$B7Y9p!*%&%$%k%9%A%'%C%/%5!<(B$B%S%9(B

[VirusCheckService]

==
(BVIRUS GUARD and CHECK SERVICE for E-Mail  Powerd by SYMANTEC Scan Engine.
(B
$B$"$J$?$,Aw$C$?%a!<%k$K%&%#%k%9$rH/8+$7$^$7$?!#(B
$B8!CN$5$l$?%&[EMAIL PROTECTED];_$N0Y!"%a!<%k$r:o=|CW$7$^$7$?!#(B
$B%a!<%k$rAw?.$7$h$&[EMAIL PROTECTED]<5-$N$H$*$j$G$9!#(B
(B[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(B
(B
(B[EMAIL PROTECTED]>!'(Byour_picture.pif $B%&%#%k%9L>!'([EMAIL PROTECTED]
(B[EMAIL PROTECTED]>!'(B3B2504982D   $B%&%#%k%9L>!'([EMAIL PROTECTED]
(B==
(BTT2 date:2005/03/05 19:27:19
(B
(B
(B-- 
(BTo UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Bwith a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Shouldn't kernel-image-2.6.x-y-z depend on alsa-base ?

[Josselin Mouette]

Le samedi 05 mars 2005 à 00:44 +0100, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> Exactly. I don't have alsa-base installed on any of my 2.6.x systems
> and some of them have sound and some don't. None of them have
> problems.
> 
> A depends would be too strong. A recommends/suggests should be there.

I'm only pointing the issue. When you install a brand new sarge system,
sound doesn't work correctly on many kinds of hardware, because both OSS
and ALSA modules are loaded. Adding a Depends: is only a possible
solution, I'm sure there are better choices. However, I feel we
shouldn't release in this state after having spent so much efforts in
hardware detection.
-- 
 .''`.   Josselin Mouette/\./\
: :' :   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
`. `'[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  `-  Debian GNU/Linux -- The power of freedom


signature.asc
Description: Ceci est une partie de message	=?ISO-8859-1?Q?num=E9riquement?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_sign=E9e?=

combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[martin f krafft]

Hi all,

I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels,
and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH,
but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root. Thus, it tries
to use /root/.ssh for configuration and node verification, which is
not accessible to the normal user.

The reasons seems to be that OpenSSH uses getpwnam to obtain the
real UID's home directory, rather than $HOME. This is probably
a security measure.

Has anyone else run into this problem? How could I work around it?

-- 
martin;  (greetings from the heart of the sun.)
  \ echo mailto: !#^."<*>"|tr "<*> mailto:"; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
invalid/expired pgp subkeys? use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver!
spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
"even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day."
-- orbital


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[Petter Reinholdtsen]

[martin f krafft]
> I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels,
> and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH,
> but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root.

Why isn't it enough to do 'make install' as root?  Is there something
in the build process requiring root access?


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: NoX idea

[Henning Makholm]

Scripsit Benjamin Mesing <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> Just wondering if Debian should switch to LSB recommendation

> LSB recommends:
> 0 halt
> 1 single user mode
> 2 multiuser with no network services exported 
> 3 normal/full multiuser   
> 4 reserved for local use, default is normal/full multiuser
> 5 multiuser with xdm or equivalent
> 6 reboot

That seems awfully restrictive, only giving the local admin a single
runlevel to customize to his own needs.

-- 
Henning Makholm"Nej, hvor er vi altså heldige! Længe
  leve vor Buxgører Sansibar Bastelvel!"

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Petter Reinholdtsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1225 +0100]:
> > I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels,
> > and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH,
> > but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root.
> 
> Why isn't it enough to do 'make install' as root?  Is there something
> in the build process requiring root access?

Weird; some packages have dh_testroot in the build target. I tried
removing that and using fakeroot only for install. It seems like it
works now, but we'll see... argh. It seems that some people
(including myself when I wrote these scripts) think that `fakeroot
dpkg-buildpackage` is the same as `dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot`).

Thanks; it's too early in the day for me to have thought of this
myself. :)

-- 
Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list!
 
 .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
: :'  :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author
`. `'`
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system
 
Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver!


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

grass and Packages-arch-specific

[Steve Halasz]

Hi,

I've sent a few emails over the last month to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] requesting that grass be removed from
packages-arch-specific. But my pleas have fallen on deaf ears, or
perhaps overzealous spam filters. Are you guys out there? Is there
anyone else who can make this change for me?

Thanks in advance,

Steve


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: grass and Packages-arch-specific

[Thiemo Seufer]

Steve Halasz wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I've sent a few emails over the last month to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] requesting that grass be removed from
> packages-arch-specific. But my pleas have fallen on deaf ears, or
> perhaps overzealous spam filters. Are you guys out there? Is there
> anyone else who can make this change for me?

File a bug against the ftp.debian.org pseudopackage.


Thiemo


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Is NEW processing on hold? (was: Question for candidate Towns)

[Frank Küster]

Hamish Moffatt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> There's rumours on debian-devel that NEW processing is actual on hold 
> (by decision rather than by default) but that wasn't communicated. Of
> course it may be false 

It is false.  

http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-changes/2005/03/msg00019.html

Regards, Frank
-- 
Frank Küster
Inst. f. Biochemie der Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer

Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Nobuhiro Iwamatsu]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Nobuhiro Iwamatsu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: tinywm
  Version : 1.2.0
  Upstream Author : Nick Welch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://incise.org/
* License : fair license 
  Description : Ridiculously tiny window manager

 TinyWM is a ridiculously tiny window manager implemented in nearly as
 few lines of C as possible, without being obfuscated or entirely
 useless. It allows you to move, resize, focus (sloppy), and raise
 windows.
 
-- System Information:
Debian Release: 3.1
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Kernel: Linux 2.6.10
Locale: LANG=ja_JP.eucJP, LC_CTYPE=ja_JP.eucJP (charmap=EUC-JP)


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[Goswin von Brederlow]

martin f krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Hi all,
>
> I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels,
> and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH,
> but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root. Thus, it tries
> to use /root/.ssh for configuration and node verification, which is
> not accessible to the normal user.
>
> The reasons seems to be that OpenSSH uses getpwnam to obtain the
> real UID's home directory, rather than $HOME. This is probably
> a security measure.
>
> Has anyone else run into this problem? How could I work around it?

ssh -i usualy helps.

MfG
Goswin


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Goswin von Brederlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1840 +0100]:
> ssh -i usualy helps.

not if you cannot influence how SSH is called.

-- 
Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list!
 
 .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
: :'  :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author
`. `'`
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system
 
Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver!


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[Michael Tautschnig]

also sprach Goswin von Brederlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1840 +0100]:
ssh -i usualy helps.
not if you cannot influence how SSH is called.
Actually I don't really know, but maybe the environment-variable 
DISTCC_SSH could be helpful.

Regards,
Michael
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[Florian Weimer]

* martin f. krafft:

> Has anyone else run into this problem? How could I work around it?

"unset LD_PRELOAD" and a wrapper script works with current fakeroot.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

debootstrap-farm (was: Automatic building of (parts of) the archive)

[Frank Küster]

Hi, 

a while ago I wrote:

>> Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> in order to test whether packages that build-depend on tetex can still
>>> be built with the upcoming version 3.0, I would like to automatically
>>> build as many of these packages.  I know where I can read about setting
>>> up a buildd, but two questions remain:
[...]
> Is this documented in the sbuild package, or somewhere else? For a
> starter, I looked at Andreas Barth's cheat sheet, but there he only
> mentions manual building of packages, no local queue.

While I only read it back then, I wanted to actually do the stuff
described in the cheat sheet.  However, it mentions the command
"debootstrap-farm".  I can't find anything about it.  What is changed in
this command, compared to standard debootstrap?

TIA, Frank
-- 
Frank Küster
Inst. f. Biochemie der Univ. Zürich
Debian Developer

Re: Bug#297121: ITP: wmail -- WindowMaker docklet watching your inbox

[Ludovic Rousseau]

Le Sunday 27 February 2005 à 10:08:02, Julien Danjou a écrit:
> Package: wnpp
> Severity: wishlist
> Owner: Julien Danjou <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> * Package name: wmail
>   Version : 2.0
>   Upstream Author : Sven Geisenhainer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> * URL : http://dockapps.org/file.php/id/70
> * License : Seems specific, but free and probably GPL-compatible
>   Description : WindowMaker docklet watching your inbox
> 
> 
> wmail is a Window Maker docklet watching your inbox, which is either a
> ordinary mbox or a directory conforming to qmails Maildir format. It
> provides a nice little GUI displaying some useful pieces of information
> about your inbox (as many other nice wm-apps doing nearly the same
> thing...). Per default it uses the $MAIL environment-variable to locate
> the inbox you are using, other mailing mechanisms like POP or IMAP are
> not supported - use a tool like fetchmail to retrieve POP- or IMAP-based
> mail.

