On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 3:24 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On 26 November 2014 at 18:30, Greg Ewing
> wrote:
> > Guido van Rossum wrote:
> >>
> >> Hm, that sounds like you're either being contrarian or Chris and I have
> >> explained it even worse
Can you summarize that in a self-contained form for inclusion in the PEP?
(That was a rhetorical question. :-)
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 12:17 PM, Isaac Schwabacher
wrote:
> On 14-11-26, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 8:54 AM, Paul Moore wrote:
> >
> >
it on GitHub? ;D
>
> ijs
>
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On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 3:15 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
>
> On 27 Nov 2014 03:58, "Paul Moore" wrote:
> >
> > On 26 November 2014 at 17:19, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > > It's hard to use as an example because the behavior of contextlib is an
> &g
>
> ChrisA
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No, that was a figure of speech. The proposed decorator returns a new
function object that references a new code object. The original function
and code object are unchanged.
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 4:38 PM, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 11:33 AM, Guido van Rossum
>
Well, that's just a general problem with decorator ordering.
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 4:57 PM, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 11:50 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > No, that was a figure of speech. The proposed decorator returns a new
> > function objec
s Angelico wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > Well, that's just a general problem with decorator ordering.
>
> Indeed. I was hoping it could be avoided in this instance by just
> altering __code__ on an existing function, but if that
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 2:53 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On 27 Nov 2014 06:35, "Guido van Rossum" wrote:
> [...]
>
> > I think we can put a number to "much faster" now -- 150 nsec per
> try/except.
> >
> > I have serious misgivings about that deco
On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 3:04 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On 27 November 2014 at 11:15, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 2:53 PM, Nick Coghlan
> wrote:
> >>
> >> On 27 Nov 2014 06:35, "Guido van Rossum" wrote:
> >>
> >&
think of is to have asyncio special-case the Return
exception -- we could do that by defining a new exception (e.g.
AlternateReturn) in asyncio that gets treated the same way as
StopIteration, so that Trollius can inherit from AlternateReturn (if it
exists).
What do you think?
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Pytho
we bother
the community with another review. And that one will certainly take longer
than five days!
On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 12:01 PM, Raymond Hettinger <
raymond.hettin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Nov 27, 2014, at 8:52 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> I understand that @al
f
> module switch, nor whether cutting them out would be a good or bad
> thing!
>
> ChrisA
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how the try/except *setup* cost
became *shut down* cost of the pipeline. But that doesn't matter, since the
number of setups equals the number of shut downs.
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AttributeError?
On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 11:37 AM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 4:21 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > Are these really all our options? All of them sound like hacks, none of
> them
> > sound like anything the language (or even the C
ey run.
And historically we've not done a great job on maintenance and
administration.
Of course it's fun to make tools in Python, and to see them used beyond the
Python world. But that's an entirely different argument from what I hear.
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 6:15 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:
>
> On Sat, Nov 29, 2014, 21:55 Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> All the use cases seem to be about adding some kind of getattr hook to
> modules. They all seem to involve modifying the CPython C code anyway. So
> why not tackle
On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 2:54 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > All the use cases seem to be about adding some kind of getattr hook to
> > modules. They all seem to involve modifying the CPython C code anyway. So
>
On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> On Sun, 30 Nov 2014 11:15:50 -0800
> Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 6:15 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, Nov 29, 2014, 21:55 Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > >
to transfer the changes from the contributor to the committer so
> you’re
> “losing” that history regardless.
>
> ---
> Donald Stufft
> PGP: 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA
>
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ild limitation that it doesn't work with
> > extension modules, but eh. Mostly I'd be nervous about the two points
> > above.
> >
> > -n
> >
> > --
> > Nathaniel J. Smith
> > Postdoctoral researcher - Informatics - University of E
On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 5:42 PM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 1:27 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > Nathaniel, did you look at Brett's LazyLoader? It overcomes the subclass
> > issue by using a module loader that makes all modules instances of a
> >
As far as I'm concerned I'm just waiting for your decision now.
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:07 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:
>
>
> On Sun Nov 30 2014 at 8:25:25 PM Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
>
>> Can we please stop the hg-vs-git discussion? We've established earlier
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 1:38 PM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 4:06 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 5:42 PM, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> >>
> >> On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 1:27 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> >> > Nat
On Sun, Nov 30, 2014 at 10:25 AM, Donald Stufft wrote:
>
> On Nov 30, 2014, at 1:05 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> I don't feel it's my job to accept or reject this PEP, but I do have an
> opinion.
