On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 15:08, Kyle Terry wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:05 PM, VamVan wrote:
>> I believe in Community building. My only concern was the kind of language
>> used is very intimidating , that's all.
>
> Are you referring to bad language?
An unintended pun. Nice. ;-P
--
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:05 PM, VamVan wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 14:37, VamVan wrote:
>> > Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
>>
>> It's a PHP-related general discussion, Vam. Perhaps not ent
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 14:37, VamVan wrote:
> > Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
>
> It's a PHP-related general discussion, Vam. Perhaps not entirely
> in good manners, but it's 100% relevant. Indeed,
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:54 AM, Robert Cummings wrote:
> On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 14:50 -0500, Daniel Brown wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 14:37, VamVan wrote:
> > > Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
> >
> > It's a PHP-related general discussion, Vam. Perha
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:37 PM, VamVan wrote:
> Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Kyle Terry wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Robert Cummings > >wrote:
>>
>> > On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 10:50 -0800, Kyle Terry wro
On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 14:50 -0500, Daniel Brown wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 14:37, VamVan wrote:
> > Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
>
> It's a PHP-related general discussion, Vam. Perhaps not entirely
> in good manners, but it's 100% relevant. Indeed,
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 14:37, VamVan wrote:
> Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
It's a PHP-related general discussion, Vam. Perhaps not entirely
in good manners, but it's 100% relevant. Indeed, this is the right
place.
That aside, as intelligent folks,
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:45 AM, Robert Cummings wrote:
> On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 11:37 -0800, VamVan wrote:
> > Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
>
> Could you explain "burning our egos"?
>
> Cheers,
> Rob.
> --
> http://www.interjinn.com
> Application and Templatin
On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 11:37 -0800, VamVan wrote:
> Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
Could you explain "burning our egos"?
Cheers,
Rob.
--
http://www.interjinn.com
Application and Templating Framework for PHP
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To
Why are you guys Burning your egos here? Its not the right place.
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Kyle Terry wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Robert Cummings >wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 10:50 -0800, Kyle Terry wrote:
> > > On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Daniel Brown
>
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Robert Cummings wrote:
> On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 10:50 -0800, Kyle Terry wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
> >
> > > On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 13:22, Kyle Terry wrote:
> > > >>
> > > > Aside from a few perl scripts, I have rewritten al
On Mon, 2009-01-19 at 10:50 -0800, Kyle Terry wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 13:22, Kyle Terry wrote:
> > >>
> > > Aside from a few perl scripts, I have rewritten all my bash scripts in
> > PHP.
> > > It's just easier to manage for me
""Daniel Brown"" wrote in message
news:ab5568160901191010u2d4073aas33789f0c81183...@mail.gmail.com...
> On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 12:36, Tony Marston
> wrote:
>>
>> Really? In 2007 I single-handedly designed and built an ERP system with
>> 130
>> database tables, 230 relationships and 1000 scree
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:35 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 13:22, Kyle Terry wrote:
> >>
> > Aside from a few perl scripts, I have rewritten all my bash scripts in
> PHP.
> > It's just easier to manage for me.
>
> /me nods.
>
>In 2001, I started rewriting a library o
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 13:22, Kyle Terry wrote:
>>
> Aside from a few perl scripts, I have rewritten all my bash scripts in PHP.
> It's just easier to manage for me.
/me nods.
In 2001, I started rewriting a library of Perl scripts I'd been
building since 1995 (5.0.0.1), which meant rewr
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:19 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:13, Per Jessen wrote:
> >
> > Yes, I am serious, and no, I don't write php extensions etc. I don't
> > write many web apps anyway. I do use PHP quite a bit for command line
> > stuff, in fact for >95% of my scri
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:13, Per Jessen wrote:
>
> Yes, I am serious, and no, I don't write php extensions etc. I don't
> write many web apps anyway. I do use PHP quite a bit for command line
> stuff, in fact for >95% of my scripts.
