2010/1/24 Petteri Räty :
> On 01/24/2010 03:02 PM, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> You can't have functioning package management without the hard
>> dependencies it requires. So both portage and python should be in the
>> system set.
>
> Why should we keep redundant infor
On 8 February 2010 16:22, AllenJB wrote:
> The current system caters perfectly for both people who want to avoid
> specific toolkits and those who don't care what toolkits they use.
I agree. The current system is best, in my opinion.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer
willing to redirect some of my activity
to this area.
1: http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/wm/index.xml
2: http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/desktop/util/index.xml
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
the coming days. Please consult https://bugs.gentoo.org/283429 and
depending bugs for more information.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
__
this won't be
necessary.
Regards,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 24 February 2010 08:15, Doug Goldstein wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 21, 2010 at 11:25 PM, Ben de Groot wrote:
[...]
>> one remaining issue: MythTV. Its current stable version uses Qt3, but
>> there is a Qt4 version in testing. In all this time the MythTV
>> maintainers have
I think this is good to go, let's get some comments from the list.
Ben
-- Forwarded message --
From: Richard Freeman
Date: 24 February 2010 16:57
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Re: Pending mask of Qt3 and MythTV
To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org
How about this revised news item:
Titl
-- Forwarded message --
From: Alec Warner
Date: 26 February 2010 04:52
Subject: Re: [RFC] News item: 2010-03-01 MythTV 0.22 Upgrade Database Corruption
To: Ben de Groot
Cc: p...@gentoo.org
Is there a simple way for users to determine what client versions they may have?
-A
On
hings
are to stay the way they are, then we better stop pretending.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
The 72 hours have passed, so I take it we are ready to officially
publish this. Richard, are you going to commit this?
Thanks,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
# Ben de Groot (01 Mar 2010)
# Grand mask of qt:3 and remaining reverse dependencies
# pending removal on 21 Mar 2010 (bug 283429)
=x11-libs/qt-3*
app-misc/chesstask
app-office/indeview
dev-db/qt-unixODBC
dev-embedded/yapide
dev-util/bouml
dev-util/gambas
dev-util/qsoapman
games-board/mahjongg3d
For some reason beyond my understanding, we have the cups useflag
enabled by default in profiles. This has started to generate circular
dependencies, at least for desktop profile users (gtk -> cups ->
poppler -> gtk). I propose we no longer enable the cups useflag.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Gro
hese
and see if any instructions are needed. They could always ask the
involved devs/teams for more info when necessary.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
is not something that is necessary for running a
desktop system.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
ce in the case of poppler.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
2010/3/4 Dawid Węgliński :
> On Wednesday 03 March 2010 22:51:10 Ben de Groot wrote:
>> I'm not talking about selectively disabling cups. My proposal is
>> to no longer enable the cups useflag in the base profile.
>
> How is that going to fix circular dependency pr
he qt flags, unless some
> application needs it, or you find that you'd prefer to have them set
> system-wide?
The toolkits should still be enabled in the default desktop profile,
they are not DE specific.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
printing.
> Printing is something I'd argue is part of a desktop environment.
And I'd argue it isn't necessarily so.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 4 March 2010 10:58, Alex Alexander wrote:
> Nice idea, +1.
>
> I too prefer dev-vcs as the category name.
My thoughts exactly.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
> Users using these profiles are expected to migrate to a new profile
> before 2010-01-04, at which point the profiles will be removed.
I think you want another date here, unless you invented time travel :p
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
default of
> USE=cups in desktop profiles is bogus for *my* Gentoo desktops.
Exactly. The last time I owned a printer is over 5 years ago. So I don't
think cups warrants to be in the standard desktop profile.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
re neither gtk+ nor cups is present
yet. But this issue can be discussed separately from whether cups
should be enabled in profiles.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
ty much same for LXDE.
As LXDE lead, I am very much for a "lighter" default desktop profile
without gnome and kde specific stuff enabled (as they are going to be
in their own subprofiles). There is no need for a separate profile for
LXDE, just a base desktop profile without too much bloat.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
rked stable, but I am against having
it pulled in on systems that don't need it.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
agree there. You did not seem to grasp the following part:
>> But this issue can be discussed separately from whether cups
>> should be enabled in profiles.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
was:
>> What it fixes is (1) the circular dependency that people run into on a
>> fresh install and the default desktop profile, and (2) the default
>> dependency on cups that many users do not need.
