Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 28/06/2024 18:42, Keith Bainbridge wrote: On 28/6/24 16:13, John Crawley wrote: Except that midnight is also 0:00, so you still have the am/pm confusion. They should have kept 0:00 just for midnight really. That's the first time I've seen anything to justify calling midnight AM. Thankyou

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 28/6/24 16:13, John Crawley wrote: Except that midnight is also 0:00, so you still have the am/pm confusion. They should have kept 0:00 just for midnight really. That's the first time I've seen anything to justify calling midnight AM. Thankyou But how can mid-day be after mid-day? Ah:

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 28/06/2024 14:00, Erwan DAVID wrote: Le 28 juin 2024 13:12:03 David Wright a écrit : On Wed 26 Jun 2024 at 12:50:32 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: On Wed, Jun 26, 2024 at 11:25:38 -0500, John Hasler wrote: I wrote: 12 Noon and 12 Midnight works. David Wright wrote: Except that The Wan

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

Le 28 juin 2024 13:12:03 David Wright a écrit : On Wed 26 Jun 2024 at 12:50:32 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: On Wed, Jun 26, 2024 at 11:25:38 -0500, John Hasler wrote: > I wrote: > > 12 Noon and 12 Midnight works. > > David Wright wrote: > > Except that The Wanderer's "strictly correct" versi

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Wed 26 Jun 2024 at 12:50:32 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Wed, Jun 26, 2024 at 11:25:38 -0500, John Hasler wrote: > > I wrote: > > > 12 Noon and 12 Midnight works. > > > > David Wright wrote: > > > Except that The Wanderer's "strictly correct" version, M for noon, > > > is out there in so

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Wed, Jun 26, 2024 at 11:25:38 -0500, John Hasler wrote: > I wrote: > > 12 Noon and 12 Midnight works. > > David Wright wrote: > > Except that The Wanderer's "strictly correct" version, M for noon, > > is out there in some pre-2008 documents. > > If you use M for noon you should use either AM

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

I wrote: > 12 Noon and 12 Midnight works. David Wright wrote: > Except that The Wanderer's "strictly correct" version, M for noon, > is out there in some pre-2008 documents. If you use M for noon you should use either AM or PM for midnight. -- John Hasler j...@sugarbit.com Elmwood, WI USA

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 6/25/24 20:36, Keith Bainbridge wrote: On 23/6/24 23:22, e...@gmx.us wrote: I started using 24 hour time in junior high school with digital watches.  I just thought it made more sense, especially for setting alarms.  Several decades later I've not seen any reason to change, though it annoys

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

David Wright wrote: > On Mon 24 Jun 2024 at 17:12:18 (-0500), John Hasler wrote: > > The Wanderer writes: > > > (Similar logic could be used for 11:59:59 PM, 12:00 M, and > > > 12:00:01 AM, where the standalone M would stand for "midnight". > > > That does expose one unfortunate weakness of this

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 25/6/24 07:53, The Wanderer wrote: Although I don't think anything or anyone actually does it this way, I think strictly speaking the correct 12-hour notation for that time would be "12:00 M" - followed by 12:00:01 PM, and preceded by 11:59:59 AM. Sorry to repeat you - well you did it MUC

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 24/6/24 23:41, Erwan David wrote: AM/PM would not be so strange if between 11AM and 1 PM it was 12 AM ... Umm 12Meridian?? -- All the best Keith Bainbridge keithr...@gmail.com keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com +61 (0)447 667 468 UTC + 10:00

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 24/6/24 00:53, Curt wrote: On 2024-06-23, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: I think we are losing sight of the fact that all of timekeeping is an abstraction and over-generalization. Time zones were created to help regularize railroad schedules over wide areas. Timezones are an abstraction that pe

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 23:22, e...@gmx.us wrote: On 6/23/24 02:30, gene heskett wrote: A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't convert back to t

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 18:57, Brad Rogers wrote: On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 15:35:14 +1000 Keith Bainbridge wrote: Hello Keith, +14:00?? I've only ever heard of maxima of +/- 12:00. AFAIAC, it was political willy waving, nothing more; To be 'first' into the new millennium. As if that has any cachet what

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 18:56, Brad Rogers wrote: On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 13:01:10 +1000 Keith Bainbridge wrote: Hello Keith, Not to mention some cultures change how words are spelt: colour, odour, metres to quote a few. Due, mainly, to the literacy of the people that moved, rather than any deliberate cho

