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On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 02:54:46 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> On 08/15/2013 02:48 AM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
> >
> >> Multiple cases like mandating bash 3.2 that we don't even have in
> >> tree anymore,
> >
> > There is =app-shells/bash-3.2_p51 in the Portage t
On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 02:56:18 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> On 08/15/2013 02:52 AM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
> > On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 02:13:07 +0200
> > hasufell wrote:
> >
> >> I have no idea what that means. Global changes are _always_
> >> discussed in the community. PMS doesn't add anything to that
> >>
On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 07:50:16 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> > Because if you want to allow multiple package managers as an option,
>
> If - but why would we do that?
To give our users choice.
http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/about.xml
http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/philosophy.xml
http://www.gentoo.o
On 14/08/13 17:56, Peter Stuge wrote:
> Luca Barbato wrote:
>>> [3] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/gerrit
>>
>> And all boils down to the fact gerrit needs to be fixed to take
>> patches from a mailing list
>
> Usually Gerrit just needs an OpenID in order to accept git push via SS
On 08/15/2013 02:52 AM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 02:13:07 +0200
> hasufell wrote:
>
>> I have no idea what that means. Global changes are _always_ discussed
>> in the community. PMS doesn't add anything to that process.
>
> It puts the consensus and / or decisions in one canonica
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On 08/15/2013 02:48 AM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
>
>> Multiple cases like mandating bash 3.2 that we don't even have in
>> tree anymore,
>
> There is =app-shells/bash-3.2_p51 in the Portage tree.
>
Fun facts: It is in unstable branch.
So while I write e
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On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 02:13:07 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> I have no idea what that means. Global changes are _always_ discussed
> in the community. PMS doesn't add anything to that process.
It puts the consensus and / or decisions in one canonical catego
On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 07:42:21 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/15/2013 04:21 AM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> > On 14 August 2013 21:17, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
> >>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
> >>
> >>> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
> >>> prog
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On 08/15/2013 01:23 AM, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2013-08-15, o godz. 00:19:40 hasufell
> napisał(a):
>
>> On 08/14/2013 10:56 PM, Markos Chandras wrote:
>>>
>>> If you want PMS to go away, and call portage the one-and-true
>>> PM for Gentoo, then
On 08/15/2013 04:56 AM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> On 14 August 2013 21:41, hasufell wrote:
>> On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>>>
And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
progress in gentoo.
>>>
On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 4:42 PM, Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/15/2013 04:21 AM, Markos Chandras wrote:
>> On 14 August 2013 21:17, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>>>
And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
progress in
On 08/15/2013 04:21 AM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> On 14 August 2013 21:17, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
>>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>>
>>> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
>>> progress in gentoo.
>>
>> Perhaps these basic notions of how Gento
Dnia 2013-08-15, o godz. 00:19:40
hasufell napisał(a):
> On 08/14/2013 10:56 PM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> >
> > If you want PMS to go away, and call portage the one-and-true PM for
> > Gentoo, then it's probably something for the Council to decide.
> >
>
> I think that would make sense. We don
On Thu, 15 Aug 2013 00:19:40 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 10:56 PM, Markos Chandras wrote:
> > If you want PMS to go away, and call portage the one-and-true PM for
> > Gentoo, then it's probably something for the Council to decide.
> >
>
> I think that would make sense. We don't have en
On 08/14/2013 10:56 PM, Markos Chandras wrote:
>
> If you want PMS to go away, and call portage the one-and-true PM for
> Gentoo, then it's probably something for the Council to decide.
>
I think that would make sense. We don't have enough resources for such
fun and overcoming PMS burdens has be
Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:56:09
Ciaran McCreesh napisał(a):
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 11:50:56 -0400
> "Anthony G. Basile" wrote:
> > On 08/14/2013 11:41 AM, Patrick Lauer wrote:
> > > On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > >> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> > >> Sergey Popov wro
On 14 August 2013 21:41, hasufell wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
>>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>>
>>> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
>>> progress in gentoo.
>>
>> Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo devel
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 22:41:02 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> Why don't you respond to my technical points then? PMS is blocking
> progress, again, because it does not reflect reality.
>
> I don't even see a reason why we should keep up that effort.
PMS reflects the most recent Council vote on "what's al
On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>
>> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
>> progress in gentoo.
