Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 372 -- Adding an ordered directory t o collections ready for pronouncement

2009-03-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > [Nick Coghlan] > > The examples in the PEP used 'odict' (until recently), but the patch was > > for OrderedDict. > > As an experiment, try walking down the hall asking a few programmers who aren't in this conversion what they > think > collections.odict()

[Python-Dev] Interpreter crash in test_strftime?

2009-03-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello everybody, I'm trying the current py3k under a Windows virtual machine (with VS Express 2008), and the interpreter crashes in test_strftime in test_datetime.py. Has anyone been getting something like that? (not being a Windows user, it's a bit hard for me to investigate what's wrong) Regar

Re: [Python-Dev] Interpreter crash in test_strftime?

2009-03-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hi Amaury, Le mardi 03 mars 2009 à 00:39 +0100, Amaury Forgeot d'Arc a écrit : > > > > I'm trying the current py3k under a Windows virtual machine (with VS Express > > 2008), and the interpreter crashes in test_strftime in test_datetime.py. > > Has anyone been getting something like that? > > > >

Re: [Python-Dev] first 3.1 alpha this Saturday

2009-03-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Benjamin Peterson python.org> writes: > > I have been talking with Antoine about io in C implementation. We > would like to merge the branch before Saturday, so it can get some > real world testing. io-c, however, hasn't received much through > review. Would somebody have time to go through a dif

Re: [Python-Dev] Interpreter crash in test_strftime?

2009-03-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Amaury Forgeot d'Arc gmail.com> writes: > > This should be fixed with r70114. Indeed, thanks! Regards Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 372 -- Adding an ordered directory to collections ready for pronouncement

2009-03-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
bitdance.com> writes: > > I actually like StableDict best. When I hear that I think, "ah, the > key order is stable in the face of insertions, unlike a regular dict". > Nor can I at the moment think of an alternative explanation of what a > "StableDict" might be. > > That said, I have no proble

Re: [Python-Dev] asyncore fixes in Python 2.6 broke Zope's version of medusa

2009-03-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > Neil Schemenauer wrote: > > > What I would like to see is a module that provides a low-level API > > for doing cross-platform asynchronous IO. The two necessary parts > > are: > > > > * a wrapper that allows non-blocking reads and writes on > >

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickler/Unpickler API clarification

2009-03-06 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Michael Haggerty alum.mit.edu> writes: > > It is easy to optimize the pickling of instances by giving them > __getstate__() and __setstate__() methods. But the pickler still > records the type of each object (essentially, the name of its class) in > each record. The space for these strings cons

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickler/Unpickler API clarification

2009-03-06 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Le vendredi 06 mars 2009 à 13:44 +0100, Michael Haggerty a écrit : > Antoine Pitrou wrote: > > Michael Haggerty alum.mit.edu> writes: > >> It is easy to optimize the pickling of instances by giving them > >> __getstate__() and __setstate__() methods. But the pickl

Re: [Python-Dev] Forgotten Py3.0 change to remove Queue .empty() and Queue.full()

2009-03-06 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Jesse Noller gmail.com> writes: > > I would tend to agree with Martin, Agreed as well. Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options

[Python-Dev] Regexp 2.7

2009-03-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, Matthew Barnett has been doing a lot of work on the regular expressions engine (it seems he hasn't finished yet) under http://bugs.python.org/issue2636. However, the patches are really huge and touch all of the sre internals. I wonder what the review process can be for such patches? Is ther

[Python-Dev] 3.1 performance

2009-03-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, Out of curiosity, I timed running the test suite ("./python -m test.regrtest") in non-debug mode, in both the release30-maint and py3k branches: * release30-maint got: 302 tests OK. [...] 165.79user 26.03system 5:01.75elapsed 63%CPU * py3k got: 304 tests OK. [...] 113.33user 28.93system 4

Re: [Python-Dev] IMAP/POP3 servers on python.org?