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

Well, The International BIPM writes the time with a colon: https://www.bipm.org/en/ Best Heriberto On Tuesday, June 25, 2024, David Wright wrote: > On Mon 24 Jun 2024 at 23:34:45 (+0800), Bret Busby wrote: >> On 24/6/24 21:41, Erwan David wrote: >> > Le 24/06/2024 à 22:38, Curt a écrit : > >> >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Mon 24 Jun 2024 at 23:34:45 (+0800), Bret Busby wrote: > On 24/6/24 21:41, Erwan David wrote: > > Le 24/06/2024 à 22:38, Curt a écrit : > > > When my mom came to visit one time in the nineties she requested I > > > change my alarm clock to AM PM time (it is now 15:25 here in the Gallic > > > re

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Mon 24 Jun 2024 at 17:12:18 (-0500), John Hasler wrote: > The Wanderer writes: > > (Similar logic could be used for 11:59:59 PM, 12:00 M, and 12:00:01 AM, > > where the standalone M would stand for "midnight". That does expose one > > unfortunate weakness of this system: unless you introduce an

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Tue, Jun 25, 2024 at 14:25:51 -0400, Roy J. Tellason, Sr. wrote: > So I have this digital clock up there in my panel, and in the virtual > machine here running Slackware I also have one. The one under Debian shows > 00:00 when it hits midnight, while the one under Slackware shows 12:00... >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Monday 24 June 2024 05:53:00 pm The Wanderer wrote: > On 2024-06-24 at 09:41, Erwan David wrote: > > > AM/PM would not be so strange if between 11AM and 1 PM it was 12 AM > > ... > > Although I don't think anything or anyone actually does it this way, I > think strictly speaking the correct 12

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Mon, Jun 24, 2024 at 06:21:57PM -0400, The Wanderer wrote: > On 2024-06-24 at 18:12, John Hasler wrote: > > > The Wanderer writes: > > > >> (Similar logic could be used for 11:59:59 PM, 12:00 M, and 12:00:01 AM, > >> where the standalone M would stand for "midnight". That does expose one > >> u

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 2024-06-24 at 18:12, John Hasler wrote: > The Wanderer writes: > >> (Similar logic could be used for 11:59:59 PM, 12:00 M, and 12:00:01 AM, >> where the standalone M would stand for "midnight". That does expose one >> unfortunate weakness of this system: unless you introduce an additional >> la

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

The Wanderer writes: > (Similar logic could be used for 11:59:59 PM, 12:00 M, and 12:00:01 AM, > where the standalone M would stand for "midnight". That does expose one > unfortunate weakness of this system: unless you introduce an additional > layer of complexity, e.g. using "00:00 M", the notatio

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 2024-06-24 at 09:41, Erwan David wrote: > AM/PM would not be so strange if between 11AM and 1 PM it was 12 AM > ... Although I don't think anything or anyone actually does it this way, I think strictly speaking the correct 12-hour notation for that time would be "12:00 M" - followed by 12:00:0

Re: System time/timezone

Bret Busby composed on 2024-06-24 23:42 (UTC+0800): > The USA is a few hundred years behind the rest of the > world, and, cannot comprehend ISO standards - > the ISO standard for date, is > 2024-06-24 > -MM-DD > which is the most efficient way of expressing a date, using the > components of

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 6/24/24 11:42, Bret Busby wrote: On 24/6/24 21:38, Curt wrote: You can become confused, though, when filling out US forms where the birth date is written M/D/Y instead of D/M/Y, and sometimes you have to be careful not commit the silly mistake that will entrain months of delay in intricate

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 24/6/24 21:38, Curt wrote: You can become confused, though, when filling out US forms where the birth date is written M/D/Y instead of D/M/Y, and sometimes you have to be careful not commit the silly mistake that will entrain months of delay in intricate *dédales* of the administration. Thi

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 24/6/24 21:41, Erwan David wrote: Le 24/06/2024 à 22:38, Curt a écrit : On 2024-06-23, gene heskett wrote: A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 y

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

Le 24/06/2024 à 22:38, Curt a écrit : On 2024-06-23, gene heskett wrote: A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't convert back to two 12

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 2024-06-24, Curt wrote: > On 2024-06-23, gene heskett wrote: >>> >> A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see >> transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I >> retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't >> convert back

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 2024-06-23, gene heskett wrote: >> > A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see > transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I > retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't > convert back to two 12 hour periods a day. The

