Express for Desktop should also work
(I'll be testing that as soon as I get a chance).
Cheers,
Steve
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Zachary Ware wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 10:42 AM, Steve Dower
> wrote:
>> This also makes it more viable to use the Windows SDK compilers. If you
>> install the Windows SDK 7.0 (which includes MSVC9) and Windows SDK 7.1 (which
>> includes the platform toolset fi
o await anything if it already has the result).
(Aside: the "_async" suffix is based on the convention used in C#, and it's
certainly one that I'll be using throughout my async Python code and
encouraging in any code that I review. It's the most obvious way to let
Ethan Furman wrote:
> On 06/26/2015 08:47 AM, Steve Dower wrote:
>> On 06/26/2015 06:48 AM, Sven R. Kunze wrote:
>>
>>> def business():
>>> return complex_calc(5)
>>>
>>> def business_new()
>>> return await complex_calc(10)
>
other language that implemented this exact model a few years ago and it
works well.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Sven R. Kunze<mailto:srku...@mail.de>
Sent: 7/5/2015 14:50
To: python-dev@python.org<mailto:python-dev@python.o
Dear Python-dev
Nobody who cares is reading this thread any more - I'm guessing Guido silenced
it within the first 10 emails and so has almost everyone else. All you're doing
is exposing your own inabilities to understand the issue (there are not now,
have never been, and never will be, methods
me up with uses other than "helps proxy to objects where listing all
members eagerly is expensive and/or potentially incorrect". Maybe once you list
all the operating systems that are now using dynamic object-oriented APIs
rather than flat APIs (Windows, iOS, Android, ... others?) this
I wonder whether XML RPC might be a good example? After all, it's already in
the stdlib and presumably suffers from the same issue.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Ronald Oussoren<mailto:ronaldousso...@mac.com>
Sent: 7/23/2
Those files should be under PC folder.
Building 3.5 and onwards is a much more pleasant experience, and many of those
improvements have been backported for 2.7.11.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Mark Kelley<mailto:keee...@gmail.com>
r decline an invitation
What do you think calendar operations are, and how do they differ from
datetime operations? And most importantly, how can we tell them apart?
Thanks,
--
Steve
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Is hg.python.org okay for others? I'm getting the following output from all hg
commands:
sending hello command
sending between command
abort: no suitable response from remote hg!
I don't know of any more verbose or debugging options than that (--debug, -v's
added nothing). I can SSH normally in
Eventually I updated Mercurial and then it worked, but that didn't make a whole
lot of sense. Maybe I caught it during some maintenance?
Seems to be okay now though.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Eric V. Smith<mailto:e...@trueb
We saw and fixed it before RC 1. I'll check whether that fix didn't stick, but
go ahead, open an issue and assign me.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: MRAB<mailto:pyt...@mrabarnett.plus.com>
Sent: 8/11/2015 17:2
s steve.do...@python.org (which is forwarding to
pyt...@stevedower.id.au, for the security conscious who will no doubt spot that
address in headers).
I can obviously still be reached at my old address, just don't send me URLs or
text with full stops in it please :)
om the original repository. It's
possible you got a slightly different version out of github? I believe
we use their released tarballs, but Zach will know for sure as he did
the last update IIRC.
Cheers,
Steve
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/etc. contents already,
and so format strings will get it too.
So I'm confident we can support it, and I expect either of these two
approaches will work for most tools without too much trouble. (There's
also a middle ground where you create new tokens for format string
c
On 17Aug2015 1506, Steve Dower wrote:
On 17Aug2015 0813, Barry Warsaw wrote:
On Aug 18, 2015, at 12:58 AM, Chris Angelico wrote:
The linters could tell you that you have no 'end' or 'start' just as
easily when it's in that form as when it's written out in
ade into a context where
they don't just look like unnecessary pain. Feedback and discussion
welcome, either on these lists or on the post itself.
Cheers,
Steve
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On 25Aug2015 2153, Terry Reedy wrote:
On 8/25/2015 2:17 PM, Steve Dower wrote:
I've written up a long technical blog post about the compiler and CRT
changes in Python 3.5, which will be of interest to those who build and
distribute native extensions for Windows.
http://stevedower.id.au
other
people do the same, many of them more effectively than me. It seems to me that
you have both enthusiasm and energy, which is why I’ve taken the time to
encourage you to put it to use.
Good luck in your progress with Python.
regards
Steve
PS: The mailing lists are all detailed on
On 01Sep2015 0747, Oscar Benjamin wrote:
Thanks for the detailed writeup Steve. Do you know how these changes
to the python.org Windows binaries would impact on people building
extension modules with MinGW?
