On Sb, 10 mar 12, 11:01:27, Joel Rees wrote:
>
> As for your requirements, I've been looking and hoping for longer than
> you, and now I think it's expecting too much. Think about cars at the
> beginning of the last century. My father used to tell me about his
> buddies who used hand-operated wind
On Sat, Mar 10, 2012 at 1:05 AM, green wrote:
> Miles Fidelman wrote at 2012-02-27 16:57 -0600:
>> Perhaps not quite the answer you're looking for, but yours might be
>> a situation that calls for looking at something other than Debian,
>> or even Linux. I'm thinking particularly that FreeBSD and
(You just sparked another rant.)
On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 6:55 PM, Andrei POPESCU
wrote:
> On Jo, 16 feb 12, 08:43:20, Joe wrote:
>>
>> Hardware compatibility happens in the MS world because the boot is on
>> the other foot, in that manufacturers have no choice but to engineer
>> their products to
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-27 19:48 -0600:
> > I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> > production environment. I need good Linux support to facilitate fast
> > deployment and low maintenance. Avoiding non-free software really helps in
> > that regard, so I con
Miles Fidelman wrote at 2012-02-27 16:57 -0600:
> Perhaps not quite the answer you're looking for, but yours might be
> a situation that calls for looking at something other than Debian,
> or even Linux. I'm thinking particularly that FreeBSD and NetBSD
> run on LOTS of hardware platforms, provide
Perhaps not quite the answer you're looking for, but yours might be a
situation that calls for looking at something other than Debian, or even
Linux. I'm thinking particularly that FreeBSD and NetBSD run on LOTS of
hardware platforms, provide reliable open source platforms, and run
pretty much
Steven Rosenberg wrote at 2012-02-27 12:02 -0600:
> Logic Supply
> Eracks, ZaReason and System76
Thanks for your comments, and especially for mentioning the other vendors
each of which have some interesting products available.
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On 02/17/2012 12:14 PM, green wrote:
green wrote:
The Fit-PC3 requires non-free fglrx for radeon hardware?
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-17 10:10 -0600:
No. The Free `radeon' driver should work just fine for those AMD Fusion
GPUs.
Hey, that is great news; thanks. I was not aware of the
On 02/15/2012 11:01 AM, green wrote:
So to recap my original post, the basic requirements are:
- fanless mini PC
- it will run Debian
- production environment (reliability is important)
- good Linux support to facilitate fast deployment and low maintenance,
- avoiding non-free software (non-free
Miles Bader wrote:
Richard Owlett writes:
Back in the 70's DEC had an enclosure for the LSI-11 irreverently dubbed
the "Hitachi".
Five sides were cast aluminum with large fins o get rid of ~100 watts of
heat. The sixth side was a heavily gasketed piece of cast
aluminum.
Are you sure it wasn't
Richard Owlett writes:
> Back in the 70's DEC had an enclosure for the LSI-11 irreverently dubbed
> the "Hitachi".
> Five sides were cast aluminum with large fins o get rid of ~100 watts of
> heat. The sixth side was a heavily gasketed piece of cast
> aluminum.
Are you sure it wasn't "The Hibachi
green wrote:
> The Fit-PC3 requires non-free fglrx for radeon hardware?
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-17 10:10 -0600:
> No. The Free `radeon' driver should work just fine for those AMD Fusion
> GPUs.
Hey, that is great news; thanks. I was not aware of the free radeon driver.
I have found t
>> Of course, the manufacturer distributes the GNU/Linux version of the
>> product with a proprietary driver which is hell to get working on
>> anything else than that specific Xorg+kernel combination.
> I like to avoid that head-banging experience and the associated "why did I
> ever purchase thi
On 17/02/2012 4:31 AM, green wrote:
Andrew McGlashan wrote at 2012-02-16 11:16 -0600:
I don't think you can ever rely on a machine having full main line
kernel support one day, still having it 3 or 4 years down the track.