What are the differences with wmbiff [1]?
What features does wmail provide that wmbiff does not?

Bye,

  Package: wmbiff (0.4.26-1)
  A dockable app that displays information about mailboxes
  
  WMBiff is an WindowMaker docking utility, that displays the number of
  read and unread messages in (usually) five mailboxes. You can also
  define actions to execute on new mail arrival (for example, play a sound
  file), [auto]fetchmail from a remote server, execute your mail reader
  with a mouse click, or list subject lines from unread messages. WMBiff
  also supports notification of incoming Licq messages, so you can put
  Licq in the background.
  
  At this moment, wmbiff supports unix-style, maildir, pop3, APOP, IMAP
  and IMAPS mailboxes, as well as Licq and GnomeICU history files.
  
  It also includes scripts to perform miscellaneous tasks. At the moment,
  these include a checker for Debian security updates.
  
  wmbiff is similar to the wmmaiload package, but features an LED-style
  appearance, IMAPS support, and other minor differences.

[1] http://packages.debian.org/unstable/x11/wmbiff

-- 
 Dr. Ludovic Rousseau[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 -- Normaliser Unix c'est comme pasteuriser le camembert, L.R. --


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH

[martin f krafft]

also sprach Michael Tautschnig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1901 +0100]:
> Actually I don't really know, but maybe the environment-variable
> DISTCC_SSH could be helpful.

... it was really too early in the day. Sorry to all.

-- 
Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list!
 
 .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
: :'  :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author
`. `'`
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system
 
Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver!


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Bug#298227: ITP: maildirsync -- Simple and efficient Maildir synchronisation utility

[Per Olofsson]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist

URL: http://hacks.dlux.hu/maildirsync/
License: GPL/Artistic

Package: maildirsync
Description: Simple and efficient Maildir synchronisation utility
 maildirsync is a utility for synchronising Maildir folders. It uses
 its own custom protocol for efficient communication, and uses ssh as
 its transport.

-- 
Pelle


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Bug#297121: ITP: wmail -- WindowMaker docklet watching your inbox

[Erik Schanze]

Ludovic Rousseau <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Le Sunday 27 February 2005 à 10:08:02, Julien Danjou a écrit:
> > Package: wnpp
> > Severity: wishlist
> > Owner: Julien Danjou <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > * Package name: wmail
> >   Version : 2.0
> >   Upstream Author : Sven Geisenhainer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > * URL : http://dockapps.org/file.php/id/70
> > * License : Seems specific, but free and probably GPL-compatible
> >   Description : WindowMaker docklet watching your inbox
> >
> >
> > wmail is a Window Maker docklet watching your inbox, which is either a
> > ordinary mbox or a directory conforming to qmails Maildir format. It
> > provides a nice little GUI displaying some useful pieces of information
> > about your inbox (as many other nice wm-apps doing nearly the same
> > thing...). Per default it uses the $MAIL environment-variable to locate
> > the inbox you are using, other mailing mechanisms like POP or IMAP are
> > not supported - use a tool like fetchmail to retrieve POP- or IMAP-based
> > mail.
>
> What are the differences with wmbiff [1]?
>
Or wmmail? 

Package: wmmail
Priority: optional
Section: mail
Installed-Size: 472
Maintainer: Chris Waters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Architecture: i386
Version: 0.64-12
Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libx11-6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), libxext6 | xlibs 
(>> 4.1.0), libxpm4 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), libxt6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), base-files 
(>= 2.0.3)
Recommends: mail-reader
Suggests: wmaker
Filename: pool/main/w/wmmail/wmmail_0.64-12_i386.deb
Size: 122954
MD5sum: dbc7c4fc78fd144c36f5953218054c75
Description: A mail notification program designed for WindowMaker
 There's nothing in the program that makes it require WindowMaker, except
 maybe the look. It's much like xbiff, and was derived from asmail 0.50.
 Now includes support for a variety of mailboxes, including mbox, MH,
 maildir, POP3 and IMAP.  A few pixmaps and sounds are included with the
 package.