Same her, Per. I actually use PHP for more command-line
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:10 AM, Daniel Brown wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 12:36, Tony Marston
> wrote:
> >
> > Really? In 2007 I single-handedly designed and built an ERP system with
> 130
> > database tables, 230 relationships and 1000 screens, all with PHP and
> > without an ORM and stat
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 12:36, Tony Marston
wrote:
>
> Really? In 2007 I single-handedly designed and built an ERP system with 130
> database tables, 230 relationships and 1000 screens, all with PHP and
> without an ORM and static typing. This took me 6 months. If you can't equal
> that then eithe
Eric Butera wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:44 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
>> I think that's at best an example of someone having chosen the wrong
>> tool. I can easily appreciate the frustration. My own rule-of-thumb
>> - scripts are for small things and rapid prototyping. Once when a
>> script (
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:44 AM, Per Jessen wrote:
> I think that's at best an example of someone having chosen the wrong
> tool. I can easily appreciate the frustration. My own rule-of-thumb -
> scripts are for small things and rapid prototyping. Once when a script
> (regardless of language) gr
On Sun, 2009-01-18 at 18:10 +, Nathan Rixham wrote:
> Jochem Maas wrote:
> > Per Jessen schreef:
> >> Nathan Rixham wrote:
> >>
> >>> Per Jessen wrote:
> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>
> >> You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have
> >> strong
> >> and loose t
Stuart wrote:
Also, PHP is procedural with OO capabilities due to its history
never understood this comment more - wish I'd given it more thought when
it stuck out the first time. - cheers stut
time4work!
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.ph
Hello guys,
It seems most of you very tallended programmers.
Could you generate someting like
php--
withouth OO just namespaces ?
and make 95% of php programmers very happy...
this Object Orgy going to blow that language
which makes us productive programmers.
and
My vote goes to Tony...
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:4973b738.3010...@gmail.com...
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Stuart" wrote in message
>> news:a5f019de0901181322i2a4cbfaam4d36eff843f42...@mail.gmail.com...
>>> 2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
In case you have forgotten what this thread is about, the OP gave a
>
Tony Marston wrote:
"Stuart" wrote in message
news:a5f019de0901181322i2a4cbfaam4d36eff843f42...@mail.gmail.com...
2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
In case you have forgotten what this thread is about, the OP gave a list
of
suggested "improvements" to PHP and asked for opinions. I merely gave my
opini
"Stuart" wrote in message
news:a5f019de0901181322i2a4cbfaam4d36eff843f42...@mail.gmail.com...
> 2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
>> In case you have forgotten what this thread is about, the OP gave a list
>> of
>> suggested "improvements" to PHP and asked for opinions. I merely gave my
>> opinion that
2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
> In case you have forgotten what this thread is about, the OP gave a list of
> suggested "improvements" to PHP and asked for opinions. I merely gave my
> opinion that these "improvements" would be a waste of time as they would add
> nothing to the language (IMHO, of course
Tony Marston wrote:
"Stuart" wrote in message
news:a5f019de0901181015g5e2db21fn2782839ab9648...@mail.gmail.com...
2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypengu
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:49737051.9080...@gmail.com...
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
Wow, Tony, do you thi
"Stuart" wrote in message
news:a5f019de0901181015g5e2db21fn2782839ab9648...@mail.gmail.com...
> 2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
>>
>> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>> news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
>>> Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypeng
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:49737051.9080...@gmail.com...
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>> news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
>>> Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
> Wow, Tony, do y
2009/1/18 Tony Marston :
>
> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
> news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
>> Tony Marston wrote:
>>> "Skip Evans" wrote in message
>>> news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
with just a
Jochem Maas wrote:
Per Jessen schreef:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have
strong
and loose typing in the same language. In my opinion.
"Instead of providing programmers with a black or white choice
bet
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
with just a bit more civility and in a
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497354c3.9090...@gmail.com...
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
point is..
Java let's me easily do 70% of what I need to
PHP let's me easily do 95% of what I need to
I'm curious - can you list what the 25% are?
it lacks dynamic
Per Jessen schreef:
> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>
>> Per Jessen wrote:
>>> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>>
> You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have
> strong
> and loose typing in the same language. In my opinion.
