ocess were for 2.7a2.
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Martin
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is indeed the right place to ask.
>>
> I thought I'd picked this thread off python-dev. What point am I not
> understanding here?
Maybe I misunderstood. I thought you copied it from the webmaster list
(as the original To indicated)
true for any other operating system, though: you need to
install the compiler tool chain (sometimes, you need to buy it first),
and compiling Python with all extensions is not a trivial task.
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vailable to them all the
time. They only have part-time to work on Python, though.
Of course, if somebody would promise a more timely provision of
binaries, and can't do that because of lack of hardware, we would have
to look for a solution.
Regards,
Martin
n a timely
manner for the next two years. Now would be a good point to do so, since
your next release would still be a beta release. Expect to mess up the
first time you do it, so it's good that it would be only a beta.
Regards,
Martin
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and required too much manual fixing, and that the demand for these
binaries was too low. I don't recall OSX being mentioned in that
discussion, though.
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atest tool chain.
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lease manager might be able to trigger a release build by just
passing the right branch name in the master UI).
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es are also on disk. It's only
that they would poison an installer - the binaries would work on no
other machine.
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C. Titus Brown wrote:
> If Georg, Benjamin,
> Martin, or Ronald are interested, please just tell me (or Steve, or the PSF
> board, or ...) what you want and I'll work on getting it funded.
For me, my company provides all the infrastructure I need (tools,
bandwidth, hardware, etc)
Paul Rudin wrote:
> "Martin v. Löwis" writes:
>
>> The major difference in the "do it yourself" attitude is that Mac user
>> get a compiler for free, as part of the operating system release,
>> whereas for Windows, they have to pay for it (leaving al
rtunately, that machine had hardware problems (or
atleast appeared to have hardware problems). So if anybody would be
interested into maintaining it, please let us know.
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Martin
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> I'd be happy to help where I can, too. All my automated testing of
> UpLib (Windows, Ubuntu, Fedora, OS X) is done on Apple servers running
> OS X and VirtualBox and Hudson, so I've got some experience there.
Would you be interested in operating a build slav
> Making the Windows binary build process automatic and robust is challenging
> if you hate Windows (like I do). Martin also made the point that it's
> been broken forever, so people don't seem to care :). ISTR Martin just
> makes them manually.
That's true. In
xpertise to write the
script (perhaps there are one or two people, and they don't have the time).
Regards,
Martin
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is
probably skeptical wrt. such a proposal.
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be willing to have a go at
> testing the existing process and if necessary adding some automation.
I do *a lot* of manual steps, because I didn't have time to script it all.
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n be more difficult.
I guess ActiveState has solved the problem (probably by not populating
/opt/sfw on the Solaris machine that builds ActivePython).
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e that you need
to go back to 10.4 (*). Unfortunately, Apple manages to break
compatibility and portability with every release, which makes this
particular build task s tricky. You have to make all kinds of
decisions and compromises where are really difficult to keep track of.
Regards,
Martin
slightly problematic issue is that the machine I want to use for
> the buildbot is running OSX 10.6 and creating the binary installer
> doesn't work on 10.6 yet, but that should be easy enough to fix when
> I look into it.
So we should definitely take one step at a
mise I see in this build process right now is that we
> are building a Panther (10.3) compatible installer, while Mac OS X is
> a certified UNIX starting with 10.5.
I think there are more issues. People want a fat binary that supports
AMD64 along with x86, yet building such a binary require
t;
> What's non-trivial about it?
Building a DMG file, in a way that the output will actually work on most
other systems.
Regards,
Martin
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to building and install
> testing the multi-arch and multi-version installers.
There is one build slave now up, contributed by David Bolen.
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Ned Deily wrote:
> In article <4bc61278.7020...@v.loewis.de>,
> "Martin v. Lowis" wrote:
>> Ned Deily wrote:
>>> That *is* something that the PSF could help with. I
>>> would be happy to help with that myself, although my time to do so will
>
ss. It would
also be good if anybody who commits to producing OSX binaries now would
also produce them throughout the 2.7 lifetime (which could be a bit
longer than the traditional 18 months).
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Martin
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t would be a
> worthy addition.