Freundlich grüßend,

Erik


-- 
 www.ErikSchanze.de *
 Bitte keine HTML-E-Mails! No HTML mails, please! Limit: 100 kB *
  * Linux-Info-Tag in Dresden, am 29. Oktober 2005  *
 Info: http://www.linux-info-tag.de *


pgpeeBhbHTsdn.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Shouldn't kernel-image-2.6.x-y-z depend on alsa-base ?

[Paul Hampson]

On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 12:01:47PM +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> Le samedi 05 mars 2005 à 00:44 +0100, Goswin von Brederlow a écrit :
> > Exactly. I don't have alsa-base installed on any of my 2.6.x systems
> > and some of them have sound and some don't. None of them have
> > problems.

> > A depends would be too strong. A recommends/suggests should be there.

> I'm only pointing the issue. When you install a brand new sarge system,
> sound doesn't work correctly on many kinds of hardware, because both OSS
> and ALSA modules are loaded. Adding a Depends: is only a possible
> solution, I'm sure there are better choices. However, I feel we
> shouldn't release in this state after having spent so much efforts in
> hardware detection.

Hmm. I would think that the better solution (the less surprising
solution) would be to leave out the ALSA modules from the Debian
kernel package, since we have a seperate package of ALSA modules
which _does_ depend on alsa-base.

Then a "desktop" install could offer to include them, and a non-
"desktop" install could leave them out by default, or something.

-- 
---
Paul "TBBle" Hampson, MCSE
8th year CompSci/Asian Studies student, ANU
The Boss, Bubblesworth Pty Ltd (ABN: 51 095 284 361)
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

"No survivors? Then where do the stories come from I wonder?"
-- Capt. Jack Sparrow, "Pirates of the Caribbean"

This email is licensed to the recipient for non-commercial
use, duplication and distribution.
---


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Popularity-contest http POST: call for testers

[Bill Allombert]

Hello developers,

We have plans to add support in popularity-contest to send the
report through http POST. Both the server part an the client part have
been developed.  The last issue is to actually use it in the cron job
and see what issues 

For that purpose, I have made an experimental popularity-contest package
that use both smtp and http. Please find it here:



This package report to the test popcon account so we can monitor it.

We would really like people to review or test this package in real
situations, in particular when network connectivity is chaotic.
We would like to make sure the popcon cron job will not cause problem
to users with poor network.

Thanks in advance for your comments,
-- 
Bill. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Imagine a large red swirl here. 


pgpLIll7EWGxr.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Andrew Suffield]

On Sun, Mar 06, 2005 at 01:17:50AM +0900, Nobuhiro Iwamatsu wrote:
> Package: wnpp
> Severity: wishlist
> Owner: Nobuhiro Iwamatsu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> 
> * Package name: tinywm
>   Version : 1.2.0
>   Upstream Author : Nick Welch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> * URL : http://incise.org/
> * License : fair license 

That's not a free license. In fact, it's about as non-free as you can
get, since it's essentially "all rights reserved"; there's no
permission to modify or redistribute at all. We can't distribute this,
even in non-free.

Here's the text:

Use of the works is permitted provided that this instrument
is retained with the works, so that any entity that uses the
works is notified of this instrument.

DISCLAIMER: THE WORKS ARE WITHOUT WARRANTY.

Usual example of why random people should not be writing licenses.

-- 
  .''`.  ** Debian GNU/Linux ** | Andrew Suffield
 : :' :  http://www.debian.org/ |
 `. `'  |
   `- -><-  |


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Popularity-contest http POST: call for testers

[Ron Johnson]

On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 00:48 +0100, Bill Allombert wrote:
> Hello developers,
> 
> We have plans to add support in popularity-contest to send the
> report through http POST. Both the server part an the client part have
> been developed.  The last issue is to actually use it in the cron job
> and see what issues 
> 
> For that purpose, I have made an experimental popularity-contest package
> that use both smtp and http. Please find it here:
> 
> 
> 
> This package report to the test popcon account so we can monitor it.
> 
> We would really like people to review or test this package in real
> situations, in particular when network connectivity is chaotic.
> We would like to make sure the popcon cron job will not cause problem
> to users with poor network.
> 
> Thanks in advance for your comments,

This is *great*, since it resolves bug #239097.

-- 
-
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson, LA USA
PGP Key ID 8834C06B I prefer encrypted mail.

