quot;hello world".find("goodbye")
-1
py> "hello world".startswith("goodbye")
False
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On Wednesday 23 March 2016 09:23, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 23, 2016 at 6:43 AM, Michael Torrie wrote:
>> And despite the impression you may have gotten, it is appropriate to
>> look before you leap. Using os.exists() and other pre-flight checks are
>> appropriate.
>
> Hmm, can you jus
This is not actually off-topic, as it has relevance to open source projects
like Python: the importance of getting package management right, and not
basing your development ecosystem on cowboys who might pull the rug out from
under your feet at any time.
Ironically, this also showcases what hap
[1, 2, 3, 4]])
py> arr.T
array([[1, 1, 1, 1],
[2, 2, 2, 2],
[3, 3, 3, 3],
[4, 4, 4, 4]])
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behaves like this?
The answer is, of course, *no* sort of mapping. Sequences are not mappings.
The only reason we think of them as kinda-sorta like mappings is because of
a superficial similarity between key:value and index:item. That similarity
is real, but virtually everything else about mappings and sequences is
different.
> This way we will have a simpler way to let people to use sequences
> or maps indifferently, and let the code untouched.
Have you ever actually wanted to use sequences or maps indifferently? To do
what?
The only case I've ever seen of that is the dict constructor, and
dict.update, which will accept either a mapping or a sequence of (key,
value) pairs.
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7;w')
try:
os.rename('a123.junk', 'b123.junk')
except OSError as e:
print(e.winerror) # Windows only
print(e.errno)
print(repr(e))
os.unlink('a123.junk')
os.unlink('b123.junk')
I'd test it myself, except I don't have acc
On Wed, 23 Mar 2016 11:28 pm, Random832 wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 23, 2016, at 08:17, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> Any Windows users here?
>>
>> print(e.winerror) # Windows only
>> print(e.errno)
>> print(repr(e))
>
> 183
> 17
> FileEx
On Thu, 24 Mar 2016 12:33 am, Random832 wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 23, 2016, at 05:03, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> https://medium.com/@azerbike/i-ve-just-liberated-my-modules-9045c06be67c
>>
>> Of course, moving his allegedly infringing package "kik" to github isn
etter;
- the coefficient is in our favour (1/2);
- string copying may be quite efficient (although not as efficient as in C,
where they can be implemented by just a memcopy, more or less);
- the strings are getting smaller all the time, which makes memory
management easier, when compared to having to allocate growing strings;
- although against that, perhaps this ends up fragmenting memory even more?
- it *may* turn out that the cost of the rest of the work done dwarfs the
cost of copying the string in the first place
- but then again it might not.
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On Thu, 24 Mar 2016 09:39 pm, ast wrote:
> Hi
>
> I have a string which contains a tupe, eg:
>
> s = "(1, 2, 3, 4)"
>
> and I want to recover the tuple in a variable t
>
> t = (1, 2, 3, 4)
>
> how would you do ?
py> import ast
py> ast.liter
>
> Do you understand why people aren't taking your results very seriously?
You know what is missing from this conversation?
For one of Bart's critics to actually show faster code.
There's plenty of people telling him off for writing unpythonic and slow
code, but I haven't seen anyone actually demonstrating that Python is
faster than his results show.
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n any code
they like on your computer. You want malware? That's how you get malware.
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On Fri, 25 Mar 2016 01:04 am, BartC wrote:
> On 24/03/2016 13:50, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> On Thu, 24 Mar 2016 02:24 pm, Chris Angelico wrote:
>>
>>
>>> This is how you're currently evaluating Python. Instead of starting
>>> with the most simpl
f Barack Obama cuts himself shaving, the POTUS will have the same
cut, because they are one and the same person (at least for now). But in
another year or so, if Obama cuts himself, the POTUS will not notice,
because the name POTUS will have been rebound to a different person.
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a second one and then do slice assignment than to iterate
over it in a for loop changing each item in place.
This demonstrates that what logically ought to be more efficient (changing
values in place) is not necessarily *actually* more efficient.
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starts.
>
> But I understand that most people aren't interested in this kind of sport.
Checkout the benchmark game:
http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/
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hoice that
they wanted the language to be as fast and efficient as possible, even at
the cost of safe, reproducible behaviour.