But if you choose to ignore what I actually write, then I'd better stop
respondi
eless version.
Another possible solution is to rename the package to a unique
string like dev-lang/python3, tho I agree that is sub-optimal.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
d to docs that refer to the desktop profile, yes. That's
a good point. Let's start identifying which docs need updating.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
rm essential, so you will have a very hard time convincing
people that this is the best solution.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 4 March 2010 19:17, Victor Ostorga wrote:
> 0.8.5 was released on february 23, 2010 and the patch at bug
> 255453 seems to work fine.
> Please don't remove one of the greatest open source games.
So step up and maintain it!
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (q
On 5 March 2010 15:22, Markos Chandras wrote:
> On Friday 05 March 2010 15:17:06 Ben de Groot wrote:
>> So step up and maintain it!
>>
> games herd already maintains that package . At least this is what I see on
> metadata.xml
Nominally, yes. But if a package has open QA
I usually do is mail the
maintainer or herd to which it is assigned, and ask if there are any
objections to fixing it. If no objections are raised within a reasonable
timeframe (depending on the seriousness of the bug), I would go ahead.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
package... I understand they like that sort of thing.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 6 March 2010 10:11, Nirbheek Chauhan wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 2:36 AM, Ben de Groot wrote:
>>> If no, I can split off utils from poppler - with CMake it's effortless.
>>
>> We just rejoined the split poppler into one package again. So if you
>> are g
ngs too thinly otherwise. And even for the
more involved bumps it could be handy to have users around for
testing.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 10 March 2010 19:50, Sebastian Pipping wrote:
> On 03/10/10 14:59, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> I think it would be better to have it all happen on the same day.
> The thing is bugday will soon not be thin anymore: it will require all
> the attention of all online devs: there weill b
roblem is that we want to prevent that from happening.
Or at the very least advise our users that they should mask
python-3* unless they want it to be pulled in.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
hy should users have to compile multiple
python versions, if they only use one anyway?
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
e are good to go!
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
up
> or point me to the relevant documentation?
>
See http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/qa/treecleaners/ and the policy doc
referred to on that page.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 11 March 2010 21:20, Mart Raudsepp wrote:
> On Thu, 2010-03-11 at 02:36 +0100, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> Seeing as there were no further comments, I think we are good to go!
>
> I suggest reading my comments...
Unless I missed something, you didn't make any comments on this
The Qt team
finds the mysql dependency that was added to the desktop profile
three months ago (see bug #291996) unacceptable. How would you
propose to solve this without splitting the desktop profile?
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
ackages can use the
kde-sunset overlay.
1:
http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev-announce/msg_f295c1c2d9d70238d289de3a7ed5bf5c.xml
2:
http://archives.gentoo.org/gentoo-dev-announce/msg_d851e05567d538b662f34de8dfdb7316.xml
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
eaners project.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
? Maybe I can help there.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux developer (qt, media, lxde, desktop-misc)
__
On 13 March 2010 00:07, Ryan Hill wrote:
> On Fri, 12 Mar 2010 18:33:12 +0100
> Ben de Groot wrote:
>> Abandoned packages do not belong in the portage tree. That's
>> why we have a treecleaners project.
>
> The treecleaners project is tasked with keeping these pac
On 14 March 2010 06:09, James Cloos wrote:
>>>>>> "BdG" == Ben de Groot writes:
>
> BdG> Abandoned packages do not belong in the portage tree.
>
> Nonsense. That attitude only servers to harm the user base.
You're wrong. It serves to protect
ython 3 stays
> as far away as possible from any system that doesn't need it.
And the best way to do that is to package.mask it.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
nt being the bottleneck that it is (with candidates
waiting many months), it is good to have another option
for people who want to contribute. In my personal experience
proxy-maintenance is a good way into eventual devhood.
There is no reason not to promote the possibility of
proxy-maintenance.
Cheers
On 18 March 2010 21:53, Doktor Notor wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 21:27:50 +0100
> Ben de Groot wrote:
>
>> > Since the last option will take time in any case, I guess the first
>> > option is the best to achieve the desired goal: make sure Python 3
>> > st
into the dependency graph.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
On 24 March 2010 17:43, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
wrote:
> 2010-03-23 20:28:38 Ben de Groot napisał(a):
>> On 23 March 2010 20:13, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
>> wrote:
>> > I'm attaching updated news item, which will be committed soon.