>
>
> So here’s a question. If it’s not your job to accept
e end up needing more time we don't *have* to make a
> decision at PyCon, but it's a good goal to have. I don't think we can
> cleanly replicate a single repo on all three solutions as I sure don't want
> to deal with that merging fun (unless someone comes forward to
On Tue, Dec 2, 2014 at 10:21 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:
>
>
> On Tue Dec 02 2014 at 1:05:22 PM Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for taking charge, Brett.
>>
>> I personally think this shouldn't be brought up at the summit -- it's
>> likely to
t; Furthermore, I'm not sure how effectively we can experiment when it
> comes to moving hosting. There's overhead involved that biases the
> outcome and in part contributes to the momentum of the initial
> experimental conditions. I doubt any external solution is going t
s
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Author: Chris Angelico , Guido van Rossum <
gu...@python.org>
Status: Accepted
Type: Standards Track
Content-Type: text/x-rst
Created: 15-Nov-2014
Python-Version: 3.5
Post-History: 15-Nov-2014, 19-Nov-2014, 5-Dec-2014
Abstract
This PEP propo
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precision (defaulting to 6), or add %N in a
> manner similar (or identical) to Ruby's semantics.
>
> Skip
>
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>>
>>
> --
> Matthieu BecGMTO Corp
> cell : +1 626 425 7923 251 S Lake Ave, Sui
t the difference, and
> just have dual source on a single module to
> hold the classes/functions that
> absolutely-had-to-have-this-or-that-feature (exec (the statement) vs exec
> (the function)
> comes to mind).
>
> --
> ~Ethan~
>
>
>
ll : +1 626 425 7923 251 S Lake Ave, Suite 300
> phone: +1 626 204 0527 Pasadena, CA 91101
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a
> 'regression', which it might be from their viewpoint. The last comment on
> the github thread suggests that an easy fix was found.
>
> --
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>
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There's a proof of concept patch in http://bugs.python.org/issue22906, but
it doesn't have the __future__ import and probably gets other details wrong.
Reference:
PEP 479 -- Change StopIteration handling inside generators
<https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0479/>
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provided by the stdlib http module.
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k there? Even with commit privileges you wouldn't be
committing partial work unreviewed.
On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 12:07 PM, Demian Brecht
wrote:
> On 2015-01-14 11:35 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > Why do you want to hack the existing http modules?
> >
> > This is not a rhetoric
, or maybe
>
> import bytearray_ops
> bytearray_ops.lower(b)
>
> ?
Please don't go there. The use cases are too rare.
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ray with 150K RAM.)
>
So you'll have to figure a better way to do it. We're not going to add
inplace_lower(), and that's the final word. (Of course you can add it to
microPython as an extension of the language.)
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___
else would we need to check it into Python?
>
> Best,
>
> Neil
>
> On Tue, Jan 20, 2015 at 12:03 PM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
>
>> OK. I don't like arg unpackings after keyword args, for the same reason
>> plain positional args aren't allowed after key
LLOW|0x8) = 3
> > 16525 open("build/temp.linux-armv7l-2.7/multiarch",
> > O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC|O_LARGEFILE, 0666) = 3
> > 16525 open("/data/data/jackpal.androidterm/kbox2/dev/null",
> > O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC|O_LARGEFILE, 0666) = 3
> > 1652
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upporting it, a bit by chance
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ce
> these days.
>
Right. We might look what Knuth has to say about data structures that are
stored on disk and loaded into memory piecemeal. :-)
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aded in the right direction? Of course I will need to edit
> parsermodule.c and ast.c.
>
> Best,
>
> Neil
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&g
ons that are flattenings, and again
that follows directly from analogy.
Interestingly, the non-dict versions can all be written today using a
double-nested comprehension, e.g. {**x for x in it} can be written as:
{x for x in xs for xs in it}
But it's not so straightforward for dict compreh
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I
> am probably wrong.
> Attaching the strace output to this email. I'm going to head back to
> the documentation and to back out of some Android-related changes in
> _localemodule.c
>
> On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 9:43 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > There c
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subclass -- there is no reason (in general)
why the signature of a subclass constructor should match the base class
constructor, and it often doesn't.
So this is pretty much a no-go. It's not unique to Python -- it's a basic
issue with OO.
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ure
> seems like the nicer way to go.
>
> So back to my original question: what other concerns are there, and has
> anybody done any benchmarks?
>
Con for #2 is a showstopper. Forget about it.
--
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_
I I ran the benchmark on different hardware (SSD, HDD, tmpfs), file
> systems (ext4, tmpfs, NFS/ext4), operating systems (Linux, Windows).
