On Wed, Feb 20, 2008, Andrew MacIntyre wrote:
>
> I've now written up my testing and attached the write-up to issue 2039
> (http://bugs.python.org/issue2039).
Nice work! Too often we (generic we) don't try to re-simplify code.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
ps up on c.l.py, but almost
always in the context of range(bignum). Because there's an easy
workaround and Python 3.0 changes the semantics of range(), there hasn't
been much clamor to fix it.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
&q
me which adds an even wider margin to the left.
> In those situations I either grin and bear it or stretch my window enough to
> view it without wrapping.
Yes, but svn/cvs diff is a particularly common use case. I agree with
Amaury.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*>
PyPI. Or find someone else to do
the work, but in any event, python-dev is not an appropriate place to
discuss it. Try comp.lang.python, perhaps, or a Python/XML mailing list.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"All problems in compu
wiki page on python.org that
provides this information, particularly across versions. You may be
able to find volunteers to help on comp.lang.python.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"All problems in computer science can be solved by another le
On Mon, Mar 10, 2008, Daniel Stutzbach wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 9, 2008 at 9:22 AM, Aahz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> There probably would be some value in a wiki page on python.org that
>> provides this information, particularly across versions. You may be
>>
"Premature optimization is the root of all evil in programming."
--C.A.R. Hoare (often misattributed to Knuth, who was himself quoting Hoare)
"We should forget about small efficiencies, say about 97% of the time:
premature optimization is the root of all evil." --Knut
message? I can relay it for you if you want, dunno
about other options for mailservers. I think further discussion should
go on psf-members.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"All problems in computer science can be solved by another level
esn't matter: it's too late. Although we
have not released a beta, we are far along the alpha cycle and this is
too big a change. Remember that Python 3.0 is scheduled to have final
release in August.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
&qu
the capi-sig list. python-dev is
for people working on improving the Python core.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code."
--Bill Harlan
__
nd it is, in some ways -- but I think
reminding people of the pedagogical issues involved in the transition is
important. Granted, this is python-dev, so we should be using 2.x
syntax, but we're currently talking about 3.0 and that requires
clarifying what is meant/intended.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PR
On Fri, Apr 25, 2008, Neal Becker wrote:
>
> Sorry, my mistake. Acutally, I was trying to debug this:
python-dev is probably not the right place for this -- please use c.l.py
or the list capi-sig.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
~/Erlang and a $PATH as long as
>>my arm just so I can run a few applications without system-
>>installing them.
>
> I hate to send a "me too" messages, but I have to say Glyph is exactly
> right here.
+1
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http
t; Subscribers to the python-dev digests may also not see a posting
> immediately, waiting until the next digest is sent.
Heck, I'm not on the digest and I still have been seeing posts after a
week (though that's the fault of a balky mailserver that should be
fixed).
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Aahz (
ber what
happened.
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I just processed two weeks of backlog on python-dev (I'm only a backup
moderator). Would anyone object to changing the list policy so that
non-member posts get discarded instead of held?
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Need a book? Use y
On Thu, May 29, 2008, Benjamin Peterson wrote:
> On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 8:14 PM, Aahz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> I just processed two weeks of backlog on python-dev (I'm only a backup
>> moderator). Would anyone object to changing the list policy so that
&
On Thu, May 29, 2008, tjreedy wrote:
>> On May 29, 2008, at 9:14 PM, Aahz wrote:
>>>
>>> I just processed two weeks of backlog on python-dev (I'm only a backup
>>> moderator). Would anyone object to changing the list policy so that
>>> non-member po
ot covered by the
ABC.
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goal for GC that has not been previously articulated. I believe this
requires consensus rather than a simple declaration of principle.
Guido's opinion if he has one obviously overrules. ;-) Guido?
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.
nd a notice to python-dev. And expect that you'll
probably miss at least some replies.
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"as long as we like the same operating system, things are cool." --piranha
way.
If you care about this issue, please file a report at bugs.python.org
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I support the RKAB
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On Wed, Jul 23, 2008, Sebastien Loisel wrote:
>
> [...] I was thinking that it would be simpler to have a way
> for defining new infix operators, [...]
python-dev is the wrong place for this discussion. Please use either
comp.lang.python or python-ideas.
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hon-ideas or comp.lang.python
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ss that's also been axed).
IIRC, the humor page was axed due to lack of updates -- I recommend
finding the material using Wayback and just adding it to the wiki.
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Adopt A Process -- stop killing all your
tion assistance as well plus
> benefits. Please email resumes to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
python-dev is the wrong place to advertise for jobs. Please see
http://www.python.org/community/jobs/
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Adopt A Process
we simply don't have the infrastructure to
maintain multiple releases -- if we force time-based maintenance, it
won't work.
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Adopt A Process -- stop killing all your children!
