I also feel this decision was a mistake. If there's a consensus to revert,
I'm happy to draft a PEP.
Alex
On Nov 6, 2017 1:58 PM, "Neil Schemenauer" wrote:
> On 2017-11-06, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> > Gah, seven years on from Python 2.7's release, I still get caught by
> > that. I'm tempted to prop
This is a great UX win for our development process. Thanks for making this
happen!
Alex
On Tue, Sep 5, 2017 at 9:10 PM, Mariatta Wijaya
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> The cherry picker bot has just been deployed to CPython repo, codenamed
> miss-islington.
>
> miss-islington made the very first backport PR f
I'm +1 on this, I even wrote the patch: https://bugs.python.org/issue22559
:-) If you're interested in making sure that still applies and tests still
pass, I'd be a big fan.
In addition to all the benefits you mentioned, it also substantially
reduces the diff between 2.7 and 3.x (or at least it di
Hi all,
While I appreciate the vote of confidence from everyone, I'm not interested
in being the BDFL-delegate for this. I don't think it's a good idea, and
I'm not willing to put further time into.
If he's interested, Donald Stufft would make a good choice for delegate.
Really do appreciate eve
Ben Finney benfinney.id.au> writes:
>
> Rather, the claim is that *if* one's code base doesn't migrate to Python
> 3, it will be decreasingly supported by the PSF and the Python community
> at large.
>
The PSF doesn't support any versions of Python. We have effectively no
involvement in the de
On Sun Nov 30 2014 at 10:28:50 AM Brett Cannon wrote:
> Why specifically? Did you have a web UI for reviewing patches previously?
> Do you have CI set up for patches now and didn't before? What features did
> you specifically gain from the switch to GitHub that you didn't have
> before? IOW was i
Donald Stufft stufft.io> writes:
>
> [words words words]
>
I strongly support this PEP. I'd like to share two pieces of information. Both
of these are personal anecdotes:
For the past several years, I've been a contributor on two major projects using
mercurial, CPython and PyPy. PyPy has a stro
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes:
>
> OK, I'll hold off a bit on approving the PEP, but my intention is to approve
> it. Go Alex go!
>
A patch for the environmental variable overrides on Windows has landed; thanks
Benjamin!
Alex
___
Python-Dev m
ing until the PEP is approved, but I
> also feel that I want to see more working code and some beta testing before
> it goes live. Perhaps I should just approve the PEP but separately get to
> approve the code? (Others will have to review it for correctness -- but I
> want to understand
thon 2.7, 3.4 and
> 3.5 in the Abstract (for example in the 3rd paragraph of the abstract).
>
> On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 3:52 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
>
>> On 20 September 2014 08:34, Alex Gaynor wrote:
>> > Pushed a new version which I believe adresses all of these
; is the same as ssl.create_default.http.client ..."
>
> (4) There's no mention of the Python 2 equivalent of http.client.
>
> Finally, it's kind of non-obvious in the PEP that this affects Python
> 2.7.X (I guess the one after the next) as well as 3.4 and 3.5.
>
> On F
Hi all,
I've just updated the PEP to reflect the API suggestions from Nick, and the
fact that the necessary changes to urllib were landed.
I think this is ready for pronouncement, Guido?
Cheers,
Alex
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
h
currently pulls down an https URL using urlopen. Without adding package
> dependencies.
>
> On Mon, Sep 8, 2014 at 10:25 AM, Alex Gaynor
> wrote:
>
>> Guido van Rossum python.org> writes:
>>
>> >
>> >
>>
>> Would you be willing to offi
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes:
>
>
Would you be willing to officially pronounce on PEP-476 in the context of 3.4.x,
so we can get it into the release, and then we can defer on officially approving
it for 2.7.X until we figure out all the moving pieces?