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sun 23 Jun 2024 at 08:41:51 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 23:25:43 -0500, David Wright wrote: > > creation of Pacific/Kiritimati (+14:00), which became a press > > story at the start of the new millennium. > > > > $ TZ=Pacific/Kiritamati date; TZ=Australia/Eucla date >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

Brad Rogers writes: > Due, mainly, to the literacy of the people that moved, rather than any > deliberate choice. That is, spelling was often a 'best guess'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Webster's_Dictionary#Noah_Webster's_American_Dictionary_of_the_English_Language -- John Hasler j...@sugarb

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 2024-06-23, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > I think we are losing sight of the fact that all of timekeeping is an > abstraction and over-generalization. Time zones were created to help > regularize railroad schedules over wide areas. Timezones are an abstraction > that permit us to _pretend_ that

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 6/23/24 09:23, e...@gmx.us wrote: On 6/23/24 02:30, gene heskett wrote: A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't convert back to two

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 6/23/24 02:30, gene heskett wrote: A attribute the FCC forced on broadcasters as they like to see transmitter logs kept in 24 hour time. I got so used to it that when I retired in 2002, I'd been on 24 hour time for 40 years and didn't convert back to two 12 hour periods a day. I started usi

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 23:25:43 -0500, David Wright wrote: > creation of Pacific/Kiritimati (+14:00), which became a press > story at the start of the new millennium. > > $ TZ=Pacific/Kiritamati date; TZ=Australia/Eucla date > Sun Jun 23 04:24:54 Pacific 2024 > Sun Jun 23 13:09:54 +0845 2024 > $

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 15:35:14 +1000 Keith Bainbridge wrote: Hello Keith, >+14:00?? I've only ever heard of maxima of +/- 12:00. AFAIAC, it was political willy waving, nothing more; To be 'first' into the new millennium. As if that has any cachet whatsoever. -- Regards _ "Valid sig

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sun, 23 Jun 2024 13:01:10 +1000 Keith Bainbridge wrote: Hello Keith, >Not to mention some cultures change how words are spelt: colour, odour, >metres to quote a few. Due, mainly, to the literacy of the people that moved, rather than any deliberate choice. That is, spelling was often a 'bes

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 6/23/24 01:35, Keith Bainbridge wrote: On 23/6/24 14:25, David Wright wrote: On Sun 23 Jun 2024 at 12:52:55 (+1000), Keith Bainbridge wrote: Have you ever pondered why the 'international date line' is so convoluted? Only on the odd occasion when an area decides to cross it, for whatever

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 12:18 AM David Wright wrote: > [...] > Well, that's a mouthful. And what am I to call the time that a system > issues using that system default time zone? The kernel clock counts ticks. The ticks are relative to Epoch, which is UTC. Ticks are what you see in the output of

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 14:25, David Wright wrote: On Sun 23 Jun 2024 at 12:52:55 (+1000), Keith Bainbridge wrote: Have you ever pondered why the 'international date line' is so convoluted? Only on the odd occasion when an area decides to cross it, for whatever reason. Like Samoa recently. And before th

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat 22 Jun 2024 at 12:31:41 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 09:52:39 -0500, David Wright wrote: > > On Fri 21 Jun 2024 at 07:15:32 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > > If I boot up two computers > > > > and they display different times, what term is appropriate in your >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sun 23 Jun 2024 at 12:52:55 (+1000), Keith Bainbridge wrote: > Have you ever pondered why the 'international date line' is so convoluted? Only on the odd occasion when an area decides to cross it, for whatever reason. Like Samoa recently. And before that, the creation of Pacific/Kiritimati (+1

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 00:53, David Wright wrote: Styles change: there's a tendency in English to evolve towards compound words, sometimes with hyphenation along the way. Not to mention some cultures change how words are spelt: colour, odour, metres to quote a few. But don't fret.Some people prono

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 12:08, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: On Sat, Jun 22, 2024, 11:02 AM Stefan Monnier > wrote: > Yes, I realise that. The times are being displayed by the gettys, > controlled by the /etc/issue format string.  Jobs are being run > by cron, log

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 23/6/24 01:16, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: Possible. I was happy to forget that I had anything to do with Windows 🙂 Especially delving into the registry -- All the best Keith Bainbridge keithr...@gmail.com keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com +61 (0)447 667 468 UTC + 10:00

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat, Jun 22, 2024, 11:02 AM Stefan Monnier wrote: > > Yes, I realise that. The times are being displayed by the gettys, > > controlled by the /etc/issue format string. Jobs are being run > > by cron, logs written by rsyslogd, and so on. And the term is … ? > > Maybe there simply isn't such a