Currently, no version of MinGW AFAIK will link against the UCRT, so
they'll s
eferred to __iob_func in their own code. It submitted a patch for it
months ago and they fixed it, but possibly only in 1.0.2.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Paul Moore"
Sent: 9/2/2015 5:38
To: "Carl Kleffner"
Cc: "S
On 02Sep2015 0803, Paul Moore wrote:
On 2 September 2015 at 14:07, Steve Dower wrote:
You can also build existing object or static libraries into their own DLL
with the old compiler and dynamically link to them. It's not perfect, but
it's no worse than trying to link them i
It thinks you have version 3.5.5339.0 installed, which IIRC was a test build I
made for some tcl changes. It's probably listed under xPython - can you see it?
As I said at the time, they should be totally independent, but I guess not.
Thanks for the heads up.
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-
proach you could use is making a separate directory to put on
PATH that contains stub executables (or symlinks?) to launch the actual
ones from a separate directory. That way you can control exactly what is
available on PATH while still launching from a directory that is not on
runtime1#0.dll where # != 4).
Cheers,
Steve
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ok when I'm at my PC.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "tds...@gmail.com"
Sent: 9/13/2015 6:59
To: "Python-Dev"
Subject: [Python-Dev] Windows x86-64 embeddable zip file, Feedback
Hi,
had some time to test the new distribute
27;s not just FILE* that will break...).
Cheers,
Steve
Sorry to bug this list, I didn't know where else to reach out to.
-Chris
[1] it's actually prefer hard to find out which compiler version is
used for which python version. And has been for years. Would a patch
to the docs, prob
ll-publicised blog
posts will reach more people.
Cheers,
Steve
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ing
for an entire directory (recursively). This would be useful for codebases
that have not been ported to standard annotations yet, and for codebases
that will not be ported for the reasons listed above.
Thanks for your consideration.
Best,
Steve
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e...
>>
>>
>> On October 5, 2015 3:01:11 PM CDT, Guido van Rossum
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> "They"?
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 5, 2015 at 12:57 PM, Ryan Gonzalez wrote:
>>>
>>>> There is one reason I would be really frea
ntext of blocking that release. (The XP notification, as well as the more
confusing Vista and Win7 w/o service packs notifications, have been added
already. Python-list will probably keep asking though, just in case it can get
something for free...)
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows
inal Message-
From: "Laura Creighton"
Sent: 11/1/2015 6:22
To: "Steve Dower"
Cc: "Chris Angelico" ; "Phil Thompson"
; "python-dev" ;
"l...@openend.se"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] Python 3.5.1 plans
In a message of Sun, 01
7;t work around. Saying it is rarely used is
rather exposing your own unawareness though - it could arguably be the most
commonly used encoding (depending on how you define "used").
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Victor Stinner&
On 07Dec2015 1250, Laura Creighton wrote:
As webmaster, I am dealing with 3 unhappy would-be python users who have
windows 10.
Right now their first problem is that when they click on the big
yellow button here: https://www.python.org/downloads/
instead of getting a download of 3.5.1 they get a
On 07Dec2015 1324, Steve Dower wrote:
On 07Dec2015 1250, Laura Creighton wrote:
As webmaster, I am dealing with 3 unhappy would-be python users who have
windows 10.
Not directly related to this thread, but I just pushed an update to the
Windows installers for 3.5.1. (Should avoid people
On 07Dec2015 1403, Steve Dower wrote:
On 07Dec2015 1324, Steve Dower wrote:
On 07Dec2015 1250, Laura Creighton wrote:
As webmaster, I am dealing with 3 unhappy would-be python users who have
windows 10.
Not directly related to this thread, but I just pushed an update to the
Windows
r question out there
now, it's just a question of finding them. stackoverflow.com has a pretty
good Python channel too.
In any case, good luck, and thanks for reaching out to Python.
regards
Steve
On Wed, Dec 16, 2015 at 7:29 PM, Mullins, Robb
wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
>
> Not q
x2 for all of Victor's votes and reasoning.