>
> Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo development works
You certainly are not an a
I've always found those class = something.that.is.clearly.portage.specific
lines a bit of a bummer, since they're very tied to the internal
functioning of portage and not a generic standard for how things should be
defined.
Before we add sets to the tree, maybe there should be some discussion abou
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:16:18 +0100
Markos Chandras wrote:
> My understanding is that the cvs tree should be PMS compatible and
> since 'sets' are not part of PMS that means that it would be wise not
> to use them yet.
> It is unfortunate that nobody seems to have realized that all these
> years th
On 14 August 2013 21:17, Ulrich Mueller wrote:
>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
>
>> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
>> progress in gentoo.
>
> Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo development works
You certainly are not an
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013, hasufell wrote:
> And their lack of time (to be polite) should not block general
> progress in gentoo.
Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo development works
>>>
>>> You certainly are not an authority when it comes to that
>>> question...
>>
>>
On 14 August 2013 21:13, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 22:03:38 +0200
> Tom Wijsman wrote:
>> > Using the conventional view of what a "set" is,
>>
>> But what kind of view would that be, a mathematical set, a set from a
>> prior discussion or a completely different set? I assume th
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 22:03:38 +0200
Tom Wijsman wrote:
> > Using the conventional view of what a "set" is,
>
> But what kind of view would that be, a mathematical set, a set from a
> prior discussion or a completely different set? I assume the first
> one.
The rather outdated GLEP 21 says they're
On 08/14/2013 10:07 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:59:37 +0200
> hasufell wrote:
>>> You're fundamentally misunderstanding how PMS and Gentoo development
>>> works.
>>
>> I think you are fundamentally misunderstanding. I think gentoo should
>> stop supporting downstreams IF su
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:59:37 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> > You're fundamentally misunderstanding how PMS and Gentoo development
> > works.
>
> I think you are fundamentally misunderstanding. I think gentoo should
> stop supporting downstreams IF supporting them means blocking
> progress.
What's this
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 20:28:02 +0100
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> [.. SNIP ..]
Thank you.
> > > In order for sets to be added to the tree, we need a spec, we need
> > > to decide where sets are allowed (package.mask?), and we need an
> > > implementation.
> >
> > Sets in package.mask sounds unrelia
On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 12:51 PM, Michael Weber wrote:
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>
> On 08/14/2013 09:28 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>> Using the conventional view of what a "set" is, the point is to
>> allow you to mask, say, kde7 using a single line, and then define
>> w
On 08/14/2013 09:51 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:34:51 +0200
> hasufell wrote:
>> On 08/14/2013 03:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>>> Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:53:17
>>> Sergey Popov napisał(a):
>>>
14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42
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On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:53:26 +0200
Michael Weber wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 09:51 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo development works should
> > be added to the new developer quiz, so we can be sure people
> > unders
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On 08/14/2013 09:51 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> Perhaps these basic notions of how Gentoo development works should
> be added to the new developer quiz, so we can be sure people
> understand the appropriate ways of making changes and where the
> pow
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 21:34:51 +0200
hasufell wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 03:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> > Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:53:17
> > Sergey Popov napisał(a):
> >
> >> 14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
> >>> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> >>> wrote: Right now, howe
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On 08/14/2013 09:28 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> Using the conventional view of what a "set" is, the point is to
> allow you to mask, say, kde7 using a single line, and then define
> what kde7 is using a set. Then the user can unmask kde7 without
> h
On 08/14/2013 03:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:53:17
> Sergey Popov napisał(a):
>
>> 14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
>>> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
>>> wrote:
>>> Right now, however,
>>> it might be useful if only to get a sense for how th
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 20:57:57 +0200
Tom Wijsman wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 19:09:40 +0100
> Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > Er, look at the first post in the thread:
>
> That was about the repository, not about the PMS; the question was
> whether we need to respect the PMS
Ask yourself this: if it
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 19:09:40 +0100
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> Er, look at the first post in the thread:
That was about the repository, not about the PMS; the question was
whether we need to respect the PMS and why it misses this _feature_,
for which no proposed specification exists afaik, so I don
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 18:54:40 +0200
Tom Wijsman wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 16:56:09 +0100
> Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>
> > > > On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> > > > > Sergey Popov wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Why it was not
On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
> The discussion at stake here is "Can we add sets to the tree? If so,
> should everyone be able to do that free or by prior discussion?" and I
> don't think that any reply to this whole sub thread benefits anyone.
