Re: Debian default mailer choice

to allow local delivery for local mail, it would be the most sensible choice (while waiting for "no MTA" to be an option). Stefan

Re: Debian default mailer choice

> On 17 Jul 2025, at 20:09, Marco Moock wrote: > > On 17.07.2025 19:00 Uhr Stefan Monnier wrote: > >> I don't have anything against Exim4 (I just happened to choose Postfix >> many years ago and never had a reason to reconsider that choice). >> I know basic

Re: Debian default mailer choice

On 17.07.2025 19:00 Uhr Stefan Monnier wrote: > I don't have anything against Exim4 (I just happened to choose Postfix > many years ago and never had a reason to reconsider that choice). > I know basically nothing about Exim4 other than the fact that > installing Postfix inste

Re: Debian default mailer choice

Hi, On Thu, Jul 17, 2025 at 12:54:58PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote: > Why does Debian default to installing Exim4? Just historical reasons I think: No great mystery, just that a choice had to be made and that was the choice that was made. Personally I haven't been too thrilled wit

Debian default mailer choice

d with Postfix. I don't have anything against Exim4 (I just happened to choose Postfix many years ago and never had a reason to reconsider that choice). I know basically nothing about Exim4 other than the fact that installing Postfix instead saved a few kB (nothing very significant in the gran

Choice of browser? [WAS Re: how do i configure lynx browser as default browser for html]

On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 08:02:54AM -0400, The Wanderer wrote: > On 2022-09-29 at 07:49, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: > > > There are hints in this thtread as to where to configure your > > default browser. Update-alternatives is probably your friend here. If > > all of this is just to run the Wikipedi

Re: choice of web browsers

riveravaldez wrote: ... > $ dpigs -n2 -SH > 287.7M linux-signed-amd64 > 195.4M firefox-esr > > ;) things be different at this machine: $ dpigs -n8 -SH 499.3M linux 359.6M golang-1.16 357.8M linux-signed-amd64 325.8M libreoffice 292.4M qemu 273.7M rustc 213.1M python3.9 203.5M firefox

Re: choice of web browsers

On Friday, October 29, 2021, Dan Ritter wrote: > kaye n wrote: >> Maybe you're right about Firefox. Any "light" browsers you can recommend? > > The problem with web browsers is that they are basically a > second operating system for computers. > > (The great thing about web browsers is that they

Re: choice of web browsers

At 29.10.21 Dan Ritter wrote: > and then the heavies: > > chromium > firefox I was a long time user of Mozilla based browsers (Netscape -> Mozilla Suite -> SeaMonkey -> Firefox) but lately I found Chromium based browsers faster and more appealing. Beat me, but I even prefer Chrome above Chromi

Re: choice of web browsers

On Friday 29 October 2021 09:10:29 am Dan Ritter wrote: > You can substantially improve the memory usage and speed of > firefox by installing the extension ublock Origin. Thanks for posting this, I've installed it and reviewed a fair amount of the docs. It looks to be truly useful... -- Mem

choice of web browsers

kaye n wrote: > Maybe you're right about Firefox. Any "light" browsers you can recommend? The problem with web browsers is that they are basically a second operating system for computers. (The great thing about web browsers is that they are a nearly-universal operating system.) The lightest we

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 5:09 AM Tom Browder wrote: > > I am preparing servers to use with OpenSMTPD and Sympa to provide mail and mailing list service. ... After considering all the suggestions, I have prepared a plan, using a bit of pseudo code, to describe what I believe I need to do. Interest

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 11:04 AM Henning Follmann wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 08:47:36AM -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 08:37 Henning Follmann ... > For years I operated a couple of sendmail installations. That and the > O'Reilly Sendmail book tought me a lot. > Today

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 12:36:38 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:05 PM Brian wrote: > > On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 11:22:58 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > > > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 09:36 Brian wrote: > ... > > Thanks, I will read the page in detail later. Meanwhile, I did a qu

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:36 PM Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:05 PM Brian wrote: > > Thanks, I will read the page in detail later. Meanwhile, I did a quick > > search on the page for "mailname" and didn't get anything. Anyway, what > > I really wanted to know was what function

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:05 PM Brian wrote: > On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 11:22:58 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 09:36 Brian wrote: ... > Thanks, I will read the page in detail later. Meanwhile, I did a quick > search on the page for "mailname" and didn't get anything. Anywa