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Victor Stinner"
Sent: 12/17/2015 8:16
To: "Serhiy Storchaka"
Cc: "Python Dev"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] New poll about a macro for safe reference replacing
2015-12-16 15:12 GMT+01
milar, but lighter weight than a regular future.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Andrew Barnert via Python-Dev"
Sent: 12/17/2015 6:37
To: "Paul Sokolovsky"
Cc: "Python-Dev"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] async/await
quick
if you put an integer vs a PyObject* there.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Nick Coghlan"
Sent: 12/22/2015 2:39
To: "Serhiy Storchaka"
Cc: "python-dev@python.org"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] New poll about a
s when you try to build without having downloaded the externals
it creates enough directories that the script thinks it exists when it
isn't all there.
Cheers,
Steve
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I'm still yet to meet a lawyer who trusts "public domain" statements...
The CLA will ensure we have enough rights to republish the PEP on p.o or future
sites, and it doesn't prevent authors from also releasing the text elsewhere
under other terms.
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original
s used by
some people, I vote for breaking that for 3.6 and making it read-only.)
This is probably the code snippet that bothered me the most:
### Encoding table
encoding_table=codecs.charmap_build(decoding_table)
It shows up in many of the encodings modules, and while it is not a bad
It doesn't currently end up on disk. Some tables are partially or completely
stored on disk as Python source code (some are partially generated from simple
rules), but others are generated by inverting those. That process takes time
that could be avoided by storing the generated tables, and stor
are clearly insignificant
compared to other factors.
Cheers,
Steve
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ython-dev about twelve months ago, IIRC.
Maybe a little longer.
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Serhiy Storchaka"
Sent: 1/30/2016 10:22
To: "python-dev@python.org"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] More optimisation ideas
On 30.01.16 18:31
a superset of what we already do.
Any and all feedback welcomed, especially from the owners of other
distros, Python implementations or tools on the list.
Cheers,
Steve
-
PEP: ???
Title: Python environment registration in the Windows Registry
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Aut
solely for other programs.
But those fixes are probably not PEP-worthy.)
Cheers,
Steve
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On 03Feb2016 0839, Paul Moore wrote:
On 3 February 2016 at 16:29, Steve Dower wrote:
Final point I want to reiterate - Python itself is essentially registry free
already in that it does not need registry settings to function.
That's something we should probably publicise better. People
On 03Feb2016 0923, eryk sun wrote:
On Wed, Feb 3, 2016 at 10:46 AM, Steve Dower wrote:
sys.path.extend(read_subkeys(fr'HKCU\Software\Python\PythonCore\{sys.winver}\PythonPath\**'))
sys.path.extend(read_subkeys(fr'HKLM\Software\Python\PythonCore\{sys.winver}\PythonPath\**'
:
1. other programs need to locate all available Pythons
2. there appears to only be one space to register your Python
3. this space is *sometimes* used by Python to locate itself and
installed packages
I want to fix problem 2 via documentation, and then look at the much
m
with and I wish it didn't do that, but it does, and it's a
> very widely used package on Windows). So ignoring this aspect of
> Python's behaviour is a big problem. (Also, what changes will pywin32
> need to make to correctly support being installed into non-python.org
&
e. In either case, other
applications need a guaranteed place to find these installations, and
that place is the system registry.
Cheers,
Steve
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nt to have to be more explicit
about it and I definitely do not want to actually name or list them in
any way.
Cheers,
Steve
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r feedback or concerns from developers who are likely to create
or use the keys that are described here.
PEP: 514
Title: Python registration in the Windows registry
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Author: Steve Dower
Status: Draft
Type: Informational
Content-Type:
Could we perhaps redefine bytes paths on Windows as utf8 and use Unicode
everywhere internally?
I really don't like the idea of not being able to use bytes in cross platform
code. Unless it's become feasible to use Unicode for lossless filenames on
Linux - last I heard it wasn't.
Top-posted fr
On 09Feb2016 1801, Andrew Barnert wrote:
On Feb 9, 2016, at 17:37, Steve Dower mailto:pyt...@stevedower.id.au>> wrote:
Could we perhaps redefine bytes paths on Windows as utf8 and use
Unicode everywhere internally?
When you receive bytes from argv, stdin, a text file, a GUI, a name
where *nix will convert
_to_ the encoding as a normalized form, Windows will convert _from_ the
encoding to its UTF-16 "normalized" form. Back-compat concerns have
prevented any significant changes being made here, otherwise there
wouldn't be a
interpreted the resulting literal.
Right or wrong, could you please add a paragraph explaining the meaning of the
underscores?
Glad I kept reading the thread this far - just pretend I also wrote
exactly the same thing as Barry.
Cheers,
Steve
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I think the test is blocked on my question of whether we are allowed to rely on
ctypes in the test suite.