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http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-psyco/index.html
Pyscho is unmaintained and doesn't work on anything better than 2.6, but the
author has gone on to be one of the lead devs in PyPy, and it has inspired
newer projects like numba and theano. The attitude of the core developers,
esp
side from the fact that "real name" is
subjective, you have no idea what is someone's real name and what isn't.
Nobody appointed you as Real Name Sheriff. Just give it up.
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On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 09:08 am, BartC wrote:
> On 25/03/2016 16:22, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> On Fri, 25 Mar 2016 10:06 pm, BartC wrote:
>
> (OK, I'll risk the wrath of Mark Lawrence et al by daring to post my
> opinions.)
Please ignore Mark Lawrence when he is acting
On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 03:57 am, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano :
>
>> Undefined behaviour in C is a minefield waiting to blow your program's
>> legs off, because the designers of the language made the explicit
>> choice that they wanted the langu
a role in
ensuring Python's success.)
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e agreed would be broken
for a dict or other mapping. We do not have stability of "key":value pairs.
This violates the property that mapping key:value pairs should be stable.
Inserting new entries into a mapping, or deleting them, shouldn't affect
the remaining entries. But with a sequence, it can effect the relationship
between index and item.
That means that indexes are not keys, and sequences are not mappings.
For a sequence, this does not matter. There is no promise that items will
always be found at the same index you put them in. Many operations on
sequences will move items around:
sort
reverse
pop
insert
delete an item or slice
some slice assignments
shuffle
and more.
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crosoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows
> 10
is that correct? 32-bit or 64-bit?
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h of subgraphs, or the
index.
The smaller change would probably be the first, changing subgraphs. But the
better change would probably be to change the for-loop.
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ou can do is use an editor which colours functions
like "next" differently from statements like "continue".
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On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 01:59 pm, Paul Rubin wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano writes:
>> Culturally, C compiler writers have a preference for using undefined
>> behaviour to allow optimizations, even if it means changing the semantics
>> of your code.
>
> If your code has
On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 04:43 am, Rustom Mody wrote:
> On Saturday, March 26, 2016 at 4:09:41 PM UTC+5:30, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 04:30 pm, Rustom Mody wrote:
>>
>> > For one thing its good to remember that we wouldn't be here without
>>
3 version
input('Press the Enter key to exit... ')
That will halt and wait for you to press the exit key before closing the
window.
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[email protected]>
Notice the difference? Here the two values lined up:
<[email protected]>
<[email protected]>
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the brackets (round brackets or
parentheses for any Americans reading) and the list doesn't sort, but
that's the exception rather than the rule. And if you're worried about
that, you can run a "linter" which check your source code for such
potential problems.
Google for PyLint, PyFlakes, PyChecker, Jedi, etc if you want more
information about linters, or just ask here. I can't tell you too much
about them, as I don't use them, but somebody will probably answer.
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d Python even has a built-in function called "compile" that
takes source code and compiles it a code object:
py> x = compile("value = 23", "", "single")
py> type(x)
py> print(x)
at 0xb7993300, file "", line 1>
py> eval(x)
py>
ells you that your code is written wrongly and Python doesn't
understand what you mean. You have to look at the code and fix the syntax
problem. If you show us the line of code that Python is complaining about,
and maybe the line before it, we can help.
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On Sat, 26 Mar 2016 08:23 am, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 26, 2016 at 2:50 AM, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> Undefined behaviour does not mean "implementation specific behaviour".
>> Nor does it mean "something sensible will happen but we don't
On Sun, 27 Mar 2016 05:13 pm, Paul Rubin wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano writes:
>> For example, would you consider that this isolated C code is
>> "meaningless"?
>> int i = n + 1;
>
> It's meaningful as long as n is in a certain range of values so th
le to determine at
compile-time whether or not n could ever, under any circumstances, be
MAXINT. If n might conceivably ever be MAXINT, then the behaviour of foo is
undefined. Not implementation-specific, or undocumented. Undefined, in the
special C meaning of the term.
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please speak up. I don't know Windows very
well and I'm not sure why the console is disappearing in the first place.
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s as
expressions seems to me to be well less than the extra difficulty it would
produce.