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 09:52:39 -0500, David Wright wrote: > On Fri 21 Jun 2024 at 07:15:32 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > If I boot up two computers > > > and they display different times, what term is appropriate in your > > > opinion to describe the time displayed? > > > > They're out of

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

> Yes, I realise that. The times are being displayed by the gettys, > controlled by the /etc/issue format string. Jobs are being run > by cron, logs written by rsyslogd, and so on. And the term is … ? Maybe there simply isn't such a term. The subject is sufficiently complex/delicate that there c

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 09:53:47AM -0500, David Wright wrote: > On Fri 21 Jun 2024 at 06:45:58 (+0200), to...@tuxteam.de wrote: [...] > > > I recall a checkbox do disable DST in Windows 95 or Windows 98, so perhaps > > > searching for a timezone without DST was not necessary. > > > > It's a log

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Fri 21 Jun 2024 at 06:45:58 (+0200), to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > > "the system's > > > time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", > > > and others disagree 🙂

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Fri 21 Jun 2024 at 06:48:14 (+0200), to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 11:17:42PM -0500, David Wright wrote: > > On Thu 20 Jun 2024 at 22:58:53 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10 +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > > > > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxtea

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

because they're being used by different people for different purposes like in an internet café. I need to tell these people what time they're set to. I say to them "this system is on Dubai time, and that one's on Bahrain time. They know exactly what I mean, but what's the

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

On 20/6/24 11:51, Max Nikulin wrote: On 20/06/2024 02:16, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Servers in data centers don't move around, they just sit there :-) So in my experience servers running anything non-windows have RTC set to local time. That's been on Red Hat/CentOS, Debian, Ubuntu. My experi

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Sat, Jun 22, 2024 at 10:22:53AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: [...] > I think, you are biased treating "system" as tightly built-in while most of > others assume "system-wide". Taking your bias out ("you are biased" -- "most of others") I'd tend to agree :-) You do have a point. Coming from the

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 21/06/2024 11:45, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: "the system's time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", and others disagree 🙂 What term is appropriate in your opin

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 23:17:42 -0500, David Wright wrote: > And what am I to call the time that a system > issues using that system default time zone? If you mean the current time translated into that time zone, "local time" is the traditional name for it. If you mean an arbitrary past time, th

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 11:17:42PM -0500, David Wright wrote: > On Thu 20 Jun 2024 at 22:58:53 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10 +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > > > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: [...] > Well, that's a mouthful. And what am I to call the

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > "the system's > > time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", > > and others disagree 🙂 > > What term is appropriate in your opinion do describe the setting stor

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Thu 20 Jun 2024 at 22:58:53 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10 +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > > "the system's > > > time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", > > > and others disagree 🙂 > >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 09:32:10 +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > "the system's > > time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", > > and others disagree 🙂 > > What term is appropriate in your opinion do describe the setting stored

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On 20/06/2024 11:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: "the system's time zone" (of which some, me included, say "there's no such thing", and others disagree 🙂 What term is appropriate in your opinion do describe the setting stored as the /etc/localtime symlink? localtime(5) On 19/06/2024 11:37, to...

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 01:22:31AM -0400, Jeffrey Walton wrote: > On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 12:52 AM wrote: [...] > > Please, keep those three at a safe distance > > I'm not sure how you can disgorge them given they contribute to a > human readable time. I wasn't arguing to disgorge anything --

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Thu, Jun 20, 2024 at 12:52 AM wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 01:01:44PM -0400, Jeffrey Walton wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 7:09 AM Greg Wooledge wrote: > > [...] > > > > I strongly disagree. The system clock is kept on "epoch time", which > > > is the number of seconds since midnigh

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 01:01:44PM -0400, Jeffrey Walton wrote: > On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 7:09 AM Greg Wooledge wrote: [...] > > I strongly disagree. The system clock is kept on "epoch time", which > > is the number of seconds since midnight, January 1, 1970 UTC. > > > > The system clock doesn'

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 02:16:14PM -0500, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Reading the link that Walton sent, the only case where RTC clock in UTC is recommended is in the linux/windows dual-boot case. There's no statement that RTC should be set to UTC besides that. And they say right there why it isn't

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

> If your system only boots one operating system, and never changes its > default time zone, then it makes no difference whether the RTC is set > to UTC or local time. The OS will use the same assumptions when reading > and writing to the RTC, so everything will remain correct. Of course, the fam

