Repost-Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Vic Cekvenich
Jim Barnett wrote: Also, having owners assign copyrights to ASF would probably be a mistake. First, ASF really doesn't have the resources or (I would guess) the interest in enforcing copyrights assigned to it when a third party uses the contributed work outside the scope of the Apache licens

[STATUS] (incubator) Wed Sep 15 23:45:21 EDT 2004

2004-09-15 Thread Rodent of Unusual Size
APACHE INCUBATOR PROJECT STATUS: -*-indented-text-*- Last modified at [$Date: 2003/11/11 00:01:00 $] Web site: http://Incubator.Apache.Org/ Wiki page: http://Nagoya.Apache.Org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheIncubatorProjectPages [note: the Web site is the 'official' documenta

Re: Repost-Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Vic Cekvenich
Vic Cekvenich wrote: Jim Barnett wrote: Also, having owners assign copyrights to ASF would probably be a mistake. First, ASF really doesn't have the resources or (I would guess) the interest in enforcing copyrights assigned to it when a third party uses the contributed work outside the scope

Repost: Re-: Subject: Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Vic
Jim Barnett wrote: Also, having owners assign copyrights to ASF would probably be a mistake. First, ASF really doesn't have the resources or (I would guess) the interest in enforcing copyrights assigned to it when a third party uses the contributed work outside the scope of the Apache license. Se

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Vic
Brian Behlendorf wrote: The original copyright notice shouldn't be thrown away of course, but perhaps moved to another part of the package to denote its historic origin? Brian I agree Brian ;-) This would be wrong: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=geronimo-dev&m=106875482022176&w=2 .V -- Ple

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Vic
Roy T. Fielding wrote: The alternative being that we start asking for copyright assignments. I assume that was the case? .V ps/ot: http://jroller.com/page/erAck/20040915#sun_ms_covenant_and_openoffice BTW, I don't claim that my workaround of having the copyright owner change the copyright n

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Dain Sundstrom
On Sep 15, 2004, at 3:59 PM, Roy T. Fielding wrote: On Sep 15, 2004, at 2:55 PM, Jennifer B Machovec wrote: I think the short-term (and maybe even long-term) resolution to the copyright notice issue may be having the ASF copyright notice in each main file clearly apply to the whole project. This

Subject: Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Jim Barnett
Hello. I am one of BEA's attorneys. I've been working with Cliff Schmidt and the BEA Workshop team in connection with BEA's Beehive contribution to Apache, and in that context have considered the issue being discussed on the thread I've cut and pasted below (i.e., whether it is appropriate for

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Brian Behlendorf
On Wed, 15 Sep 2004, Roy T. Fielding wrote: That is correct. 2 main issues with any codebase that the ASF develops is that (1) it be under the Apache License and (2) that the Copyright be assigned to the ASF. So it must be licensed "by" the ASF (via the AL) and "owned" by the ASF. That is not corre

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Roy T. Fielding
On Sep 15, 2004, at 2:55 PM, Jennifer B Machovec wrote: I think the short-term (and maybe even long-term) resolution to the copyright notice issue may be having the ASF copyright notice in each main file clearly apply to the whole project. This could read, for example: "Apache Derby is (c) Copyri

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Noel J. Bergman
Dain Sundstrom wrote: > how about someone writes a shell script that does the > change and get someone at IBM to execute it? As I understand it, it doesn't matter how they make the change, so long as they are the ones who commit it. --- Noel -

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Jennifer B Machovec
I think the short-term (and maybe even long-term) resolution to the copyright notice issue may be having the ASF copyright notice in each main file clearly apply to the whole project. This could read, for example: "Apache Derby is (c) Copyright The Apache Software Foundation 2004. All rights

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Dain Sundstrom
Just an idea but, how about someone writes a shell script that does the change and get someone at IBM to execute it? -dain On Sep 15, 2004, at 2:19 PM, Noel J. Bergman wrote: We've just finished a conference with Jennifer. As I understand it, her issues are not with the practice but with how to

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Noel J. Bergman
We've just finished a conference with Jennifer. As I understand it, her issues are not with the practice but with how to implement that practice properly. As I understand Roy's comment, the practice is correct, but the legal magic is that IBM needs to be the party that does it. --- Noel

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Rodent of Unusual Size
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Roy T. Fielding wrote: > > That is not correct: CLAs and software grants are licenses, > not assignments. Larry Lessig says that the code should retain > each contributor's copyright. Apache has traditionally used the > Apache copyright alone to make it clear

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Roy T . Fielding
That is correct. 2 main issues with any codebase that the ASF develops is that (1) it be under the Apache License and (2) that the Copyright be assigned to the ASF. So it must be licensed "by" the ASF (via the AL) and "owned" by the ASF. That is not correct: CLAs and software grants are licenses, n

Re: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Jim Jagielski
On Sep 15, 2004, at 2:50 PM, Cliff Schmidt wrote: IIUC, it is the ASF's policy that all copyright notices, particularly in a distribution should read "Copyright The Apache Software Foundation." That is correct. 2 main issues with any codebase that the ASF develops is that (1) it be under the

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Cliff Schmidt
Noel J. Bergman wrote on Wednesday, September 15, 2004 12:09 AM: > Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > >> I've been lurking on the Derby list, and there's a discussion >> about code copyright. Why isn't all the code (c) ASF? > > The files should all have the AL v2. The license file provided > includes

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Noel J. Bergman
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > I've been lurking on the Derby list, and there's a discussion > about code copyright. Why isn't all the code (c) ASF? The files should all have the AL v2. The license file provided includes the copyright. Any other notices, such as historical credits, go into the NO

RE: Derby code copyright question

2004-09-15 Thread Noel J. Bergman
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > I've been lurking on the Derby list, and there's a discussion > about code copyright. Why isn't all the code (c) ASF? The files should all have the AL v2. The license file provided includes the copyright. Any other notices, such as historical credits, go into the NO