In another message, I just mentioned the desktop to be replaced, which h
On 16/02/12 20:16, Joe wrote:
On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 04:16:09 +1100
Andrew McGlashan wrote:
I had some small ARM machines which worked very well on Lenny, but
In history, I remember a P133 machine being "quite powerful" and it
was at the time,
I had one of the first ARM computers, an Acorn Ar
On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 04:16:09 +1100
Andrew McGlashan wrote:
>
> I had some small ARM machines which worked very well on Lenny, but
>
> In history, I remember a P133 machine being "quite powerful" and it
> was at the time,
I had one of the first ARM computers, an Acorn Archimedes running a 4MHz
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 09:53:36 -0600
green wrote:
> Your message has
> come closest so far to doing that; thanks.
You're welcome, I wish I could offer more hope, but as users of an
operating system most people have never heard of, we get to suck it and
see.
Whichever way you go, I recommend kee
Andrew McGlashan wrote at 2012-02-16 11:16 -0600:
> I don't think you can ever rely on a machine having full main line
> kernel support one day, still having it 3 or 4 years down the track.
In another message, I just mentioned the desktop to be replaced, which has an
Abit KR7A-133R motherboard an
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-16 08:10 -0600:
> > The question is, how can I be reasonably sure before the purchase? In many
> > cases the information is unavailable or difficult to find.
>
> Agreed, it's a serious problem. E.g. for fit-pc2 I actually forgot to
> mention that the video driver
Mark Neidorff wrote at 2012-02-16 04:38 -0600:
> On Wednesday 15 February 2012 2:01:22 pm green wrote:
> > When you purchased the server on which you run Lenny, did you know for sure
> > that the installation would go smoothly and all hardware would work
> > correctly?
>
> Yes. I knew because, fo
Okay, just a few cents from me.
I don't think you can ever rely on a machine having full main line
kernel support one day, still having it 3 or 4 years down the track.
The drivers change, some disappear too -- there is never going to be any
guarantees. The same goes for all sorts of pack
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-15 20:19 -0600:
> The same should hold for the Fit-PC3 (tho you may want to check their
> forums first, since support for some particular features like the IR
> interface or the watchdog may not all be supported by the current
> kernel). While they don't guarantee t
Joe wrote at 2012-02-16 02:43 -0600:
> On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 22:14:50 -0600 green wrote:
> > The question is, how can I be reasonably sure before the purchase?
> > In many cases the information is unavailable or difficult to find.
>
> Because it mostly doesn't exist. If you were given one of these m
On Wednesday 15 February 2012 2:01:22 pm green wrote:
> Mark Neidorff wrote at 2012-02-14 17:45 -0600:
>
> When you purchased the server on which you run Lenny, did you know for sure
> that the installation would go smoothly and all hardware would work
> correctly? What if today you needed anothe
On Jo, 16 feb 12, 08:43:20, Joe wrote:
>
> Hardware compatibility happens in the MS world because the boot is on
> the other foot, in that manufacturers have no choice but to engineer
> their products to work with Windows, and modify them if problems are
> found. No such incentive exists (yet) for
On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 22:14:50 -0600
green wrote:
> Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-15 20:25 -0600:
> >
> > If your machine is supported by the stock kernel, all these
> > problems are pretty much absent: you can expect to simply "aptitude
> > upgrade" for the next ten years.
>
> This is *precise
Stefan Monnier wrote at 2012-02-15 20:25 -0600:
> > not a necessity, though it is desiable :). A custom kernel that
> > doesn't work is obviously going to be a problem, but if it works well
> > enough then it would be fine for me. But I guess it does make a
>
> The problem is: what will you do w
> not a necessity, though it is desiable :). A custom kernel that
> doesn't work is obviously going to be a problem, but if it works well
> enough then it would be fine for me. But I guess it does make a
The problem is: what will you do with your machine three year down
the road? Will you have
> So to recap my original post, the basic requirements are:
> - fanless mini PC
> - it will run Debian
> - production environment (reliability is important)
> - good Linux support to facilitate fast deployment and low maintenance,
> - avoiding non-free software (non-free firmware, out-of-tree kern
Mark Neidorff wrote at 2012-02-14 17:45 -0600:
> I've stayed on the sidelines of this thread because the original post sounded
> to me like trolling. But, after the posts that I have read, you seem quite
> serious.
