utiltisation and 1 context switch.
This can be useful for comparing different processor configurations.


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MBF: build Python 3 modules for packages that support it upstream

[Paul Tagliamonte]

Please CC me on all replies, I'm not subscribed to -devel



I'd like to propose a MBF on Python packages that contains a Trove
classifier that's positive Python 3, who's Debian packaging does not
build a Python 3 package.


Which is to say their upstream claims Python 3 support, but we don't
build Python 3 modules.


I'll curate the raw run I did today, since I saw a few false positive
(python 3 backports to python 3) and file them. I'll run a dd-list at
some point before the file.

Severity will be wishlist. Target is the next release / sid after Jessie
release.


Cheers,
  Paul


-- 
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Re: Minified javascripts in packages

[Ian Jackson]

Andreas Noteng writes ("Re: Minified javascripts in packages"):
> Guess I'll have to start over again and figure out how to manually
> concatenate the separate upstream files into one huge file. I can see
> how it makes sense, but it also seems like a lot of work for very
> little gain…

So you propose to manually reimplement the needed build-time
functionality, for which upstream expect to use grunt ?

Wouldn't it be easier to package grunt ?  Forgive me if I've missed,
in this thread, the explanation of why that's difficult.

Ian.


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Re: Debian Outreach Team Delegation

[João Vanzuita]

Hi,

from 0 to 10, what's the importance of this team ?

att,

On 04/16/2015 08:35 AM, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:

Dear Developers,

I am happy to announce the creation of the Debian Outreach Team. As
highlighted below in the official delegation, the Outreach Team is
responsible for coordinating Debian's participation in outreach programs
such as Google Summer of Code and Outreachy[1] (formerly GNOME's Outreach
Program for Women) -- but not limited to those two.

Initially, the team will be composed of Nicolas Dandrimont, Sylvestre Ledru,
Molly de Blanc and Tom Marble. Most of them have previous experience as
Debian GSOC and/or OPW admins. They can be reached at 
(or will be -- pending DSA creation of the alias), and will have a web page
soon at .

There are also some Debian-only mentorship programs, such as the Debian
Women Mentoring Program[2], and DebianMed's Mentoring of the Month
(MoM)[3]. Those programs are currently outside of the scope of this
delegation, as they do not have the same needs in terms of coordination,
funding, selection and ranking.

[1] https://www.gnome.org/outreachy/
[2] https://www.debian.org/women/mentoring
[3] https://wiki.debian.org/DebianMed/MoM

Cheers,

- Lucas



Debian Outreach Team delegation
===

I hereby appoint the following developers as members of the Debian Outreach
Team:

- Nicolas Dandrimont (olasd)
- Sylvestre Ledru(sylvestre)

Additionally, even though not officially delegated as they are not DDs yet,
Tom Marble and Molly de Blanc are also members of the Debian Outreach Team.

The delegation is not time-limited. It will be effective until further
changes by present or future DPLs.

Task Description


The Debian Outreach Team is responsible for coordinating the participation
of Debian in internship-like programs (including Outreachy and Google
Summer of Code). This involves:

- acting as a contact point for all topics related to Debian's
   participation into those programs

- when necessary, ensuring the funding of Debian's participation (by
   requesting the use of Debian funds to the DPL, by organizing fundraising
   campaigns, etc.)

- when necessary, establishing Debian-specific rules about who can apply for
   the various roles (mentors, participants) in those programs

- ranking and selecting applications -- generally, considering the feedback
   given by mentors and other reviewers

- coordinating the communication around Debian's participation into those
   programs





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Work-needing packages report for Apr 17, 2015

[wnpp]

The following is a listing of packages for which help has been requested
through the WNPP (Work-Needing and Prospective Packages) system in the
last week.

Total number of orphaned packages: 670 (new: 3)
Total number of packages offered up for adoption: 148 (new: 1)
Total number of packages requested help for: 57 (new: 0)

Please refer to http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/ for more information.



The following packages have been orphaned:

   cronolog (#782432), orphaned 4 days ago
 Description: Logfile rotator for web servers
 Installations reported by Popcon: 334

   docbook-to-man (#782433), orphaned 4 days ago
 Description: converter from DocBook SGML into roff man macros
 Reverse Depends: gtk-doc-tools
 Installations reported by Popcon: 3822

   pacpl (#782435), orphaned 4 days ago
 Description: multi-purpose audio converter/ripper/tagger script
 Installations reported by Popcon: 554

667 older packages have been omitted from this listing, see
http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/orphaned for a complete list.



The following packages have been given up for adoption:

   uid-wrapper (#782374), offered 5 days ago
 Description: UID wrapper library
 Installations reported by Popcon: 3

147 older packages have been omitted from this listing, see
http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/rfa_bypackage for a complete list.