2009-03-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Aahz pythoncraft.com> writes: > > One thing I haven't seen addressed in this discussion is why it's > undesirable to ship Twisted as part of the testing source tree. Because Twisted is huge and it's not reasonable to include it just for testing purposes? (besides, launching a twisted server impl

Re: [Python-Dev] 3.1 performance

2009-03-08 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hi, Victor Stinner haypocalc.com> writes: > > Summary (minimum total) on 32 bits CPU: > * Python 2.6.1: 8762 ms > * Python 3.0.1: 8977 ms > * Python 3.1a1: 9228 ms (slower than 3.0) Have you compiled with or without "--with-computed-gotos"? Regards Antoine. _

Re: [Python-Dev] 3.1 performance

2009-03-08 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Heimes cheimes.de> writes: > > Why is the feature still disabled by default? Marc-André expressed concerns that it might trigger compiler issues. > PS: Holy moly! Computed gotos totally put my Python on fire! The feature > increases the minimum run-time by approx. 25% and the average

Re: [Python-Dev] Ruby-style Blocks in Python [Pseudo-PEP]

2009-03-08 Thread Antoine Pitrou
tav espians.com> writes: > > Apologies for bringing up an old issue, but I think I've worked out a > Pythonic syntax for doing Ruby-style blocks. The short of it is: > [...] This thread should probably be redirected to python-ideas. Regards Antoine. __

Re: [Python-Dev] Regexp 2.7

2009-03-09 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Facundo Batista gmail.com> writes: > > > Matthew Barnett has been doing a lot of work on the regular expressions engine > > (it seems he hasn't finished yet) under http://bugs.python.org/issue2636. > > However, the patches are really huge and touch all of the sre internals. I > > wonder what the

Re: [Python-Dev] draft 3.1 release schedule

2009-03-10 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > >>> You might also want to collect a list of serious changes that you > >>> want in this release; > > I'm making minor updates to the decimal module to match the 1.68 version of the spec. What about decimal-in-C, by the way? Is anyone still working on it?

Re: [Python-Dev] Addition of further status options to tracker

2009-03-10 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Tennessee Leeuwenburg gmail.com> writes: > > Hi all,I am beginning reviewing some more issues in the tracker. I think it would be useful to have the following status options (new status options marked with a '+'): I have to point out that the more alternatives there are to choose from, the more

Re: [Python-Dev] Regexp 2.7

2009-03-10 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, > So, if there's interest in investigating how much of the PCRE tests > can augment the existing tests, I am offering to do so. IMO there's nothing wrong with having more tests, provided that: - they don't make the test suite slower than it should be - they aren't too implementation-spec

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-10 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Neil Hodgson gmail.com> writes: > > What would be useful is a simple, generic > way in Python to copy all the appropriate metadata (ownership, ACLs, > ...) to another file so the temporary-and-rename technique could be > used. How about shutil.copystat()? __

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-10 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Heimes cheimes.de> writes: > > I agree with you, fsync() shouldn't be called by default. I didn't plan > on adding fsync() calls all over our code. However I like to suggest a > file.sync() method and a synced flag for files to make the job of > application developers easier. We alread

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Neil Hodgson gmail.com> writes: > >shutil.copystat does not copy over the owner, group or ACLs. It depends on what you call "ACLs". It does copy the chmod permission bits. As for owner and group, I think there is a very good reason that it doesn't copy them: under Linux, only root can change

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Heimes cheimes.de> writes: > > It's more than an object oriented convenience. fsync() takes a file > descriptor as argument. Therefore I assume fsync() only syncs the data > to disk that was written to the file descriptor. Ok, I agree that a .sync() method makes sense. __

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Oleg Broytmann phd.pp.ru> writes: > >Only root can change file ownership - and yes, there are scripts that > run with root privileges, so why not copy? Because the new function would then be useless for non-root scripts, and encouraging people to run their scripts as root would be rather bad

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Oleg Broytmann phd.pp.ru> writes: > >That's easy to fix - only copy ownership if the effective user id == 0. But errors should not pass silently. If the user intended the function to copy ownership information and the function fails to do so, it should raise an exception. Having implicit sp

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Heimes cheimes.de> writes: > > In my initial proposal one and a half hour earlier I suggested 'sync()' > as the name of the method and 'synced' as the name of the flag that > forces a fsync() call during the close operation. I think your "synced" flag is too vague. Some applications ma

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
After Hrvoje's message, let me rephrase my suggestion. Let's instead allow: open(..., sync_on="close") open(..., sync_on="flush") with a default of None meaning no implicit syncs. Regards Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.o

