Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 11:59 PM, Ralf Gommers wrote: > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:52 PM, Charles R Harris > wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 6:37 PM, wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 8:28 PM, Ralf Gommers >>> wrote: On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:21 PM,

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 9:39 PM, Nathaniel Smith wrote: > On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 11:59 PM, Ralf Gommers > wrote: > > > > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:52 PM, Charles R Harris < > charlesr.har...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 6:37 PM, wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Juan Nunez-Iglesias
Hi all! I've been lurking on this discussion, and don't have too much to add except to encourage a fast deprecation: I can't wait for sparse matrices to have an element-wise multiply operator. On 7 Jan 2017, 7:52 PM +1100, Ralf Gommers , wrote: > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 9:39 PM, Nathaniel Smi

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Marten van Kerkwijk
Hi All, It seems there are two steps that can be taken now and are needed no matter what: 1. Add numpy documentation describing the preferred way to handle matrices, extolling the virtues of @, and move np.matrix documentation to a deprecated section 2. Start on a new `sparse` class that is base

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Todd
On Jan 6, 2017 20:28, "Ralf Gommers" wrote: On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:21 PM, CJ Carey wrote: > > On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 6:19 PM, Ralf Gommers > wrote: > >> This sounds like a reasonable idea. Timeline could be something like: >> >> 1. Now: create new package, deprecate np.matrix in docs. >> 2

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 8:33 AM, Marten van Kerkwijk < m.h.vankerkw...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi All, > > It seems there are two steps that can be taken now and are needed no > matter what: > > 1. Add numpy documentation describing the preferred way to handle > matrices, extolling the virtues of @, an

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 9:31 AM, Todd wrote: > > > On Jan 6, 2017 20:28, "Ralf Gommers" wrote: > > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:21 PM, CJ Carey > wrote: > >> >> On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 6:19 PM, Ralf Gommers >> wrote: >> >>> This sounds like a reasonable idea. Timeline could be something like: >>

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Charles R Harris
On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:29 PM, Ralf Gommers wrote: > > > On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 9:31 AM, Todd wrote: > >> >> >> On Jan 6, 2017 20:28, "Ralf Gommers" wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:21 PM, CJ Carey >> wrote: >> >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2017 at 6:19 PM, Ralf Gommers >>> wrote: >>> >>

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Charles R Harris wrote: > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:29 PM, Ralf Gommers > wrote: > >> >> It looks to me like we're getting a bit off track here. The sparse >> matrices in scipy are heavily used, and despite rough edges pretty good at >> what they do. Deprecati

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Charles R Harris
On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 4:35 PM, Ralf Gommers wrote: > > > On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Charles R Harris < > charlesr.har...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:29 PM, Ralf Gommers >> wrote: >> >>> >>> It looks to me like we're getting a bit off track here. The sparse >>> ma

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:42 PM, Charles R Harris wrote: > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 4:35 PM, Ralf Gommers > wrote: > >> >> >> On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Charles R Harris < >> charlesr.har...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 2:29 PM, Ralf Gommers >>> wrote: >>> >>>

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread CJ Carey
I agree with Ralf; coupling these changes to sparse is a bad idea. I think that scipy.sparse will be an important consideration during the deprecation process, though, perhaps as an indicator of how painful the transition might be for third party code. I'm +1 for splitting matrices out into a sta

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Charles R Harris
On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 5:31 PM, CJ Carey wrote: > I agree with Ralf; coupling these changes to sparse is a bad idea. > > I think that scipy.sparse will be an important consideration during the > deprecation process, though, perhaps as an indicator of how painful the > transition might be for thir

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Charles R Harris
On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 4:51 PM, Ralf Gommers wrote: > > > On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:42 PM, Charles R Harris < > charlesr.har...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 4:35 PM, Ralf Gommers >> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Charles R Harris < >>> charlesr.har.

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread Ralf Gommers
On Sun, Jan 8, 2017 at 2:09 PM, Charles R Harris wrote: > > > On Sat, Jan 7, 2017 at 5:31 PM, CJ Carey > wrote: > >> I agree with Ralf; coupling these changes to sparse is a bad idea. >> >> I think that scipy.sparse will be an important consideration during the >> deprecation process, though, pe

Re: [Numpy-discussion] Deprecating matrices.

2017-01-07 Thread CJ Carey
> Decoupled or not, sparse still needs to be dealt with. What is the plan? > My view would be: - keep current sparse matrices as is (with improvements, like __numpy_func__ and the various performance improvements that regularly get done) - once one of the sparse *array* implementations progresses