for those not familiar with my past experiences with
Mercurial, I gave up on it once before (pylockfile) because I got things so
totally f**ked up. I went back to Subversion on Google Code and have been
happy ever since. I approach this new way of managing Python development
with a gr
l.
Georg> You can still exchange commits with the other local clones by
Georg> using, for example, "hg push ../3.2". (You can also add another
Georg> entry in the .hgrc's [paths] section if you want to give
Georg> nicknames to these path names).
That seems
tead of cloning everything from cpython, right?
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You already
pushed from 3.1 to ../3.2 then updated in 3.2. Didn't that make the changes
available?
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tin> them.
Martin> So after "hg push", the change is on the "3.1 branch" of the
Martin> "3.2 clone". The "merge 3.1" tries to merge all changes on the
Martin> 3.1 branch that are not already on the 3.2 branch to the 3.2
Martin&g
st is synchronized with the rietveld
Martin> issue's cc list, so comments get mailed to the nosy list.
What should I be looking for? For example, this issue:
http://bugs.python.org/issue11205
contains a patch but I don't see anything which l
atal Python error: subversion
Vinay> keywords missing".
I encountered the same problem. My "solution" was to manually expand the
$HeadURL$ string at the top of posixmodule.c as it would have been expanded
by Subversion. I then committed that locally.
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n't see any great
harm in expanding that string and checking it in, simply to avoid this
problem in the future. I'm sure there are plenty of developers maintaining
external code which is still supposed to be 2.5-compatible.
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Anybody here (or elsewhere) with plans to blog at PyCon for those of us not
going?
Thx,
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>> You are not a registered user.
>> Unknown address: python-dev@python.org
I should point out that I approved this message, mostly so whoever has
thinks set up to send messages to the meta tracker as python-dev can fix the
pr
Antoine> Ouch. I fear this message may be repeated several times :/
Antoine> Sorry for the spam, if that happens...
Do you want me to reject or discard future messages to python-dev from
roundup-admin?
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on on the change. If the peephole optimizer
is largely Raymond's work, why should that be treated any differently? Is
it just because it can't practically be distributed outside of Python proper
the way ElementTree can?
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Martin> I don't think any of the regular core committers got any such
Martin> explicit veto powers on any code...
"Veto powers" is your term, not mine. I suggested that Raymond's opinion
should be accorded extra weight. This isn't
out that the case at
Martin> hand is different.
I didn't know that, nor did I infer that Fredrik had veto power. I wrote:
I think we would give reasonably large weight to Fredrik Lundh's opinion
on the change.
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:
changeset: 68585:c63d7374b89a
user:Skip Montanaro
date:Sat Mar 19 09:09:30 2011 -0500
summary: Mention RFC 4180. Based on input by Tony Wallace in issue
11456.
I committed. Now:
changeset: 68680:64eeb4cd4b56
tag: tip
parent: 6858
RDM> merge it into default, and also patch 2.7, just like any other
RDM> bug-fix commit.
Sorry, I found updating cpython hard enough. I almost gave up on just that
one simple change.
Anyway, I thought I was supposed to pull from head to 3.2 and 2.
to
learn how to do something I was doing in CVS and Subversion with no trouble,
I would have done so by now. I want to understand how to use the workflow
set up for this project. If you aren't willing to help me get past my
initial difficulties, please don't bother responding.
--
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ns on the whitespace in .rst files. Now that I know, it's not
difficult to avoid.
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ot run). The workflow of the version control system isn't
going to magically expose semantic interactions across modules. It seems to
me that at best the new workflow means there is a better chance of catching
textual conflicts before checkin than before.
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_
Terry> What you felt like doing after doing the rest;-?
I still f*cked everything up. R. David Murray came to my rescue. Even he
muffed it and had to backtrack I think, at least based on one of the
comments I saw on one of the involved tracker issues.
S
essed intention of the switch away from
a centralized version control system, to make it easier for more people to
contribute to Python. It certainly seems harder for this old dog.
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n's terminology) would happen with Subversion.
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ntimes)? If so, I think there is
value it having both 2.x and 3.x versions, even if the 3.x stuff won't be
useful for speed comparisons.
