t isn't this, despite the force or otherwise of your arguments, simply
*you* "digging in" in response to what you perceive as Martin's truculence?
There's little point at this stage repeating arguments you have already
put forward, since those who were convinced by them rem
ot" whose title makes
it clear this is a moving target and, among other things, whose content
points the user at a definitive (set of) URL(s) for the latest information.
Putting this information in "What's New" (except possibly for mentioning
the creation of this new docu
#x27;s confusing.
>>
>> So, you-people-in-the-list, do you think fix this will be a problem?
>
> The proper English word for plural "you" is "y'all". ;-) Except for
> "all y'all". Isn't English fun?
That's not Engl
ting, saving, etc.)
> in a database. I asked "so what did you learn from this data?", and
> was told that no one has analyzed it; they're just *accumulating* the
> data. It's stamp collecting as computer science.
>
> --amk, who save his files every 87.4 seconds
make the scope of a try clause too
broad, covering a larger span of code that necessary so that the except
clause is triggered by unanticipated exceptions. Try to ensure that a
try clause applies to the fewest possible statements to avoid these issues.
regards
Steve
--
Steve
ent does ever break anything it should be more
> tracable).
+1
Enforcing whitespace correctness on checkin has the added advantage that
we will be able to screw another 1% out of uncle Timmy, who will no
longer have to make his repeated whitespace correction checkins and will
therefore have time fo
; is part of some other grammatical construct, generally a statement
> or operator of some kind, so I tend to think of those differently.
>
>
How about "a keyword is an identifier that appears as a literal in the
grammar"?
regards
Steve
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t;"")
Alas if the proposal to remove the continuation backslash goes through
this may not remain available to us.
I realise that the arrival of Py3 means all these are up for grabs, but
don't think any of them are really warty enough to require removal.
I take the point that octal c
t access to
> it instead.
>
> BTW, one of my test cases involves multiple super calls in the same method -
> there is a *very* large performance improvement by instantiating it once.
>
And how does speed deteriorate for methods with no uses of super at all
(which will
es.address = addresses.id
and addresses.city = cities.id
and events.venue = venues.id""",
(city,))
It also gives you better error messages from most database back-ends.
I realise it makes
gt; b"abc" could then be a shortcut constructor for this subclass.
>>
>> In general, I don't think it's a good idea to have literals
>> turn into mutable objects, since literals are normally perceived
>> as being constant.
>
> Does that mean you wan
> myself but I don't know where I'd find the time).
>
I'm having a hard time understanding why bytes literals would be a good
thing. OK, displays require the work of creating a new object (since
bytes types will be mutable) but surely a mutable literal is always
going to make prog
ar when we should be allowed to hang spammers
up by the nuts (assuming they have any) - "not very welcoming" was the
phrase, IIRC. So maybe I'm no longer rational on this topic.
or-any-other-for-that-matter-ly y'rs - steve
--
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ument describes the
development and release schedule for Python 2.5." but it could just as
easily say "future releases of the Python 2.X series" or something similar.
Which reminds me, that PEP needs updating!
regards
Steve
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Nick Coghlan wrote:
> Steve Holden wrote:
>> In which case doesn't it make more sense to use the existing mechanism
>> of PEP 356 (Release Schedule)? If something isn't listed in there
>> (even without dates) then there are no current plans to release it,
>>
I have a proposal for a literal syntax for OrderedDicts which is just
replacing the braces with square brackets:
['a': 1,'b': 2] == OrderedDict([('a', 1),('b', 2)])
OrderedDict literals would follow:
[x : x for x in foo()] == OrderedDict([(x,x) for x in foo()])
The rationale for the syntax is t
intended to be used as subscripts. Does
this seem sensible? Was it considered during design? Should I alter the
materials so that only integer subscripts are used?
regards
Steve
Begin forwarded message:
> From: kirby urner
> Date: February 22, 2011 2:31:08 PM PST
> To: Steve Holden
then it is treated as a number, otherwise
> it is used as a string.
>
That's not strictly true:
>>> d = {"Steve":"Holden", "Guido":"van Rossum", 21.2:"float"}
>>> d[21.1]
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "&qu
rporated into the
documentation after implementation. Too much of the format() stuff is
demonstrated rather than explained.
regards
Steve
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etting it up and running and so on
> will mean waiting another two years.