"Oh, great altar of passive entertainment, bestow upon me thy
discordant images at such speed as to render linear thought
impossible"
Calvin, regarding TV



signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

Re: Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Josselin Mouette]

Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 à 01:17 +0900, Nobuhiro Iwamatsu a écrit :
>  TinyWM is a ridiculously tiny window manager implemented in nearly as
>  few lines of C as possible, without being obfuscated or entirely
>  useless. It allows you to move, resize, focus (sloppy), and raise
>  windows.

Describing how the code is small si sure some fun, but is this package
really useful for something? As described, it sounds just like one more
random window manager nobody cares for.
-- 
 .''`.   Josselin Mouette/\./\
: :' :   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
`. `'[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  `-  Debian GNU/Linux -- The power of freedom


signature.asc
Description: Ceci est une partie de message	=?ISO-8859-1?Q?num=E9riquement?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_sign=E9e?=

Re: debootstrap-farm (was: Automatic building of (parts of) the archive)

[Kenshi Muto]

Hi,

At Sat, 05 Mar 2005 19:59:27 +0100,
Frank Küster wrote:
> > Is this documented in the sbuild package, or somewhere else? For a
> > starter, I looked at Andreas Barth's cheat sheet, but there he only
> > mentions manual building of packages, no local queue.
> 
> While I only read it back then, I wanted to actually do the stuff
> described in the cheat sheet.  However, it mentions the command
> "debootstrap-farm".  I can't find anything about it.  What is changed in
> this command, compared to standard debootstrap?

debootstrap-farm is included in unofficial buildd-farm package, on
volatile.debian.net.

This command is the wrapper of debootstrap, just does:

#! /bin/bash +e

debootstrap $*

if [ "$1" == "--variant=buildd" ]; then
  echo "adding extra directories"
  install -d $3/var/debbuild/srcdep-lock -o buildd
  install -d $3/build/buildd -m 777
  cp /etc/passwd $3/etc/
fi


I wrote a note on http://kmuto.jp/open.cgi?buildd
This note is not perfect and has funny English :-), but will help you.

(BTW I tried to queue tetex-bin with manual installed tetex-base yesterday, but
it goes strange infinite loop. I'll send a report to BTS later.)

Thanks,
-- 
Kenshi Muto
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Popularity-contest http POST: call for testers

[Daniel Burrows]

On Saturday 05 March 2005 06:48 pm, Bill Allombert wrote:
> For that purpose, I have made an experimental popularity-contest package
> that use both smtp and http. Please find it here:

  Have you considered uploading it to experimental?

  Daniel

-- 
/--- Daniel Burrows <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --\
| Afternoon, n.:|
|   That part of the day we spend worrying  |
|   about how we wasted the morning.|
\- A duck! -- http://www.python.org /


pgpi6wedyCB1d.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: NoX idea

[Sven Mueller]

Henning Makholm wrote on 05/03/2005 12:17:
Scripsit Benjamin Mesing <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Just wondering if Debian should switch to LSB recommendation

LSB recommends:
0   halt
1   single user mode
2   multiuser with no network services exported 
3   normal/full multiuser   
4   reserved for local use, default is normal/full multiuser
5   multiuser with xdm or equivalent
6   reboot
That seems awfully restrictive, only giving the local admin a single
runlevel to customize to his own needs.
Well, for one, SysV-Init isn't restricted to the 7 runlevels listed 
above. And also, I can't imagine which other runlevels a local admin 
might want. And finally: There is nothing which could keep the local 
admin from modifying the runlevels. His system would just not comply 
with LSB anymore.

cu,
sven
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Ron Johnson]

On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 01:59 +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 à 01:17 +0900, Nobuhiro Iwamatsu a écrit :
> >  TinyWM is a ridiculously tiny window manager implemented in nearly as
> >  few lines of C as possible, without being obfuscated or entirely
> >  useless. It allows you to move, resize, focus (sloppy), and raise
> >  windows.
> 
> Describing how the code is small si sure some fun, but is this package
> really useful for something? As described, it sounds just like one more
> random window manager nobody cares for.

A "weak" computer that needs GUI app...

-- 
-
Ron Johnson, Jr.
Jefferson, LA USA
PGP Key ID 8834C06B I prefer encrypted mail.

