Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-05 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 10:56 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > Nick Coghlan wrote: > >> As a tool for communicating between different instances of the *same* >> version of Python though, pickle is fine. > > I'm using pickle to pass a list and dict of floats and strings from Python > 2.6 to 3.1. I've ne

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Bob Ippolito
On Friday, November 5, 2010, wrote: > On 12:21 am, m...@gsites.de wrote: > > Am 04.11.2010 17:15, schrieb anatoly techtonik: >> pickle is insecure, marshal too. > > If the transport or storage layer is not save, you should cryptographically > sign the data anyway:: > >    def pickle_encode(data

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread exarkun
On 12:21 am, m...@gsites.de wrote: Am 04.11.2010 17:15, schrieb anatoly techtonik: > pickle is insecure, marshal too. If the transport or storage layer is not save, you should cryptographically sign the data anyway:: def pickle_encode(data, key): msg = base64.b64encode(pickle.dump

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Jesus Cea
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 04/11/10 15:57, Alexander Belopolsky wrote: > On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote: > .. Twisted actually tried to preserve pickle compatibility in the bad old days, but it was impossible. Pickles should never re

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Steven D'Aprano
Nick Coghlan wrote: As a tool for communicating between different instances of the *same* version of Python though, pickle is fine. I'm using pickle to pass a list and dict of floats and strings from Python 2.6 to 3.1. I've never had any problems with it. Am I living in a state of sin or is

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Marcel Hellkamp
Am 04.11.2010 17:15, schrieb anatoly techtonik: > pickle is insecure, marshal too. If the transport or storage layer is not save, you should cryptographically sign the data anyway:: def pickle_encode(data, key): msg = base64.b64encode(pickle.dumps(data, -1)) sig = base64.b6

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 1:25 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: > On Nov 4, 2010, at 12:49 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote: > > What's the attack you're thinking of on marshal? It never executes any > code while unmarshalling (although it can unmarshal code objects -- > but the receiving program has to do somet

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Glyph Lefkowitz
On Nov 4, 2010, at 12:49 PM, Guido van Rossum wrote: > What's the attack you're thinking of on marshal? It never executes any > code while unmarshalling (although it can unmarshal code objects -- > but the receiving program has to do something additionally to execute > those). These issues may h

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 9:15 AM, anatoly techtonik wrote: > pickle is insecure, marshal too. What's the attack you're thinking of on marshal? It never executes any code while unmarshalling (although it can unmarshal code objects -- but the receiving program has to do something additionally to exec

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread anatoly techtonik
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: > On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 4:28 PM, anatoly techtonik wrote: >> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz >> wrote: >>> >>> This is the strongest reason why I recommend to everyone I know that they >>> not use pickle for storage they'd lik

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Alexander Belopolsky
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote: .. >>> Twisted actually tried to preserve pickle compatibility in the bad old days, >>> but it was impossible.  Pickles should never really be saved to disk unless >>> they contain nothing but lists, ints, strings, and dicts. > > But *that*

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Guido van Rossum
> On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz > wrote: >> This is the strongest reason why I recommend to everyone I know that they >> not use pickle for storage they'd like to keep working after upgrades [not >> just of stdlib, but other 3rd party software or their own software]. :) >> >> +1

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 4:28 PM, anatoly techtonik wrote: > On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz > wrote: >> >> This is the strongest reason why I recommend to everyone I know that they >> not use pickle for storage they'd like to keep working after upgrades [not >> just of stdlib, but

Re: [Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-04 Thread exarkun
On 06:28 am, techto...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: This is the strongest reason why I recommend to everyone I know that they not use pickle for storage they'd like to keep working after upgrades [not just of stdlib, but other 3rd party software or

[Python-Dev] Pickle alternative in stdlib (Was: On breaking modules into packages)

2010-11-03 Thread anatoly techtonik
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: > > This is the strongest reason why I recommend to everyone I know that they > not use pickle for storage they'd like to keep working after upgrades [not > just of stdlib, but other 3rd party software or their own software]. :) > > +1. > Twis