[Python-Dev] Re: PEP 638: Syntactic macros

2023-02-03 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
" On Fri, Feb 3, 2023 at 12:28 PM Stephen J. Turnbull < stephenjturnb...@gmail.com> wrote: > Stéfane Fermigier writes: > > > NB: on a very basic level, I remember trying, a few years ago, to use > the > > Unicode "empty set" symbol as a synonym for

[Python-Dev] Re: PEP 638: Syntactic macros

2023-02-02 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 8:34 AM Stephen J. Turnbull < stephenjturnb...@gmail.com> wrote: > cd...@cam.ac.uk writes: > > > I don't want to be forced to learn lots of weird little functions > > like `np.matmul(x1, x2)` when there's already one obvious syntax > > I'm very familiar with: `x1 * x2`. >

[Python-Dev] Re: It's now time to deprecate the stdlib urllib module

2022-02-07 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
My two cents: 1. I’ve grepped ("ag-ed" acually) through all my code bases, and as noted by others, urllib.parse is used in many places. urllib.request never is, as we've been using requests or httpx instead. IMHO and for the context I'm using it (YMMV), urllib.parse is useful and should be kept (

[Python-Dev] Re: Suggestion: a little language for type definitions

2022-01-09 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On 9 Jan 2022 at 02:22:31, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Sat, Jan 08, 2022 at 12:59:38AM +0100, jack.jan...@cwi.nl wrote: > > I posted this suggestion earlier in the callable type syntax discussion, > at which point it was completely ignored. Possibly because it’s a really > stupid idea, but let me

[Python-Dev] Re: Suggestion: a little language for type definitions

2022-01-08 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On 8 Jan 2022 at 00:59:38, jack.jan...@cwi.nl wrote: > I posted this suggestion earlier in the callable type syntax discussion, > at which point it was completely ignored. Possibly because it’s a really > stupid idea, but let me post it again on the off chance that it isn’t a > stupid idea but was

[Python-Dev] Re: Speeding up CPython

2021-05-13 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Thu, May 13, 2021 at 8:42 AM Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer < arj.pyt...@gmail.com> wrote: > Actual quote by "a Python Software Foundation fellow and contrib- > utor to Python infrastructure projects" > Ah, this is what you were referring to. The document was published 5 years ago, so this may or ma

[Python-Dev] Re: Speeding up CPython

2021-05-13 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, May 12, 2021 at 8:51 PM Abdur-Rahmaan Janhangeer < arj.pyt...@gmail.com> wrote: > Great news, just a tiny bit from me. > I read the other day in the OpenSource report > sponsored by the Ford Foundation a CPython > contributor stating that we have an all time high > count of Python users bu

[Python-Dev] Re: Typing syntax and ecosystem

2021-04-14 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
I agree that showing support for type hints is important, as long as this doesn't convey the counterproductive message that type hints have become almost mandatory. They are useful in some circumstances, and less so (specially when dealing with beginners or non-professional programmers) in others.

[Python-Dev] Re: Typing syntax and ecosystem, take 2

2021-04-13 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 1:46 AM Hugh Fisher wrote: > In any Python 3.6 or later, type > > >>> x : float = 1 > >>> isinstance(x, float) > > or replace the second line with > > >>> type(x) > > As someone who has programmed in FORTRAN, Pascal, C/C++, > Java, and Go this is not at all wha

[Python-Dev] Re: [Python-ideas] Re: Re: Have virtual environments led to neglect of the actual environment?

2021-02-24 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 12:42 PM Paul Moore wrote: > On Wed, 24 Feb 2021 at 10:55, Stéfane Fermigier wrote: > > There is probably a clever way to reuse common packages (probably via > clever symlinking) and reduce the footprint of these installations. > > Ultimately the

[Python-Dev] Re: Have virtual environments led to neglect of the actual environment?

2021-02-24 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 11:43 AM Henk-Jaap Wagenaar < wagenaarhenkj...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > I've been using pyenv (on MacBooks to be fair, not Linux/Debian) and been > quite happy with that, and it basically does what Jonathan does manually: > clone the github repo and build python from scratc

[Python-Dev] Re: [Python-ideas] Have virtual environments led to neglect of the actual environment?

2021-02-24 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
I love pipx and I'm glad it exists at this point because it make The main issue is that each virtualenv takes space, lots of space. I have currently 57 apps installed via pipx on my laptop, and the 57 environments take almost 1 GB already. ~  cd .local/pipx/venvs/ ~/.l/p/venvs  ls abilian-to

[Python-Dev] Re: [Python-ideas] Re: Re: Have virtual environments led to neglect of the actual environment?