4 degrees from Vladimir Putin



signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

Re: Popularity-contest http POST: call for testers

[Jacob S]

On Sun, 6 Mar 2005 00:48:21 +0100
Bill Allombert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hello developers,
> 
> We have plans to add support in popularity-contest to send the
> report through http POST. Both the server part an the client part have
> been developed.  The last issue is to actually use it in the cron job
> and see what issues 
> 
> For that purpose, I have made an experimental popularity-contest
> package that use both smtp and http. Please find it here:
> 
> 
> 
> This package report to the test popcon account so we can monitor it.
> 
> We would really like people to review or test this package in real
> situations, in particular when network connectivity is chaotic.
> We would like to make sure the popcon cron job will not cause problem
> to users with poor network.

I have not yet bothered to setup smtp on my machine to go through my
ISP's required gateway, so I could only send reports via the HTTP
method. Would my beta testing still be helpful, or are reports needed
via both methods for the test?

Thanks,
Jacob
 


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Nick Welch]

(not sure if i can post to this list, but what the hey)

> That's not a free license. In fact, it's about as non-free as you can
> get, since it's essentially "all rights reserved"; there's no
> permission to modify or redistribute at all. We can't distribute this,
> even in non-free.
>
> Here's the text:
>
> Use of the works is permitted provided that this instrument
> is retained with the works, so that any entity that uses the
> works is notified of this instrument.
>
> DISCLAIMER: THE WORKS ARE WITHOUT WARRANTY.
>
> Usual example of why random people should not be writing licenses.

It's the fair license, which is OSI approved:
http://opensource.org/licenses/fair.php

-- 
Nick Welch aka mackstann | mack @ incise.org | http://incise.org


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Matthew Palmer]

On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 09:07:16PM -0600, Ron Johnson wrote:
> On Sun, 2005-03-06 at 01:59 +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> > Le dimanche 06 mars 2005 ? 01:17 +0900, Nobuhiro Iwamatsu a ?crit :
> > >  TinyWM is a ridiculously tiny window manager implemented in nearly as
> > >  few lines of C as possible, without being obfuscated or entirely
> > >  useless. It allows you to move, resize, focus (sloppy), and raise
> > >  windows.
> > 
> > Describing how the code is small si sure some fun, but is this package
> > really useful for something? As described, it sounds just like one more
> > random window manager nobody cares for.
> 
> A "weak" computer that needs GUI app...

As much as I agree with the reasoning, these days the weight of your WM
isn't normally the defining characteristic in whether a lower-end computer
can run reasonably.  And if you're running a specialist app, you don't
actually even need a WM often.

- Matt


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Matthew Palmer]

On Sat, Mar 05, 2005 at 10:38:49PM -0600, Nick Welch wrote:
> (not sure if i can post to this list, but what the hey)
> 
> > That's not a free license. In fact, it's about as non-free as you can
> > get, since it's essentially "all rights reserved"; there's no
> > permission to modify or redistribute at all. We can't distribute this,
> > even in non-free.
> >
> > Here's the text:
> >
> > Use of the works is permitted provided that this instrument
> > is retained with the works, so that any entity that uses the
> > works is notified of this instrument.
> >
> > DISCLAIMER: THE WORKS ARE WITHOUT WARRANTY.
> >
> > Usual example of why random people should not be writing licenses.
> 
> It's the fair license, which is OSI approved:
> http://opensource.org/licenses/fair.php

Thanks for pointing this out.  Now we have a concrete example of just how
screwed up OSI is.  That licence does not grant any permission to modify,
redistribute, or otherwise deal in the work in a Free manner.  For it to be
judged as satisfying the Open Source Definition is ludicrous.

- Matt


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Nick Welch]

> Thanks for pointing this out.  Now we have a concrete example of just
> how screwed up OSI is.  That licence does not grant any permission to
> modify, redistribute, or otherwise deal in the work in a Free manner.
> For it to be judged as satisfying the Open Source Definition is
> ludicrous.

Interesting.  Based on discussions I have seen/been in on OSI's mailing
list, the license is basically the same (or intended to be) as the MIT/X
or BSD licenses, except that it requires notification of the license
terms instead of simple inclusion (i.e. to prevent trying to
hide/obfuscate it)

http://www.mail-archive.com/license-discuss@opensource.org/msg07011.html
http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:9414:kggljgdonepiacdbcied

As far as disallowing modification/redistribution/etc., that is not what
the license intends to do -- it's basically supposed to just be a
minimalist "do what you want with this, but give me credit" license.
If the wording implies restriction of modifications and whatnot, then it
would seem that there have been some big misunderstandings all around.