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Unsubsc
ed with my trivial doc patch last week. I was quite
surprised to see all my local checkins turn up on the python-checkins
mailing list. Is there not some way to automatically collapse a series of
local commits into one large commit when you do the push?
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y expose problems, just as we do today for unit tests.
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I came across a new message I neither understood before or after searching
for it on Google (and thus the documentation):
% hg pull -u
pulling from /Users/skip/src/hgpython/2.6
searching for changes
adding changesets
adding manifests
adding file changes
added 242
t's one reason why the
Stephen> Linux kernel uses Linus and lieutenants as a serialization
Stephen> mechanism).
So DVCS scales up to a point, then it breaks and you need to revert to some
sort of serialization scheme?
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uot; button, it created a patch
Senthil> and then attached to the issue tracker. You can click on the
Senthil> review button to post that patch to reitveld and do the
Senthil> review,.
Sorry, I don't see a "Create Patch"
Hrvoje> If you are not familiar with other DVCS workflows, take a look
Hrvoje> at, for example, chapter 5 of the "Pro Git" book, which
Hrvoje> describes the alternatives such as integrator-manager and
Hrvoje> dictator-lieutenant workflows: http://progit.org/book/ch5-1.html
Thanks.
1:6b2edc385ffe
parent: 68803:b99c94261225
user:Martin v. L?wis
date:Mon Mar 21 10:32:02 2011 +0100
summary: null merge
changeset: 68309:c3caaf979b9e
branch: 2.5
parent: 68263:7790ad8332ba
user:Skip Montanaro
date:
of which support
Senthil> creating mercurial repositories. Or it could be a repository at
Senthil> hg.python.org and with a url like hg.python.org/sandbox/skip or
Senthil> hg.python.org/skip
Senthil> You will have to 'push' your changes to those so that they
Sjoerd> Are you sure the hg pull part worked?
Pretty sure:
2.7% hg pull
Enter passphrase for key '/Users/skip/.ssh/id_rsa':
pulling from ssh://h...@hg.python.org/cpython
searching for changes
no changes found
2.7% cd ../2.6
2.6% hg pull
pullin
3:7790ad8332ba
| | | | | |user:Skip Montanaro
| | | | | |date:Sun Mar 06 21:31:25 2011 -0600
| | | | | |summary: manually expand the defunct HeadURL subversion
keyword
...
I see no other "parent"s. I have to admit I don't know how to rea
y and
Daniel> often). It's saved my butt more than once
Interesting concept. So, I take it your commit messages are generally
empty? Care to share the hook function? (I trust it understands when you
save files not under version control.)
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27;t know if it's possible to do easily, but when uploading a new
version of a patch the user could be prompted to select other patches
(or maybe they could be selected based on having the same name?)
which the new patch makes obsolete so they can be elided from the
web. There is
no editorial review of their quality other than Google page rank. Is there a
prioritized list of stuff one should read?
Again, I reveal my ignorance with stunning alacrity. My apologies to the
experts.
>From Joel Spolsky:
e recent checkins) or revision-wise (rev 68001 is newer than
68000)?
If I had more time I'm sure I could ask more questions.
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>> hg revert -r 68263 Python/sysmodule.c
>>
>> Was that the right thing to do?
merwok> Use hg backout, not revert.
They differ, how?
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se to me because I guess I don't know what you mean by "main". What
is/are the "main repos"? hg.python.org/sandbox/ncoghlan?
hg.python.org/cpython?
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Martin> Yes, it will turn into a giant bowl of spaghetti - that's the
Martin> whole point of "Distributed" version control systems.
skip> No, you don't understand. Just the repositories I will have to
skip> deal with will turn into a big bowl of s
tedly running those tests simply because they run fast gives a false
sense of security.
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TOH, when I run a simple "make test" only distutils fails.
This is on my Macbook Pro running Leopard.
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e code which is currently the most flaky.)
Barry> Any objections to adding those slowest 5 tests to the blacklist,
Barry> and -j5 to quicktest for Python 3.3?
Convince me that you haven't so horribly skewed the coverage that the result
is no longer meaningful.