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 11:22:58 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 09:36 Brian wrote: > > > On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 05:09:47 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > > > ... > | > I need to settle on names to define as the "mailname" for each the two > > > > servers I will designate for the DN

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 09:36 Brian wrote: > On Fri 21 Feb 2020 at 05:09:47 -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > ... | > I need to settle on names to define as the "mailname" for each the two > > servers I will designate for the DNS MX records for all my mail-enabled > > domains. The mailnames should be

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 08:47:36AM -0600, Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 08:37 Henning Follmann > wrote: > > > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:38:45PM +0100, john doe wrote: > > ... > > > Don't do THAT! > > > > RFC2181 section 10.3 says you can't point your MX record to a CNAME > > >

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

DNS MX records for all my mail-enabled > domains. The mailnames should be "fully qualified domain names" (FQDNs) so > they will have names like: > > + mail.example.com > + smtp.example.com > + mx.example.com > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over anothe

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 08:37 Henning Follmann wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 12:38:45PM +0100, john doe wrote: ... > Don't do THAT! > > RFC2181 section 10.3 says you can't point your MX record to a CNAME > Maybe that's why Namecheap has the MXE record that points to an IP. Besides the rele

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

le.com > > + mx.example.com > > > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another, or any other > > choice? > > > > I might be missing something here but the domain name is what you > buy/what you get. > > If your planning to use split DNS

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:46:59 -0600 Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:29 Joe wrote: > > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:00:14 -0600 > > Tom Browder wrote: > > ... > > > > As I understand it, a mail server has to use smtp to physically > > > transfer mail between physical hosts and th

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:29 Joe wrote: > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:00:14 -0600 > Tom Browder wrote: ... > > As I understand it, a mail server has to use smtp to physically > > transfer mail between physical hosts and that requires one name that > > will resolve to an IP. Even if the server is h

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

Quoting Tom Browder (2020-02-21 13:17:52) > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:00 Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > > > Hi tom, > > > ... > > > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another, or any other > > > > choice? > > > ... > > &

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:17 Michael Howard wrote: ... > I don't know your use case but using 'regular' names like smtp.example.com, > imap.example.com, pop3.example.com etc, help with the auto config > processes used on devices, thus making it easier for users to setup > accounts on their devic

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:00:14 -0600 Tom Browder wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 05:39 john doe wrote: > ... > > > I might be missing something here but the domain name is what you > > buy/what you get. > > > Note I own (techically it's more of a rental or lease) multiple > domains hosted ac

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:00 Jonas Smedegaard wrote: > Hi tom, > ... > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another, or any other > > choice? > ... > Depends on the purpose of the name(s). ... Thanks, Jonas, that makes good sense. Based on that I sho

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

to use one over another, or any other choice? Thanks for any help. Best regards, -Tom I don't know your use case but using 'regular' names like smtp.example.com, imap.example.com, pop3.example.com etc, help with the auto config processes used on devices, thus making it

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

ecords for all my > mail-enabled domains. The mailnames should be "fully qualified domain > names" (FQDNs) so they will have names like: > > + mail.example.com > + smtp.example.com > + mx.example.com > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another,

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 05:39 john doe wrote: ... > I might be missing something here but the domain name is what you > buy/what you get. Note I own (techically it's more of a rental or lease) multiple domains hosted across multiple servers which I also fully control (no sharing, full root cont

Re: Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

s for all my mail-enabled > domains. The mailnames should be "fully qualified domain names" (FQDNs) so > they will have names like: > > + mail.example.com > + smtp.example.com > + mx.example.com > > Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another, or any other &g

Choice of "mailname" for mail server: suggestions welcome

ualified domain names" (FQDNs) so they will have names like: + mail.example.com + smtp.example.com + mx.example.com Does anyone have strong reasons to use one over another, or any other choice? Thanks for any help. Best regards, -Tom

Re: Attributing (was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

On Sat 06 Jul 2019 at 11:16:19 (-0400), Stefan Monnier wrote: > >> (General observation: it's really quite annoying that you remove all > >> attribution when you quote previous emails in your replies.) > > It really is very annoying, primarily because it's intentional, and so > > intentionally ann

Re: Attributing (was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

On 2019-07-06, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> (General observation: it's really quite annoying that you remove all >>> attribution when you quote previous emails in your replies.) >> It really is very annoying, primarily because it's intentional, and so >> intentionally annoying, which is really, real