"Instead of providing programmers with a black or white
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497366f5.2030...@gmail.com...
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Skip Evans" wrote in message
>> news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
>>> Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
>>> with just a bit more civility and in a less
Nathan Rixham wrote:
> Per Jessen wrote:
>> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>
You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have
strong
and loose typing in the same language. In my opinion.
>>> "Instead of providing programmers with a black or white choice
>>> between static or
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:497354c3.9090...@gmail.com...
> Per Jessen wrote:
>> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>
>>> point is..
>>> Java let's me easily do 70% of what I need to
>>> PHP let's me easily do 95% of what I need to
>>>
>>
>> I'm curious - can you list what the 25% are?
>
> it lacks
Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
with just a bit more civility and in a less condescending tone?
Nathan expressed some thoughts he had, politely, and when out of
Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>> If we could get that 5% added then PHP would be perfect, not only
>>> that but me and the rest of the team at work would be able to make
>>> our multi-million pound enterprise projects in PHP instead of java;
>>> as would so many others (that can't be a bad thing for PHP)
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have strong
and loose typing in the same language. In my opinion.
"Instead of providing programmers with a black or white choice between
static or dynamic typing, we should instead strive for soft
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
point is..
Java let's me easily do 70% of what I need to
PHP let's me easily do 95% of what I need to
I'm curious - can you list what the 25% are?
it lacks dynamic typing, the ability to procedural code and its
precompiled not interpreted; all in a h
Nathan Rixham wrote:
>> You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't/shouldn't have strong
>> and loose typing in the same language. In my opinion.
>
> "Instead of providing programmers with a black or white choice between
> static or dynamic typing, we should instead strive for softer type
>
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't
use PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
why not?
Because your desired functionality is already satisfied by
You're right, and as soon as you apologize to Nathan for
calling him feeble minded (and promise to adjust your
attitude) I will apologize to you.
I also think it would be a good idea for you to address the
rest of the list and assure everyone you will try to be more
polite in the future.
Sk
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49733d18.6080...@bigskypenguin.com...
>I will be brief. Tony is a dick.
To quote your own words: "There's just no need to insult other list members
like this."
--
Tony Marston
http://www.tonymarston.net
http://www.radicore.org
> Peace & Love,
> Skip
>
> To
I will be brief. Tony is a dick.
Peace & Love,
Skip
Tony Marston wrote:
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
with just a bit more civility and in a less condescending tone?
Nathan exp
"Jochem Maas" wrote in message
news:4972365b.4060...@iamjochem.com...
> Daniel Brown schreef:
>> Well, since Nathan asked especially for the opinions of those who
>> would disagree with him, I thought all was well
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 13:33, Tony Marston
>> wrote:
>>> If your f
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:49723749.4070...@gmail.com...
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>>>
>>> a: Optional Static Typing
>>> I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
>>> properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know
"Skip Evans" wrote in message
news:49723137.2010...@bigskypenguin.com...
> Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
> with just a bit more civility and in a less condescending tone?
>
> Nathan expressed some thoughts he had, politely, and when out of his way
> to
Nathan Rixham wrote:
> point is..
> Java let's me easily do 70% of what I need to
> PHP let's me easily do 95% of what I need to
>
I'm curious - can you list what the 25% are?
> If we could get that 5% added then PHP would be perfect, not only that
> but me and the rest of the team at work woul
Nathan Rixham wrote:
> Per Jessen wrote:
>> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>
>>> Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't
use PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
>>> why not?
>>
>> Because your desired functionality is already satis
On Sat, 2009-01-17 at 20:45 +0100, Jochem Maas wrote:
> Skip Evans schreef:
> > Tony Marston wrote:
> >
> > It's NOT just so we can blast each other and show off our highly
> > dubiously assumed superiority.