For the following packages help is requested:

   apt-xapian-index (#567955), requested 1900 days ago
 Description: maintenance tools for a Xapian index of Debian packages
 Reverse Depends: ept-cache goplay packagesearch
 Installations reported by Popcon: 72927

   athcool (#278442), requested 3824 days ago
 Description: Enable powersaving mode for Athlon/Duron processors
 Installations reported by Popcon: 40

   awstats (#755797), requested 267 days ago
 Description: powerful and featureful web server log analyzer
 Installations reported by Popcon: 4175

   balsa (#642906), requested 1299 days ago
 Description: An e-mail client for GNOME
 Reverse Depends: balsa-dbg
 Installations reported by Popcon: 701

   cardstories (#624100), requested 1452 days ago
 Description: Find out a card using a sentence made up by another
   player
 Installations reported by Popcon: 10

   chromium-browser (#583826), requested 1782 days ago
 Description: Chromium browser
 Reverse Depends: chromedriver chromium-dbg chromium-l10n
   design-desktop-web mozplugger
 Installations reported by Popcon: 26485

   cups (#532097), requested 2140 days ago
 Description: Common UNIX Printing System
 Reverse Depends: bluez-cups chromium cinnamon-settings-daemon
   cloudprint cups cups-backend-bjnp cups-browsed cups-bsd cups-client
   cups-core-drivers (64 more omitted)
 Installations reported by Popcon: 146066

   debtags (#567954), requested 1900 days ago
 Description: Enables support for package tags
 Reverse Depends: goplay packagesearch
 Installations reported by Popcon: 2260

   developers-reference (#759995), requested 229 days ago
 Description: guidelines and information for Debian developers
 Installations reported by Popcon: 15946

   ejabberd (#767874), requested 164 days ago
 Description: distributed, fault-tolerant Jabber/XMPP server written
   in Erlang
 Reverse Depends: ejabberd-contrib
 Installations reported by Popcon: 836

   fbcat (#565156), requested 1919 days ago
 Description: framebuffer grabber
 Installations reported by Popcon: 163

   freeipmi (#628062), requested 1421 days ago
 Description: GNU implementation of the IPMI protocol
 Reverse Depends: freeipmi freeipmi-bmc-watchdog freeipmi-ipmidetect
   freeipmi-ipmiseld freeipmi-tools ipmitool libfreeipmi-dev
   libfreeipmi16 libipmiconsole-dev libipmiconsole2 (5 more omitted)
 Installations reported by Popcon: 6197

   gnat-gps (#496905), requested 2422 days ago
 Description: co-maintainer needed
 Reverse Depends: gnat-gps gnat-gps-dbg
 Installations reported by Popcon: 546

   gnokii (#677750), requested 1034 days ago
 Description: Datasuite for mobile phone management
 Reverse Depends: gnokii gnokii-cli gnokii-smsd gnokii-smsd-mysql
   gnokii-smsd-pgsql gnome-phone-manager libgnokii-dev libgnokii6
   xgnokii
 Installations reported by Popcon: 1475

   gradle (#683666), requested 987 days ago
 Description: Groovy based build system
 Reverse Depends: gradle libgradle-plugins-java
 Installations reported by Popcon: 278

   gridengine (#703256), requested 760 days ago
 Description: Distributed resource management
 Reverse Depends: gridengine-client gridengine-drmaa-dev
   gridengine-exec gridengine-master grid

Python 3 porting ML - Request for Projects

[Paul Tagliamonte]

Heyya -devel,

If anyone has Python 2 only projects that you need a hand with porting,
we have a brand new list:

https://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/py3porters-devel

This list, within less than 15 hours of my posting the d-d-a mail, has
over 110 people subscribed.

Feed us. Feed us old code. Let us hack :)


Please include as much documentation as you can, and any information you
can provide. Many folks here are totally 100% new to Debian, so please
be descriptive and link to VCS repos.

Please be friendly!

With love,
  Paul

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`. `'`  http://people.debian.org/~paultag
 `- http://people.debian.org/~paultag/conduct-statement.txt


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Russell Stuart]

On Thu, 2015-04-16 at 19:37 +0200, Sven Bartscher wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 09:04:07 -0600
> Dimitri John Ledkov  wrote:
> 
> > I'd rather see gitlab.debian.net :)
> 
> I don't  a reason to have gitlab/github/someother git stuff for debian,
> since we already have alioth.
> Maybe someone can enlighten me.

Probably not.  UI's are a personal thing and if you've looked at the
others and still the UI provided by FusionForge, that's unlikely to
change.