_
On Tue, Aug 19, 2008, Kent Tenney wrote:
>
> I can't write the C code myself, or evaluate the patch.
Maybe not, but maybe you can upload them to the bug tracker -- that's
the only way this will get looked at.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pyt
On Mon, Aug 25, 2008, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis wrote:
>
> I'm attaching the patch which fixes respecting LDFLAGS when
> building libpython$(VERSION).so.
Please post your patch to bugs.python.org
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, it
will almost certainly get lost.
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ht.c)
If you want this patch considered, please post it to bugs.python.org --
patches posted to the mailing list can't be tracked. Thanks!
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Adopt A Process -- s
proposals/>
We look forward to seeing you in Chicago!
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"Argue for your limitations, and sure enough they're yours." --Richard Bach
___
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Huzzah!
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"...if I were on life-support, I'd rather have it run by a Gameboy than a
Windows box." --Cliff Wells, comp.lang.python, 3/13/2002
___
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x27;t bother, we've
already had about twenty other people reporting. ;-)
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"...if I were on life-support, I'd rather have it run by a Gameboy than a
Windows box."
ined for 2.6/3.0.) For more info,
see PEP6 about bugfix releases:
http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0006/
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"...if I were on life-support, I'd rather have it run by a
, please file a bug report -- that's the only way
we have of tracking things.
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code."
--Bill Harlan
__
onger
>> to calculate for a long implementation using something other than a
>> power-of-2 base.
>
> Right: numbits is only a natural property of a *binary* integer.
>
> On the other hand, I can't realistically see Python ever adopting a
> non power-of-two based implementa
ly if they don't have an
actual summary for a thread. I'd title this "How do I get my patches
accepted?" or "Can someone please look at my patches?"
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
&quo
munity that discouraged the use
of 3.0; I also believe it would be a shame and a disservice to Python if
you (and other people) tell conservatives like me that we should keep our
mouths shut.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"It is easie
ing so. That will
give more time for any additional similar bugs to get fixed at once.
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"It is easier to optimize correct code than to correct optimized code."
--Bill Harlan
On Sun, Dec 07, 2008, Nick Coghlan wrote:
>
> If the binary APIs are missing from a major platform (i.e. Windows) then
> the choice to use them brings with it a major cross-platform portability
> problem that should really be handled by the standard library.
+1
--
Aahz ([EMA
On Sat, Dec 13, 2008, Roy Lowrance wrote:
>
> What's the best way to learn how Python 3.0 works?
Post to the correct mailing list. ;-)
Use comp.lang.python or python-tutor or python-help
python-dev is for people creating new versions of Python
--
Aahz (a...@pyth
On Sat, Dec 20, 2008, Nick Coghlan wrote:
>
> It turns out that _PyBuiltin_Init doesn't call PyType_Ready on any of
> the builtin types - they're left to have it called implicitly when an
> operation using them needs tp_dict filled in.
This seems like a release blocker fo
t upgrade dope" policy.
What kind of upgrade hell are you talking about? I have used several
different Linux distributions, Windows, and OS X, and I have to say that
upgrading Ubuntu has been by far the easist and least painful of them
all. Because I was lazy, last weekend I finally did a tw
to raise a TypeError in 3.0.1?
This definitely cannot be changed for 3.0.1 -- there's plenty of time to
discuss this for 3.1.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
T
't get lost -- it's
already Thursday with no response.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by
defin
The O'Reilly Open Source Convention has opened up the Call For
Participation -- deadline for proposals is Tuesday Feb 3.
OSCON will be held July 20-24 in San Jose, California.
For more information, see
http://conferences.oreilly.com/oscon
http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2009/public/cfp/57
--
Aa
him make the 2.7 and 3.1 releases as great as 2.6 and 3.0!
Great news! How many cases of beer did you feed him before he agreed?
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore,
On Sat, Jan 10, 2009, Barry Warsaw wrote:
> On Jan 9, 2009, at 8:21 PM, Aahz wrote:
>> On Fri, Jan 09, 2009, Barry Warsaw wrote:
>>>
>>> To that end, I'm happy to say that Benjamin Peterson will be the
>>> release manager for Python 2.7 and 3.1. I will
publicize the URL if you end up
doing it; I may try it on my Mac with Windows under Fusion...
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleve
es some headers wrong.
Please post this to http://bugs.python.org/ -- regardless of whether
this is a real bug, using the tracker ensures that we won't lose it.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Debugging is twice as hard as writ
le [ | not ]:
>
What I suggest is that your ideas need more thought before bringing them
to python-dev -- I think you should either go back to python-ideas or try
comp.lang.python
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Weinberg's Secon
for constants?