Attributing (was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

>> (General observation: it's really quite annoying that you remove all >> attribution when you quote previous emails in your replies.) > It really is very annoying, primarily because it's intentional, and so > intentionally annoying, which is really, really annoying. Interesting. I never read a

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 07/04/2019 08:50 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: On 07/02/2019 04:05 PM, Linux-Fan wrote: ... For my local purposes, I have created my own metapackage (not in Debian...) Please send me a copy. I've a ~10 year old Lenovo T510 whose hardware should be new enough. Apparently runs fine. No nee

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 2019-07-04, Michael Stone wrote: > On Thu, Jul 04, 2019 at 11:26:39AM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> If it had been done 10 years ago it wouldn't need to be done now. :) > > (General observation: it's really quite annoying that you remove all > attribution when you quote previous emails in y

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Thu, Jul 04, 2019 at 11:26:39AM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote: If it had been done 10 years ago it wouldn't need to be done now. :) (General observation: it's really quite annoying that you remove all attribution when you quote previous emails in your replies.) VMs running on a core 2 defi

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

arguably more efficient. > these days, running on something that old has a strong component of personal > choice. Just like choosing something more recent is a personal choice, yes. With global ecological implications. > Which is fine, but not a strong argument. Put a different way, it&

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

* On 2019 04 Jul 08:51 -0500, Richard Owlett wrote: > I've a ~10 year old Lenovo T510 whose hardware should be new enough. I've a T410 running Buster amd64 and have simply installed the VirtualBox binaries from the Sid repository (manually downloaded and installed). I also have QEMU installed for

Old computers (Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

On Thursday, July 04, 2019 09:50:36 AM Richard Owlett wrote: > BTW my oldest machine is a Kaypro 10 ;/ Just for kicks, I'll mention that my oldest machine is a Digital Group Z-80, circa 1976, assembed from a kit, and with 2K on board RAM plus 2 auxillary memory boards with 8K each (iirc) for a t

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 07/02/2019 04:05 PM, Linux-Fan wrote: ... For my local purposes, I have created my own metapackage (not in Debian...) -- this is why I suggested a list of packages: I expect that installing all of the packages yields the same result (except for automatically vs. manually installed packages...

Re: Oldest Usable x86 CPU for Stretch (Was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

On Jo, 04 iul 19, 01:47:58, Matthew Crews wrote: > > You know, this got me thinking. What *is* the oldest 32-bit x86 CPU that > we can use in Stretch for a VM host? And assuming we are talking > out-of-the-box experience, ie I download a standard ISO and fire it up. This might get you started: ht

Oldest Usable x86 CPU for Stretch (Was: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?)

On 7/3/19 10:20 AM, Stefan Monnier wrote: >> That said I do not believe that any existing i386 32-bit-only hardware >> that is still floating around even supports the virtual machine >> extensions necessary to run a true VM host. > > I haven't use qemu on my 32bit only i686 machines recently, but

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

the need is very real (not just for playing around) but doesn't have anything to do with maximizing hardware utilization in a datacenter. Since faster and more efficient hardware can literally be found for free these days, running on something that old has a strong component of personal choice. Wh

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

> Because the hardware features to permit efficient virtualization weren't > available on i386-only CPUs. (And there's really no good reason to run a VM > host [vs guest] in i386 mode if it can run in amd64 mode.) By "there's really no good ..." I think you mean "I can't think of any good ...". F

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 01:20:06PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote: think in this day and age it is a bit silly to try and run a VM on a 32-bit host Why? Often the question is not "which hardware should I pick to run this VM" but "what kinds of technology should I use to run this software on this

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

ware". When "this hardware" is 32bit, and a VM is needed between the two, then that's that. What might be silly is to think that this choice can't be the best one. > (or for that matter, run a 32-bit host at all if your > hardware supports 64-bit, That's wha

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:01:11AM +0200, Matthew Crews wrote: > I have no idea what an Owlett thread is, It's what you're seeing right now. It's also the reason I end up writing a filtering program to send all email from certain From: addresses into a spam folder.