>
Addressing only the issues of PCBuild8 and 64-bit architectures, I have
tried to establish "free" buildbot support for the 64-bit architectures
without any real success.
Should the PSF be considering p
> them into the computer"). ;-)
>
But doesn't *everyone* now know that documentation contributions don't
have to be marked up? It's certainly been said enough. Maybe that fact
should be more prominent in the documentation? Then we'll just have to
worry about getting people to
> documentation isn't available in Sanskrit yet" or "the dog ate my
> -> >> changes before I could type them into the computer"). ;-)
> ->
> -> Steve> But doesn't *everyone* now know that documentation contributions
> -> S
actly the same output since
June 9. I can't believe it's useful information.
regards
Steve
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Skype: holdenweb http://del.icio.us/steve.holden
--- Asciimercial
Brett Cannon wrote:
> On 7/7/07, Josiah Carlson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Tracker wrote:
>>>> ACTIVITY SUMMARY (07/01/07 - 07/08/07)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Tracker at ht
uiltin
>>> module is missing from config.c. Again, this is not so easy to fix,
>>> because the ftruncate function does not exist on Windows.
>>>
>> I don't have a Windows box; contributions to fix this situation are welcome.
>>
>
> You would
able and lest subject to confusion.
regards
Steve
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--- Asciimercial --
Get on the web: Blog, lens and tag th
e a stupid git to run
Windows".
regards
Steve
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--- Asciimercial --
Get on the web: Blog, lens and tag t
s are used to separate sentences. One space (for
> example, G. D. Montanaro) following a period is considered a non-breakable
> space.
>
How very twentieth-century :-)
regards
Steve
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i686-2.5/libImaging/Chops.o
Are we done yet? Waiting on pid 3244
Got pid, status 3244 0
Got WIFEXITED 0
So it appears unlikely to be gcc-specific, leaving me wondering what
exactly is the difference between the build environment and my tests.
It would be really nice if test_distutils showed any
etup.py install
running install
running build
running build_py
running build_ext
building '_imaging' extension
!::=::\
!C:=C:\cygwin\bin
ALLUSERSPROFILE=C:\Documents and Settings\All Users
APPDATA=C:\Documents and Settings\sholden\Application Data
APR_ICONV_PATH=C:\Program Files\Subversion\iconv
other test out of this dreadfully irritating bug.
Thanks again for looking at this.
regards
Steve
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--- Asciimercial
o return an empty iterator?
>
> I'm +0 for the latter.
>
>
> -1. I'm a heavy user of iterators on finite and infinite streams and,
> for me, iter() is an error that I do not want to paper over. The
> alternate logic implies, e.g ., len() should return 0.
>
age Style->No Style), but it
> didn't affect the initial rendering speed. However, scrolling was
> *much* faster without CSS.
>
Probably because the positional calculations are more straightforward then.
regards
Steve
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Steve Holden+1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119
Holde
Steve Holden wrote:
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>>> The only environment variables that don't appear in the shell output
>>> from the env command are INFOPATH, MAKE_MODE and PLAT. I am still flummoxed.
>> At this point, I'd recommend to perform a cygwin update;
ing, the object continues to
> live. Such objects could also start out with a refcount of sys.maxint
> or so to ensure that calls to the no-op deallocator are unlikely.
>
The thought of adding references is amusing. What happens when a
refcount becomes negative by overflow? I know, I sh
nning - a month or two could do it on a 32bit platform).
>
Could each class define the value to be added to or subtracted from the
refcount? We'd only need a bit to store the value (since it would always
be zero or one), but the execution time might increase quite a lot if
there's n
ronPython is that you don't *need* any
> wrappers - you access .NET objects natively (which in fact wrap the
> lower level win32 API) - and the .NET APIs are usually not as bad as you
> probably assume. ;-)
>
This thread might represent an argument that you *do* need wrappers ...
4 (cygming special, gdc 0.12, using dmd 0.125)] on cygwin
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> "%%(%s)=%%s" % "hello"
'%(hello)=%s'
>>>
I suspect the problem may lie somewhe
an cost (It's just
>
> I will prepare, just for decimal.py, a benchmark that is a mix of all
> operations and use (a mix of common operations like add, not so used
> ones like log10, context switching, exceptions raised, etc). You can
> use this if you want, to measure also
se, even if you had such a system, the generated
> code wouldn't look anything like well-formed Python and would be a
> maintenance nightmare.