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Weinberg's Second Law: If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote
programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy c
t; Final-Recipient: rfc822; fdr...@acm.org
> Original-Recipient: rfc822;fdr...@acm.org
> Action: failed
> Status: 5.0.0
> Remote-MTA: dns; acm.org.s7a1.psmtp.com
> Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 550 No such user - psmtp
- End forwarded message -
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com)
On Wed, Jan 21, 2009, Benjamin Peterson wrote:
>>> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 12:48 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>>>> On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 10:00 AM, Aahz wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> In comp.lang.python, there has been some discussion of the fact that
&
iscussion on list.
Second, I think it would be good to explicitly mention the option of
deferring this PEP. Based on previous discussion, it sounds like there
are a fair number of people who think that there is a DVCS in Python's
future, but not now (where "now" means over the next
.)
This can also be done for Python 2.7, too.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Weinberg's Second Law: If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote
programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization.
__
On Thu, Jan 29, 2009, Michael Foord wrote:
> Aahz wrote:
>> On Tue, Jan 27, 2009, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
>>
>>> It is becoming the norm in 3.x for functions to return iterators,
>>> generators, or views whereever possible.
>>>
>>> I had
e Manager, and Barry doesn't like this approach. The vetting does
need to be handled by a core committer IMO -- MAL, are you volunteering?
Anyone else?
Barry, are you actively opposed to marking 3.0.x as experimental, or do
you just dislike it? (I.e. are you -1 or -0?)
--
Aahz (a...@pythonc
e probably right that what Raymond wants to is best not done for
3.0.1 -- but once we've agreed in principle that 3.0.x isn't a true
production release of Python for PEP6 purposes, we can do "release early,
release often".
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*>
The O'Reilly Open Source Convention has opened up the Call For
Participation -- deadline for proposals is Tuesday Feb 3.
OSCON will be held July 20-24 in San Jose, California.
For more information, see
http://conferences.oreilly.com/oscon
http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2009/public/cfp/57
--
Aa
On Sun, Feb 01, 2009, Reto Sch?ttel wrote:
>
> While helping Brandon Rhodes to port PyEphem[1] to Python 3 we
> struggled over a strange locale-related problem on OS X.
Please file a report at bugs.python.org -- that's the only way to ensure
that this gets tracked.
--
Aahz (a...@p
seen more then once and that
> unique_sects is True.
Please go ahead and post the patch to bugs.python.org; it can always be
revised later and this ensures that we have a record.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
Weinberg's Second Law: If
st like this, it's useful to summarize the issue;
few people know bug reports by number, and at least some people who might
be interested in looking probably won't bother if they have no clue
whether it's in their area of expertise.
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plain
alias, so anyone whose e-mail isn't working will generate a bounce.
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WiFi is the SCSI of the 21st Century -- there are fundamental technical
reasons for sacrificing a goat. (with no apologies to John W
doesn't exist.
Fixed
> PS: The devguide doesn't say anything (AFAIK) about the contributor
> agreement.
The devguide seems to now be hosted on docs.python.org and AFAIK the web
team doesn't deal with that. Someone from python-dev needs to lead.
--
Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com)
e input() bug mentioned
> here: http://bugs.python.org/issue11272 was occuring in what I thought was
> the latest release - then I realized that my terminal windows stated version
> 3.2, not 3.2.3 after several uninstalls/installs.
- End forwarded message -
--
Aahz (a...@
ould be useful in offical documentation. Please let me know
> if this is not the right mailing list for documentations. (The class
> diagram show be viewed with monospace fonts.)
If you look at the Python docs, the bottom of every page says, "See
About the Python Documentation for information on s
start of this message.
We're even less wise now given that you probably didn't intend this for
python-dev. ;-)
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
WiFi is the SCSI of the 21st Century -- there are fundamental technical
reasons for sac
jected, then write a
PEP.
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"19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming,
is not worth knowing." --Alan Perlis
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place to get Python support; python-dev is for
people actively working on Python language development. Please use
comp.lang.python or one of the other resources.
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"19. A language that doesn't affect the
perience.
http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html
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"19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming,
is not worth knowing." --Alan Perlis
___
Pyth
to go ahead and do that. You could
>> draft the outline on a Wiki page, and then later figure out an
>> attractive design and organization for a new site.
>
> suggested hostname: why.python.org
This is where the process always gets bogged down. :-( Once we have
material, that&
gt; return NULL;
>> return PyMarshal_WriteObjectToString(x, version);
>> }
>
> Crash. Which means that there is no way in 2.4.0 to marshal an object in the
> old version format as a string -- you'd have to work around by writing a real
> file and read
> Nothing wrong with an incremental release, but none of these sound
> like critical bugs to me.
You don't think a blowup in marshal is critical? Mind expanding on
that?