Cheers,
Alex
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes:
> OK, that changes my position for 2.7 (but not for 3.5). I had assumed there
> was a way to disable the cert check by changing one parameter to the
> urlopen() call. (And I had wanted to add that there should be a clear FAQ
> about the subject.) If this isn't
Ethan Furman stoneleaf.us> writes:
>
> I apologize if I missed this point, but if we have the source code then it is
> possible to go in and directly modify the application/utility to be able to
> talk over https to a router with an invalid certificate? This is an option
> when creating the ssl
Antoine Pitrou pitrou.net> writes:
>
> And how many people are using Twisted as an HTTPS client?
> (compared to e.g. Python's httplib, and all the third-party libraries
> building on it?)
>
I don't think anyone could give an honest estimate of these counts, however
there's two factors to bare
The Windows certificate store is used by ``load_default_certs``:
* https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/master/Lib/ssl.py#L379-L381
* https://docs.python.org/3.4/library/ssl.html#ssl.enum_certificates
Cheers, Alex
___
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Python-D
Thanks for the rapid feedback everyone!
I want to summarize the action items and discussion points that have come up so
far:
To add to the PEP:
* Emit a warning in 3.4.next for cases that would raise a Exception in 3.5
* Clearly state that the existing OpenSSL environment variables will be
res
rsion: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date$
Author: Alex Gaynor
Status: Draft
Type: Standards Track
Content-Type: text/x-rst
Created: 28-August-2014
Abstract
Currently when a standard library http client (the ``urllib`` and ``http``
modules) encounters an ``https://`` URL it will wrap the network
Donald Stufft stufft.io> writes:
>
>
>
> For the record I’ve had all of the problems that Nick states and I’m
> +1 on this change.
>
>
> ---
> Donald Stufft
> PGP: 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA
>
I've hit basically every problem everyone here has stated, and in no uncer
Antoine Pitrou python.org> writes:
>
> You mean for use with SSL_set_app_data?
Yes, if you look in ``_servername_callback``, you can see where it uses
``SSL_get_app_data`` and then reads ``ssl->Socket``, which is supposed to be
the same object that's returned by ``context.wrap_socket()``.
A
Antoine Pitrou python.org> writes:
> No, IIRC there shouldn't be a cycle. It's just complicated in a
> different way than 3.x
>
> Regards
>
> Antoine.
>
Indeed, you're right, this is just differently convoluted so no leak (not that
I would call "collected by a normal GC" a leak :-)).
That s
Hi all,
I've been happily working on the SSL module backports for Python2 (pursuant to
PEP466), and I've hit something of a snag:
In python3, the SSLSocket keeps a weak reference to the underlying socket,
rather than a strong reference, as Python2 uses.
Unfortunately, due to the way sockets work
Hi all,
I wanted to bring everyone up to speed on the status of PEP 466, what's been
completed, and what's left to do.
First the completed stuff:
* hmac.compare_digest
* hashlib.pbkdf2_hmac
Are both backported, and I've added support to use them in Django, so users
should start seeing these ben
Hi python-dev and Raymond,
I think this change is a considerable usability regression for the
documentation. Right now the warnings about CSPRNGs are hidden in the
introductory paragraph, which users are likely to skip. I agree that
there's no need to repeat the same advice twice, but I'd much rat
This mostly looks good to me, however I'm not sure I understand the point of
this sentence: "Rather, it is intended to send a clear signal to potential
corporate contributors that the core development team are willing to accept
offers of corporate assistance in putting this policy into effect [...]
At this I think this PEP has become a little too vague and abstract, and I
think we'd probably be better served by getting more concrete:
Problem:
Some of Python 2's modules which are fundamentally necessary for interop with
the broader internet, and the security thereof, are missing really impor
A casual glance at
https://github.com/kennethreitz/requests/blob/master/requests/packages/urllib3/
util.py#L610
which is probably the most widely used consumer of these APIs, outside the
stdlib itself, looks to me like if these names were to suddenly show up,
everything would continue to work just
Thanks for putting this together Nick.
I suspect it goes without saying that I'm wildly +1 on this as a whole. I'm in
favor of leaving it somewhat implicit as to exactly which networking modules
concern "the health of the internet as a whole".