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:17:22AM -, Curt wrote: > On 2019-07-03, wrote: > > > >> I have an innate desire to help people, but more importantly I give > >> people the benefit of the doubt. Besides I self-taught myself a few > >> things along the way, so I consider it a win. > > > > I prefer t

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 2019-07-03, wrote: > >> I have an innate desire to help people, but more importantly I give >> people the benefit of the doubt. Besides I self-taught myself a few >> things along the way, so I consider it a win. > > I prefer that one, too :) People get the benefit of the doubt until they remo

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 05:01:11AM +0200, Matthew Crews wrote: > On 7/2/19 1:20 PM, Andy Smith wrote: > > I do feel sorry for you Matthew. You have been enticed into spending > > considerable time giving a thorough answer in an Owlett thread. > > Unfortunately Owlett threads are either an ongoing I

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/2/19 1:20 PM, Andy Smith wrote: > I do feel sorry for you Matthew. You have been enticed into spending > considerable time giving a thorough answer in an Owlett thread. > Unfortunately Owlett threads are either an ongoing Internet > performance art project or a result of severe mental illness

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

have a GUI. What choice metapackages provide that function? Thank you very much for the rephrasing -- the use of `host` and `guest` aids the description very well. TL;DR: There is (AFAICT) no metapackage satisfying your requirements. * * * The long version: As far as I can tell, there is

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

Hello Curt and Matthew, On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 12:04:36PM -, Curt wrote: > On 2019-07-02, Richard Owlett wrote: > > > > A restatement of my question might be: […] > What do we win if we provide the correct answer? A year's supply of > invective? I do feel sorry for you Matthew. You have b

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/2/19 8:34 AM, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? >> No, because it isn't free software. >> See for details. > > I believe what you wrote is slightly misleading: the base VirtualBox > software seems to

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/2/19 8:34 AM, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? >> No, because it isn't free software. >> See for details. > > I believe what you wrote is slightly misleading: the base VirtualBox > software seems to

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/2/19 8:34 AM, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? >> No, because it isn't free software. >> See for details. > > I believe what you wrote is slightly misleading: the base VirtualBox > software seems to

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

>> I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? > No, because it isn't free software. > See for details. I believe what you wrote is slightly misleading: the base VirtualBox software seems to satisfy the definition of Free Software just fine

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On Tue, Jul 02, 2019 at 11:17:06AM -0400, Kenneth Parker wrote: > I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? No, because it isn't free software. See for details.

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

gt; host capable of running multiple VM guests. Although the guests will be > > running in command line mode, the host should have a GUI. > > What choice metapackages provide that function? > I'm partial to VirtualBox. Is that on any of the Debian DVD'S? > > What do

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/2/19 6:04 AM, Matthew Crews wrote: > To determine *which* installation DVD contains one of these programs, > you will need to look at the individual wiki page for each VM host > program, see which package or packages you need, and check the DVD .list > files to see which DVD contains that pac

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

be > running in command line mode, the host should have a GUI. > What choice metapackages provide that function? You have your answer already in previous emails. The Wiki provides a list of software capable of turning Debian into a VM host [1]. They include full hardware virtualization such as

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

t; running in command line mode, the host should have a GUI. > What choice metapackages provide that function? What do we win if we provide the correct answer? A year's supply of invective?

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

n problem. A restatement of my question might be: I run the i386 version of Debian 9.8. Using only contents of that set of installation DVDs, I wish to use a VM host capable of running multiple VM guests. Although the guests will be running in command line mode, the host should have a GUI. W

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 2019-07-01, Matthew Crews wrote: > On 7/1/19 10:35 AM, Curt wrote: >> On 2019-07-01, Matthew Crews wrote: >>> >>> At a cursory glance, it does NOT appear that DVD-1 contains any VM Host >>> software, other than perhaps nspawn (which is part of Systemd). >> >> Isn't nspawn a chroot container?

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 7/1/19 10:35 AM, Curt wrote: > On 2019-07-01, Matthew Crews wrote: >> >> At a cursory glance, it does NOT appear that DVD-1 contains any VM Host >> software, other than perhaps nspawn (which is part of Systemd). > > Isn't nspawn a chroot container? > Indeed, but depending on the needs, it mi

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

Richard Owlett writes: [...] On 06/30/2019 10:44 AM, Linux-Fan wrote: Matthew Crews writes: On 6/30/19 5:34 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: > I'm considering using a VM for some experiments. > Although my web searches have turned up articles about particular > aspects of particular VMs, I've found

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 2019-07-01, Matthew Crews wrote: > > At a cursory glance, it does NOT appear that DVD-1 contains any VM Host > software, other than perhaps nspawn (which is part of Systemd). Isn't nspawn a chroot container? > Hope this helps. >