1. The ultimate decision on that is with the release manager (i.e. Benjamin)
2. My personal recommendation is to allow it: while it *is* a new
feature, it is a feature that doesn't change any API.
Regards,
Martin
__
e vicinity in the
> foreseeable future.)
I think we could arrange to have somebody ship it somewhere, even across
the globe.
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Martin
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p some volunteer to do a smoke test in a
timely manner at release time who will test the installer on, say, a
clean VM.
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decision or BDFL pronouncement).
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Martin
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Ronald Oussoren wrote:
> On 15 Apr, 2010, at 6:36, Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>
>> Greg Ewing wrote:
>>> Michael Foord wrote:
>>>> Building Python requires, I believe, the XCode development tools to be
>>>> installed. Even then, building a full version
y help,
as testing results for that binary might not transfer to the next one
(if the next one comes from a different environment again).
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Martin
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d be
used. So it's ambiguous, in which case the feature shouldn't be provided
in the first place.
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Martin
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selves, which is suboptimal from a language usability's point of view.
Indeed, you shouldn't be switching. Instead, you should be using Unicode
strings all the time.
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Martin
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http
know well Windows API, and so I would like your opinion about that ;-)
Can you please elaborate what the specific issue is? I completely fail
to see what byte strings have to do with surrogate codes. AFAICT, on
Windows, you can just use surrogate codes at the APIs, and be done.
Regards,
Martin
___
report again.
> Amaury also reopened #8394 "ctypes.dlopen() doesn't support surrogates",
> because ctypes.CDLL() rejects byte string.
Ok, I'll close this as well.
Regards,
Martin
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ht
that, we need to understand what exactly happened.
As a starting point for further research, try the sxstrace utility of
your Vista installation.
Regards,
Martin
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s 2008 R2
Enterprise. What would matter is processor architecture - we don't have
an Itanium Windows buildbot slave :-)
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Martin
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Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> Martin v. Löwis v.loewis.de> writes:
>> As for the operating system: I don't think it matters at all. Windows XP
>> Home is as fine a platform for this application as Windows 2008 R2
>> Enterprise. What would matter is processor architecture
>> As a starting point for further research, try the sxstrace utility of
>> your Vista installation.
>
> What Vista installation? XP I'm afraid...
Then you are out of look. Check the event log, and ask in Windows help
forums for better ways to analyse the pr
typical verbosity options). The
> default help for the action needs to be fixed, and there are a couple of
> documentation tweaks to be made, but Steven's decision to remove the
> feature has a sound rationale.
Exactly my feelings. IMO, straight removal would be fine as we
te only).
> Should I report this issue to a specific tracker (other than bugs.python.org
> and webmas...@python.org)?
Please don't report that to the tracker.
Regards,
Martin
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x27;t quite figure
out who (whenever I was looking, the traffic looked genuine). It turned
out that Sridhar himself contributed a good chunk of this traffic.
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Martin
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;work".
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Martin
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ct on the issue in a reasonable amount of time.
Of course, long-term contributors can and do also make the same
mistakes; it's just that new people are often unfamiliar with the
conventions.
This was all in the abstract, independent of dangerjim (whom I don't know
an we add a easy-to-remove configure error in
3.2, and remove the support in 3.3.
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Martin
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past issues to normal which have
them currently unset?
I would do that "behind" roundup, so that it appears as if the issue was
already created with that priority. That way, those issues don't appear
as if they had recent activity.
Regards,
Martin
_
> Same here. Unfortunately I think that requires a code change as I can't
> see how to do it through the web API.
You have to write an auditor, which I just did.
Regards,
Martin
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Eric Smith wrote:
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>>>> If possible, I think 'normal' should be the default in the hox or else
>>>> there should be some sort of auto replacement.
>>> Makes sense to me.
>>
>> I have now changed to make 'norma
ears as if the issue was
>> already created with that priority. That way, those issues don't appear
>> as if they had recent activity.
>
> +1
>
> This will make the default grouping more useful, since now critical
> issues will appear at the top, instead of
g,
since it isn't real spam, but just non-sensical. I don't think the user
needs to be banned from the tracker.
