Ralph, thanks for the transparency! I'm okay with that unless another tool gives a large advantage. I really like Gradle's incremental build feature but I can live without it. However, moving half the project into separate repos feels too much like working around the limitations of the build tool.
If the slow release problem can be solved by using a better release plugin or something, then there is no urgent reason to move away from Maven. Otherwise we should considering all options, including other build tools. Is that fair? On Sat, May 6, 2017 at 2:50 PM, Ralph Goers <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> wrote: > I have to be honest. Since I am on the Maven PMC - although I haven’t > committed anything in years - I still have a preference for using it over > other tools. > > Ralph > > > On May 5, 2017, at 10:07 PM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Gradle would enable you to skip the clean, so only the necessary classes > are compiled before the tests are run. Much faster. You'll love it. > > > > Agreed that RM's job should be #1 priority. > > > > > > (Shameless plug) Every java main() method deserves http://picocli.info > > > >> On May 6, 2017, at 13:40, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >> For normal development I run Eclipse. > >> > >> I run mvn clean install before I commit anything non-trivial. > >> > >> So whether I do that in last step in Maven or Gradle is the same to me. > >> > >> The RM's job should be #1 consideration IMO. > >> > >> Gary > >> > >>> On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >>> > >>> The gitflow plugin looks promising. It seems to address the problem of > the > >>> tests being run twice head-on > >>> <https://www.atlassian.com/blog/software-teams/maven-git- > >>> flow-plugin-for-better-releases> > >>> : > >>> > >>>> > >>>> - Only builds your project once in the finish goal. e.g. if you do > >>>> release-start and release-finish together, your tests only run once > >>>> > >>>> > >>> It also seems to open up possibilities for streamlining our release > >>> procedures: since all changes are made on a branch and not on master, a > >>> rollback becomes very easy (just delete a branch). Would this allow us > to > >>> eliminate the first step in our release procedure? > >>> > >>> I assume we currently have `mvn clean install` as a first step > >>> <https://wiki.apache.org/logging/Log4j2ReleaseGuide> to detect > problems in > >>> advance. If a rollback is easy we can just try to optimistically > build the > >>> release. It would be great we can reduce 3 test runs to 1. > >>> > >>> I'm still interested in Gradle's incremental compilation for normal > log4j > >>> development but no rush here. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>> On Sat, May 6, 2017 at 4:42 AM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Yeah, it seems a bit easier to try experimenting with different Maven > >>>> plugins first before going all in on Gradle or something else. > >>>> > >>>>> On 5 May 2017 at 13:26, Ralph Goers <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> We could try using the maven gitflow plugin instead of the release > >>>> plugin. > >>>>> > >>>>> Ralph > >>>>> > >>>>>> On May 5, 2017, at 11:22 AM, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Is it possible to do mvn test and then the rest with -DskipTests? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> G > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On May 5, 2017 11:11 AM, "Ralph Goers" <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> Probably both. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Ralph > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On May 5, 2017, at 10:13 AM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> It seems like it. I'm not sure if it's in release:prepare or > >>>>>>>> release:perform. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On 5 May 2017 at 12:12, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> > >>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Are the tests run 3 times from within the same mvn call? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Gary > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On May 5, 2017 5:54 AM, "Remko Popma" <remko.po...@gmail.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> I don't oppose breaking things up into modules, but I'm not sure > >>>> that > >>>>>>> we > >>>>>>>>>> want to move modules into separate repos: I've seen this in > >>>> practice > >>>>> at > >>>>>>>>>> work and I worry we'll end up with a very complicated build. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Are we open to the idea of using a different build tool that > >>>> supports > >>>>>>>>>> incremental builds and lets us fix one of the root causes of the > >>>> slow > >>>>>>>>> build > >>>>>>>>>> where we need to run the tests three times to do a release? > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> I'm willing to put in the time to investigate and prototype a > >>>> Gradle > >>>>>>>>> build > >>>>>>>>>> but I don't want to waste my time if we know upfront we want to > >>>> stick > >>>>>>>>> with > >>>>>>>>>> Maven. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Remko > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> (Shameless plug) Every java main() method deserves > >>>>> http://picocli.info > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> On May 5, 2017, at 21:11, Mikael Ståldal < > >>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> ...but the main reason for breaking up into modules is not > build > >>>>>>> speed. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 9:40 AM, Mikael Ståldal < > >>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I think we should continue to break up things into modules, > but > >>>>> keep > >>>>>>>>>> them > >>>>>>>>>>>> in the same repo. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 2:16 AM, Remko Popma < > >>>>> remko.po...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Why don't we focus on making the build faster instead of this > >>>>> module > >>>>>>>>> & > >>>>>>>>>>>>> repo break-up? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> We know this breakup is adding all kinds of complexity but we > >>>> are > >>>>>>>>> only > >>>>>>>>>>>>> *hoping* (not sure) that it will make the build faster. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> The way I've heard Ralph and Matt describe it, the build > >>>> currently > >>>>>>>>>>>>> requires the most time consuming part (running the tests) to > >>> be > >>>>>>>>>> repeated > >>>>>>>>>>>>> three times! Wouldn't that be the first thing to look at? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Is this a Maven issue? Can it be fixed? Are we open to > >>>> considering > >>>>>>>>>>>>> alternatives like Gradle? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm concerned we're focusing on the wrong problem. We can > >>> break > >>>> up > >>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>>>>> modules later for the right reasons (dependencies etc). > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Remko > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> (Shameless plug) Every java main() method deserves > >>>>>>>>> http://picocli.info > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On May 5, 2017, at 1:58, Ralph Goers < > >>>> ralph.go...@dslextreme.com > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because the build takes forever. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ralph > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On May 4, 2017, at 9:00 AM, Mikael Ståldal < > >>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am not sure it is worth the effort to keep things in > >>>> different > >>>>>>>>>> repos > >>>>>>>>>>>>> at > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this point. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can see a point in keeping the Scala stuff in its own > repo > >>>>> since > >>>>>>>>> it > >>>>>>>>>>>>> needs > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Java 8 and scala compiler for building. The same goes for > >>>>>>>>>> log4j-kotlin > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any other language bindings we might want to do. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But for logging-log4j-tools, why? It has no other build > >>>>>>>>> requirements > >>>>>>>>>>>>> than > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the main repo. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, May 4, 2017 at 5:55 PM, Gary Gregory < > >>>>>>>>>> garydgreg...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, May 4, 2017 at 8:08 AM, Matt Sicker < > >>>>> boa...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I think we should really get the other git repos released > >>>>> before > >>>>>>>>> we > >>>>>>>>>>>>> make > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2.9 release. The thing holding that back, in my opinion, > >>> is > >>>>>>>>>> figuring > >>>>>>>>>>>>> out > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how to manage the website and documentation for all these > >>>>>>>>> separate > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> modules > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that aren't even in the same Maven project anymore. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which makes it harder to work with... :-( > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gary > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4 May 2017 at 09:44, Mikael Ståldal < > >>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have extracted the SocketServer stuff from log4j-core > >>> to > >>>>> new > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> log4j-server > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> module: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LOG4J2-1851 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That module is in the new logging-log4j-tools repo. > >>>> However, > >>>>>>>>> that > >>>>>>>>>>>>> repo > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not ready for making a release. Is anyone going to do > >>> that > >>>>>>>>> before > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2.9 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> release, or should we move the log4j-server module back > >>> to > >>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>> main > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> repo > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the time being? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | > >>>>>>>>> www.magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be > >>> contained > >>>>> in > >>>>>>>>>> this > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this > >>>>> message > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a > >>>>> person), > >>>>>>>>> you > >>>>>>>>>>>>> may > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the > >>>> sender > >>>>> by > >>>>>>>>>>>>> reply > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1617290459/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative= > >>> 9325&creativeASIN=1617290459& > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId= > >>> cadb800f39946ec62ea2b > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 1af9fe6a2b8> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1617290459> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182021/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative= > >>> 9325&creativeASIN=1935182021& > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId= > >>> 31ecd1f6b6d1eaf8886ac > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 902a24de418%22 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1935182021> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182951/ref=as_li_ > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative= > >>> 9325&creativeASIN=1935182951& > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> linkCode=%7B%7BlinkCode%7D%7D& > >>> tag=garygregory-20&linkId=%7B% > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 7Blink_id%7D%7D%22%3ESpring+Batch+in+Action> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t= > >>> garygregory-20&l= > >>>>>>>>>>>>> am2&o=1&a= > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1935182951> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | > >>>>> www.magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained > >>> in > >>>>>>> this > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this > >>>> message > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a > >>> person), > >>>>> you > >>>>>>>>>> may > >>>>>>>>>>>>> not > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the > sender > >>>> by > >>>>>>>>> reply > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* > >>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* > >>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | > >>> www.magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in > >>>> this > >>>>>>>>>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this > message > >>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), > >>>> you > >>>>>>> may > >>>>>>>>>> not > >>>>>>>>>>>> copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > >>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender > by > >>>>> reply > >>>>>>>>>>>> email. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* > >>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* > >>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | > >>> www.magine.com > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in > >>>> this > >>>>>>>>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message > >>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), > >>> you > >>>>> may > >>>>>>>>>> not > >>>>>>>>>>> copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > >>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by > >>>>> reply > >>>>>>>>>>> email. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > >>>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org > >> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition > >> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1617290459/ref=as_li_ > tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1617290459& > linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=cadb800f39946ec62ea2b1af9fe6a2b8> > >> > >> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > 1617290459> > >> JUnit in Action, Second Edition > >> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182021/ref=as_li_ > tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182021& > linkCode=as2&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=31ecd1f6b6d1eaf8886ac902a24de418%22 > > > >> > >> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > 1935182021> > >> Spring Batch in Action > >> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1935182951/ref=as_li_ > tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&creativeASIN=1935182951& > linkCode=%7B%7BlinkCode%7D%7D&tag=garygregory-20&linkId=%7B% > 7Blink_id%7D%7D%22%3ESpring+Batch+in+Action> > >> <http:////ir-na.amazon-adsystem.com/e/ir?t=garygregory-20&l=am2&o=1&a= > 1935182951> > >> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com > >> Home: http://garygregory.com/ > >> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory > > > > >
