nder which
I can successfully invoke it?
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Martin
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Alexey Borzenkov schrieb:
> On 5/1/07, "Martin v. Löwis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > After doing some research I found that it seems to be impossible to
>> > use CreateFile for a file that doesn't have SHARE_READ.
>> So what about GetFileAttrib
real file, or
else they had not reported that as a real bug, really.
Are you proposing to unfix the bug?
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Martin
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> Would tests that use ctypes do do the open directly be acceptable ways
> of solving this?
If it solves it - sure.
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Martin
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, and relies on the GIL for
thread-safety.
In release mode, PyMEM_FREE goes directly to free, which is thread-safe.
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n on what the valid
ranges are for argcount, kwcount, locals, and what the rationale
for these limitations are, and then they should get a consistent
datatype.
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probably create
> some Py_int and so on.
> Ok, b) is not a real suggestion, then.
Also, in Py3k, the int type will go away, along with this entire problem.
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.
Please, no. This will complicate things very much for everybody,
for the sake of a few elitist users who think they have a use
case.
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Martin
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play is a constructed thing
which may contain runtime-computed components, unlike a
literal).
So if bytes are mutable and also have source-level
representation, they should be displays, not literals.
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Martin
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x = foo()
x[0] = 5 # supported
2. def foo():
return b"\x01\x02\x03"
print foo() is foo() # False
x = foo()
x[0] = 5 # supported
3. def foo():
return b"\x01\x02\x03"
print foo() is foo() # True
x = foo()
x[0] = 5 # TypeError
HTH,
Martin
s.
Now, I think it is quite possible that you have inaccessible
directories on sys.path, e.g. when you inherit PYTHONPATH from
a parent process.
So I would rather let importing proceed, and add a note to the
error message that some files could not be read.
Regards,
Martin
__
> How about an ImportWarning instead? That way people can have either
> have import halt immediately, or continue (with or without a message).
If I put my dislike of warnings aside: yes, that would also work.
Martin
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st it, or somebody else
may have found it.
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If I worry about creating a list in 2.x, I would write
try:
xrange
except NameError:
xrange=range
at the top of the file.
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Martin
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quot;, then no: 2.4 is not anymore officially supported. Only 2.5
is officially supported. There may, of course, be security patches
released for 2.4 if there is a need.
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nation with a non-raw string:
r"foo\uhallo" "\u20ac" r"welt"
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gt; characters should be written using \x or \u escapes.
Following that convention: How do you get a non-ASCII byte into
a raw byte string in Python 2.x?
You can't - so why should you be able to get a non-ASCII character
into a raw Unicode string?
Regards,
Martin
_
> We supposedly have a standard for additions to the standard lib. I cannot
> think of any other module being admitted with what amounts to an unlimited
> blank check for further additions.
xml.dom.minidom, xml.sax, posix, htmlentitydefs, Tkinter.
Regard
Greg Ewing schrieb:
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
>> why should you be able to get a non-ASCII character
>> into a raw Unicode string?
>
> The analogous question would be why can't you get a
> non-Unicode character into a raw Unicode string.
No, that would not be analogo
u005Cuser32.dll") will just cause puzzled
faces.
Windows path names are one of the two primary applications of raw
strings (the other being regexes).
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Martin
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nge when removing the
> 'u' prefix in Py3k.
How do you know? Py3k hasn't been released, yet.
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Martin
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n't. You may be able to do so
when using the API directly, however, it fails if you
pass the file name in a command line of some tool that
takes /foo to mean a command line option "foo".
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Martin
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27;'
The more I think about it: no, there is no official support for the
current stable release. We will like produce more bug fix releases,
but then, we may not if the volunteers doing so lose time or
interest, and 2.6 comes out earlier than planned.
Why do you need such a statement
dation maintains the current stable major
> release of Python.
Ah, maintains is indeed better than supports. That's what we do:
we maintain Python.
Regards,
Martin
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red that
to python-dev and its readership.
I had meant to propose a PEP on maintenance of Python releases
for quite some time now; perhaps this is the time to actually
write this PEP.
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Martin
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everything, so
it is essential that there are very very few new patches in each
security release.
Please let me know what you think.
Regards,
Martin
PEP: XX
Title: Maintenance of Python Releases
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Author: Martin v. Löwis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Discussio
mp.lang.python,
python-tutors, and python-help, and none of them have the notion of
"unsupported Python releases". Thing become unsupported by no
volunteer being willing to offer help.
It's also important to understand that the bug tracker is *
utton "Spammer"
should allow committers to lock an account and hide all messages
and files that he sent, but that still requires somebody to implement
it.
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Martin
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slash
followed by u in your regular expression, you should write
\\u.
It would be possible to future-warn about \u in 2.6, catching
these cases. Authors then would either have to remove the
backslash, or duplicate it, depending on what they want to
express.
Regards,
Martin
__
activity: creating a new web page on
pydotorg, running the test suite, etc. all is still necessary.
In any case, the patch gets certified by being committed (with
the indication that it is a security fix), so if they want
certified patches, they can just import the maintenance branch.
Regards
d is just unacceptable.
Regards,
Martin
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he branch, not by fetching a tarball."
In effect, this is what the PEP says. That's intentional (i.e. it
is my intention - others may have different intentions). It's
the repository that holds the security patches; the tarballs
(and the version number bumps) are just a convenience.
you can start
setting a policy that these volunteers can agree to. When the volunteers
then run away, or become inactive, the policy needs revisiting.
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Martin
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get. If PSRT members (who are they, anyway) also
happen to be committers, they can commit these changes at the
time the PSRT deems appropriate. If they are not committers, they
need to post the patch to SF as anybody else.
(you can tell that I come from a country where people are quite
skeptical ab
ain than that: yes, I do not take security
seriously enough to release security fixes for old Python versions more
than once a year. As a user, it's easy to demand things, and people
really have to learn that in open source, all things are done by
volunteers, and that demanding g
ets implemented, I believe there would be more security patches
than those we had seen - this single one was only in response to some
demanding users.
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Martin
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> You can always can make a checkout of the security-manteined-only
> branch, if you're in a particular hurry (maybe the PEP should say
> something about this).
Indeed. I can add explicit wording to say that.
Regards,
Martin
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Aahz schrieb:
> On Mon, May 14, 2007, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote:
>> Skip(?):
>>> In the meantime (thinking out loud here), would it be possible to keep
>>> search engines from seeing a submission or an edit until a trusted person
>>> has had a chance
onsidered CAPTCHA, but some people were immediately opposed
to using it, both for the reason that spammers still get past it in
an automated manner, and that it might lock out certain groups of
legitimate users. So I have personally given up on that
tly backwards-compatible, assuming that S/T/U get used
only when needed. However, it would complicate the
implementation.
I'm still leaning towards "don't change", since I don't expect
that such string objects occur in so
ow what an orb is
(it's not an object request broker, right?)
Is the answer "sun"?
Regards,
Martin
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n/branches/[EMAIL PROTECTED]
but that URL is, unfortunately, not browsable.
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Martin
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g to help us not throw up
> our hands in surrender.
Would that help go so far as to provide patches to the roundup
installation?
Regards,
Martin
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Uns
d,
and for code objects, it would index the various elements of
the code object.
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Martin
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ets are created, copied, and
> discarded. It would run as if written: s=s1.copy(); s.update(s2);
> s.update(s3); s.update(s4).
I'd rather see this as collections.bigunion.
> * Make sets listenable for changes (proposed by Jason Wells):
-1, IAGNI.
Martin
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wondering what bastards let the spam in in the first place.
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Martin
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true set;
it couldn't be an iterator, as you need to test whether
an element of self is in the other operand.
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Martin
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Brett Cannon schrieb:
> For removing extension modules from the build process on Windows, do you
> just delete the File entry from PCbuild/pythoncore.vcproj?
No, you also need to remove the entry from PC/config.c.
Regards,
Martin
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er, I know that the patch will be rejected,
>> so I don't even start working on it.
> This would be a very useful feature for distutils2.
But I'm not interested at all in having it in distutils2. I want the
Python build itself
ion. If you implement it in distutils2, you have very good chances
> to get it for 3.3. Isn’t that a win?
It is, unfortunately, a very weak promise. Until distutils2 is
integrated in Python, I probably won't spend any time on it.
Regards,
Martin
__
ree memory,
> would it not make more sense to tell OS that [] is not needed
> anymore, and not move some of the consequtive [L_LL][LFFF] at all, or
> at least not move those objects as far down the memory region?
See above. Python does no moving of objects whatsoever.
Regards,
Martin
_
together
> (generations are separate regions) or preload the object with high
> survival count (if q1 is single region).
We would consider such a proposal only if you had *actual evidence*
that it improves things, rather than just having a reasonin
aim that they are identical if they are equal
(assuming they support equality - which is tricky for things like NaN).
Of course, the C API has lots of assumptions that identity and address
are really the same thing.
Regards,
Martin
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Am 04.12.2010 00:35, schrieb Terry Reedy:
> On 12/3/2010 5:52 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>> Am 03.12.2010 23:48, schrieb Éric Araujo:
>>>> But I'm not interested at all in having it in distutils2. I want the
>>>> Python build itself to use it,
Am 04.12.2010 01:00, schrieb Terry Reedy:
> On 12/3/2010 6:46 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>
>>> and stable as D1. I do not know what Martin means by 'integrate' (other
>>> than that he be able to use it to build Python)
>>
>> That th
> Am I still missing something?
Apparently. The hole C API would break if objects would move in memory.
Since they have to stay at fixed addresses, it's easy enough to use the
address as ID. There is no problem to be solved here.
Regards
depends on the programming language. So for C++, it's an
API change; for C, it's not.
Still, I can point that out.
Regards,
Martin
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> I'm afraid I don't follow you. Unless you're suggesting some sort of
> esoteric object system whereby objects *don't* have identity (e.g. where
> objects are emergent properties of some sort of distributed,
> non-localised "information"), any object naturally has an identity --
> itself.
Not in
tually Python 3.
This shouldn't be necessary, as typeslots.inc is also checked into
subversion, and should have a newer time stamp than typeslots.inc
(perhaps not currently, but that is the plan, anyway).
In any case, I now made the script 2-vs-3
l, sure, in a hash table you need a hash value. But I was talking
> about an id() function.
>
> So is that it? Is IdentityHashValue (or *Code, as the case may be) just
> a longer name for hash()?
Of course not.
Regards,
Martin
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at's only the case if the hash() result is guaranteed not
to change. In some applications, it may be desirable to have that
as an absolute guarantee (rather than just being a convention).
No, you can't substitute identity hash with hash: the value hash o
erhaps
yes: I disagree with the principle that bold rewrites should be
developed independently. Such work would be much better carried out in a
branch - it will never stand on its own.
Regards,
Martin
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files after an update, perhaps Mercurial is better with that. For a
release, the time stamps in the tar file will do fine.
Regards,
Martin
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> I actually wonder if Python's re module can claim to provide even
> Basic Unicode Support.
Do you really wonder? Most definitely it does not.
Regards,
Martin
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2000, for which
we already decided to not support it anymore.
Opinions?
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Martin
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rocAddress to call them. These can be replaced with
regular calls. _WINNT (or whatever the macro is called) then needs to
be bumped accordingly.
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Am 06.12.2010 05:36, schrieb Nick Coghlan:
> On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 7:48 AM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>> I'd like to tighten PEP 11, and declare a policy that systems
>> older than ten years at the point of a feature release are not
>> supported anymore by def
Am 06.12.2010 09:36, schrieb Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven:
> -On [20101206 08:30], "Martin v. Löwis" (mar...@v.loewis.de) wrote:
>> As a counter-example, I think the only way to phase out support
>> for old OpenBSD releases is that we set a date.
>
> If you want, I
without any official EOL or life cycles.
Here my proposal stands: 10 years, by default.
Regards,
Martin
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resolution, but that might give you files dated
in the future (which make complains about - but you'ld get over with
that after 20s). ms might offer some middle ground (but I think all
filesystems supporting ms resolution will also support µs).
Regards,
Martin
Am 06.12.2010 14:40, schrieb Floris Bruynooghe:
> On 6 December 2010 09:18, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>>> Also, it is not clear what to do about distributions/OSs
>>> without any official EOL or life cycles.
>>
>> Here my proposal stands: 10 years,
s taken out again: codecs.lookup would still find them.
Regards,
Martin
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Am 06.12.2010 20:25, schrieb Terry Reedy:
> On 12/6/2010 4:08 AM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>
>> For Windows and Solaris, it seems that some users continue to use the
>> system after the vendor stops producing patches, and dislike the
>> prospect of not hav
on warnings (and, occasionally, "exciting"
> code-generation bugs...)
Dropping support for old gcc versions (or other old compiler versions)
is probably an issue on its own. It will be difficult to figure out
what work-arounds are in place for what particular compiler glitch.
Regards
Am 07.12.2010 04:03, schrieb Alexander Belopolsky:
> On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 5:58 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>>> I actually wonder if Python's re module can claim to provide even
>>> Basic Unicode Support.
>>
>> Do you really wonder? Most definite
ure about this? It's not intentional (except in the limited ABI).
Regards,
Martin
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bug and security fixes
I don't plan upgrading the Windows build before 3.2; I have already
patched the OpenSSL copy that we use.
Regards,
Martin
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U
Am 09.12.2010 06:57, schrieb Alexander Belopolsky:
> On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 12:47 AM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
> ..
>>> However, in Python 3.2b1 the library python32.lib contains only
>>> _PyUnicode_IsWhitespace, therefore breaking the build.
>>>
>
> Comments?
How do you implement that? In particular, how do you retrieve
information for different locales in a single program?
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Martin
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ould approve it - that would
be convincing).
I also share Alexander's concern that Python just shouldn't mess with
signal handlers at all, ideally. So some trade-off has to be found to
address that concern (e.g. by making the signal handlers only active
for the exe
Am 18.12.2010 19:26, schrieb MRAB:
> On 18/12/2010 09:26, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote:
>>> Comments?
>>
>> How do you implement that? In particular, how do you retrieve
>> information for different locales in a single program?
>>
> The locale m
Regards,
Martin
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Some signal handlers are more likely to interfere with the
the rest of the application than others.
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Martin
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async-signal-safe
function, this part is fine.
Looking at your function list, my other concern is that you are calling
Python API without holding the GIL, IIUC. In particular, you are
accessing _PyThreadState_Current, which may not point to the current
thread if the current
egards,
Martin
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thread.
> I don't think that it will possible the acquire the GIL in
> Py_FatalError() or in the fault handler.
I agree.
Regards,
Martin
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Un
ere also counter-
examples where you'ld need the Python stack (or, rather, the entire
interpreter trace) to understand how the crashing case can occur in
the first place.
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and: the last active thread may not be the one that got
the signal. Instead, it may be another thread that keeps running while
your thread crashes.
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Martin
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> Given the changing dynamics of the desktop launch menus to better
> support direct access as an alternative to hierarchical navigation,
> would it be reasonable to consider including the major version number
> in the start menu shortcut names?
>
> (Question is mainly for Mart
> So, do you agree with the fault handler? Does someone want to give a
> last review because I commit it?
It's a new feature, so regardless of whether it's correct or not
(which I haven't reviewed yet), I don't think it should go in before
3.2 is
for testing. This specific feature has seen very little
testing. Giving it a full release cycle (i.e. until 3.3) would
somewhat reduce the need for a more careful code review.
Regards,
Martin
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s has nothing to do with Unix signals.
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gt; This is misleading as to what the method actually does,
> Really? Unless I misunderstood the docs, __index__ is used when the
> object is used as an index (or with bin or oct, but I didn’t want to
> complicate the docstring, just fix it).
In case Antoine's objection isn't
return "(%s if %s else %s)" % (x.group(2), x.group(1),
> + expr.sub(repl, x.group(3)))
Please update the comment as well.
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> What are the actual used of .__index__?
Can you please rephrase this question?
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Martin
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;UTF-8 encoded string", because "UTF-8-encoded" has too many
> "-". I should maybe be uniformized.
David's other concern was whether it should be "encod*ed*" or
"encod*ing*". It seems he would prefer "encoded". Not sure w
Process, as well
as Get/SetThreadPriority along with it.
I think Python should incorporate something like pywin32, to expose
all APIs whole-sale, in a type-safe manner (unlike ctypes).
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Martin
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htt
Am 28.12.2010 18:08, schrieb Lukas Lueg:
> Also, the
> load_fast in lne 22 to reference x could be taken out of the loop as x
> will always point to the same object
That's not true; a debugger may change the value of x.
Regards,
Martin
nize on FreeBSD. As a consequence,
multiprocessing locks would stop working on FreeBSD, and concurrent
futures; the tests would recognize this lack of features and get
skipped.
Regards,
Martin
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a whitelist of systems on which
POSIX IPC is used (==['linux']), and use sysv ipc everywhere else.
Regards,
Martin
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