Trolling?! Apparently I failed to clearly express myself in the original
post.
Alex Hutton wrote at 2012-02-14 16:59 -0600:
> Fair points. I guess you would need to go with an Atom or other x86
> system which would have a more mature architecture, rather than ARM.
Yes, x86 seems to be the architecture of choice at this point, with regard to
reliability.
> For my personal n
On Tue, 14 Feb 2012 23:26:04 +1100, Alex wrote in message
:
> On 13 February 2012 00:57, green wrote:
> >
> > So the Trim-Slice is not supported by mainline kernels?
> >
>
> As others said, the main issue is the Tegra 2 is a nvidia chip
...that doesn't work with nouveau? Uh-oh.
> and CompuL
Christofer C. Bell wrote at 2012-02-13 16:54 -0600:
> Maybe they mean the system halts but doesn't power off. Would that be an
> issue? Having to manually cut power?
Um, maybe the thing that people aren't getting here is that I am interested
in *purchasing* a device. (I am not out to throw mu
On Monday 13 February 2012 5:04:04 pm green wrote:
> David Goodenough wrote at 2012-02-13 11:31 -0600:
> > On Monday 13 Feb 2012, green wrote:
> > > Is Tegra 3 supported by Linux? Are any of the Tegras supported by
> > > Linux? While I have found nothing definitive, everything I have found
> > > s
On 15 February 2012 02:34, green wrote:
> I am *not* looking for disposable hardware. I am *not* interested in
> purchasing a maintenance burden. I need *rock-solid* *long-term* Linux
> reliability on *rock-solid* hardware. Will Compulabs continue to provide
> updated custom kernels a year or m
On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 12:56 PM, green wrote:
> Tom H wrote at 2012-02-14 11:18 -0600:
>> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 10:34 AM, green wrote:
>> >
>> > Frankly, I am surprised that comments here suggest apathy and even
>> > hostility
>> > toward (that is, questioning the value of) a search for a str
Tom H wrote at 2012-02-14 11:18 -0600:
> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 10:34 AM, green wrote:
> > Frankly, I am surprised that comments here suggest apathy and even hostility
> > toward (that is, questioning the value of) a search for a strictly "free
> > software" device, especially considering Debian'
On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 10:34 AM, green wrote:
>
> I am *not* looking for disposable hardware. I am *not* interested in
> purchasing a maintenance burden. I need *rock-solid* *long-term* Linux
> reliability on *rock-solid* hardware. Will Compulabs continue to provide
> updated custom kernels a
Alex Hutton wrote at 2012-02-14 06:26 -0600:
> There was an interesting article about the Trim Slice posted a few
> days ago, I don't know if you saw it:
> http://blog.sesse.net/blog/tech/2012-02-12-21-43_playing_with_the_trim_slice.html
Thanks, I had not seen that yet. Reading that certainly sug
On 13 February 2012 00:57, green wrote:
>
> So the Trim-Slice is not supported by mainline kernels?
>
As others said, the main issue is the Tegra 2 is a nvidia chip and
CompuLab are reliant on nvidia in order to get things working.
I haven't tried upgrading the kernel since I got the original un
On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 4:47 PM, green wrote:
> Christofer C. Bell wrote at 2012-02-13 15:33 -0600:
>> On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM, green wrote:
>> >
>> > So they just try booting Ubuntu and if it works, then claim Linux support?
>>
>> Their testing methodology isn't outlined in the post her
Christofer C. Bell wrote at 2012-02-13 15:33 -0600:
> On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 10:11 AM, green wrote:
> > Bruce Ferrell wrote at 2012-02-12 18:56 -0600:
> > > http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/fanless_systems
> >
> > Thanks for the link, they have some nice looking systems. Unfortunately I
> >
David Goodenough wrote at 2012-02-13 11:31 -0600:
> On Monday 13 Feb 2012, green wrote:
> > Is Tegra 3 supported by Linux? Are any of the Tegras supported by Linux?
> > While I have found nothing definitive, everything I have found suggests
> > not.