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"19. A language that do
the FAQ should be usable for
anyone with a "reasonably current" version of Python, say at least two
major versions. IOW, answers should continue to work with 2.2 during
the lifetime of 2.4.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"19. A l
typing.
>
> duck typing?
"If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it must be a duck."
Python is often referred to as having duck typing because even without
formal interface declarations, good practice mostly depends on
conformant interfaces rather than subclassing to deter
e an exception, to implement a read-only attribute).
I'd prefer "property descriptor" since that's the primary use case.
"Getset descriptor" also works for me.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"19. A language t
ple doing things like
year, month, day, hour, min, sec, junk, junk, junk = time.localtime()
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming,
is not worth knowing." --Alan Pe
On Fri, Jan 14, 2005, Alex Martelli wrote:
> On 2005 Jan 14, at 19:11, Aahz wrote:
>>On Fri, Jan 14, 2005, Brett C. wrote:
>>>
>>>Right, it's a struct_time object; just force of habit to call it a
>>>time tuple.
>>>
>>>And I technically
iming the __str__ behavior is new in 2.4?
(Haven't been following the thread closely.)
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"19. A language that doesn't affect the way you think about
ng.python. Thanks!
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Given that C++ has pointers and typecasts, it's really hard to have a serious
conversation about type safety with a C++ programmer and keep a straight face.
It's kind of
ing Python. Thanks.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"Given that C++ has pointers and typecasts, it's really hard to have a serious
conversation about type safety with a C++ programmer and keep a straight face.
It's kind of like having
o require a
contrib agreement. But we're probably not going to press the point
until we get contrib agreements from all CVS committers.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python should be in seeing short, concise, rea
ion of the five patch review
> idea. Can someone make sure that's explained on the /dev/ site?
This should go into Brett's survey of the Python dev process, not as
official documentation. It's simply an offer made by some of the
prominent members of pytho
g
> relative to the end?
Yup! As usual, patches welcome. (Yes, I'm comfortable channeling Guido
here.)
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python should be in seeing short, concise, readable
classes that expres
and c
>>are all integers.
>
> How often does that happen in real code?
Dunno how often, but I was working on some code at my company yesterday
that did that -- we use a lot of ints to indicate options.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncr
re?
Please post a patch to SF. If you're not familiar with the process,
take a look at http://www.python.org/dev/dev_intro.html
Another thing: I don't know whether you'll get this in direct e-mail;
it's considered a bit rude for python-dev to use munged addresses.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL P
clear whether your e-mail address is munged or not, which
likely contributes to reluctance to respond.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python should be in seeing short, concise, readable
classes that express a lot of act
Both entries so far look very good. Perhaps writing python-dev summaries
could be a rotating position?
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python should be in seeing short, concise, readable
classes that express a lot of
On Fri, Mar 04, 2005, John J Lee wrote:
> On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, Aahz wrote:
>>
>> Both entries so far look very good. Perhaps writing python-dev summaries
>> could be a rotating position?
>
> Or even a joint effort? It's up to the contributors, of course: j
people avoid
similar problems seems like a Good Thing to me.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python should be in seeing short, concise, readable
classes that express a lot of action in a small amount of clear code --
upgrading optparse to sync with Optik
> 1.5.1? I'm a bit embarassed that Python 2.4's optparse has __version__
> == "1.5a2" because I didn't release Optik 1.5 in time.
-1, sorry
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.co
is even worse than you're noting, because
2.3's bool works a bit differently, so you have to actually code for
three different problems in two major versions. Sehr schlecht.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/
"The joy of coding Python
7;s not clear what you're looking for, but it's pretty clear that
python-dev is the wrong place to ask. Please switch to comp.lang.python.
Thanks. (python-dev should only be used for people working on Python
releases.)
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.p
stinction... does something else do this anywhere? I thought this
> approach was common knowledge...
Functionally speaking, Python has only major releases and micro
releases. We don't have the resources to support minor releases.
--
Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www
This isn't particularly an argument in favor of
adding OrderedDict to stdlib, but it's another use case. Each dict key
contains a dict value; the subkeys from later-added keys are supposed to
override earlier subkeys. The original implementation relied on subkeys
being unique, but that d
On Wed, Mar 09, 2005, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
> [Aahz]
>>
>> Gee, I just found out I could have used an OrderedDict today. (We're
>> using a dict that we're now having to add an auxilliary list to to track
>> when keys are added.) (This isn't part
ss should be business casual.
>
> Looking forward to hearing from you.
>
> Rosalyn
> (415) 947-6182
>
>
> =
> Rosalyn Lum
> Technical Editor
> Software Development Magazine
> CMP Media
> 600 Harrison St., 6
the last element is not evil; it's just weird, unexpected, and
>> non-obvious. Resist the urge to get tricky with this one.
+1
> Fine, but then let's keep reduce(), which has this nice property.
-1
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Aahz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.
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