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 6/30/19 12:12 PM, Richard Owlett wrote: > On 06/30/2019 10:44 AM, Linux-Fan wrote: >> Matthew Crews writes: >>> Are you asking what virtual machine hosts are available on Debian? > > *explicitly* So clearly I struck a nerve, and I apologize. The way you asked your question was somewhat unclear

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 1/07/19 7:12 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: > What 32 bit VMs which DO NOT depend on non-FOSS components are available > for 32-bit Debian? > LEARN TO WRITE!! A VM is a Virtual Machine. You appear not to be asking for a Virtual Machine, but software to host a Virtual Machine!!!1! If you ask the

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

Richard Owlett wrote: > *CAVEAT LECTOR* > If I can't win, >may I aspire to "break even"? > Recently I was chastised for expecting people to *read*. > if no hmr, *DENT* rd frthr ;/ > caveat finis ;/ > > > > > What are my options? > > > > > > > Are you asking what virtual machine hosts are avai

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

*CAVEAT LECTOR* If I can't win, may I aspire to "break even"? Recently I was chastised for expecting people to *read*. if no hmr, *DENT* rd frthr ;/ caveat finis ;/ On 06/30/2019 10:44 AM, Linux-Fan wrote: Matthew Crews writes: On 6/30/19 5:34 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: > I'm considering usi

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

Matthew Crews writes: On 6/30/19 5:34 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: > I'm considering using a VM for some experiments. > Although my web searches have turned up articles about particular > aspects of particular VMs, I've found no inventory of what VMs are > available in Debian. > > My firm requireme

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 6/30/2019 3:45 PM, Matthew Crews wrote: > On 6/30/19 5:34 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: >> I'm considering using a VM for some experiments. >> Although my web searches have turned up articles about particular >> aspects of particular VMs, I've found no inventory of what VMs are >> available in Debia

Re: Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

On 6/30/19 5:34 AM, Richard Owlett wrote: > I'm considering using a VM for some experiments. > Although my web searches have turned up articles about particular > aspects of particular VMs, I've found no inventory of what VMs are > available in Debian. > > My firm requirement is that all required

Choice of VMs under i386 Stretch?

I'm considering using a VM for some experiments. Although my web searches have turned up articles about particular aspects of particular VMs, I've found no inventory of what VMs are available in Debian. My firm requirement is that all required software be in set of install DVDs for i386 Debia

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Tue, Apr 16, 2019 at 08:39:25PM +0200, Pascal Hambourg wrote: If you intend to use guided partitioning on the whole disk, I repeat that LVM is worthless unless you plan to add disks in the future. I'd agree that It's utility is very much diminished by d-i allocating the entire VG with its gu

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

Quoting Pascal Hambourg (2019-04-16 20:39:25) > Le 15/04/2019 à 16:38, Tom Browder a écrit : > > > > I have decided to use the Deb installer and select LVM during > > the clean installation, and accept the FS default (I assume it will be > > ext4, but if not, I will select it). > > If you intend

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

Jonathan Dowland composed on 2019-04-16 09:17 (UTC+0100): > On Mon, Apr 15, 2019 at 01:38:12PM -0400, Felix Miata wrote: >> Both DFSee and IBM >>BM use the last sector on the first track for data storage, including useful >>cataloging data. Even when not having IBM BM installed, its data sector i

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

Le 15/04/2019 à 16:38, Tom Browder a écrit : I have decided to use the Deb installer and select LVM during the clean installation, and accept the FS default (I assume it will be ext4, but if not, I will select it). If you intend to use guided partitioning on the whole disk, I repeat that LVM

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Mon, Apr 15, 2019 at 01:38:12PM -0400, Felix Miata wrote: Both DFSee and IBM BM use the last sector on the first track for data storage, including useful cataloging data. Even when not having IBM BM installed, its data sector is (optionally) used by DFSee, by me, always. So I gather that you

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

Jonathan Dowland composed on 2019-04-15 10:28 (UTC-0400): > On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 05:36:00PM -0400, Felix Miata wrote: >>LVM's extra layer(s) would render my backup/restore system that depends in >>large >>part on cloning useless. > I don't quite understand this, would you care to elaborate?