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Heimes cheimes.de> writes: > > And sync_on="flush" implies sync_on="close"? close() implies flush(), so by construction yes. > Your suggestion sounds like > the right way to me! I'm glad I brought something constructive to the discussion :-)) ___

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Eric Smith trueblade.com> writes: > > Why wouldn't sync just be an optional argument to close(), at least for > the "sync_on_close" case? It wouldn't work with the "with" statement. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.pytho

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > I like this, because it doesn't expand the signature that > file-like objects need to support. If you're wrapping > another file object you just need to pass on the mode > string and it will all work. What do you mean? open() doesn't allow you to wrap oth

Re: [Python-Dev] Formatting mini-language suggestion

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > Financial users in particular find the locale approach to be frustrating and non-obvious. Putting in a > thousands separator is a > common task for output destined to be read by non-programmers. Please note that for it to be useful in all parts of the wor

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-11 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > The tempfile module would be another example. Do you really need your temporary files to survive system crashes? ;) > For that reason, I think Steven's idea of a filetools module which > provided context managers and the like that wrapped *existing* file-like

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-12 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > On the performance side... the overhead from fsync() itself is going to > dwarf the CPU overhead of going through a wrapper class. The significant overhead is not in calling sync() or flush() or close(), but in calling methods which are supposed to be fast (re

Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss

2009-03-12 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Steven D'Aprano pearwood.info> writes: > > It depends on what you mean by "temporary". > > Applications like OpenOffice can sometimes recover from an application > crash or even a systems crash and give you the opportunity to restore > the temporary files that were left lying around. For such

Re: [Python-Dev] wait time [was: Ext4 data loss]

2009-03-12 Thread Antoine Pitrou
R. David Murray bitdance.com> writes: > > By the way, I would not like to see python programmers encouraged to make > the same mistake that sqlite3 made. The decision about how aggressive > to be on flushing data to disk should be in the hands of the _user_, not > the application. I disagree. T

Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev] wait time [was: Ext4 data loss

2009-03-12 Thread Antoine Pitrou
R. David Murray bitdance.com> writes: > > Seriously, though, the point is that IMO an application should not be > calling fsync unless it provides a way for that behavior to be controlled > by the user. But whether an application does it or not is none of Python's business, is it? What is the di

Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev] wait time [was: Ext4 data loss

2009-03-13 Thread Antoine Pitrou
R. David Murray bitdance.com> writes: > > You will note that what > I suggested was that applications that _use the sync feature_ make > it user controllable. I'm sorry, but if it has nothing to do with Python itself, perhaps we could stop this subthread (or move it to another ML)? There are eno

Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev] wait time [was: Ext4 data loss

2009-03-13 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Aahz pythoncraft.com> writes: > > On Fri, Mar 13, 2009, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > > R. David Murray bitdance.com> writes: > >> > >> You will note that what > >> I suggested was that applications that _use the sync feature_ make > >> it user c

Re: [Python-Dev] In-place operators

2009-03-17 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > I'm sure that consistency/completeness/safe_vs_sorry > was the reason they were added. But, if they aren't useful, > they never should have been (IMO). It wastes the time of > people who try to use them and then find-out that they don't > act as expect

Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code

2009-03-18 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello Arc, Arc Riley gmail.com> writes: > > I've seen and heard that a lot of work is still needed on > http://svn.python.org /view/python/trunk both during the 3.1 release cycle, optimization possible all over the place. Well, first, it's too late for 3.1, which will (should) be out before Ju

Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code

2009-03-18 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Terry Reedy udel.edu> writes: > > Or the much requested 3to2 using the same tools. I didn't know there was such a request. I thought it was only a PyPy April fool. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listi

Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects: 3to2

2009-03-18 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Terry Reedy udel.edu> writes: > > Some of the people who need to support both late 2.x and 3.x would > prefer to write 3.x code and backport. The OP of a current python-list > thread asked whether there was any way to write something like > > @alias('__nonzero__') > def __bool__(s

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 380 (yield from a subgenerator) comments

2009-03-21 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > And that it formally expanded to: > > Do we really want to add a syntactic feature which has such a complicated expansion? I fear it will make code using "yield from" much more difficult to understand and audit.