>
Besides which, the migration path is already well-specified: write in
3.x-compatible 2.6 and use 2to3 to migrate the code with no further
p
nses since I was under the impression that restricted
> algorithms are disabled by default.
>
> I've disabled IDEA in the makefiles and configure headers of openssl.
> I've also added another step to the makefile patcher in build_ssl. It
> makes sure that the three algorith
the
module namespace.
I doubt many people would want to replace "global" with "module".
What's it being replaced with in 3.x?
regards
Steve
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__
ake
> a bit more time with 64 bits, though.
>
That's a good local optimization for today's conditions, probably. Who
nows whether it will survive the next ten years. And decisions like that
have a weird habit of running into pathological cases whose authors
curse you when they fi
7;t take into account the
different options that were used to compile existing object files.
Without the "make clean" it says "aha, here's a nice up-to-date object
file, I'll use that" and you don't get a freshly-compiled version.
Touching the sources should als
[Sorry, the send key pressed itself there]
Touching the sources should also work, and is a little quicker (but this
is usually only practical for small projects).
regards
Steve
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s Titus has just uploaded
about seventy (70!) new projects I am unsure as to how long it would
have to wait ti get in the queue.
regards
Steve
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seems ugly and unnecessary to me.
I'd rather consider Icon's "break break" to exit two levels of looping,
but I don't see that flying either.
You still haven't made a convincing use case for "yield break", IMHO.
regards
Steve
--
Steve Holden+1 5
Joseph Armbruster wrote:
> Is svn.python.org ok? I am unable to perform an update at the moment.
>
Looks like a transient or location-related problem - I am getting an
update as I write.
regards
Steve
--
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/sandbox/trunk/2to3': could not connect
> to server (http://svn.python.org)
>
> Something seems amiss.
>
Guess my previous output didn't apply to the sandbox. Sorry.
regards
Steve
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uters/ was totally
alien to the Windows mindset.
looking-at-Vista-and-thinking-very-hard-ly y'rs - steve
--
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mpotent? Couldn't
if isinstance(result, str):
result = unicode(result)
avoid repeating in Python a test already made in C by re-spelling it as
result = unicode(result)
or have you hand-waved away important details that mean the test really
is require
hat it *should* feel a little gross
> when you have to do it, so the code I've written that does
> monkeypatching for real is generally a bit ugly.
Yes, monkeypatching should never be formalized to the point where
novices see it as other than a tool of last resort. Otherwise a user
b
id.seek(0)
data = fid.read()
print data
fid.close()
By the way, this is the sort of topic normally reserved for
comp.lang.python, whose denizens would have straightened you out in no
time flat.
regards
Steve
> Cheers
> Ole Nielsen, Geoscience Australia
>
>
> -Original M
aspects of issue
processing, for example to ensure that priority gets set by a
"responsible" reviewer.
However whether such workflow should be imposed by automation or simply
a discipline of development I'm not in a position to say.
regards
Steve
--
Steve Holden+1 57
eat job 98% of the time.
Maybe once we get easy_install as a part of the core (so there's no need
to find and run ez_setup.py to start with) things will start to improve.
This is an issue the whole developer community needs to take seriously
if we are interested in increasing take-up.
Christian Heimes wrote:
> Steve Holden wrote:
>> Maybe once we get easy_install as a part of the core (so there's no need
>> to find and run ez_setup.py to start with) things will start to improve.
>> This is an issue the whole developer community needs to take seriously
Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> At 01:06 AM 1/22/2008 +1000, Nick Coghlan wrote:
>> Steve Holden wrote:
>>> Christian Heimes wrote:
>>>> Steve Holden wrote:
>>>>> Maybe once we get easy_install as a part of the core (so there's no need
>>>>>
patch? I can't bring myself to believe
that 1745035 is really "important" enough.
regards
Steve
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Guido van Rossum wrote:
> On Jan 23, 2008 12:25 PM, Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Giampaolo Rodola' wrote:
>>>> Also, *nothing* should go into the 2.4 branch any more *except*
>>>> important security patches.