-- 
Nick Welch aka mackstann | mack @ incise.org | http://incise.org


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Bernd Eckenfels]

In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> you wrote:
> That licence does not grant any permission to modify,
> redistribute, or otherwise deal in the work in a Free manner.  For it to be
> judged as satisfying the Open Source Definition is ludicrous.

Are you an Laywer, is that based on research?

I mean, for me "Use" of source code does include all those freedoms.
Therfore I feel like accepting OSI's decision and accepting the fact that it
is free.

Greetings
Bernd


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Matthew Palmer]

On Sun, Mar 06, 2005 at 07:59:11AM +0100, Bernd Eckenfels wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> you wrote:
> > That licence does not grant any permission to modify,
> > redistribute, or otherwise deal in the work in a Free manner.  For it to be
> > judged as satisfying the Open Source Definition is ludicrous.
> 
> Are you an Laywer, is that based on research?

No, and yes.  

> I mean, for me "Use" of source code does include all those freedoms.

That's nice.  But irrelevant.  The fair licence doesn't even require source
code, so it can quite easily apply to a work for which there is no source. 

In the past, some copyright holders have decided to interpret even
widely-known and free licences like the MIT licence in non-free ways (cite:
pine), so having the wording of a licence be explicit and clear is a
definite advantage.  This licence is neither.

> Therfore I feel like accepting OSI's decision and accepting the fact that it
> is free.

I feel like an icecream sundae.

- Matt


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Matthew Palmer]

[no cc thanks]

On Sun, Mar 06, 2005 at 12:16:03AM -0600, Nick Welch wrote:
> > Thanks for pointing this out.  Now we have a concrete example of just
> > how screwed up OSI is.  That licence does not grant any permission to
> > modify, redistribute, or otherwise deal in the work in a Free manner.
> > For it to be judged as satisfying the Open Source Definition is
> > ludicrous.
> 
> Interesting.  Based on discussions I have seen/been in on OSI's mailing
> list, the license is basically the same (or intended to be) as the MIT/X
[...]
> As far as disallowing modification/redistribution/etc., that is not what
> the license intends to do -- it's basically supposed to just be a
> minimalist "do what you want with this, but give me credit" license.
> If the wording implies restriction of modifications and whatnot, then it
> would seem that there have been some big misunderstandings all around.

This is why random Joe off the street should not be writing licences.



By default, every creative work is provided the protection of copyright law. 
This includes the restriction of duplication, modification, "public
display", and so forth -- the exact rights vary between jurisdictions, but
certainly the act of modification, mass duplication and redistribution tends
to be restricted.

Absent an explicit notification to the contrary, the rights above are
restricted to the copyright holder.  Note that carefully: EXPLICIT
NOTIFICATION.  The licence provided to the wide world needs to say it in
clear english that you are allowed to do those things normally restricted by
copyright law.  Otherwise, you're not allowed to do it, and hence the
"licence" is not DFSG-free.



- Matt


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Bug#298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Petri Latvala]

On Sun, Mar 06, 2005 at 01:59:12AM +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> Describing how the code is small si sure some fun, but is this package
> really useful for something? As described, it sounds just like one more
> random window manager nobody cares for.


(I will some day learn to use "reply to list" instead of reply, and
learn how to read what I'm actually doing. Apologizes.)


For learning how to make a window manager yourself this is much better
than peering through the depths of Enlightenment, for example. But
this of course has no relevance on whether its suitable to be included
in Debian.

-- 
Petri Latvala


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Bug #298195: ITP: tinywm -- Ridiculously tiny window manager

[Thomas Viehmann]

Hi.
Nick Welch wrote:
(not sure if i can post to this list, but what the hey)
Hey, thanks for joining the discussion.
It's the fair license, which is OSI approved:
http://opensource.org/licenses/fair.php
Yet it seems that the BSD license's
 Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without
 modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions
 are met:
is much more explicit than the fair license on use and modifications.
Also I'm not sure about the "notification" bit, so I'll leave that to 
the experts.

Thomas
--
Thomas Viehmann, http://thomas.viehmann.net/
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Shouldn't kernel-image-2.6.x-y-z depend on alsa-base ?

[Thomas Viehmann]

Hi.
Josselin Mouette wrote:
As long as the linux26 installation ends up with both sound modules
loaded, that's a bug that needs to be fixed, though. Another option
would be to put the alsa modules in separate packages, just like pcmcia
modules.
That definetly sounds much better ;).
Kind regards
Thomas
--
Thomas Viehmann, http://thomas.viehmann.net/
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]