So, I already added my two ce
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 16:58:01 +0100
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:53:09 +0800
> Patrick Lauer wrote:
>
> > On 08/14/2013 11:44 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:56 +0800
> > > Patrick Lauer wrote:
> > >
> > > > So fix PMS to reflect reality. Again.
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 16:56:09 +0100
Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > > On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> > > > Sergey Popov wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Why it was not added as a part of the PMS? Some implementation
> > > > > flaws? Or maybe
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:59:28 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> > Uhm. Look at the class line.
> >
> > https://git.overlays.gentoo.org/gitweb/?p=proj/kde.git;a=blob;f=sets.conf;h=1f4c4263f48e5360606c1acc97fbab64b03541b7;hb=HEAD
>
> ... a static identifier.
>
> I would usually call that a constant. No
Luca Barbato wrote:
> > [3] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/gerrit
>
> And all boils down to the fact gerrit needs to be fixed to take
> patches from a mailing list
Usually Gerrit just needs an OpenID in order to accept git push via SSH.
That seems significantly better to me than
The original maintainers of the package app-laptop/prey have decided[1]
they do no longer want to maintain this package; therefore it has been
assigned to maintainer-needed@g.o, if anyone is interested in
maintaining this package then feel free to pick it up. It only has two
bugs open at the moment
On 14 August 2013 16:59, Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 11:54 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:50:36 +0800
>> Patrick Lauer wrote:
>>> On 08/14/2013 11:43 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:03 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 10
On 08/14/2013 11:41 AM, Patrick Lauer wrote:
On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
Sergey Popov wrote:
I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
yet(when we updated it for EAPI changes), my question is: 'why?'. It
is one of th
On 08/14/2013 11:54 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:50:36 +0800
> Patrick Lauer wrote:
>> On 08/14/2013 11:43 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:03 +0800
>>> Patrick Lauer wrote:
On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 201
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:53:09 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 11:44 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:56 +0800
> > Patrick Lauer wrote:
> >> On 08/14/2013 09:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> > On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> > wrote: Righ
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 11:50:56 -0400
"Anthony G. Basile" wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 11:41 AM, Patrick Lauer wrote:
> > On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> >> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> >> Sergey Popov wrote:
> >>> I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
On 14/08/13 01:40, Ryan Hill wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Aug 2013 07:13:13 +0200
> Luca Barbato wrote:
>
>> On 13/08/13 03:41, Ryan Hill wrote:
>>> I don't see any reason to keep this masked other than bug #416069, which
>>> needs to be fixed anyways. How does Friday sound?
>>>
>>> https://bugs.gentoo.o
On 08/13/2013 04:10 PM, Tomáš Chvátal wrote:
> As per my comment in bugzilla [1] I said that the patch should be
> submitted upstream prior having it in cvs.
>
> Yet you decided to completely ignore my statement and just smash in the
> patch anyway [2].
>
> Please don't do this ever again. We had
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:50:36 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 11:43 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:03 +0800
> > Patrick Lauer wrote:
> >> On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> >>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> >>> Sergey Popov wrote:
> I
On 13/08/13 10:10, Tomáš Chvátal wrote:
> [3] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/gerrit
And all boils down to the fact gerrit needs to be fixed to take patches
from a mailing list or provide some sane alias to cope with it's
specific ways...
lu
On 08/14/2013 11:44 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:56 +0800
> Patrick Lauer wrote:
>> On 08/14/2013 09:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> wrote: Right now, however,
> it might be useful if only to get a sense for ho
On 08/14/2013 11:43 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:03 +0800
> Patrick Lauer wrote:
>> On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
>>> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
>>> Sergey Popov wrote:
I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
y
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:56 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 09:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
> >>> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> >>> wrote: Right now, however,
> >>> it might be useful if only to get a sense for how they're being
> >>> used, trade ideas, etc.
>
> >
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 23:41:03 +0800
Patrick Lauer wrote:
> On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> > On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> > Sergey Popov wrote:
> >> I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
> >> yet(when we updated it for EAPI changes), my question
On 08/14/2013 09:02 PM, Michał Górny wrote:
>>> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
>>> wrote:
>>> Right now, however,
>>> it might be useful if only to get a sense for how they're being used,
>>> trade ideas, etc.