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 380 (yield from a subgenerator) comments

2009-03-21 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > Whether or not different people will find code using "yield from" > difficult to understand or not will have more to do with their grasp of > the concepts of cooperative multitasking in general more so than the > underlying trickery involved in allowing truly n

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 380 (yield from a subgenerator) comments

2009-03-22 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > "When the iterator is another generator, the effect is the same as if > the body of the subgenerator were inlined at the point of the ``yield > from`` expression. Furthermore, the subgenerator is allowed to execute > a ``return`` statement with a value, an

Re: [Python-Dev] an unimportant question, ...

2009-03-22 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Christian Tismer stackless.com> writes: > > Or was it maybe to just keep the string layout on many > common platforms compatible, in order to save rebuilding > so many windows extension modules? > > If the latter is true and the only reason, I vote for reclaiming > the three bytes. Maybe it save

Re: [Python-Dev] Integrate BeautifulSoup into stdlib?

2009-03-23 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Chris Withers simplistix.co.uk> writes: > > Well, python already has tools available to do exactly this.: > buildout from a private egg repository will do exactly what you're after. > > However, its built on top of setuptools, which is flawed, and it's not > blessed as "official core python", s

Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC: Core Python development tools

2009-03-23 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Daniel (ajax) Diniz gmail.com> writes: > > Sometimes, non-obvious bits like the right sequence of svnmerge > commands, the right way to link a Rietveld code review to a given > issue or checking for correct autoconf version might get in the way of > real development. Well, really, rather than

Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC: Core Python development tools

2009-03-23 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hi, Daniel (ajax) Diniz gmail.com> writes: > > But the real point is that, regardless of underlying VCS, there is a > choice between "having all core developers know by heart the right > switches and order of steps to correctly checkout/update ->( branch > locally) -> fix -> diff -> commit -> m

Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC: Core Python development tools

2009-03-23 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Guilherme Polo gmail.com> writes: > > Any chance you were not using the latest svnmerge when you did that > merge ? I've had problems like this when using older versions. Well, actually, Benjamin did the merge, so perhaps he can give more info. Regards Antoine. __

Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC: Core Python development tools

2009-03-23 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Martin v. Löwis v.loewis.de> writes: > > P.S. I don't believe your claim that it forgot changesets. Could it be > that it simply forgot adding files, and that it did so because you > already had the files in the sandbox, so that the merging failed? It's more weird actually, it actively forgot so

Re: [Python-Dev] speeding up PyObject_GetItem

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hrvoje Niksic avl.com> writes: > > Agreed, and more importantly, I have yet to be convinced that those NULL > checks introduce a measurable slowdown. Daniel, have you tried > measuring the performance difference with only the NULL checks removed? I think it would be fine to add a special case

Re: [Python-Dev] speeding up PyObject_GetItem

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > -1 > > The API confusion and clutter isn't worth the micro-optimization. The API wouldn't change, there would only be a short path for long-indexing of lists, exactly as there is today in 2.x's BINARY_SUBSCR implementation. __

[Python-Dev] Test failures under Windows?

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, I've just tried running test_io under Windows (in a virtual machine) and I get the following failures: == ERROR: test_error_through_destructor (test.test_io.CTextIOWrapperTest) -

Re: [Python-Dev] speeding up PyObject_GetItem

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Mark Dickinson gmail.com> writes: > > > Making no other changes from the trunk, removing the PyLong_Check and NULL > > check from PyLong_AsSsize_t shaves off 4 nanoseconds (or around 4% since the > > trunk is around 100 nanoseconds). > > Thanks. I'd call that a noticeable difference. 4% on a m

Re: [Python-Dev] Test failures under Windows?

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
David Bolen gmail.com> writes: > > Antoine Pitrou pitrou.net> writes: > > > Am I the only one getting those? > > By the way, what happened to the Windows buildbots? > > Oops - sorry, mine (XP-4) apparently got stuck with C++ debug > assertion dialogs (an

Re: [Python-Dev] Test failures under Windows?

2009-03-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Mark Hammond gmail.com> writes: > > Note that I previously opened http://bugs.python.org/issue5116 with a > patch to enable this to be controlled from Python via the msvcrt module. > This would enable the test suite to disable assertions for its entire run. We certainly don't want to disable

Re: [Python-Dev] "setuptools has divided the Python community"

2009-03-25 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Paul Moore gmail.com> writes: > > 3. Setuptools, unfortunately, has divided the Python distribution > community quite badly. Wait a little bit, and it's gonna be even worse, now that buildout and pip seem to become popular. For example, the TurboGears people are considering switching from setupt

Re: [Python-Dev] "setuptools has divided the Python community"

2009-03-25 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Tarek Ziadé gmail.com> writes: > > But I agree that the sizes of the packages are too small now, and it has gone > to far. Installing a web app like Plone is scary (+100 packages) I am working on a TurboGears2-based app and I just did a count of the .egg packages in the virtualenv. There are 45

Re: [Python-Dev] "setuptools has divided the Python community"

2009-03-25 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Paul Moore gmail.com> writes: > > Another division (Not one I'll try to blame on setuptools, though ) > > Some people find larger, stable, unified packages more useful. Others > find fine-grained, rapidly developing packages more useful. > > It sounds like Antoine and I fall into the former ca

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 380 (yield from a subgenerator) comments

2009-03-26 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes: > > That's stating it a little too strongly. Phillip has shown how with > judicious use of decorators and helper classes you can get a > reasonable approximation, and I think Twisted uses something like > this, so it's not just theory. I think the best you can

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 380 (yield from a subgenerator) comments

2009-03-27 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > It's not really about doing away with trampolines anyway. > You still need at least one trampoline-like thing at the > top. What you do away with is the need for creating > special objects to yield, and the attendant syntactic > clumisiness and inefficienc

[Python-Dev] "yield" in list comprehensions

2009-03-27 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, Just for the record, I thought I'd point out this slightly exotic and funny incompatibility between 2.x and py3k. This is due to the fact that list comprehensions now live in their own frame, so a "yield" expression inside a list comprehension turns the comprehension itself into a generator

Re: [Python-Dev] splitting out bdist_* (was: intermin able 'setuptools' thread)

2009-03-27 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Mark Hammond gmail.com> writes: > > As mentioned, it isn't really a natural fit - but regardless, py2exe is > struggling to maintain itself at the moment... It is the first auto-maintained package I have ever heard of :-) Regards Antoine. ___ Pyth

Re: [Python-Dev] "setuptools has divided the Python community"

2009-03-28 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Lennart Regebro gmail.com> writes: > > The people who use pythonlibraries are programmers. It can be expected > that they are comfortable with the command line. You probably haven't met lots of Windows (so-called) programmers... Regards Antoine. __

[Python-Dev] pyc files, constant folding and borderline portability issues

2009-03-29 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, There are a couple of ancillary portability concerns due to optimizations which store system-dependent results of operations between constants in pyc files: - Issue #5057: code like '\U00012345'[0] is optimized away and its result stored as a constant in the pyc file, but the result should

Re: [Python-Dev] Evaluated cmake as an autoconf replacement

2009-03-29 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Jeffrey Yasskin gmail.com> writes: > > The other popular configure+make replacement is scons. I can only give uninformed information (!) here, but in one company I worked with, the main project decided to switch from scons to cmake due to some huge performance problems in scons. This was in 2005

Re: [Python-Dev] Evaluated cmake as an autoconf replacement

2009-03-29 Thread Antoine Pitrou
David Cournapeau gmail.com> writes: > > I would think the bootstrap problem to be much more significant. I > don't find the argument "many desktop have already python" very > convincing - what if you can't install it, for example ? I agree. I had to build Python once on a corporate AIX box witho

[Python-Dev] CSV, bytes and encodings

2009-04-01 Thread Antoine Pitrou
R. David Murray bitdance.com> writes: > > Having read through the ticket, it seems that a CSV file must be (and > 2.6 was) treated as a binary file, and part of the CSV module's job > is to convert that binary data to and from strings. IMO this interpretation is flawed. In 2.6 there is no tangib

Re: [Python-Dev] CSV, bytes and encodings

2009-04-01 Thread Antoine Pitrou
pobox.com> writes: > > Antoine> The documentation is, IMO, wrong even in 2.x. Just yesterday I > Antoine> had to open a CSV file in 'rU' mode because it had Windows line > Antoine> endings and I'm under Linux > > See above. You almost certainly didn't have fields containing CRLF

Re: [Python-Dev] CSV, bytes and encodings

2009-04-01 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Le mercredi 01 avril 2009 à 18:22 -0400, R. David Murray a écrit : > I just added some tests to trunk that seem to indicate this case is > handled correctly in terms of preserving the data. Maybe you didn't > write the file such that the fields with the newlines were quoted? I used the default cs

Re: [Python-Dev] Let's update CObject API so it is safe and regular!

2009-04-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes: > > On Thu, Apr 2, 2009 at 6:22 AM, Jim Fulton zope.com> wrote: > > The original use case for CObjects was to export an API from a module, in > > which case, you'd be importing the API from the module. > > I consider this the *only* use case. What other use

Re: [Python-Dev] PyDict_SetItem hook

2009-04-02 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Raymond Hettinger rcn.com> writes: > > It seems weird to me that Collin's group can be working > so hard just to get a percent or two improvement in > specific cases for pickling while python-dev is readily > entertaining a patch that slows down the entire language. I think it's really more

Re: [Python-Dev] Should the io-c modules be put in their own directory?

2009-04-03 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Alexandre Vassalotti peadrop.com> writes: > > I just noticed that the new io-c modules were merged in the py3k > branch (I know, I am kind late on the news—blame school work). Anyway, > I am just wondering if it would be a good idea to put the io-c modules > in a sub-directory (like sqlite), inst

Re: [Python-Dev] PyDict_SetItem hook

2009-04-03 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Thomas Wouters python.org> writes: > > > Pystone is pretty much a useless benchmark. If it measures anything, it's the speed of the bytecode dispatcher (and it doesn't measure it particularly well.) PyBench isn't any better, in my experience. I don't think pybench is useless. It gives a lot of

Re: [Python-Dev] Getting values stored inside sets

2009-04-03 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Steven D'Aprano pearwood.info> writes: > > That's hardly unusual in Python. > > >>> alist = [0, 1, 2, 3, 4] > >>> 3.0 in alist > True > >>> alist[3.0] > Traceback (most recent call last): > File "", line 1, in > TypeError: list indices must be integers Your example is wrong: >>> alist = [0,

Re: [Python-Dev] PyDict_SetItem hook

2009-04-03 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Thomas Wouters python.org> writes: > > Really? Have you tried it? I get at least 5% noise between runs without any changes. I have gotten results that include *negative* run times. That's an implementation problem, not an issue with the tests themselves. Perhaps a better timing mechanism could b

Re: [Python-Dev] PyDict_SetItem hook

2009-04-03 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Collin Winter gmail.com> writes: > > - I wish PyBench actually did more isolation. > Call.py:ComplexPythonFunctionCalls is on my mind right now; I wish it > didn't put keyword arguments and **kwargs in the same microbenchmark. Well, there is a balance to be found between having more subtests and

Re: [Python-Dev] core python tests

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > C. Titus Brown wrote: > > I vote for a separate mailing list -- 'python-tests'? -- but I don't > > know exactly how splintered to make the conversation. It probably > > belongs at python.org but if you want me to host it, I can. > > If too many things get mov

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
C. Titus Brown msu.edu> writes: > > we're having a discussion over on the GSoC mailing list about basic > math types > [...] > -> > -> Otherwise we'll be doomed to have each project implement vec2, vec3, > -> vec4, matrix3/4, quaternion (which has already happened many times) - > -> and continue

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > Something I've suggested before is to provide a set of > functions for doing elementwise arithmetic operations on > objects that support the new buffer protocol. > > Together with a multidimensional version of the standard > array.array type, this would p

Re: [Python-Dev] Possible py3k io wierdness

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hi! sweetapp.com> writes: > > class _RawIOBase(_FileIO): FileIO is a subclass of _RawIOBase, not the reverse: >>> issubclass(_io._RawIOBase, _io.FileIO) False >>> issubclass(_io.FileIO, _io._RawIOBase) True I do understand your surprise, but the Python implementation of IOBase.close() in _pyi

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > > Again, I don't want to spoil the party, but multidimensional buffers are > > not implemented, and neither are buffers of anything other than single-byte > > data. > > When you say "buffer" here, are you talking about the > buffer interface itself, or th

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > So you're saying the buffer interface *has* been fully > implemented, it just hasn't been tested very well? No, it hasn't been implemented for multi-dimensional types, and it hasn't been really tested for anything other than plain linear collections of by