But do acknowledge that makes you unusual.  Github has all but
annihilated SourceForge in the hosting market place, and the stand out
change is it's UI.  That is in spite of SourceForge's impressive mirror
network and SourceForge being VCS agnostic.  So it's not surprising some
DD's want to move away from the FusionForge UI.

I'm on SourceForge now.  [0]  I'd prefer to be on Debian's
infrastructure of course, but Alioth is so poorly maintained it was
unusable for me [1].

Of the suggestions so far only Kallithea is VCS agnostic, but Kallithea
only supports source code hosting - no Ticketing (eg bug tracking), no
web project web page, no release hosting (binaries).  Maybe that's an
advantage for Debian projects because it forces you to use Debian's
existing infrastructure for everything else, but for me it makes it a
no-go.

Gogs looks to be similar, but is unstable.  Gitlab is git only and
doesn't support releases.

SourceForge's Apollo is an open source project supporting all those
features plus a heap more, but the UI is not "code centric" like the
others - it feels more like FusionForge.  That said, unlike FusionForge
modern work flows (forking, pull requests and the like) - it's just they
aren't a prominent in the UI.



[0]  http://sourceforge.net/u/rstuart/

[1]  https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2014/05/msg00463.html

 That triggered this response, but it read like someone in denial
 rather than acknowledging the problem:

 https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2014/06/msg00435.html

 Acknowledging the problem is always the first step in fixing it,
 and I think it's significant the number of open bugs has gone up by
 20% since then.



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Re: debian github organization ?

[Iustin Pop]

On 2015-04-17 10:54:43, Russell Stuart wrote:
> Github has all but
> annihilated SourceForge in the hosting market place, and the stand out
> change is it's UI.  That is in spite of SourceForge's impressive mirror
> network and SourceForge being VCS agnostic.

I think the VCS agnosticism is actually detrimental in this context.
It's much easier for the user when every repo is using the same VCS.
And consistency makes it very easy, for example, to refer to commits
across projects, to standardise pull/clone workflows, etc.

regards,
iustin


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Re: ITP: wrk -- HTTP benchmarking tool

[Robert Edmonds]

Dmitry Smirnov wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Apr 2015 17:44:52 Robert Edmonds wrote:
> > * Package name: wrk
> >   Version : 4.0.1
> >   Upstream Author : Will Glozer
> > * URL : https://github.com/wg/wrk
> > * License : Apache-2.0, BSD-3-Clause
> >   Programming Lang: C
> >   Description : HTTP benchmarking tool
> > 
> >  wrk is a modern HTTP benchmarking tool capable of generating significant
> >  load when run on a single multi-core CPU. It combines a multithreaded
> >  design with scalable event notification systems such as epoll and kqueue.
> >  .
> >  An optional LuaJIT script can perform HTTP request generation, response
> >  processing, and custom reporting.
> 
> Any noticeable differences from "siege"? Thanks.

Hi, Dmitry:

One big difference is the LuaJIT scripting support in wrk.  E.g., I
believe with siege, the HTTP requests have to be constructed ahead of
time (though there is support for variable expansion), whereas wrk can
call a user-supplied Lua function to generate a request.

-- 
Robert Edmonds
edmo...@debian.org


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Re: debian github organization ?

[Russ Allbery]

Iustin Pop  writes:

> I think the VCS agnosticism is actually detrimental in this context.
> It's much easier for the user when every repo is using the same VCS.
> And consistency makes it very easy, for example, to refer to commits
> across projects, to standardise pull/clone workflows, etc.

+1.  VCS agnosticism means you waste a bunch of time making each new
feature work with every supported VCS, which can include trying to
shoehorn pretty foreign workflows into the model of some other VCS.

-- 
Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org)   


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Re: Debian Outreach Team Delegation

[Paul Wise]

On Fri, Apr 17, 2015 at 4:49 AM, João Vanzuita wrote:

> from 0 to 10, what's the importance of this team ?

It is really quite important for bringing new people to Debian.

-- 
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pabs

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Re: debian github organization ?

[Marc Haber]

On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 19:40:21 -0700, Russ Allbery 
wrote:
>Iustin Pop  writes:
>> I think the VCS agnosticism is actually detrimental in this context.
>> It's much easier for the user when every repo is using the same VCS.
>> And consistency makes it very easy, for example, to refer to commits
>> across projects, to standardise pull/clone workflows, etc.
>
>+1.  VCS agnosticism means you waste a bunch of time making each new
>feature work with every supported VCS, which can include trying to
>shoehorn pretty foreign workflows into the model of some other VCS.

But it leaves a choice to the author. On a VCS-bound system, all
choice you have is to go to a different place.