Alex
___
Maciej Fijalkowski gmail.com> writes:
>
> HI
>
> I'm working on an incremental GC for PyPy. How do I measure GC pauses
> in CPython? (that is, the circular reference searching stuff)
>
> Cheers,
> fijal
>
For what it's worth I threw together some code that might be helpful:
http://bpaste.ne
3.3 adds some -X options around faulthandler if I recall correctly.
Alex
On Mon, Jun 24, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 6:14 PM, R. David Murray
> wrote:
> > On Sun, 23 Jun 2013 17:40:13 +0200, Maciej Fijalkowski
> wrote:
> >> On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 3:36
Stefan Behnel behnel.de> writes:
> Right. If that makes a difference, it's another bug.
>
> Stefan
>
>
It's fixed, with, I will note, fewer lines of code than many messages in this
thread:
https://bitbucket.org/pypy/pypy/changeset/c30cb1dcb7a9adc32548fd14274e4995
Alex
__
Brett Cannon python.org> writes:
>
> Time to ask the other VMs what they are currently doing (the ast module came
into existence in Python 2.6 so all the VMs should be answer the question since
Jython is in alpha for 2.7 compatibility).
>
As far as I know PyPy supports the ast module, and pr
On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 9:51 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
> Also, I have a few content quibbles:
>
> - Is it really worth flagging a negative return value with ValueError?
> I'd just as well clip this to zero. What's the worry? That the
> computed value is wrong? But it's only meant to be a hint,
Guido van Rossum python.org> writes:
>
>
> Looks good to me, so accepted.But why isn't it visible on
> python.org/dev/peps/
yet?
I just realized the text in the python.org repo did not match what I had
locally.
I've pushed what I intended to be the latest text, if everyone could take a new
Hi all,
The discussion on PEP 0424 seems to have subsided (and I haven't gotten angry
emails in a week!). So I would like to request a BDFL or BDFP pronouncement
on PEP 0424, text available here:
http://hg.python.org/peps/file/tip/pep-0424.txt
Alex
_
That's not, strictly speaking, true. Mozilla added a method-JIT (Jaegermonkey)
and then added another one (IonMonkey) because their tracing JIT (Tracemonkey)
was bad. There's no fundamental reason that tracing has to only cover loops,
indeed PyPy's tracing has been generalized to compile individua
Victor Stinner gmail.com> writes:
> Example:
>
> a = GETLOCAL(0); # "a"
> if (a == NULL) /* error */
> b = GETLOCAL(1); # "b"
> if (b == NULL) /* error */
> return PyNumber_Add(a, b);
>
>
> I don't expect to run a program 10x faster, but I would be happy if I
> can run arbitrary Pytho
I've updated the PEP to reflect the discussion. There are two major changes:
1) NotImplemented may be used by __length_hint__ to indicate that there is no
finite length hint available.
2) callers of operator.length_hint() must provide their own default value, this
is also required by the cu
On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 10:16 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 9:18 AM, Benjamin Peterson
> wrote:
> >> Open questions
> >> ==
> >>
> >> There are two open questions for this PEP:
> >>
> >> * Should ``list`` expose a kwarg in it's constructor for supplying a
> length
On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 4:18 PM, Benjamin Peterson wrote:
> 2012/7/14 Alex Gaynor :
> >
> > Proposal
> >
> >
> > This PEP proposes formally documenting ``__length_hint__`` for other
> > interpreter and non-standard library Python to implement.
>
Hi all,
I've just submitted a PEP proposing making __length_hint__ a public API for
users to define and other VMs to implement:
PEP: 424
Title: A method for exposing a length hint
Version: $Revision$
Last-Modified: $Date
Author: Alex Gaynor
Status: Draft
Type: Standards Track
Content
On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 11:47 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 12, 2012 at 12:38 PM, Alex Gaynor wrote:
>
>> For PyPy: I'm not an expert in our import, but from looking at the source
>>
>> 1) imp.cache_from_source is unimplemented, it's an Attri
For PyPy: I'm not an expert in our import, but from looking at the source
1) imp.cache_from_source is unimplemented, it's an AttributeError.
