Re: WiFi security (was wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi)

2010-06-23 Thread Joel Rees
On Jun 24, 2010, at 1:10 AM, JD wrote: > > > On 06/23/2010 01:24 AM, Joel Rees was caught red-handed while > writing:: >> On Jun 23, 2010, at 11:14 AM, JD wrote: >> >> >>> >>> On 06/22/2010 07:27 PM, Darr was caught red-handed while writing:: >>> On Tuesday, 22 June, 2010 @22:00 zulu, JD s

Re: WiFi security (was wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi)

2010-06-23 Thread JD
On 06/23/2010 01:24 AM, Joel Rees was caught red-handed while writing:: > On Jun 23, 2010, at 11:14 AM, JD wrote: > > >> >> On 06/22/2010 07:27 PM, Darr was caught red-handed while writing:: >> >>> On Tuesday, 22 June, 2010 @22:00 zulu, JD scribed: >>> >>> >>> WPA2-PSK + AE

Re: WiFi security (was wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi)

2010-06-23 Thread Joel Rees
On Jun 23, 2010, at 11:14 AM, JD wrote: > > > On 06/22/2010 07:27 PM, Darr was caught red-handed while writing:: >> On Tuesday, 22 June, 2010 @22:00 zulu, JD scribed: >> >> >>> WPA2-PSK + AES : I thought it is not possible for inter-customer >>> traffic to figure out the keys because once the con

Re: WiFi security (was wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi)

2010-06-22 Thread JD
On 06/22/2010 07:27 PM, Darr was caught red-handed while writing:: > On Tuesday, 22 June, 2010 @22:00 zulu, JD scribed: > > >> WPA2-PSK + AES : I thought it is not possible for inter-customer >> traffic to figure out the keys because once the connection is >> established, >> keys change dynam

Re: WiFi security (was wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi)

2010-06-22 Thread Darr
On Tuesday, 22 June, 2010 @22:00 zulu, JD scribed: > WPA2-PSK + AES : I thought it is not possible for inter-customer > traffic to figure out the keys because once the connection is > established, > keys change dynamically per the protocol. Perhaps a an expert on the > WPA2-PSK protocl can shed s

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread JD
On 06/22/2010 03:17 PM, Tim was caught red-handed while writing:: > On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 13:23 -0700, JD wrote: > >> Choose WPA2 with AES (aka CCMP), and you're safe >> (until someone comes along and exposes to the world >> that it is breakable). >> > Well, to be pedantic, if someone c

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Tim
On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 13:23 -0700, JD wrote: > Choose WPA2 with AES (aka CCMP), and you're safe > (until someone comes along and exposes to the world > that it is breakable). Well, to be pedantic, if someone cracks it but doesn't publicly prove it, you're still unsafe. ;-) You really have to won

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread bruce
hey guys... time to change the subject/name.. give that the initial OP thread has diverged!! On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 2:01 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht wrote: > > Bruno Wolff III writes: >> That depends on your threat model. If you don't trust the wireless operator >> the wireless encryption isn't

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread JD
On 06/22/2010 02:01 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht was caught red-handed while writing:: > Bruno Wolff III writes: > >> That depends on your threat model. If you don't trust the wireless operator >> the wireless encryption isn't that big of a deal since you need to use an >> encrypted tunnel in

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Bill Davidsen
bruce wrote: > hey guys > > if you're using starbucks, or nay other public access, aren't you > pretty much constrained to having to deal with an open network. or are > you implying that you can implement an encrypted connection on the nic > setup? > Not clear to me if you can or not, because

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Wolfgang S. Rupprecht
Bruno Wolff III writes: > That depends on your threat model. If you don't trust the wireless operator > the wireless encryption isn't that big of a deal since you need to use an > encrypted tunnel in any case. No kidding. You should use some form of end-to-end encryption any time you are on the

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Aaron Konstam
On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 09:25 -0700, JD wrote: > > On 06/22/2010 04:40 AM, Tim was caught red-handed while writing:: > > On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 11:31 -0700, JD wrote: > > > >> Also, WPA encryotion can be broken by a notebook PC in under 1 minute. > >> WPA (and WPA2) encryption that uses TKP can