[Python-Dev] BufferedReader.peek() ignores its argument

2009-04-04 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, Currently, BufferedReader.peek() ignores its argument and can return more or less than the number of bytes requested by the user. This is how it was implemented in the Python version, and we've reflected this in the C version. It seems a bit strange and unhelpful though. Should we change t

Re: [Python-Dev] BufferedReader.peek() ignores its argument

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Alexandre Vassalotti peadrop.com> writes: > > I am not sure if this is a good idea. Currently, the argument of > peek() is documented as a lower bound that cannot exceed the size of > the buffer: Unfortunately, in practice, the argument is neither a lower bound nor an upper bound. It's just used

Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Alexandre Vassalotti peadrop.com> writes: > > Off the top of my head, the following is needed for a successful migration: There's also the issue of how we adapt the current workflow of "svnmerging" between branches when we want to back- or forward-port stuff. In particular, tracking of already d

Re: [Python-Dev] Possible py3k io wierdness

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Brian Quinlan sweetapp.com> writes: > > I don't see why this is helpful. Could you explain why > _RawIOBase.close() calling self.flush() is useful? I could not explain it for sure since I didn't write the Python version. I suppose it's so that people who only override flush() automatically get

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes: > > Parts 2 and 3, being the memoryview API and support for the new protocol > in the builtin types are the parts that are currently restricted to > simple linear memory views. > > That's largely because parts 2 and 3 are somewhat use case challenged: > the key mo

Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Dirkjan Ochtman ochtman.nl> writes: > > Right. The canonical way to do that with Mercurial is to commit patches > against the "oldest" branch where they should be applied, so that every > stable branch is a strict subset of every less stable branch. It doesn't work between py3k and trunk, whic

Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Hello, > hgsubversion in many cases will preserve the rev order from svn so > that the local revision numbers that hg shows will be the same as in SVN > anyway. Er... I guess it's only the case in simplistic cases where you convert all branches in the SVN repo to a single hg repo (which is not

Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Dirkjan Ochtman ochtman.nl> writes: > > I also think 100MB+ is a cheap price to pay, > given you only pay it in disk space (cheap) and initial clone time (not > very often, and usually still quite fast). It is a cheap price to pay if there is a significant return for it. In my experience using

Re: [Python-Dev] Possible py3k io wierdness

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
James Y Knight fuhm.net> writes: > > It seems that a separate method "_internal_close" should've been > defined to do the actual closing of the file, and the close() method > should've been defined on the base class as "self.flush(); > self._internal_close()" and never overridden. I'm comp

Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Georg Brandl gmx.net> writes: > > When commits with bad whitespace changes are rejected on push, this is a > pretty good incentive to run the pre-commit hook next time, so that you > don't have to re-do all the commits in that batch :) Do you really have to re-do all the commits, or can you just

Re: [Python-Dev] graphics maths types in python core?

2009-04-05 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Greg Ewing canterbury.ac.nz> writes: > > Why is it that whenever the word "buffer" is mentioned, > some people seem to think it has something to do with > memoryview? There is no such thing as "a buffer". There is a Py_buffer struct. ___ Python-Dev m

Re: [Python-Dev] pyc files, constant folding and borderline portability issues

2009-04-06 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Cesare Di Mauro a-tono.com> writes: > def f(): return ['a', ('b', 'c')] * (1 + 2 * 3) [...] > > With proper constant folding code, both functions can be reduced > to a single LOAD_CONST and a RETURN_VALUE (or, definitely, by > a single instruction at all with an advanced peephole optimizer). Lis

Re: [Python-Dev] Getting information out of the buildbots

2009-04-06 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Jack diederich gmail.com> writes: > > I committed some new telnetlib tests yesterday to the trunk and I can > see they are failing on Neal's setup but not what the failures are. > Ideally I like to get the information out of the buildbots but they > all seem to be hanging on stdio tests and quiti

Re: [Python-Dev] Evaluated cmake as an autoconf replacement

2009-04-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
pobox.com> writes: > > I don't know thing one about cmake, but if it's good for the goose (building > Python proper) would it be good for the gander (building extensions)? African or European? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http:/

Re: [Python-Dev] What's missing from easy_install

2009-04-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Neal Becker gmail.com> writes: > > 2. Various utilities to provide query package management. >- easy_install --list (list files installed) "yolk" will tell you that. http://pypi.python.org/pypi/yolk Regards Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list

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