>>
On 24 March 2010 18:23, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
wrote:
> 2010-03-24 17:56:48 Ben de Groot napisał(a):
>> On 24 March 2010 17:43, Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
>> wrote:
>> > 2010-03-23 20:28:38 Ben de Groot napisał(a):
>> >> On 23 March 20
or issue for most stable users, unless we're expecting breakage.
>
> Rich
Did you even read the whole thread? And the other one named
"Packages pulling in python-3*, also they dont require it"?
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
ee that this is the minimum that should be done. But our
Python lead stubbornly refuses to honor this reasonable request.
Not so cheerful,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
, and what
the criteria for inclusion are. Once you clarify the goal and the criteria
and ask for which packages should be included on that basis, I think
you'll get the answers you're looking for.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
On 31 March 2010 07:28, Alec Warner wrote:
> This thread is primarily engaged in gauging interest in such a setup.
> Please reply if you are interested (or go vote on the bug.)
I am definitely interested.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
need poisonous people, so let's
get rid of them.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
thdrawn
from various other herds I was involved in, I now have some time and
motivation to pick up something new. I wish to dedicate this to something
that will really help and I believe these discussions are a good starting
point. I hope it will trigger others in similar ways.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
o we keep to the original "free for all" model, with all the spam
that includes, or do we go with registered users only? I think the
latter is the smarter option. I also think we will want to mark
certain pages "official" and lock down editing rights.
Is there anything else we
m to all the resources
they might need. It also means our existing documentation needs to
be brought and kept up to date.
Are there any other ideas on how to improve our recruitment process?
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
ou can help. Stay in touch!
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
e) and tag those pages as reviewed.
I agree this is a good idea.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
he LXDE guide, or the Qt4 ebuild
development howto) as well as keeping existing documentation up to
date. GuideXML documents are often experienced as an unnecessary
barrier.
What else do we want it for and how would that impact organization?
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
of GuideXML, so it doesn't really make sense
to keep that around when we have a better solution.
I know there are people who do not agree with me on this last point,
which is why I see that as a later and separate goal. We can cross
that bridge when we come to it.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
o use it or not.
At this point they don't, so GDP-maintained documentation is not
included in the scope of the wiki. I do hope that will change in the
future. But I can live with it if it doesn't.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
On 4 April 2010 10:48, Antoni Grzymala wrote:
>
> Has anyone considered the immensely powerful twiki?
No. So tell us why we should. Specifically, how does it compare to
MediaWiki in terms of features and performance?
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
On 4 April 2010 09:31, Joshua Saddler wrote:
> On Sun, 4 Apr 2010 03:20:53 +0200
> Ben de Groot wrote:
>> >> GuideXML documents are often experienced as an unnecessary
>> >> barrier.
>> >
>> > I think you should clearly state again that this is not
On 4 April 2010 17:36, wrote:
> Hm. Can you all just talk to the admin of gentoo-wiki and make it official?
Been there, done that. He's not interested.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
the number one community site we have: gentoo.org, with all the
infrastructure support that entails.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
is talking about ripping off and destroying, but you. There is
no need for such dramatic language.
> If an "official wiki" starts up and becomes a major documentation centre
> for user contributions,
That is the intent, and we hope you will work with us to make that
happen.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
aterials needed. Obviously this team would confer with recruiters
and incorporate their feedback into its work.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
ead that are not at all central
to our reasons for starting an official Gentoo Wiki. It's not about
hijacking your content. We already stated that we prefer to stick
with the license used for most other Gentoo documentation, which
prevents simply copying your content. So you don't need to
On 3 April 2010 20:56, George Prowse wrote:
> Does mediawiki have captcha ability?
Yes, there are a number of solutions for that.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
nd
> there's much, much more content constantly written for /proj/ and dev.g.o
> than for /doc/. So don't try to tell me that people don't have at least
> passing familiarity with it.
That's not the point. The problem is that most of us don't use it
often enough to be sufficiently fluent in it, and you will never use
it for anything else but gentoo.org pages. Moreover, there is no web
UI for quick edits, with helpful buttons and hints...