Regards,
Martin
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aving
asked for them to happen.
For example, I would prefer not to be assigned any issues, because I'm
unlikely to act on them in the six months - unless, as David says, I'm
the *only* person who could move the issue forward in that time.
Regards,
Martin
__
is
not difficult at all. Start with a clean sandbox, then apply the patch.
If you want to go back to the state without patch, revert the sandbox,
if you need it again, apply it again. It's really simple.
Regards,
Martin
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ly documents the "easy" keyword.
So which ones you don't understand?
> Also, some of the headings in the page are enclosed in square brackets,
> while others are not. It's not clear to me what the brackets are
> intended to designate.
Not sure what this is refe
I've marked it as spam now.
Regards,
Martin
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> When I open http://bugs.python.org/iss...@template=item
> priority is (still) set at no selection. Is this my local cache (which I
> do not know how to clear in FF) or is 'normal' filled in after submission?
It is filled in after submissio
Feel free to submit patches. I don't want to spend more time on this
soon, though.
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Martin
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d if you also post a message explaining why the issue was
closed. I'm just reporting what it was meant for originally.
> I never noticed this. there are also pop-up boxed for Stage, Priority,
> and Keywords. There should also be a pop-up for
onents
and opponents of the PEP would accept.
Without a BDFL, I think we need a committee to make decisions, e.g. by
majority vote amongst committers.
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Martin
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have to indicate whether he
is interested in that role.
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Martin
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Steve Holden wrote:
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>>>> Without a BDFL, I think we need a committee to make decisions, e.g. by
>>>> majority vote amongst committers.
>>> Couldn't we just go with the FLUFL?
>> Not sure whether that's a serious propo
> I see the confusion. I think Martin meant more about open issues that
> required discussion, not simply issues that had a patch ready to go.
I actually think it is perfectly fine to point out that specific issues
are need committer action on this list. This is what the list is the
ponsibility.
Regards,
Martin
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listen to the opinions of the respective
experts.
See also my proposal that the release manager of the next feature
release automatically assumes that role.
Regards,
Martin
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> Then it's not obvious that we will have many PEPs in the future.
Given Guido's Theorem: the PEPs yet to be written will hopefully
outnumber the PEPs written so far.
Regards,
Martin
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It runs on
www.python.org (why would you expect it to run elsewhere???),
and what about "daily" do you consider imprecise? Do you really need
exact hour, minute, and second? What for?
Regards,
Martin
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ned to be done). I didn't know how this all
worked myself, either, but, using the root account, it took me only a
minute to find out - much faster than finding the documentation that may
have explained it in detail.
The only starting point that you need is the machine that you know it
runs
> In the meantime, let's groom Benjamin to be the Sacred Next Uncle Galvanizing
> the Gamut of Language Evolution.
I don't think anybody having such a position permanently can really work.
Regards,
Martin
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Jesus Cea wrote:
> On 26/04/10 22:00, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>>> Maybe we can drop OSF/1 safely supporting Tru64 yet, but we don't have
>>> any buildbot running any of this systems...
>> Dropping support is fine with me, in the long term. If PEP 11
> Will changing the indentation of source files to 4 space indents break
> patches on the bug tracker?
Plain patch will choke, but "patch -l" might accept them. I have only
read the documentation, though, and don't know whether it does in pract
ges.
>>
> Let's not forget to consider what Hg can do, since that represents the
> future.
I think Mercurial chokes in the light of white space inconsistencies
just as much as Subversion. One reason for not converting in the past
was also that i
David Bolen and I started producing daily OSX installers, at
http://www.python.org/dev/daily-dmg/
If you find problems with these, please report them to bugs.python.org.
Regards,
Martin
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e
release cycle), and definitely less than 6.
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Martin
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A.M. Kuchling wrote:
> On Fri, May 07, 2010 at 09:30:00AM +0200, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>> I agree with Terry: how did you arrive at the 4 years for 2.x releases?
>> Bug fixes releases stopped after the next feature release being made,
>> which gave (counting betwe
> Has anyone considered using regrtest's -j option in the buildbot
> configuration to speed up the test runs?
Yes, I did. I turned it off again when the tests started failing because
of it.