> No, we can't. Sets are portage-specific, the tree needs to follow
On 08/14/2013 10:17 PM, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
> Sergey Popov wrote:
>> I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
>> yet(when we updated it for EAPI changes), my question is: 'why?'. It
>> is one of the long-standing feature of quite exp
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 15:29:00 + (UTC)
Duncan <1i5t5.dun...@cox.net> wrote:
> Sergey Popov posted on Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400 as excerpted:
> > Why [were sets] not added as a part of the PMS? Some implementation
> > flaws? Or maybe, architecture problems?
>
> [TL;DR folks, skip to last pa
Sergey Popov posted on Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400 as excerpted:
> Why [were sets] not added as a part of the PMS? Some implementation
> flaws? Or maybe, architecture problems?
[TL;DR folks, skip to last paragraph summary.]
(As a user who has been using sets as they appear in the kde overlay
On Tue, 13 Aug 2013 22:59:49 +0200
"Andreas K. Huettel" wrote:
> anymore but default to English. The intention behind this is to
intention behind this is => rationale is
> have a hard time analyzing localized builds.
analyzing localized builds => reading build logs in foreign languages
> Thi
"Paweł Hajdan, Jr." writes:
> Sounds good. Note that it doesn't need to be set up as "against
> Canonical". Just do the best thing for the users.
Thanks. I'd take your advice.
>> I would like to kick out a sub-project of Gentoo targeting smartphone
>> and tablets. It would be nice to find out a
Daniel Campbell writes:
> I'm not a developer but this project's existence would motivate me to
> get a compatible smartphone and test this new Gentoo version on it,
> assuming it's also capable of standard phone calls and texts, etc.
This assumption certainly holds firm. It is firstly a phone a
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 17:07:32 +0400
Sergey Popov wrote:
> I am all for the standarts, but as we did not brought sets to PMS
> yet(when we updated it for EAPI changes), my question is: 'why?'. It
> is one of the long-standing feature of quite experimental 2.2_alpha
> branch, that should finally come
Dear Duncan,
Duncan <1i5t5.dun...@cox.net> writes:
> heroxbd posted on Mon, 12 Aug 2013 16:45:56 +0900 as excerpted:
>
>> I have made a GLEP draft to standardize our recent effort on using our
>> own libc from portage inside Prefix.
>>
>> At present only glibc on linux is supported.
>>
>> The r
Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 23:12:08
Michael Palimaka napisał(a):
> On 14/08/2013 23:02, Michał Górny wrote:
> > No, we can't. Sets are portage-specific, the tree needs to follow PMS.
> Are you saying we can't use sets at all in the tree, or we can't use
> them to replace existing meta packages?
W
On 14/08/2013 23:02, Michał Górny wrote:
No, we can't. Sets are portage-specific, the tree needs to follow PMS.
Are you saying we can't use sets at all in the tree, or we can't use
them to replace existing meta packages?
14.08.2013 17:02, Michał Górny пишет:
> Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:53:17
> Sergey Popov napisał(a):
>
>> 14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
>>> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
>>> wrote:
>>> Right now, however,
>>> it might be useful if only to get a sense for how they're
Dnia 2013-08-14, o godz. 16:53:17
Sergey Popov napisał(a):
> 14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
> > On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> > wrote:
> > Right now, however,
> > it might be useful if only to get a sense for how they're being used,
> > trade ideas, etc.
>
> Well,
14.08.2013 16:05, Rich Freeman пишет:
> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka
> wrote:
> Right now, however,
> it might be useful if only to get a sense for how they're being used,
> trade ideas, etc.
Well, we can use sets as replacement for metapackages(for example,
qt-meta, leechcr
On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 7:42 AM, Michael Palimaka wrote:
> Should everyone be free to add sets at will, or should each addition be
> discussed first, similar to adding new global USE flags?
While I don't want to deter people from creating them, it probably
wouldn't hurt to at least do a little bi
Now that portage-2.2 is in ~arch, we should now be able to add sets to
the tree.
How should we go about doing this? In some overlays, the repository root
has sets/{foo,bar,etc} and sets.conf which might look like this:
[gentoo sets]
class = portage.sets.files.StaticFileSet
multiset = true
dir
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Donnie Berkholz schrieb:
> On 14:37 Tue 13 Aug , Rich Freeman wrote:
>> If a maintainer is holding something up for months by all means
>> escalate it if you think it is justified, but if a maintainer just
>> wants a few days to look into things,
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