>
> Victor
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On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 8:58 PM, Ethan Furman wrote:
> On 02/12/2015 08:01 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 7:41 PM, Ethan Furman wrote:
> >>
> >> 2) always use the type of self when creating new instances
> >>
> >>co
On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 10:02 AM, Alexander Belopolsky <
alexander.belopol...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 12:35 PM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
>
>> IIUC you're proposing that the base class should *try* to construct an
>> instance of the s
self.__microseconds +
> other.__microseconds)
> 40207tim_one return NotImplemented
> 39876 gvanrossum
>
>
> [1] http://bugs.python.org/issue2267#msg125979
>
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I am still in favor of this PEP but have run out of time to review it and
the feedback. I'm going on vacation for a week or so, maybe I'll find time,
if not I'll start reviewing this around Feb 23.
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TBH I think this will be a tough sell. I worry that an meme will emerge to
make all string literals use raw mode, or worse, to deprecate non-raw
string literals. I'm not sure how we'll get out of the whole conundrum, and
I'm not in a hurry to see this in 3.5.
--
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On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 10:00 AM, Ethan Furman wrote:
> On 02/24/2015 09:44 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> >
> > TBH I think this will be a tough sell. I worry that an meme will emerge
> to make all
> > string literals use raw mode, or worse, to deprecate non-raw string
I like the \x07 solution.
On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 10:47 AM, Ethan Furman wrote:
> On 02/24/2015 10:14 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> > This is about messages from failing file-open operations if the filename
> contains an escaped character? I'd go slow
> > there too
t() should print
whatever is the most useful as the default for a given use case. There is
*no* rule that says a subclass cannot change the str().
> In any event, there are many larger problems to be solved (that is, if
> anyone else /does/ consider this a problem) and I very well ma
On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 10:50 AM, Paul Moore wrote:
> On 24 February 2015 at 18:24, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > Here's my review. I really like where this is going but I have a few
> > questions and suggestions (I can't help myself :-).
>
> Thanks.
>
> >
7;t it be pkg.mod.fn?
I'd specify that when the output argument is a file open for writing, it is
the caller's responsibility to close the file. Also, can the file be a
pipe? (I.e. are we using seek()/tell() or not?) And what about the input
file or folder named C:\test and being stumped by "cannot open
'C:\test'."
On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 1:25 PM, Glenn Linderman
wrote:
> On 2/24/2015 10:49 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> I like the \x07 solution.
>
>
> The more I think about it, the more I th
ython -m zipapp bar.pyz --info
> Interpreter:
>
> I can't see it being useful for scripting, and if it matters, there's
> always get_interpreter() then. It's mainly just as a diagnostic for
> people who are getting the wrong interpreter invoked.
>
> P
o "flatten" a sequence of sequences, but I
think very few people in the thread have supported this part. Therefore I
would like to ask Neil to update the PEP and the patch to take out the
comprehension part, so that the two "easy wins" can make it into Python 3.5
(basically, I am acceptin
As a follow-up, Joshua updated the PEP to remove *comprehensions, and it is
now accepted.
On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> I'm back, I've re-read the PEP, and I've re-read the long thread with "(no
> subject)".
>
One more thing. This PEP would never have been accepted without a working
implementation. Thanks Neil and Joshua for that! (And for being flexible.)
On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 12:19 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> As a follow-up, Joshua updated the PEP to remove *comprehensions, and it
>
Accepted!
Thanks for your patience, Paul, and thanks everyone for their feedback.
I know there are still a few small edits to the PEP, but those don't affect
my acceptance. Congrats!
--Guido
On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 9:05 AM, Paul Moore wrote:
> On 24 February 2015 at 18:24, Guido va
PEP 486 is hereby accepted. You can fix the typo at the same time as
marking it as accepted.
Paul, thanks and congrats, everyone else, thanks for the feedback!
--Guido
On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 12:45 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> Thanks for doing this, Paul!
>
> I think this is a fine
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> ___
entation defaulted to the
choice in the PEP.)
However, those are just minor edits, and I hereby approve the PEP. Thanks
Chris and everyone else for the fruitful discussion (and thanks especially
to Chris for eventually ending the bikeshedding and writing a PEP that
explains each of the choices)
ut I have no idea
> where the code would go.
>
> Suggestions??