If so, it's fine as I recall. Fairly sure it's a Windows-specific test anyway,
so ctypes can basically be assumed for all Windows platforms we currently care
about.
Top-posted from my Wind
someone commits to supporting it for an
extended period of time. Hopefully that helps clarify our position.
Cheers,
Steve
On 26Feb2016 0212, Mathieu Dupuy wrote:
Hi.
I am currently working on adding some functionality on a standard
library module (http://bugs.python.org/issue15873). The Python
ould
require some of the same effort as supporting any other compiler though (a
build bot configured to compile python this way).
I also think, but am not sure, that what you linked is in fact the leaner
meaner toolchain that Steve was referring to.
On 2/27/2016 16:49, Chris Krycho wrote:
looking for your installations. But the Python
interpreter itself should not know or care about your new keys.
Steve can probably clarify better than I can, but that's how I recall
it being intended to work.
Paul
Yes, the intention was to not move sys.path building out of the
PythonCore key.
.
Cheers,
Steve
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n. Clicking the links for the latest
downloads on the home page of python.org is the traditional way to get
started. Good luck!
regards
Steve
Steve Holden
On Sat, Mar 12, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Sumit Mandal
wrote:
> Sir/Mam
>
>
>
> I wanted to know if python runs on windows 10 or
cally they're fine and the
first build succeeds.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Martin Panter"
Sent: 3/13/2016 19:43
To: "Russell Keith-Magee" ; "python-dev"
Cc: "anto...@python.org"
Subje
keep an unused DLL secure.
Hopefully that helps explain the position somewhat. I'm happy to go into
more detail on any of these issues if anyone would like (potentially
just linking to where I've previously discussed it either here, on
bugs.p.o or on my blog).
Cheers,
Steve
d be a great candidate for that (trigger the runtime installer
if necessary). Otherwise, having a package that only includes this DLL
would probably be fine too, though it really only defers the problem to
the next DLL you depend on.
Cheers,
Steve
_
On 26May2016 1453, Sebastian Krause wrote:
Chris Angelico wrote:
BUT -- Steve Dower seems to have identified that the wonders of dll hell
never cease, and this isn't possible anyway. Oh well.
I'm not entirely grasping what's happening here. There are multiple
versions
On 26May2016 1601, Glenn Linderman wrote:
On 5/26/2016 3:18 PM, Steve Dower wrote:
This has been deprecated. It sounded like a great idea at the time (~8
years ago) but caused more problems than it solved.
Somehow I missed the announcement of the deprecation.
The feature itself probably
esolve for Python's
incredibly diverse user base.
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
-Original Message-
From: "Chris Angelico"
Sent: 5/26/2016 17:04
Cc: "python-dev"
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] runtime dlls on Windows
On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 5:13 AM, Steve Dower wro
the nicest of the options. It accurately
> describes what it is: a type derived from another. And its shorter and
> easy to both say and write than "Distinguished type" (which sounds like
> "distinguished gentlemen" -- is it wearing a monocle and a top hat?).
>
> &quo
Sounds good to me. NT is already an obsolete term - Win32 would be more
accurate - but WinRT hasn't changed the path format, so WindowsPath will be
accurate for the foreseeable future.
Cheers,
Steve
Top posted from my Windows Phone
From: Benjamin Pet
of MSVC, provided they are "safe", and the build will fail if
they aren't.
There are still some ways the differing CRTs can cause issues - alloc/free
pairing, for example - so some macros may also have to become exported
functions. After that I don't think there are any ways
distutils to detect and build with any
available compiler, though this may be more of a feature than we'd want for 2.7
at this point.
Cheers,
Steve
> (Note, similar to the Mac OS X situation, I think we should do this without
> hosting any new interpreter variants on python.org -
Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> Am 22.11.13 01:58, schrieb Steve Dower:
>
>> I'm happy to work on a PEP and changes for what I described above, if
>> there's enough interest? I can also update distutils to detect and
>> build with any available compiler, though this may
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> Am 22.11.13 19:10, schrieb Steve Dower:
>> I'd really want to update distutils.msvc9compiler to detect later
>> versions as well, since that would make 'pip install' work properly
>> for a large (majority?) of users for a large (m
Steve Dower wrote:
> The advice I've been given on FILE* is that there's probably no way to make it
> work correctly due to its internal buffering. Unfortunately, there are more
> places where this leaks through than just the APIs using them - extensions
>
by end of November, thanks for your quick responses!
>
Oops, too quick!
> all the best -- Chris
>
And to you.