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status
* Grab a cup of coffee
* Read python-dev
* Try out a few new bass lines you heard on Pinetop Perkins' last album
(may he RIP).
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ious things, but on
this I am definitely in agreement with him.
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e coordinated manually. Say, everybody breaks for {morning snack,
lunch, dinner}. When they return from the break if the local buildbots are
green you push out to cpython, then everyone starts banging on their
keyboards again.
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ML-RPC I suspect your best fallback is a dictionary.
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>> Boggle.
Jesse> I assume that means your in, or you hate that idea?
Or that he just really likes to play Boggle. :-)
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Antoine> Take a look at:
Antoine> http://docs.python.org/devguide/committing.html
What form should directed graphs be in for inclusion?
Thx,
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can't be encoded in ASCII unless a non-ASCII message body is detected?
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asking if it would be possible (read: fairly
easy) to only generate utf-8 when it was necessary.
For the time being I'm using a procmail hack to blindly rewrite utf-8 to
us-ascii in the checking messages. I'll see how that works before doing
something more elaborate like switch
where no non-ascii symbols are
Eugene> used?
Sure, but the mime header tells VM that the body of the part is utf-8
encoded, and it's base64-encoded. If it wasn't base64-encoded I could
simply hit D in my mail reader to expand the part.
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that.
That's fine. I was just asking.
I guess I have my work cut out for me. It appears my preferred mail reader,
VM, is not supported out-of-the-box by GNU Emacs (they still use Rmail and
Babyl for some reason), and I'm not sure the investment trying to get XEmacs
built with MULE i
the ediff and vc packages recognize version-controlled files
(It seems they do, but I haven't put them through their paces)
* replace the GNU python.el with python-mode.el from the python-mode
project (formerly distributed with Python, but no
>> For the record, I added a page documenting our continuous integration
>> setup at: http://docs.python.org/devguide/buildbots.html
Jesse> that's awesome. should we document how to donate/add a buildbot
Jesse> somewhere in the same section (or alongside)?
I must admit, it wasn't
Please see this thread in the tracker-discuss list:
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/tracker-discuss/2011-March/thread.html
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skip> Please see this thread in the tracker-discuss list:
skip>
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/tracker-discuss/2011-March/thread.html
That didn't read right. I meant see that thread to see other discussion
about the folding topic, not that it would necessary convince
tached. (Apologies
for the image size. Who would have thought such a modest image would be so
hard to compress?)
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ges
rapidly become less important as they age. Think following the Japanese
earthquake/tsunami aftermath.
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re accuracy than the language conversion)? :-)
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comment box when
Ethan> one runs out of previous comments to read.
Again, drawing on the forum model, the new message box is always at the
bottom (of each page) in my experience.
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e tools in pure Python.
anatoly> http://code.google.com/p/rainforce/issues/detail?id=4
Yeah, I sort of figured that. :-) I meant JPEG? PNG? ASCII art? Some sort
of graph notation (like Graphviz)? MoinMoin .draw notation? Does ReST
support an
Laura> Sphinx lets you embed graphviz.
Laura> http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ext/graphviz.html?highlight=image
Cool, thanks. I'm going to try to reproduce Nick's setup as he described
it. That would certainly be a whole lot easy for me to understand,
hopefully for other
Skip> I'm going to try to reproduce Nick's setup as he described it.
Skip> That would certainly be a whole lot easy for me to understand,
Skip> hopefully for others as well.
Laura> *DEFINITELY* for me too!
Nick> I'll reproduce it in dodgy ASCI
vawda, 2011-03-20 19:15
...
bz2-doc.diff > nvawda, 2011-04-02 18:14
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at
circumstances might the 100% rule be relaxed?
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Mark Summerfield responded to Martin's python-announce post. Rather than
approving it I rejected it and forwarded it here. (I suppose I could have
forwarded it directly to Martin, but that would have required that I recall
or look up his email address...)
Barry> I would agree. Use asserts for "this can't possibly happen
Barry> " conditions.
Without looking, I suspect that's probably what the author thought he was
doing.
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rom the code and maintain it manually, it's going to get out-of-date.
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ted
system you won't even consider cycles for reclmation, would both RC and GC
have to punt because they can't tell which object's destructor to call
first?