>
> If you look at the linux-arm mailing list, o
On Monday 13 Feb 2012, green wrote:
> Andrei Popescu wrote at 2012-02-12 17:10 -0600:
> > On Sb, 11 feb 12, 20:09:00, green wrote:
> > > - Trim-Slice H (custom kernel)
> >
> > I was almost going to order one of those, but eventually gave up because
> > "SATA is implemented with USB to SATA Genesys
Andrei Popescu wrote at 2012-02-12 17:10 -0600:
> On Sb, 11 feb 12, 20:09:00, green wrote:
> > - Trim-Slice H (custom kernel)
>
> I was almost going to order one of those, but eventually gave up because
> "SATA is implemented with USB to SATA Genesys Logic GL830". I admit the
> custom kernel was
Bruce Ferrell wrote at 2012-02-12 18:56 -0600:
> http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/fanless_systems
Thanks for the link, they have some nice looking systems. Unfortunately I
was unable to find any mention of Linux kernel support status.
> They have a FEW system they have marked as unusuitabl
On 02/12/2012 07:29 AM, green wrote:
> kei...@strucktower.com wrote at 2012-02-12 08:28 -0600:
>> But I'm curious about the original query- what's the need for such an
>> ultra-quiet machine?
> Reason 1: no cleaning. A system with a fan requires cleaning. Frequency
> of cleaning depends on the e
On Sb, 11 feb 12, 20:09:00, green wrote:
> - Trim-Slice H (custom kernel)
I was almost going to order one of those, but eventually gave up because
"SATA is implemented with USB to SATA Genesys Logic GL830". I admit the
custom kernel was also not an incentive.
Maybe CompuLab will release a devic
green wrote:
kei...@strucktower.com wrote at 2012-02-12 08:28 -0600:
But I'm curious about the original query- what's the need for such an
ultra-quiet machine?
Reason 1: no cleaning. A system with a fan requires cleaning. Frequency
of cleaning depends on the environment. The desktop that th
On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
> I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> production environment.
> Doesnt thin clients & LTSP qualify for this ?
For my situation, this would result in maintaining 2 devices rather than 1;
not really a reasonable option.
> WYSE S
kei...@strucktower.com wrote at 2012-02-12 08:28 -0600:
> But I'm curious about the original query- what's the need for such an
> ultra-quiet machine?
Reason 1: no cleaning. A system with a fan requires cleaning. Frequency
of cleaning depends on the environment. The desktop that this will repl
I'm glad to see this thread, because I hadn't heard of the Raspberry Pi
before- way cool!
But I'm curious about the original query- what's the need for such an
ultra-quiet machine? I too hate fan noise, but even when run hard I have
to _try_ to hear my laptop fan. Is there a special reason you ne
On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 7:27 PM, green wrote:
> On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
> > I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> > production environment.
>
> Alex Hutton wrote at 2012-02-11 22:56 -0600:
> > I share your sympathies. I really hate fan noise! There are A
On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
> I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> production environment.
Alex Hutton wrote at 2012-02-11 22:56 -0600:
> I share your sympathies. I really hate fan noise! There are ARM
> computers that run at 5 watts, and can be passively co
On 12 February 2012 15:06, green wrote:
> Stan Hoeppner wrote at 2012-02-11 21:15 -0600:
>> On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
>> > I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
>> > production environment.
Hi,
I share your sympathies. I really hate fan noise! There are ARM
Stan Hoeppner wrote at 2012-02-11 21:15 -0600:
> On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
> > I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> > production environment.
> [...]
> > Comments appreciated!
>
> What type of comments, exactly, are you looking for? You've got 6
> system
On 2/11/2012 8:09 PM, green wrote:
> I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
> production environment.
[...]
> Comments appreciated!
What type of comments, exactly, are you looking for? You've got 6
systems listed, 3 apparently meeting all your criteria--you listed no
I need a fanless mini PC; it will run Debian. It will be used in a
production environment. I need good Linux support to facilitate fast
deployment and low maintenance. Avoiding non-free software really helps in
that regard, so I consider non-free firmware barely tolerable, while
out-of-tree
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