2021-02-24 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 1:47 PM Stéfane Fermigier wrote: > > So IMHO the best way to implement solution 3 would be by using some > variant of the approach popularized by Nix (repository of immutable > packages + links to each virtualenv). > Another benefit of this kind of ap

[Python-Dev] Re: Remove formatter module

2020-11-24 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 12:51 PM Victor Stinner wrote: > > I never used this module, I don't know what it is. > I've run a quick search on GitHub and the only meaningful reference I could find is the Grail browser (which had its last release, AFAICT, in 1999). http://grail.sourceforge.net/ S

[Python-Dev] Re: Recent PEP-8 change

2020-06-30 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
I didn't want to participate in this discussion, but I will, probably for the following reasons: - I'm French - I bought a copy of Strunk & White during my first trip to the US, in 1990, in a desperate attempt to improve my english writing style. - I can't say it changed my life, but I found the a

[Python-Dev] Re: PEP 622: Structural Pattern Matching

2020-06-26 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Fri, Jun 26, 2020 at 3:38 PM Mark Shannon wrote: > > What does "static and dynamic specifications" mean? Surely, there are > just specifications. > There are specifications for both the runtime and the static aspects of the Python programming language. > Python does not have a static checki

Re: [Python-Dev] Python Language Governance Proposals

2018-10-23 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
+1 (for what it's worth) to any proposal which includes one (or more) GUIDOs :) S. On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 11:57 AM Victor Stinner wrote: > Hi, > > Last July, Guido van Rossum decided to resign from his role of BDFL. > Python core developers decided to design a new governance/organization > f

[Python-Dev] Fwd: Examples for PEP 572

2018-07-04 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Jul 4, 2018 at 12:09 PM Chris Angelico wrote: > > Even assuming your figures to be 100% accurate, I don't think you can > accept that scaling. Are you claiming that every high school student > (a) continues to use Python forever, and (b) continues to use it at a > non-professional level?

Re: [Python-Dev] Examples for PEP 572

2018-07-04 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Tue, Jul 3, 2018 at 11:52 PM Chris Angelico wrote: > On Wed, Jul 4, 2018 at 7:37 AM, Serhiy Storchaka > wrote: > > I believe most Python users are not > > professional programmers -- they are sysadmins, scientists, hobbyists and > > kids -- > > [citation needed] > Let's focus on France: 1)

Re: [Python-Dev] Examples for PEP 572

2018-07-04 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Jul 4, 2018 at 12:36 PM Stéfane Fermigier wrote: > > And dissimilar to countries where CS is not taught in schools, or another > language is used (Scratch or other block-languages are usually popular). > Just found: https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/coding-uk-classroom-python-over

[Python-Dev] Meta-question about this mailing list

2018-04-25 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
Hi, the description on https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev reads: "On this list the key Python developers discuss the future of the language and its implementation." I interpret this sentence as "only key (core?) developers are supposed to participate in the discussion (ie. post

Re: [Python-Dev] Slipping Python 3.5.5rc1 and 3.4.8rc1 because of a Travis CI issue--can someone make Travis CI happy?

2018-01-22 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Mon, Jan 22, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Larry Hastings wrote: > > > I have three PRs for Python 3.5.5rc1: > > https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/4656 > https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/5197 > https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/5201 > > I can't merge them because Travis CI is unhappy. All

Re: [Python-Dev] Remove typing from the stdlib

2017-11-03 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 6:47 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > On Fri, 3 Nov 2017 12:46:33 -0400 > "Eric V. Smith" wrote: > > On 11/3/2017 12:15 PM, Victor Stinner wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > 2017-11-03 15:36 GMT+01:00 Guido van Rossum : > > >> Maybe we should remove typing from the stdlib? > > >> htt

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 563: Postponed Evaluation of Annotations

2017-11-02 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Thu, Nov 2, 2017 at 7:39 PM, Jukka Lehtosalo wrote: > > As type checking has become the main use case for annotations, using > annotations without a type checker is fast becoming a marginal use case. > Type checkers can easily and reliably validate that names in annotations > aren't > misspel

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 557: Data Classes

2017-10-12 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Thu, Oct 12, 2017 at 10:20 AM, Mike Miller wrote: > > On 2017-10-12 00:36, Stéfane Fermigier wrote: > >> "An object that is not defined by its attributes, but rather by a thread >> of continuity and its identity." (from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ >>

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 557: Data Classes

2017-10-12 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 10:33 PM, Mike Miller wrote: > (Apologies for reviving a dead horse, but may not be around at the blessed > time.) > > As potential names of this concept, I liked record and row, but agreed > they were a bit too specific and not quite exact. In my recent (unrelated) > rea

Re: [Python-Dev] Investigating time for `import requests`

2017-10-03 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
Hi, On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:42 AM, Raymond Hettinger < raymond.hettin...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I don't expect to find anything that would help users of Django, Flask, > and Bottle since those are typically long-running apps where we value > response time more than startup time. > Actually, as

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 557: Data Classes

2017-09-09 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
Hi, first post here. My two cents: Here's a list of "prior arts" that I have collected over the years, besides attrs, that address similar needs (and often, much more): - https://github.com/bluedynamics/plumber - https://github.com/ionelmc/python-fields - https://github.com/frasertweedale/elk -

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 544: Protocols - second round

2017-06-22 Thread Stéfane Fermigier
On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 10:44 AM, Markus Wissinger < markus.wissin...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > I have to admit I am not happy with separating the concepts of 'runtime' > and 'static' types as implied by pep544. > > I am currently exploring a type hint generator that produces hints out of > type