Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-12 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
Hi, Well, in case of usb hid devices breaking the guest isn't that a big issue for at least some guests because they manage to reset the device and continue nevertheless ... In a situation like this, I think our responsibility is to let the user know that there could be a problem, and provid

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-11 Thread Paolo Bonzini
On 07/11/2011 05:32 PM, Kevin Wolf wrote: I'd guess the best would be to have a special VMSTATE that means "broken old version doesn't send a section" which we can set for special -M? No, the best would be to have a serious migration format, based for example on ASN.1 which Michael Tsirkin

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-11 Thread Kevin Wolf
Am 07.07.2011 17:23, schrieb Paolo Bonzini: > On 07/07/2011 01:02 PM, Alexander Graf wrote: >> I'd guess the best would be to have a special VMSTATE that means >> "broken old version doesn't send a section" which we can set for >> special -M? > > No, the best would be to have a serious migration f

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-08 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
On 07/08/11 16:43, Peter Maydell wrote: On 8 July 2011 14:02, Jes Sorensen wrote: It seems reasonable to me to introduce a situation where devices have to explicitly marked as migration compatible and fail if there are devices in the system which are not. To ask a dumb question: does "migrati

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-08 Thread Peter Maydell
On 8 July 2011 14:02, Jes Sorensen wrote: > It seems reasonable to me to introduce a situation where devices have to > explicitly marked as migration compatible and fail if there are devices > in the system which are not. To ask a dumb question: does "migration" here mean only "migration" or also

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-08 Thread Jes Sorensen
On 07/07/11 09:30, Avi Kivity wrote: > On 07/07/2011 10:14 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: >>> Can't we just implicitly fail migration whenever there's a device in >>> the tree that doesn't have VMSTATE? >> >> >> There are cases where the device doesn't need to save state, so that >> alone doesn't cut it.

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Markus Armbruster
Anthony Liguori writes: > On 07/07/2011 04:23 AM, Markus Armbruster wrote: >> Anthony Liguori writes: >> >>> On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Anthony Liguori
On 07/07/2011 02:19 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: On 07/06/11 19:13, Anthony Liguori wrote: On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We al

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Anthony Liguori
On 07/06/2011 06:32 PM, Alexander Graf wrote: On 06.07.2011, at 22:01, Anthony Liguori wrote: On 07/06/2011 12:28 PM, Avi Kivity wrote: On 07/06/2011 07:04 PM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. device

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Paolo Bonzini
On 07/07/2011 01:02 PM, Alexander Graf wrote: I'd guess the best would be to have a special VMSTATE that means "broken old version doesn't send a section" which we can set for special -M? No, the best would be to have a serious migration format, based for example on ASN.1 which Michael Tsirkin

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
Hi, Not so fast :) I agree that throwing away unrecognized migration data is unsafe, and should not be done. Now let me present my little problem. I'm working on making migration preserve "tray status": open/closed, locked/unlocked. For ide-cd, I can stick a subsection "ide_drive/tray_stat

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Anthony Liguori
On 07/07/2011 04:23 AM, Markus Armbruster wrote: Anthony Liguori writes: On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have o

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Alexander Graf
On 07.07.2011, at 11:23, Markus Armbruster wrote: > Anthony Liguori writes: > >> On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: >>> Hi folks, >>> >>> We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions >>> with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do n

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Markus Armbruster
Anthony Liguori writes: > On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: >> Hi folks, >> >> We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions >> with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. >> >> We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 sav

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Avi Kivity
On 07/07/2011 10:14 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Can't we just implicitly fail migration whenever there's a device in the tree that doesn't have VMSTATE? There are cases where the device doesn't need to save state, so that alone doesn't cut it. It should then say so by having an empty VMSTATE d

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
On 07/06/11 19:13, Anthony Liguori wrote: On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 sa

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-07 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
Hi, We don't have a hard policy about not merging devices that don't support migration. Since migration must be supported forever, I'd rather see a device get some solid testing before it starts doing live migration. That said, we should probably do this consciously by explicitly marking the

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-06 Thread Alexander Graf
On 06.07.2011, at 22:01, Anthony Liguori wrote: > On 07/06/2011 12:28 PM, Avi Kivity wrote: >> On 07/06/2011 07:04 PM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: >>> Hi folks, >>> >>> We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions >>> with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-06 Thread Anthony Liguori
On 07/06/2011 12:28 PM, Avi Kivity wrote: On 07/06/2011 07:04 PM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 sa

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-06 Thread Avi Kivity
On 07/06/2011 07:04 PM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 saves state for usb-hid devices and th

Re: [Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-06 Thread Anthony Liguori
On 07/06/2011 11:04 AM, Gerd Hoffmann wrote: Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 saves state for usb-hid devices and the usb-h

[Qemu-devel] migration: new sections and backward compatibility.

2011-07-06 Thread Gerd Hoffmann
Hi folks, We'll need to figure a sane way to handle migration to older versions with new sections, i.e. devices which used to not save state before do now. We already have one case in tree: usb. qemu 0.14 saves state for usb-hid devices and the usb-hub, whereas qemu 0.13 and older don't.