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Bruno Wolff III
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 13:23:06 -0700, JD wrote: > > Right! That's why I said even if you choose WPA2 > along with TKIP, you're toast! > Choose WPA2 with AES (aka CCMP), and you're safe > (until someone comes along and exposes to the world > that it is breakable). That depends on your threat

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread JD
On 06/22/2010 12:54 PM, Wolfgang S. Rupprecht was caught red-handed while writing:: > Tim writes: > >> On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 11:31 -0700, JD wrote: >> >>> Also, WPA encryotion can be broken by a notebook PC in under 1 minute. >>> WPA (and WPA2) encryption that uses TKP can also be bro

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Aaron Konstam
On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 07:06 -0700, bruce wrote: > hey guys > > if you're using starbucks, or nay other public access, aren't you > pretty much constrained to having to deal with an open network. or are > you implying that you can implement an encrypted connection on the nic > setup? > > thank

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Wolfgang S. Rupprecht
Tim writes: > On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 11:31 -0700, JD wrote: >> Also, WPA encryotion can be broken by a notebook PC in under 1 minute. >> WPA (and WPA2) encryption that uses TKP can also be broken in under 1 >> minute. So far AES seems to be invulnerable (as far whatever has been >> printed publicl

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread JD
On 06/22/2010 04:40 AM, Tim was caught red-handed while writing:: > On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 11:31 -0700, JD wrote: > >> Also, WPA encryotion can be broken by a notebook PC in under 1 minute. >> WPA (and WPA2) encryption that uses TKP can also be broken in under 1 >> minute. So far AES seems to

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Tim
On Tue, 2010-06-22 at 07:06 -0700, bruce wrote: > if you're using starbucks, or nay other public access, aren't you > pretty much constrained to having to deal with an open network. or are > you implying that you can implement an encrypted connection on the nic > setup? That had nothing to do with

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread bruce
right just wanted to make sure this was/is clarified in case others see this in the future... or.. you can always ssh into a secure system, and go from there.. but at the same time.. even if you are on an open network.. accesing secure "https" sites on your browser on your machine will be sa

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread fred smith
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 07:06:40AM -0700, bruce wrote: > hey guys > > if you're using starbucks, or nay other public access, aren't you > pretty much constrained to having to deal with an open network. or are > you implying that you can implement an encrypted connection on the nic > setup? Ye

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread bruce
hey guys if you're using starbucks, or nay other public access, aren't you pretty much constrained to having to deal with an open network. or are you implying that you can implement an encrypted connection on the nic setup? thanks On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 4:40 AM, Tim wrote: > On Mon, 2010-

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-22 Thread Tim
On Mon, 2010-06-21 at 11:31 -0700, JD wrote: > Also, WPA encryotion can be broken by a notebook PC in under 1 minute. > WPA (and WPA2) encryption that uses TKP can also be broken in under 1 > minute. So far AES seems to be invulnerable (as far whatever has been > printed publicly). I'd heard that

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-21 Thread JD
On 06/21/2010 09:09 AM, Bill Davidsen was caught red-handed while writing:: > bruce wrote: > >> hey. >> >> looking at using the wifi at starbucks, given that it's going to be >> free in july! >> >> i'm looking for detailed steps from anyone who's actually used a >> public starbucks wifi acces

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-21 Thread Bill Davidsen
bruce wrote: > hey. > > looking at using the wifi at starbucks, given that it's going to be > free in july! > > i'm looking for detailed steps from anyone who's actually used a > public starbucks wifi access. > > my system is fedora, running network-setup. i don't have/use/want > networkmanager!

Re: wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-19 Thread Jerry Feldman
On 06/19/2010 01:34 PM, bruce wrote: > hey. > > looking at using the wifi at starbucks, given that it's going to be > free in july! > > i'm looking for detailed steps from anyone who's actually used a > public starbucks wifi access. > > my system is fedora, running network-setup. i don't have/use

wifi access from laptop to starbucks wifi

2010-06-19 Thread bruce
hey. looking at using the wifi at starbucks, given that it's going to be free in july! i'm looking for detailed steps from anyone who's actually used a public starbucks wifi access. my system is fedora, running network-setup. i don't have/use/want networkmanager! so i'm looking for the actual s