Steve
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as an extension for this purpose. I don't recall
whether VS will add file associations for this type.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Larry Hastings<mailto:la...@hastings.org>
Sent: 1/18/2014 10:58
To: python-dev@python.org&l
ke to see it fixed before 3.4 is released.
Cheers,
Steve
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the
work you do can be automated? (If not, email on or off list is good too.)
Alternatively, if you don't want me mucking about with this, tell me and I'll
stop (being willing does not mean being keen ;) )
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
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retaining compatibility
with the existing MSIs. I'd also automate as much as possible to make it very
easy for someone else with the certificates to build/verify the release.
Happy to answer any other questions or provide more background about myself if
people ask.
Cheers,
Steve
Sent from m
have some private conversations during PyCon that are directly relevant, so
I'm bringing it here to promote the discussion. Thanks to everyone I had a
chance to chat to, and to everyone generally for a great PyCon.
Cheers,
Steve
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he opposite of the
second part. The "core CPython team" should probably not be the owner of this
fork, but there will certainly be some overlap between the core developers and
the straddle-edition team.
> - Regarding open source projects having a reputation of "not taking
&g
allation location
or the ACLs on the install directory.
As for 3.5, I have some ideas that I will raise with python-dev once I've had a
chance to think through all the issues (think proper per-user installs, redist
modules, etc.). More secure installations would certainly be on the table,
> Mike Miller wrote:
> On 04/29/2014 05:12 AM, Steve Dower wrote:
>> This would be an incredibly painful change that would surprise and
>> hurt a lot of people.
>
> Hi, I think "incredibly painful" is overstating the case a bit. ;) We're
> talking
&g
possible are not burned. Now is
the time to start publicly making a noise about the risks of the current
installer and how to mitigate them (the second part is important - otherwise
you are just making noise).
Cheers,
Steve
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and apparently the
QFE that updates the 32-bit MSM doesn't update the 64-bit one... guess I'll
have to go look for that build now).
> If anyone wants to try a 2.7 installer with that Path option, here's a
> copy: http://briancurtin.com/python-dev/python-2.7.msi (this is not
on running
well.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Antoine Pitrou<mailto:solip...@pitrou.net>
Sent: 5/11/2014 4:18
To: python-dev@python.org<mailto:python-dev@python.org>
Subject: Re: [Python-Dev] devguide: Add myself to developer
No, apologies for that. As Nick pointed out, I meant the *other* B.C. :)
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Dr. Brett Cannon<mailto:bcan...@gmail.com>
Sent: 5/17/2014 18:26
To: Steve Dower<mailto:steve.do...@microsoft.com>;
solip...@pitrou.net&
asily enough for
O(N) indexing.
Cheers,
Steve
Top-posted from my Windows Phone
From: Daniel Holth<mailto:dho...@gmail.com>
Sent: 6/4/2014 5:17
To: Paul Sokolovsky<mailto:pmis...@gmail.com>
Cc: python-dev<mailto:python-dev@python.org>
S
cussion with a genuine effect on the
Python interpreter ecosystem. Jython and IronPython already have different
string implementations from CPython - having official (and hopefully flexible)
guidance on deviations from the reference implementation would I think help
other implementations provide even
Paul Sokolovsky wrote:
> You just shouldn't write inefficient programs, voila. But if you want, you
> can keep writing inefficient programs, they just will be inefficient. Peace.
Can I nominate this for QOTD? :)
Cheers,
Steve
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else to do is:
* Nothing
Thoughts/comments/concerns?
Cheers,
Steve
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ronment running for producing the Python 2.7 installers, and I spent just
as long getting an environment for default going too. I'm personally a big fan
of automating things like this, so you can also expect scripts (probably
PowerShell) that will configure as much as possible.
Che
Stefan Krah wrote:
>Stefan Krah wrote:
>> > * Will VS 14 be golden prior to Python 3.5's release? It would suck to
>> > rely on a beta compiler.. :)
>>
>> This is my only concern, too. Otherwise, +1 for the switch.
>
>One more thing: Will the SDK 64-bit tools be available for the Express
>Vers
Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Sat, Jun 7, 2014 at 1:41 AM, Steve Dower wrote:
>> What this means for Python is that C extensions for Python 3.5 and later can
>> be built using any version of MSVC from 14.0 and later.
>
> Oh, if only this had been available for 2.7!! Actual
tudio "14" CTP that will
> prevent
> installation on a computer where an earlier version of Visual Studio is
> already
> installed. To disable the block that will put the computer in an
> un-recommended
> state, add the value "BlockerOverride" to the registry
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