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

On 20/06/2024 02:16, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Servers in data centers don't move around, they just sit there :-) So in my experience servers running anything non-windows have RTC set to local time. That's been on Red Hat/CentOS, Debian, Ubuntu. My experience with Ubuntu is that its installer i

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

>> It's *theoretically* possible for some daemons to be configured to use >> a different time zone, or to be hard-coded to use UTC. I've never seen >> this, but it could be done. > In view of that, I think it's reasonable to drop the "default", >

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

On Wed, Jun 19, 2024 at 14:16:14 -0500, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: > > > . > > Reading the link that Walton sent, the only case where RTC clock in UTC is > recommended is in the linux/windows dual-boot case. There's no statement > that RTC should be set to UTC besid

Re: RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

gt; I notice that man timedatectl says: > > > > > > > >set-timezone [TIMEZONE] > > > >Set the system time zone to the specified value. > > > >Available timezones can be listed with list-timezones. > > > >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

; > > It's *theoretically* possible for some daemons to be configured to use > > > a different time zone, or to be hard-coded to use UTC. I've never seen > > > this, but it could be done. > > > > In view of that, I think it's reasonable to drop the &

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

t time zone, or to be hard-coded to use UTC. I've never seen > > this, but it could be done. > > In view of that, I think it's reasonable to drop the "default", > and go with "system time zone", ie the time zone that the system > clock it set to.

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Tue, Jun 18, 2024 at 11:02:58PM -0500, David Wright wrote: [...] > > >set-timezone [TIMEZONE] > > > Set the system time zone [...] [...] > > I cringe a bit when I see that. > > See what, exactly? I can see three things, potentially. Especi

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

ew of that, I think it's reasonable to drop the "default", and go with "system time zone", ie the time zone that the system clock it set to. > Usually a daemon's time zone will only affect log messages that it > writes. It's uncommon for a daemon process to

RTC, was Re: System time/timezone

-timezone [TIMEZONE] > > >Set the system time zone to the specified value. > > >Available timezones can be listed with list-timezones. > > >If the RTC is configured to be in the local time, this > > >will also update th

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

ime zone: Etc/UTC (UTC, +) > > System clock synchronized: yes > > NTP service: active > > RTC in local TZ: no > > $ > > > > I notice that man timedatectl says: > > > >set-timezone [TIMEZONE] > >

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

On Mon, Jun 17, 2024 at 23:54:03 -0500, David Wright wrote: > What should I call the timezone of my computer when it's booted up and > no users are logged in? Daemons will almost always use the system's default time zone (the one specified by /etc/localtime or /etc/timezone). It's *theoretically*

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

l TZ: no > > $ > > > > I notice that man timedatectl says: > > > >set-timezone [TIMEZONE] > >Set the system time zone to the specified value. > >Available timezones can be listed with list-timezones. > >If the RTC

Re: System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

t; Time zone: Etc/UTC (UTC, +) > System clock synchronized: yes > NTP service: active > RTC in local TZ: no > $ > > I notice that man timedatectl says: > >set-timezone [TIMEZONE] >S

System time/timezone, was Re: Maximum size .bash_aliases file

RTC time: Tue 2024-06-18 04:51:43 Time zone: Etc/UTC (UTC, +) System clock synchronized: yes NTP service: active RTC in local TZ: no $ I notice that man timedatectl says: set-timezone [TIMEZONE] Set the system

Re: System time instantly wrong when network lost

On Wed, Aug 05, 2020 at 07:57:07AM -0400, Carl wrote: Optimum Online is out here (Long Island). When I lost internet service, system time almost instantly switched to December 13, 2017 at 00:00 or so. If I connect the computer via my phone hotspot, NTP corrects the time rather quickly. As soon

Re: System time instantly wrong when network lost

On Wed 05 Aug 2020 at 07:57:07 (-0400), Carl wrote: > Optimum Online is out here (Long Island). When I lost internet service, > system time almost instantly switched to December 13, 2017 at 00:00 or so. If > I connect the computer via my phone hotspot, NTP corrects the time rather >

Re: System time instantly wrong when network lost

On Wed, 5 Aug 2020 at 21:57, Carl wrote: > > Optimum Online is out here (Long Island). When I lost internet service, > system time almost instantly switched to December 13, 2017 at 00:00 or so. If > I connect the computer via my phone hotspot, NTP corrects the time rather > quic

System time instantly wrong when network lost

Optimum Online is out here (Long Island). When I lost internet service, system time almost instantly switched to December 13, 2017 at 00:00 or so. If I connect the computer via my phone hotspot, NTP corrects the time rather quickly. As soon as I turn off the hotspot, it reverts to 2017. Why