>
> If I was Robbert Cummings I'd nail you on your grammar at this point,
> I don't want t
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
> it's a simple need: if I can type that my variable can only contain an
> int,
> then I know it's always an int without tonnes of checks to check it
> actually
> contains an int / is getting set with an int throughout the rest of the
> app
> (e
Stuart wrote:
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
Stuart wrote:
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
a: Optional Static Typing
I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
> Stuart wrote:
>>
>> 2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
>>>
>>> Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>
> a: Optional Static Typing
> I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
> properties, parameters, return types
Nathan Rixham schreef:
> Jochem Maas wrote:
>> Nathan Rixham schreef:
...
>> try this snippet on for size:
>>
>> function test(stdClass $o) { var_dump($o); } $o = (object)1; test($o);
>
> ahh.. you miss the point, request: "I want to type hint that my function
> can accept objects of any type, b
Stuart wrote:
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
why not?
Because your desired functionality is already satisfied by
Stuart wrote:
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
a: Optional Static Typing
I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there is type
hinting but it's just not enough
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
> Per Jessen wrote:
>>
>> Nathan Rixham wrote:
>>
>>> Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
>>>
>>> why not?
>>
>> Because your desired functionality is
2009/1/17 Nathan Rixham :
> Tony Marston wrote:
>>
>> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>>>
>>> a: Optional Static Typing
>>> I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
>>> properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there is type
>>> hinting but it's just no
Jochem Maas wrote:
Nathan Rixham schreef:
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
a: Optional Static Typing
I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there is
type hinting but it's just not enoug
Per Jessen wrote:
Nathan Rixham wrote:
Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
why not?
Because your desired functionality is already satisfied by other
programming languages. PHP is an
Nathan Rixham schreef:
> Tony Marston wrote:
>> "Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
>>>
>>> a: Optional Static Typing
>>> I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
>>> properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there is
>>> type hinting but it's just not enou
Nathan Rixham wrote:
> Tony Marston wrote:
>>
>> If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
>> PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
>
> why not?
Because your desired functionality is already satisfied by other
programming languages. PHP is an interp
Per Jessen wrote:
Tony Marston wrote:
If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
+1
I do.. mainly Java when I need it (can you tell)
point is..
Java let's me easily do 70% of what I need to
PHP let's me easil
Tony Marston wrote:
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
a: Optional Static Typing
I'm finding an ever increasingly need to be able to staticly type
properties, parameters, return types etc (in classes) I know there is type
hinting but it's just not enough to do what one needs. Additionally
sup
On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Daniel Brown wrote:
>Well, since Nathan asked especially for the opinions of those who
> would disagree with him, I thought all was well
>
> On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 13:33, Tony Marston
> wrote:
>>
>> If your feeble brain can't handle the differences
>> the
Tony Marston wrote:
> If you really *need* to used a staticly typed language then don't use
> PHP, and don't try to change PHP to match your needs.
+1
/Per Jessen, Zürich
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Daniel Brown schreef:
> Well, since Nathan asked especially for the opinions of those who
> would disagree with him, I thought all was well
>
> On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 13:33, Tony Marston
> wrote:
>> If your feeble brain can't handle the differences
>> then I suggest you stick with your p
Skip Evans schreef:
> Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express yourself
> with just a bit more civility and in a less condescending tone?
going on past experience ... I doubt it.
> Nathan expressed some thoughts he had, politely, and when out of his way
> to come across in a
Well, since Nathan asked especially for the opinions of those who
would disagree with him, I thought all was well
On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 13:33, Tony Marston
wrote:
>
> If your feeble brain can't handle the differences
> then I suggest you stick with your previous language and LEAVE PHP A
Wow, Tony, do you think in the future you could try to express
yourself with just a bit more civility and in a less
condescending tone?
Nathan expressed some thoughts he had, politely, and when out
of his way to come across in a non-critical and
non-confrontational manner.
Tony Marston wrot
"Nathan Rixham" wrote in message
news:88.0b.41390.8f512...@pb1.pair.com...
> Afternoon all,
>
> I'd love to get some votes from my fellow developers on the following, and
> indeed some opinions (especially from those who disagree).
>
> Recently I've been running in to a lot of frustrations with
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