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Michael> "Therefore we decided to break such a cycle at an arbitrary
Michael> place, which doesn't sound too insane."
I trust "arbitrary" != "random"?
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less legitimately encounter it if the generator expression
originally contained a condition which got removed.
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ior. I am also searching for a list of deprecated
kevin> features.
One place to search:
http://svn.python.org/projects/python/branches/py3k/Lib/test/crashers/
--
Skip Montanaro - s...@pobox.com - http://www.smontanaro.net/
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that's an improvement.
Maybe it's just me, but given two sets I frequently want to operate on
s1-s2, s2-s1 and s1&s2 in different ways. I wouldn't find a disjoint
operation all that useful.
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does the "E" in R. E. Olds stand for?), not general (what star shines during
the day? what day preceeds Monday?)
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thing else I think you need to keep math in mind whether it's used
in the core documentation or not.
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made. I'm being vague here on purpose because I'm unfamiliar with the
available tools. The one thing I do know is that LaTeX provides that today
and by removing it from the toolchain you have removed a significant piece
of functionality.
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but where will they get them if they
are no longer part of Python?
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presents the most frequently requested
pages in a section at the top of the page. I can make the script available
if anyone wants it (it uses Myghty - Mason in Python.)
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it to any other
format. It's about as readable as LaTeX source.
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more familiar to people
interested in math display than anything else.
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;"Distutils setup parameters."""
* ran "python setup.py install"
That's probably more than necessary, but with the math subdir I can easily
move the whole thing to a new snapshot and the setup.py change lets me
install them transparently.
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use for lack of contributions. True
whiners will just come up with new ones (e.g., "the documentation isn't
available in Sanskrit yet" or "the dog ate my changes before I could type
them into the computer"). ;-)
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Pytho
hem into the computer"). ;-)
Steve> But doesn't *everyone* now know that documentation contributions
Steve> don't have to be marked up? It's certainly been said
Steve> enough.
Sure, but that doesn't stop the true whiners. ;-)
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be difficult
to read unless pumped through lynx -dump or something similar.
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n in checkin emails
recently. I forwarded your note to the python.org mailman/postfix gurus.
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copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import csv
>>> d = csv.get_dialect("excel")
>>> d
<_csv.Dialect object at 0x137fac0>
Please submit a bug report on SourceForge.
Thx,
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e lines. These look a little
funky when debugging from a terminal window.
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ave to patch
Aaron> subprocess.py ourselves.
In theory, I'm in favor of backporting, but how far back do you need/want to
apply it? There will clearly be more 2.5 releases. I don't think any more
2.4 releases are planned.
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Neal> We need to hear more from people outside of Google to ensure we
Neal> are doing the best possible job. It would also be great to have
Neal> more active committers that don't work at Google.
Are you worried that Google might get hit by
rd of that restriction being relaxed.
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Barry> diffs are so 20th century. :)
How do you compare two versions of something without some sort of diff?
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Barry> Silly me, the trunk is already available:
Barry> https://code.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/python/trunk
Bazaar keeps this in sync with svn.python.org?
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Window-centric so they've pretty much been off my radar
screen.
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space (for
example, G. D. Montanaro) following a period is considered a non-breakable
space.
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gramming for 30 years. I started with IBM punch
cards, so I might be a bit biased.
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Paul> And I feel that It's bug in python, or python port, because I'm
Paul> getting Bus error on some stage when I'm tracing execution and
Paul> trying to backtrace.
Have you run it under control of a C-level debugger (gdb, dbx, etc) to see
where the
Paul> ... that files can have *either* bare \n, *or* the combination
Paul> \r\n, to delimit lines.
As someone else pointed out, \r needs to be supported as well. Many Mac
applications (Excel comes to mind) still emit text files with \r as the line
terminator.
I'm working on removing Tru64 support from the Python 3 code base. There
aren't that many markers which actually say "Tru64". I see __digitial__ and
OSF/1 as well. What others are there?
Thx,
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P
e that checks whether the processor is alpha
Martin> might also be relevant - but that could also talk about other
Martin> systems (Linux or VMS).
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