>
> Thanks,
> -Chris
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> -Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 11:38 AM, Guido van Rossum > > wrote:
>>
>>>
On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 10:48 PM, Chris Barker wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2015 at 10:39 PM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
>
> (*) Adding it to the decimal module would require a discussion with
>> Raymond Hettinger, but Decimal users can probably copy and paste the
>> formula
17 main reception
>
> chris.bar...@noaa.gov
>
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Ping? Anyone? http://bugs.python.org/issue22906
On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 9:56 PM, Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 7, 2015 at 2:48 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > There's a proof of concept patch in http://bugs.python.org/issue22906,
> but
> > it doesn't ha
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tlib.html#importlib.util.cache_from_source
> )
>
> .. [4] Implementation of ``importlib.util.cache_from_source()`` from
> CPython 3.4.3rc1
>(
> https://hg.python.org/cpython/file/038297948389/Lib/importlib/_bootstrap.py#l437
> )
>
> .. [5] PEP 3147, PYC Repositor
Awesome, that's what I was hoping. Accepted! Congrats and thank you very
much for writing the PEP and guiding the discussion.
On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Brett Cannon wrote:
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 20, 2015 at 4:41 PM Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
>> I am willing to be the BD
‘gestalt’ don't you understand?]” —Karsten M. Self |
> _o__) |
> Ben Finney
>
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x27;, pattern)))
>> >
>> > In my experience, it was hard to write PEP 7 conforming code when the
>> > surrounding code is inconsistent.
>>
>> You can usually change surrounding code within reason if you want to
>> add conforming code of your own, but
ignments
> (e.g. "__author__"?). If so I'll update the PEP8 tool accordingly.
What official statement? I'm not the Pope. :-)
--Guido
> Thanks,
>
> ~ Ian Lee
> On Mar 20, 2015 8:55 PM, "Guido van Rossum" wrote:
>
>> FWIW, I think __version__, __a
n
return math.sqrt(x)
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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00
> > Rob Cliffe wrote:
> >>
> >> On 07/04/2015 02:08, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> >>> I've taken the liberty of adding the following old but good rule to
> >>> PEP 8 (I was surprised to find it wasn't already there since I've
> >
I am sitting net to Christie Wilson (bobcatfish) who is trying to register
a user account for our issue tracker. However it doesn't seem to work --
the promised email never arrives. Who can help with this?
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~
It's not in spam, and asking for a password reset email claims that the
email is not registered.
On Sat, Apr 11, 2015 at 5:39 PM, Benjamin Peterson
wrote:
> Did you check spam?
>
> On Sat, Apr 11, 2015, at 17:38, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > I am sitting net to Christie Wil
Sorry. It was in spam.
On Sat, Apr 11, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> It's not in spam, and asking for a password reset email claims that the
> email is not registered.
>
> On Sat, Apr 11, 2015 at 5:39 PM, Benjamin Peterson
> wrote:
>
>> Did you che
Also, why do you think we added the 'lone star' syntax? :-)
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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ks.
Other:
- Mention the __future__ proposal (a separate PEP to be developed).
- Lots of editing; remove some sections that didn't specify anything.
Full PEP text
--
PEP: 484
Title: Type Hints
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Author: Guido van Rossum , Jukka Lehtosalo <
(Also, there might be some interaction with PEP 492 here, which also tweaks
the definition of generators.)
On Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 9:38 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> That's a good question. We *could* make it so that you can subclass
> Generator and instantiate the instances; or we
What check are you talking about?
On Fri, Apr 17, 2015 at 10:35 PM, Stefan Behnel wrote:
> Guido van Rossum schrieb am 17.04.2015 um 23:58:
> > The ``typing`` module defines the ``Generator`` type for return values
> > of generator functions. It is a subtype of ``Iterable`` and i
Maybe the thing to fix then is the inspect module, not asyncio? Anyway, let
is know via tickets.
On Sat, Apr 18, 2015 at 12:29 PM, Stefan Behnel wrote:
> Stefan Behnel schrieb am 18.04.2015 um 19:39:
> > Guido van Rossum schrieb am 18.04.2015 um 18:38:
> >> That's a g
is a method call, you can also
write this as (x.foo)(args), and you can separate the attribute access even
further from the call and pass x.foo to some other function that is
eventually going to call it. Languages that don't do this have to use a
lambda at that point. Like every design choi
rote:
> On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 2:20 AM, Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> > (I suppose this new thread is a result of some research you did regarding
> > the thread complaining about callable()?)
>
> Yep. :)
>
> > On Sun, Apr 19, 2015 at 4:03 PM, Eric Snow
> &g
popular approach overnight.
So I think the rumors of Python's death are greatly exaggerated.
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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