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On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 05:01 am, Marco S. wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
>> The point you might have missed is that treating lists as if they were
>> mappings violates at least one critical property of mappings: that the
>> relationship between keys and values are
On Mon, 28 Mar 2016 07:49 am, BartC wrote:
> On 27/03/2016 21:32, Tim Chase wrote:
>> On 2016-03-27 14:28, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
>>> In this case, the two lines "fnc" and "next" simply look up the
>>> function names, but without actua
the code) that this is what you intend.
In your language, you can make operator overloading illegal if you like, or
discourage it by requiring special syntax, but in Python it is a
first-class (pun not intended) programming style of equal standing to
arithmetic, strings, method calls and modules.
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rfectly reasonable for a linter, but not for
Python. Other languages may choose to be more restrictive. Pascal, for
example, requires you to declare subroutines as functions or procedures
depending on whether or not they return a value, and that's got much to
recommend it too. But Python made different choices.
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name.validate
The Zen of Python has something to say about special cases.
import this
Now, I happen to think that using "name.validate" for the side-effects of
the attribute look-up is a terrible idea. But it's legal code, and the
compiler shouldn't make value judgem
Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 22, 2014 at 12:44 PM, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> def do_something(instance_or_id):
>> instance = Model.get(instance_or_id)
>> assert isinstance(instance, Model)
>> # Code that assumes that instance is an objec
one!
The advantage of the `x if cond else y` operator is that it is a
short-cutting operator, it doesn't evaluate either x or y unless needed.
But for many cases that's not important, and in those cases I won't say I
prefer the old (y, x)[cond] idiom, but neither do I dislike it.
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ike, and one which does print something
might not be:
py> mylist = [1, 5, 2, 6, 4, 3]
py> sorted(mylist) # proper function returns a value
[1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6]
py> mylist.sort() # procedure-like function returns None
py> print(mylist) # and modifies the list in place
[1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6]
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abomination that no right-thinking person should
ever use because the order of terms isn't identical to C, and now the
attitude seems to be that anyone *not* using ternary if is a heretic who
deserves to be set on fire :-)
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r built-ins and the standard library
at least, a good distinction to make is that representations of Nothing
(e.g. None, empty string, empty list, zero, empty set, etc.) are falsey,
while representations of Something (e.g. non-empty strings, non-empty
lists, numbers other than zero, non-empty sets,
use assertions as checked comments. If the
requirements change and you forget to update this part of the code, the
assertions will fail:
assert x in (a, b, c)
if x == a:
do_this()
elif x == b:
do_that()
else:
assert x == c
do_something_else()
>> Or is that insufficiently paranoid?
>
> With good tests, you're probably fine.
Is it possible to be too paranoid when it comes to tests?
:-)
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bobble("string%s" % carrot.gamma(r&s)*
(this & that).fetch(83, 36, when=when or "now")
][cond or flag or foo(42)-1 > 17 or bar(b) < thingy(c) or not d]
but re-writing that using ternary if operator won't help one iota. I don't
see why `[a, b][flag]` is inherently less readable than `b if flag else a`.
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Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano :
>
>> So why is it hard to read when the index is a flag?
>>
>> value = [f, g][cond]()
>
> So, subjectively, which syntax would you prefer:
Depends on what else the code is doing. But my personal preference is a r
uot;", line 1
> import re, codecs
^
SyntaxError: invalid syntax
If that is not the error message you are getting, you will need to tell us
what error you actually are getting.
Regards,
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alister wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Oct 2014 10:20:30 -0700, Dan Stromberg wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 1:38 AM, Steven D'Aprano
>> wrote:
>>> I don't get why that's considered hard to read.
>>
>>> So why is it hard to read when the
like this:
old_lists = [a, b, c, d]
new_lists = [thelist.append(x) for thelist in old_lists if len(thelist) < 5]
only to be unpleasantly surprised to discover than new_lists now contains
None instead of the lists. Having methods return a result rather than
behave like a procedure is a valid (i.e. useful) design choice.
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Ben Finney wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano writes:
>
>> Of course it won't be clear to *everyone* but it should be clear
>> enough to people who are familiar with standard Python idioms. A
>> concrete example should be more obvious than the fake example:
>>
Ben Finney wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano writes:
>
>> I suspect that Guido and the core developers disagree with you, since
>> they had the opportunity to fix that in Python 3 and didn't.
>
> That doesn't follow; there are numerous warts in Python 2 t
s (like numbers), and discourages the unnecessary use of
global mutable state.
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Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Fri, Oct 24, 2014 at 6:49 PM, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> addresses = [get_address(name) for name in database]
>> assert all(address for address in addresses)
>> # ... much later on ...
>> for i, address in enumerate(a
lyWrittenError?
I would expect it to raise an IOError, most likely with one of the following
error codes:
* errno.EIO (physical input/output error)
* errno.EFBIG (file is too large)
* errno.ENOSPC (no space left on device, disk is full)
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functional form:
def tolerant_load_int(obj, default=None):
try:
return load_int(obj)
except (ValueError, TypeError):
return default
values = [n for n in map(tolerant_load_int, l) if n is not None]
# alternative to using map
values = [n for n in (tolerant_load_int(obj) for obj in l) if n is not None]
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MRAB wrote:
> On 2014-10-30 11:10, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> Anton wrote:
>>
>>> Let's say I have an incoming list of values *l*. Every element of *l*
>>> can be one of the following options:
>>> 1) an integer value
>>> 2) a string in f
Roy Smith wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
>> Anton wrote:
>>
>> > Let's say I have an incoming list of values *l*. Every element of *l*
>> > can be one of the followin
mit -a") if it looks okay.)
I don't see how this sort of manual handling is less trouble than using a
proper, reliable save routine. To start with, what do you mean "detect
issues on startup" -- startup of what?
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:
return self.value
def set_message(self, message):
self.message = message
def get_message(self):
return self.message
obj = MyClass()
obj.set_value(23.0)
obj.set_message("hello world")
print(obj.get_value())
print(obj.get_message())
If you'
[email protected] wrote:
> What is Popen class?
Googling could answer that:
https://duckduckgo.com/html/?q=python+popen+class
If you have a specific question, please be more detailed when you ask your
question, then we can give more specific answers.
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ht
t;) # calls __len__ method
12
Files have quite a few examples. fileno, isatty and writable could all be
written as read-only properties, and seek/tell could be written as a
file.position property. But they're not, they're written as methods.
[1] Except for Jythonistas, who are allo
makes us look like religious
fanatics.
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se the optimized version?
Q3: What is the largest value of n beyond which you can never use the float
optimization?
You can assume that Python floats are IEEE-754 C doubles, and that
math.sqrt() is correctly rounded.
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re per-instance
state. If instance "a" needs an extra parameter that other instances don't,
perhaps it can take it from an instance attribute instead of an argument.
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s-open.html
Another way to look at this, not necessarily Voevodsky's approach, is to
note that the existing proofs of PA's consistency are *relative* proofs of
PA. E.g. they rely on the consistency of some other formal system, such as
the Zermelo-Frankel axioms (ZF). If ZF is consistent, so is PA, but we
don't know that ZF is consistent...
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Dave Angel wrote:
> Approximately 1968 for me. I wrote programs in 1967, but didn't
> get to run them till 1968.
I once used a compiler that slow too.
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of Java
provided by my Linux distro. I had to replace my system Java with Oracle's
Java, symlink it to an alternate location, and have my browser lie about
what it is in the user-agent.
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Has it caused difficulty in
debugging code?
If you had to keep one behaviour, which would you keep?
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ntation for curs to know what it does.
What is curs? Where does it come from?
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)
> colnames = [desc[0] for desc in curs.description]
> rowdicts = []
> for row in curs.fetchall():
>rowdicts.append(dict(zip(colnames, row)))
zip(colnames, row) will return:
(first column name, first item of row),
(second column name, second item of row),
(third column
27;t have any camera yet, other than a prosumer digital
> camera that does take decent video. The problem that I'm
> anticipating is the syncing of audio and video.
[...]
I think you may have sent this to the wrong mailing list (or newsgroup).
This is about the Python programming language.
ite3.connect('dbase1')
> curs = conn.cursor()
>
> file = open('data.txt')
> rows = [line.rstrip().split(',') for line in file]
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SomeClass()
c.eggs = 23
from types import MethodType
a.my_call = lambda x, y=1: x/y
b.my_call = lambda spam: str(spam).upper()
c.my_call = MethodType(lambda self: self.eggs + 1, c)
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think that
99 out of 100 *programmers* can't program. It's probably more like 65,
maybe 70 out of 100, tops.
Ha ha only serious.
More here:
http://www.protocolostomy.com/2010/03/15/programmers-that-cant-program/
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r. While muxing and demuxing is
extremely important in circuit design and telecommunications, I've never
needed it in Python programming.
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it doesn't absolve you of normal exception
> responsibilities, and, most of all, it should be used for passive
> inspection and not action. But given these guidelines, I still find it
> very useful as "active comments".
Agreed completely!
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re of process. If
your process is so poor that you release code without running it with
asserts enabled, then assert will not save you from bugs. No process is
immune to sufficiently malicious or incompetent use.
Assertions are just a tool, not a panacea.
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de is great, code that
crashes could use improvement, but incorrect code that doesn’t
crash is a horrible nightmare."
-- Chris Smith
Assertions can help by this, by causing wrong code to fail as soon as
possible (provided, of course, that you don't defeat the assertions by
ru
pilation
options: for a correct system -- one without bugs -- assertions
will always hold, so the compilation option makes no difference
to the semantics of the system.
https://docs.eiffel.com/book/method/et-design-contract-tm-assertions-and-exceptions
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Ethan Furman wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 11/14/2014 03:33 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>>
>> I agree with Marko in this case. Marko's example of defensive programming
>> is very similar to the one I gav
a global, use the global keyword.
Otherwise, there are often better ways to get a similar effect, such as
using a generator:
def gen():
x = 0
while True:
yield x
x += 1
it = gen()
next(it) # returns 0
next(it) # returns 1
next(it) # returns 2
You can turn that into funct
module's actual name (as taken from the file name).
* But when Python runs a file, as in `python2.7 path/to/script.py`,
it sets the global __name__ to the magic value '__main__' instead
of "script".
The consequence is that every module can tell whether it is bei
uot;done loading"
(I haven't ever done *all* of these things in a *single* file, but I have
done all these things at one time or another.)
There's no way that any automatic system can match that for flexibility or
simplicity.
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ecause the OP states that he is using Python 3.1 (look at the subject line)
and it doesn't work in 3.1.
For what it is worth, I cannot confirm that alleged behaviour:
steve@orac:~$ python3.1 -c "import sys; print(sys.stdout.fileno())"
1
I suspect that the OP may be using an IDE which does something funny to
sys.stdout etc., or perhaps he has accidentally shadowed them. The OP
failed to copy and paste the actual traceback, so who knows what is
actually happening?
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, the "phooey"
could refer to:
- the parse functions failing to understand Unicode;
- it being a nasty hack that assumes that Python will never use
Unicode characters for keywords or operators;
- it being necessary because u''.translate fails to support
a deletechars parameter.
It's unlikely to refer to the Unicode character set itself.
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dules are and what errors the
infrastructure team experienced, there is no way to tell whether four weeks
to get this working was a heroic effort or a sign of utter incompetence.
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for improving code reliability.
> Perhaps I was spoiled by having this capability in some other languages.
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Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2014-11-15, Steven D'Aprano
> wrote:
>> pythonista wrote:
>>
>>> I am developing a python application as a contractor.
>>>
>>> I would like to know if someone can provide me with some insight into
>>>
avascript.
Very nice!
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builtin, it is perfectly fine.
Some people don't like map. Pay no attention to them.
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ge = _temporary_name_123456.Image
del _temporary_name_123456
except that no temporary name is actually created. So you can see, the PIL
module has been imported (that's the only way Python can look up Image
inside PIL), but you don't have access to it in your name space. But you
at do you think? Is it perhaps better suited to perl-ideas?
Feeling-whimsical-at-the-moment-ly y'rs,
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Ethan Furman wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 11/14/2014 06:58 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>> Ethan Furman wrote:
>>>
>>> My point being: a safety net that is so easily disabled does not count
>>> (IMHO) as a back
and tell them
that based on your extensive experience (all ten minutes of it) they're
obviously doing it wrong and Python is a toy language not suitable for
critical business apps?
I'm sure that they will be grateful to be set right.
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s and didn't
> like how perl *requires* you to put everything into its own file. Now it
> looks like python does, too, implicitly.
You are mistaken about that.
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