Re: Windows and UTC system time

On 7/6/2014 3:20 AM, Thierry de Coulon wrote: > On Sunday 06 July 2014 00.56:04 Bob Proulx wrote: >> It doesn't solve the problem because twice a year when DST >> comes and goes what usually happens is that Windows resets the clock >> and therefore it gets set forward and back twice. > > I seem to

Re: [SOLVED] Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

Zenaan Harkness wrote: > Bob Proulx wrote: > > No worries. The fact that it is documented in rcS is historical at > > this point. It always used to be set in the /etc/default/rcS file. > > But in recent times they moved it to /etc/adjtime instead. > > However as far as I know there isn't a man pa

Re: Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

On Sunday 06 July 2014 00.56:04 Bob Proulx wrote: > It doesn't solve the problem because twice a year when DST > comes and goes what usually happens is that Windows resets the clock > and therefore it gets set forward and back twice. I seem to remeber that you could tell Windows (7?) not to care a

Re: Windows and UTC system time

On Saturday 05 July 2014 22.39:57 Doug wrote: > Unfortunately, the fix that works in Windows 7 does not work in Windows 8. > Microsoft "fixed" it! > > --doug One more reason not to use 8. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Troubl

Re: [SOLVED] Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

On 7/6/14, Bob Proulx wrote: > Nelson Green wrote: >> Bob Proulx wrote: >> > But... Read the man page for rcS and then edit /etc/adjtime and set >> > LOCAL there. >> > >> > man rcS >> >> Boy do I feel dumb. I didn't even realize there was a man page for >> rcS. Thanks for pointing that out (I

Re: [SOLVED] Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

Nelson Green wrote: > Bob Proulx wrote: > > But... Read the man page for rcS and then edit /etc/adjtime and set > > LOCAL there. > > > > man rcS > > Boy do I feel dumb. I didn't even realize there was a man page for > rcS. Thanks for pointing that out (I really did start with man). No worries

Re: [SOLVED] Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

On Sat, Jul 5, 2014 at 5:56 PM, Bob Proulx wrote: > Nelson Green wrote: > > Thanks Thierry, but I am afraid I have to leave the windows > > installation alone. Fortunately I rarely have to mess with windows, > > and as a general rule I don't lower my standards to theirs, but in > > this case I h

Re: Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

Nelson Green wrote: > Thanks Thierry, but I am afraid I have to leave the windows > installation alone. Fortunately I rarely have to mess with windows, > and as a general rule I don't lower my standards to theirs, but in > this case I have no choice, at least until we can eliminate windows > from

Re: Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

On Sat, Jul 5, 2014 at 3:01 PM, Thierry de Coulon wrote: > On Saturday 05 July 2014 21.38:46 Nelson Green wrote: > > Good afternoon, > > > > This morning I had the mis-fortune of creating a dual-boot system with > > Debian on > > a machine that already had windows installed on. I installed a seco

Re: Windows and UTC system time

On 07/05/2014 04:01 PM, Thierry de Coulon wrote: On Saturday 05 July 2014 21.38:46 Nelson Green wrote: Good afternoon, This morning I had the mis-fortune of creating a dual-boot system with Debian on a machine that already had windows installed on. I installed a second hard drive, installed De

Re: Windows and UTC system time (was: no subject)

On Saturday 05 July 2014 21.38:46 Nelson Green wrote: > Good afternoon, > > This morning I had the mis-fortune of creating a dual-boot system with > Debian on > a machine that already had windows installed on. I installed a second hard > drive, installed Debian, and almost everything works. But I a

Re: Weird hw/system time issue..

Rick Thomas wrote: > I have no idea what you need to do to re-callibrate your /etc/localtime file. > Presumably "dpkg-reconfigure " but which package? It is the tzdata package. dpkg-reconfigure tzdata However... If there are some escape clauses for the user to manually configure things and

Re: Weird hw/system time issue..

s up when you mouse over the taskbar clock shows the same time for > > > "Los Angeles" and UTC. I've run hwclock --localtime to notify the os that > > > the hw clock is on localtime.. I've also tried putting the hw clock on > > > UTC and running hwclock

Re: Re: Weird hw/system time issue..

ration variable, it would be good to fix the system time. # dpkg-reconfigure tzdata That will bring up a dialog allowing you to configure the system timezone. That sets the /etc/timezone file that everyone has been referring to. And then the time will be in the right timezone fo

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