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
wiki?
> Maybe best to just think about this and not answer it here.
That's a very good question, and I hope to hear some answers,
especially from users.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
reas if you
> have to keep looking up the basics. However, with practice you *will* get
> better. :)
If there would be a need for that, then yes, I would get better.
Anyway, this exchange has gone well beyond the original scope of the
thread, and neither of us seems to have come much closer to convincing
the other. So I'll leave it at that.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
e right fit, as we very much also
are about offering services to developers for more "internal" use,
such as project meeting agendas. I do think we should work closely
together, like the other "participating projects" mentioned on the
UserRel project page.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Linux Qt project lead developer
ation of the wiki
- moderation
1: http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/wiki/
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
moderation.
It looks like we're getting together a nice team, but we sure could
use a little more help! At this point, we're still debating and
testing, so there isn't anything to moderate yet. But soon we will
have.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
brought up to date.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
existing relevant information. Even
better would be to have as much of that relevant information as
possible consolidated into one place, so that everyone knows where to
go to look that up. Can council decide to see this implemented?
Thanks,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
des on global issues and policies that
affect multiple projects in Gentoo."
GLEP 39 also says "Global issues will be decided by an elected Gentoo council."
So all I'm asking is to do your job and make decisions on issues that
affect all of Gentoo. The issues I brought up are
On 7 April 2010 20:05, Denis Dupeyron wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> So all I'm asking is to do your job and make decisions on issues that
>> affect all of Gentoo. The issues I brought up are wider than a single
>> individual project.
roj/en/base/embedded/index.xml>
> lists members for it but the page source does not
> hold it, explicitly. where does it come from?
It does, as can be seen in
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/embedded/index.xml?passthru=1
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
t needs to be done to improve things. And yes, I
want the council to call for volunteers, and where necessary to
recruit people who are able to help.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
On 8 April 2010 21:51, Ryan Hill wrote:
> why are we setting up a user wiki when a very popular one already exists?
Because some devs request things like this:
> can we can lock certain pages down to dev edits only?
In our wiki we will be able to.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt p
o are not
even part of the Gentoo Wiki Project. Any user (or dev) with
constructive input is welcome. And as you volunteered, you are part of
the project.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
om already existing
> unofficial Gentoo-related Wiki admins.
You are quite wrong here, as Guy was one of the first to volunteer for
the official wiki project. It is the bickering about its status that
apparently has demotivated him.
Cheers,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
Allen, if you don't have anything constructive to add, then please
refrain from adding to this thread.
Thanks,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
27;s what we have overlays for. Move it to the tree once it's ready.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
On 10 April 2010 06:10, William Hubbs wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 05, 2010 at 01:19:32AM +0200, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> On 3 April 2010 20:56, George Prowse wrote:
>> > Does mediawiki have captcha ability?
>>
>> Yes, there are a number of solutions for that.
>
> I r
ge that makes for substantial improvement rather than
managing change.” (quoted from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leadership)
You've just shown a striking lack of such leadership.
No cheers this time,
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
ble or
unwilling to do so, step down and make room for somebody else who is
more qualified for the job.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
ontributions and hopefully you keep on that road.
Not if you think it is okay for Calchan to insult me the way he did.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
On 10 April 2010 23:23, Petteri Räty wrote:
> On 04/11/2010 12:18 AM, Ben de Groot wrote:
>> Not if you think it is okay for Calchan to insult me the way he did.
>
> Could he have chosen better words - yes
> Were there errors in content - no
How about:
> You have lat
On 11 April 2010 00:06, Denis Dupeyron wrote:
> On Sat, Apr 10, 2010 at 3:43 PM, Petteri Räty wrote:
>> On 04/11/2010 12:37 AM, Ben de Groot wrote:
>>> How about:
>>>
>>>> You have lately been increasingly critical but not constructively
>>>
>
eyes a bit, but calling problems by their name is
> part of fixing them.
Except when someone else does it, then calling the problem of lack of
leadership suddenly becomes "immature political ranting". Nice try.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
nux
Wiki", suggesting to somebody who is unaware of the situation that it
is an official project.
--
Ben de Groot
Gentoo Qt project lead developer
Gentoo Wiki project lead
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