>> ^
>&g
out with deprecation warnings of this type.
What's next: "This isn't Perl" when someone tries to add a number and a
string?
Surely the place to raise warnings is in 2to3.
regards
Steve
--
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c.numbers. Either one would be an
> improvement.
>
abstract_numbers would seem to express the essence without focusing on
the mechanism unduly. Of course no sane person would suggest using a
keyword, like
import abstract numbers
Wouldn't want to let reader know what was g
x27;t sound strong enough to change a
> programming language's grammar.
>
> While I promise you I will remain -1 on the proposal simply because it
> doesn't serve any programmer's goals, you've piqued my curiosity --
> can you give an example of what your t
your
test values. That was when I found out that MySQL (5.0.41, anyway)
doesn't implement the INT() function. What was I saying about standards?
regards
Steve
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rning a value of the same type as the input? int(), being a
call to a type, should never return a value of another type.
regards
Steve
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_
ere you have it.
>
"""
Python is TIOBE's Language of the Year for 2007
Python moves up from 8 to 6 in TIOBE's list of popular programming languages
Published: Fri, 18 Jan 2008, 10:30 -0500
"""
From http://python.org/, with a link to th
output.
>> Writing to stdin would be wrong, since it's usually read-only, even
>> when connected to a terminal.
>
> Nowadays, it often is writable I've found, but we still shouldn't assume that.
>
regards
Steve
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his thread could be truncated. It's got me going round and
round. I'm completely floored, and will doubtless end up barking mad -
you know, like a ceil.
regards
Steve
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___
ts lack attributions for the quotes.
I see from your headers you have, at least some of the time, been
posting via gmane using "mirapoint webmail direct", whatever that is.
Perhaps that's the problem?
sticking-with-t'bird-despite-its-f
classes were
moved into the background.
A brief scan of the 2.4 library (the nearest to hand) shows no uses of
int() without an argument in the top level modules. There's clearly no
point calling int() with a literal integer argument, so its uses for
conversion clearly dominate its use as a p
at's a low S/N
ratio. Even without the digital signature overhead it is still 89
characters from a total of 648 ... it's quite possible that's why his
messages are being misinterpreted.
regards
Steve
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;s good to see that the whole burden no longer falls on Tim
and Martin.
Does VS2008 (Express) coexist peacefully with VS2005, which I need to
retain for certain client projects?
regards
Steve
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o be a temporary) fix by
deleting files. Looks like we need to be a little more aggressive with
that policy until the replacement machine (due int he next month or two)
arrives.
Or perhaps we should just add a new disk immediately and relocate some
stuff?
regards
Steve
--
St
Aahz wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 11, 2008, Steve Holden wrote:
>> Douglas Napoleone wrote:
>>> Not sure if this is effecting the core svn repository or not, but the
>>> conference software (also hosted at svn.python.org) is reporting that
>>> the disk is full:
>>
Maybe classes should have __all__ too, then the people who complain
about not being able to declare private class attributes could be
pointed at that.
regards
Steve
Guido van Rossum wrote:
> It's not consistent with what dir() of a class or instance does though.
>
> -1.
>
e goals here (discussion is ongoing). But I hope
> that the rest of the changes are uncontroversial enough to merit
> consideration for possible inclusion in 2.6/3.0.
>
> Thoughts?
>
Only one: if this stunning plethora of improvements is likely to benefit
by you and Christian having acc
r to be "Accepted", "Someday/Maybe", "Design
decision needed", "Ready for checkin" and "Unreviewed". OK. maybe
"triage" wasn't such a good name for for a four-state condition, but it
serves a useful purpose and helps people understa
because nobody had time to pay them any attention in six months -
nor bugs neither, come to that.
regards
Steve
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Virgil Dupras wrote:
> On 2/18/08, Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I'm not sure we should be throwing RFE's away with such casual abandon
>> just because nobody had time to pay them any attention in six months -
>> nor bugs neither, come to tha
, May 18 2007, 16:56:43)
[GCC 3.4.4 (cygming special, gdc 0.12, using dmd 0.125)] on cygwin
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> def eggs((a, )=2.1):
... pass
...
>>>
Oops. 'def eggs((a, )=(2.1,
Steve Holden wrote:
[...]