2) sys.dont_write_bytecode is always false, we don't respect that flag (we
really
should IMO, but it's not a high priority for me, or anyone else appare
Eric Snow gmail.com> writes:
>
> Nick's option 2 would be an improvement, but I imagine that option 3
> would have been the most effective by far. Of course, the key thing
> is how closely the various implementors would follow the new list.
> Only they could say, though Frank Wierzbicki seemed
Nick Coghlan gmail.com> writes:
> I'm pretty sure the PyPy jit can already pick up and optimise cases
> where a dict goes "read-only" (i.e. stops being modified).
No, it doesn't. We handle cases like a type's dict, or a module's dict,
by having them use a different internal implementation (while
Brett Cannon python.org> writes:
> IOW you want the sys.modules case fast, which I will never be able to match
compared to C code since that is pure execution with no I/O.
>
Sure you can: have a really fast Python VM.
Constructive: if you can run this code under PyPy it'd be easy to just:
A few thoughts on this:
a) This is not a new issue, I'm curious what the new interest is in it.
b) Whatever the solution to this is, it is *not* CPython specific, any decision
should be reflected in the Python language spec IMO, if CPython has the semantic
that dicts aren't vulnerable to hash col
There are a number of issues that are being conflated by this thread.
1) Should str += str be fast. In my opinion, the answer is an obvious and
resounding no. Strings are immutable, thus repeated string addition is
O(n**2). This is a natural and obvious conclusion. Attempts to change this
On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 10:20 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:58 AM, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 2:49 AM, Michael Foord
> wrote:
> >> I think someone else pointed this out, but replacing builtins externally
> to
> >> a module is actually common for testi
Cesare Di Mauro gmail.com> writes:
>
>
> 2010/12/28 Lukas Lueg googlemail.com>
>
> Consider the following code:
> def foobar(x):
> for i in range(5):
> x[i] = i
> The bytecode in python 2.7 is the following:
> 2 0 SETUP_LOOP 30 (to 33)
> 3 LO
Hi all,
I ran into the follow behavior while making sure Django works
correctly on PyPy. The following behavior was observed in all tested
versions of CPython (2.5, 3.1):
>>> def f(**kwargs):
... print(kwargs)
...
>>> kwargs = {1: 3}
>>>
>>> dict({}, **kwargs)
{1: 3}
>>> f(**kwargs)
Tracebac
On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:30 PM, Steve Howell wrote:
>
>
> --- On Wed, 1/27/10, Raymond Hettinger wrote:
>
>> From: Raymond Hettinger
>
>> * the current design encourages people to use
>> the right data structure for a given need. the
>> proposed change makes the trades-off murky and
>> implem
On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 4:50 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> Steve Howell wrote:
>> There is also the possibility that my initial patch can be refined by
>> somebody smarter than myself to eliminate the particular tradeoff.
>> In fact, Antoine Pitrou already suggested an approach, although I
>> agree th
On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 7:32 PM, Michael Foord
wrote:
> On 26/01/2010 00:28, Christian Heimes wrote:
>>
>> Michael Foord wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> How great is the complication? Making list.pop(0) efficient sounds like
>>> a worthy goal, particularly given that the reason you don't use it is
>>> because y
On Fri, Jan 22, 2010 at 1:07 PM, Collin Winter wrote:
> Hey Jake,
>
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:48 AM, Jake McGuire wrote:
>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Reid Kleckner wrote:
>>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 12:27 PM, Jake McGuire wrote:
On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 2:27 PM, Collin Winter
>
On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 9:19 PM, Jesse Noller wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 6:16 PM, wrote:
>>
>> How about explaining why you're not going to give Collin a pony?
>>
>> Skip
>
> You're on to something, but the question is:
>
> 1> How do we get a pony to atlanta
> 2> Later deliver it to Mounta
On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 3:00 PM, Steve Steiner (listsin)
wrote:
>
> On Jan 21, 2010, at 3:20 PM, Collin Winter wrote:
>
>> Hey Greg,
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 10:54 PM, Gregory P. Smith wrote:
>>> +1
>>> My biggest concern is memory usage but it sounds like addressing that is
>>> already in y
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