Thankfully, git is by far the best VCS on the market and the vast
majority of people seem to agree. But imagine the outcry if ten years
ago Sourceforge had said "our VCS is svn and we don't support anything
else".

Greetings
Marc
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Re: debian github organization ?

[Russ Allbery]

Marc Haber  writes:

> Thankfully, git is by far the best VCS on the market and the vast
> majority of people seem to agree. But imagine the outcry if ten years
> ago Sourceforge had said "our VCS is svn and we don't support anything
> else".

Er, they did, didn't they?  I could have sworn that they only supported
CVS initially, and then only added Subversion, and getting Git support
took forever.

Launchpad, similarly, is probably suffering a lot from the decision to
only support bzr.  (It suffers from some other things as well, such as
asset licensing and how difficult it is to stand up your own, but I think
the VCS is a major problem right now.)

So you're of course right -- there's a tradeoff.

However, I still stand by the decision to only support a single VCS, at
least when you start, because you can move a lot faster and implement a
lot more functionality that people care a great deal about.  If you can
find the right VCS to use that 90% of people are content with (and I think
Sourceforge started there), I think your resources are much better put
into adding other features than adding more VCS support.

I have no interest in ever using bzr again, but I strongly suspect
Launchpad got a lot farther and does a lot more because the choice was
made to only support bzr.  Now, of course, they need to switch to Git, or
at least support it, and that's going to be a ton of work, but I suspect
the order in which they did that made for a better system in the long run
than if they'd tried to support both bzar and Git (and Mercurial and the
other ones that were looking viable) at the start.

-- 
Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org)   


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Re: Minified javascripts in packages

[Vincent Bernat]

 ❦ 17 avril 2015 00:32 +0100, Ian Jackson  :

>> Guess I'll have to start over again and figure out how to manually
>> concatenate the separate upstream files into one huge file. I can see
>> how it makes sense, but it also seems like a lot of work for very
>> little gain…
>
> So you propose to manually reimplement the needed build-time
> functionality, for which upstream expect to use grunt ?
>
> Wouldn't it be easier to package grunt ?  Forgive me if I've missed,
> in this thread, the explanation of why that's difficult.

Grunt alone is useless. You need to have a lot of plugins to do
something with it. Then, you have the dependencies of each plugins. You
may need to package and maintain dozens of NPM packages.
-- 
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Re: Minified javascripts in packages

[Vincent Bernat]

 ❦ 16 avril 2015 21:09 +0200, Andreas Noteng  :

>> While I still maintain my previous position that concatenated js
>> is DFSG-free, even if it is not what upstream requires, I'm just
>> wondering - what is your .orig.tar.gz? You might not need to repack
>> it if you can concatenate the files with a debhelper override in
>> d/rules. And you're still distributing source the way upstream
>> wants it, so everyone's happy.
>
> My upstream simply includes the minified copy of the js's, I exclude
> these files in a repacked tarball using the exclude field of
> d/copyright. This is no problem. My problem is that building the
> javascript libs the way upstream's upstream intended requires grunt.
>
> Guess I'll have to start over again and figure out how to manually
> concatenate the separate upstream files into one huge file. I can see
> how it makes sense, but it also seems like a lot of work for very
> little gain…

We can't know for sure what is really accepted in Debian until you
upload something. Go the easy path first.

However, note that you may also hit the "no embedding rule" (as far as I
understand, what do you try to package?).
-- 
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than someone who hasn't.
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Re: Minified javascripts in packages

[Andreas Noteng]

Not really. Just use the information from the grunt config to build the single 
file javascript using cat. It's a sub-optimal solution because it's a lot of 
work for doing something upstream allready did, and we can't run the tests. It 
was actually quite easy with jQuery, working with angular and angular-translate 
now.
Please read the first post of this thread [1], work is allready underway on 
packaging Grunt, but there are some dependency issues and som (hopefully solved 
by now) licensing issues.

[1]: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2015/04/msg00056.html

--
Andreas Noteng

> Den 17. apr. 2015 kl. 01.32 skrev Ian Jackson 
> :
> 
> Andreas Noteng writes ("Re: Minified javascripts in packages"):
>> Guess I'll have to start over again and figure out how to manually
>> concatenate the separate upstream files into one huge file. I can see
>> how it makes sense, but it also seems like a lot of work for very
>> little gain…
> 
> So you propose to manually reimplement the needed build-time
> functionality, for which upstream expect to use grunt ?
> 
> Wouldn't it be easier to package grunt ?  Forgive me if I've missed,
> in this thread, the explanation of why that's difficult.
> 
> Ian.
> 
> 
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