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 9:50 AM Tom Browder wrote: > > I have used ext4 for many years while I have been watching zfs and ... Thanks to all who have given me advice on selecting the file system for a new laptop. After considering all suggestions and my use of the laptop, I have decided to use the

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 09:50:23AM -0500, Tom Browder wrote: I have used ext4 for many years while I have been watching zfs and btrfs being developed. I am now considering using one or both on at least one partion during my upcoming new Debian installation. What in particular do you find attrac

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 05:36:00PM -0400, Felix Miata wrote: LVM's extra layer(s) would render my backup/restore system that depends in large part on cloning useless. I don't quite understand this, would you care to elaborate? Thanks! -- ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀ ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Jonathan Dowland ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://jmtd.n

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Dan Ritter writes: > Peter Wiersig wrote: > > ZFS is now in two incompatible versions: Oracle's, and ZFSonLinux, > which is now effectively the parent for all the other efforts including > FreeBSD's ZFS. The biggest problem is the incompatible license which makes the code untouchable. How Orac

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

you can't trust Oracle any further than you can spit Larry Ellison. They aren't involved in anything we do with ZFS anymore. > I would never put my business on ZFS, I'd always go the "more backups, > and maybe less perfect GPL solution" route. You have the choice. -dsr-

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Matthew Crews writes: > > Here is a good talk on the subject by Michael Lucas, one of the premier > experts on ZFS. Its worth noting that a lot of the concepts apply to > BTRFS to varying degrees: > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9A0dX2WqW8 I don't have time yet, I think I will watch the whol

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 7:08 PM Felix Miata wrote: > > Anders Andersson composed on 2019-04-13 17:31 (UTC+0200): > > > Felix Miata wrote: > > >> Because of its snapshotting, BTRFS requires considerably more space than > >> older > >> filesystems, as much as double. > > > A btrfs snapshot takes ap

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

On 4/13/19 5:40 PM, Peter Wiersig wrote: > Peter Wiersig writes: >> >> I would be pissed if my OS removes snapshots I might or might not need >> in the future. That's a release critical bug in my eyes. Yeah, I know >> Microsoft and Apple do that automatically if your capacity runs out, but >> th

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Peter Wiersig writes: > > I would be pissed if my OS removes snapshots I might or might not need > in the future. That's a release critical bug in my eyes. Yeah, I know > Microsoft and Apple do that automatically if your capacity runs out, but > that's also why I don't recommend them at all. Ok

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Felix Miata writes: > Anders Andersson composed on 2019-04-13 17:31 (UTC+0200): > >> Felix Miata wrote: > >>> Because of its snapshotting, BTRFS requires considerably more space than >>> older >>> filesystems, as much as double. > >> A btrfs snapshot takes approximately zero space. Where did you

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Felix Miata wrote: > Anders Andersson composed on 2019-04-13 17:31 (UTC+0200): > >> Felix Miata wrote: > >>> Because of its snapshotting, BTRFS requires considerably more space than >>> older filesystems, as much as double. > >> A btrfs snapshot takes approximately zero space. Where did you get

Re: BTRFS snapshot space consumption (was: New laptop: need advice on choice...)

Anders Andersson composed on 2019-04-13 17:31 (UTC+0200): > Felix Miata wrote: >> Because of its snapshotting, BTRFS requires considerably more space than >> older >> filesystems, as much as double. > A btrfs snapshot takes approximately zero space. Where did you get > this idea from? (not an

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 4:51 PM Tom Browder wrote: > > I have used ext4 for many years while I have been watching zfs and > btrfs being developed. I am now considering using one or both on at > least one partion during my upcoming new Debian installation. > > Can anyone recommend either one for a

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 11:36 PM Felix Miata wrote: > > Tom Browder composed on 2019-04-12 09:50 (UTC-0500): > > > I have used ext4 for many years while I have been watching zfs and > > btrfs being developed. I am now considering using one or both on at > > least one partion during my upcoming new

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

Curt wrote: > On 2019-04-12, Thomas D Dial wrote: > > > > ZFS for /home makes sense, especially for anyone not already somewhat > > familiar with ZFS. > > Well, if ZFS is this big sixteen-wheeler that you might crash into the > concrete embankment if you're not careful, what are the benefits tha

Re: New laptop: need advice on choice of file system types

On 2019-04-12, Thomas D Dial wrote: > > ZFS for /home makes sense, especially for anyone not already somewhat > familiar with ZFS. Well, if ZFS is this big sixteen-wheeler that you might crash into the concrete embankment if you're not careful, what are the benefits that outweigh or override thes

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