> The one that surprised me was the legality of
>
> def eggs((a, )=c):
> pass
>
> That just seems like unpacking-abuse to me.
>
Needless to say, a call that tries to *use* the default value fails
horribly, as the parameter form doe
t; and fixed for a bug report.
>
That sounds eminently sensible. So sensible there should be
documentation that tells us to do that. Drat it, where's Brett Cannon
when you need him? :-)
regards
Steve
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#x27;t really see
> why the necessity of b'' should be seen as opening the flood gates
> to backport everything without regard to whether it makes Py2.6 better.
>
It certainly doesn't seem to have the same urgency for cases where 2to3
can unambiguously do
r team (not necessarily all committers) could help us improve
quality and reduce the issue count. Deleting issues purely on grounds of
age is simply throwing away useful information to reduce a numeric
metric that doesn't really relate directly to quality, and quality
assurance is the real poin
y seen the phrase 'works for me' to mean agreement of a
>> proposed action of some sort.
>>
>> Maybe something along the lines of 'can not reproduce' would be better?
>
> I have to agree with Ron. I honestly thought "works for m
u can hold off from committing to
> that branch for a little while longer, that would be appreciated. I
> will cut 3.0a3 tomorrow (Saturday) as early as possible.
>
> time-to-start-drinking-ly y'rs,
Barry:
If you can document the web stuff you have to do I will formalize i
to their inappropriate
nature by our closeness to and familiarity with them, and I think a
major effort to revise their structure (and to a lesser degree their
content) could pay itself back many times over in increased user
friendliness.
Georg's recen
repeat the same material in
different contexts (hopefully by including some common documentation
source rather than laborious and error-prone copy-and-paste).
Document things where people expect to find them. (Now *there's* a
usability study screaming to be done ... and SoC is coming up).
reg
tool chain like Mingw and one with the
latest and greatest MS production line. Unfortunately the problem seems
to be developer effort. For a long time only Martin and Tim were serious
about the Windows platform, and I can appreciate (some of) the extra
effort that parallel development platforms wou
Steven Bethard wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 5:10 PM, Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Christian Heimes wrote:
>> > Bob Kline wrote:
>> >> Any possibility of revisiting this question (upgrading to a more recent
>> >> compiler for W
itself without the
occasional library compatibility issue), and more freely available.
regards
Steve
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Pytho
nnot say how it is licensed to the PSF for
redistribution, nor do I know whether Oracle's acquisition of SleepyCat
will affect future versions. Bet it gave the MySQL guys some sleepless
nights, though.
regards
Steve
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tracker.)
>
Make sure you get a screen shot for OnYourDesktop if/when they *do* go
green!
regards
Steve
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regards
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Neal Norwitz wrote:
> Great work Trent! You'll need to take a picture of Martin buying you
> the beer once you get the rest green. :-)
>
> n
>
> On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Trent N
to3). As one is a global statement, and the other is fairly
> local, I vote for the change.
>
As Guido(?) pointed out, this would be acceptable because it's simply
different spellings of the same way.
regards
Steve
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people are hesitant to actually execute the
> procedure.
>
> Of course, once you *do* provide an entry to "Add/Remove Programs",
> uninstalling won't be mere deletion, as mere deletion would still
> leave these registry keys behind (although Windows got mor
ge or other sites with special
> download mechanisms
>
> * scan websites for links
>
> * make coffee, clean the house, send the kids to school :-)
>
But a package that *would* do this could be immensely popular.
>> And of course, there are still some issu
e in order to get a satisfactory
translation into 3.0.
Once you start editing 3.0 source you have to either leave the 2.X world
behind or accept a dual-source development.
regards
Steve
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;repr" consumption
of the values? "The next couple of elements" is a dangerous thing to use
unless you don't mind them disappearing. And the last one's right out -
you;d end up storing lists anyway!
regards
Steve
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H
, which
might be a reasonable thing to do with a test suite.
Aside from these points, everything else looks great to me. Better
"diff-style" output for assertEquals of strings etc. has been lacking
for ages, as well as collection-oriented assertions.
-Steve
P.S. Hi all!
___
te and read. (And making it a regex match would be
> even cooler.)
>
In which case assertRaisesMatching (and then eventually
assert_raises_matching) might be a better name for it?
regards
Steve
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