Regards,
Martin
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s made it unsuitable for buildbot usage.
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Martin
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stem also;
ultimately, it is the OS vendor who specifies the C ABI for their
systems. On Linux, in absence of a vendor, the ABI is what the kernel
and gcc define it to be.
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e test, instead of
failing it. I.e. aborting the Python process is definitely not a good
response.
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Martin
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;t crash when you try to run Tk
commands without a window server. Instead of aborting Python, that
should raise an exception (which can then be detected as a test skip).
Regards,
Martin
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less until somebody contributes such a fix.
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Martin
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eople try to work around serious problems rather than fixing them. And
an interpreter crash in the test suite *is* a serious problem, IMO.
Of course, it may turn out to be an unfixable Tcl or Apple bug, in which
case working around would become more inter
Bill Janssen wrote:
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>
>> Bill Janssen wrote:
>>> I've got parc-tiger-1 up and running again. It's failing on test_tk,
>>> which makes sense, because it's running as a background twisted process,
>>> and thus can
rs but didn't.
That makes sense to me; thanks for investigating it.
If we are kind, we could also file a Tk bug, then.
Regards,
Martin
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ontext: what exactly do you want to set up?
A buildbot master, or a buildbot slave? For running what tests?
Buildbot is available from http://buildbot.net/trac
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Martin
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he slave runs
on. Otherwise, the slave will be down most of the time, and just not
function correctly; it was then a waste of time to set it up in the
first place.
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Martin
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t has been disallowed for all robots for quite
some time now:
http://www.python.org/robots.txt
There is really no point robots crawling the build logs, as they don't
contain much useful information for a search engine.
Regards,
Martin
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ound 8 hours ago, anyway).
If desired, we could password-protect the "force build" forms. If that
is to be done, some help from a buildbot expert on what to change
specifically would be appreciated.
Regards,
Martin
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al build. I
usually also fill out a reason.
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Martin
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that should be possible.
Unfortunately, these forms are deeply hidden in the buildbot code. So
I'd rather avoid editing them, or else upgrading to the next buildbot
version becomes even more tedious.
Regards,
Martin
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credentials expired, or some such...
In short, if some OS X expert could shed some light on this, it would be
appreciated. It would then be good to add this to the wiki. See also
http://buildbot.net/trac/wiki/UsingLaunchd
http://developer.apple.com/mac/library/technotes/tn2005/tn2083.html
Regards,
> A workaround is to just put them in the /etc/hosts file.
That doesn't really help: the test suite also relies on a number of host
names.
Regards,
Martin
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can't bind a thread to specific core with it, though, but you can
requests that multiple threads all run on the same core (leaving the
choice "which core" to the system).
IIUC, an affinity preference does not survive exec(2), so you can't
write a too
x
> effectively on modern multicore hardware
Not at all. Just use the multiprocessing module instead, and be done.
It's really easy to use if you already managed to understand threads.
Regards,
Martin
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oubt it will be less than five years.
Make it a GSoC project next summer, and you have them ported next fall.
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Martin
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ill suffer from the original problems.
So please join us in considering the issue fixed unless you can provide
a really world example that demonstrates the contrary.
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Martin
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gt; then we can address the issue at that time.
Exactly my feelings.
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Martin
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haven't found it.
You don't need to bother about it - it's fine that it's missing.
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Martin
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the script
doesn't exist, and then it shouldn't have been invoked. So I'm puzzled
why there is an error message at all.
I slightly object to checking it in. It's *not* a mandatory part of a
buildbot slave setup, and if you don't know what it is, you don't nee
Peter Portante wrote:
> Does anybody think that by having problems with the new GIL that it might
> further weaken the adoption rate for 3k? -peter
No, to the contrary. By having the new GIL being superior to the old
implementation, the adoption rate for 3k will increase.
Regards,
seems to think
this is useful (let alone useful enough to go into the standard
library). In addition, it's trivial to implement, more reason not to add it.
Regards,
Martin
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7;s a security fix? No. This issue has been sitting in the
tracker for more than a year now, so it's not really relevant (IMO)
whether the bug fix arrives two weeks earlier.
Regards,
Martin
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