On 17/02/15 17:34, Tanstaafl wrote:
Honest question...
What exactly is libsystemd0?
It's a shared library maintained by the systemd maintainers. It provides
a variety of (mostly fairly simple) utility functions such as:
sd_notify (etc.) - Notify service manager about start-up completion and
Honest question...
What exactly is libsystemd0?
Maybe a simple solution would be to just rename it to something less
'offensive' to some, like:
libinit - or libinit0
?
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On 02/17/2015 01:15 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 5:58 PM, Andrew Shadura wrote:
Hi,
On 17 February 2015 at 18:20, claude juif wrote:
Really rude answer. Really bad.
I find it really rude to send emails of about 300 lines of text in
total. Extremely rude.
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 6:25 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
wrote:
> which should help answer the question you asked: your work - fantastic
> as it is - was *impossible to find*. it doesn't even remotely come up
> on the radar of queries. *nobody knows what you've achieved* and
> that's somet
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 7:03 PM, Andrew Shadura wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I'd like to apologise for my mail I sent about two hours ago. I have
> overreacted mainly because of the length of the email, CAPS INSIDE and
> also because it's a topic which is being discussed for more than a year
> and which ma
Hello,
I'd like to apologise for my mail I sent about two hours ago. I have
overreacted mainly because of the length of the email, CAPS INSIDE and
also because it's a topic which is being discussed for more than a year
and which many of people here are already tired of.
I however still think that
2015-02-17 19:29 GMT+01:00 Nathan Schulte :
> Hi Andrew,
>
> On 02/17/2015 11:58 AM, Andrew Shadura wrote:
> > I find it really rude to send emails of about 300 lines of text in
> > total. Extremely rude.
>
> I for one am grateful Luke took the time to write the email he did. I
> understand it wa
Hi Andrew,
On 02/17/2015 11:58 AM, Andrew Shadura wrote:
> I find it really rude to send emails of about 300 lines of text in
> total. Extremely rude.
I for one am grateful Luke took the time to write the email he did. I
understand it was long and I believe that most won't even take the
time to
adam, i apologise for not being in a position to reply in-thread: as
mentioned previously i tried (via gmane) but the entire discussion is
completely missing, and i forgot to ask people in the original post to
cc me if they would like an ongoing threaded reply.
i also notice that you removed debia
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 5:58 PM, Andrew Shadura wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On 17 February 2015 at 18:20, claude juif wrote:
>> Really rude answer. Really bad.
>
> I find it really rude to send emails of about 300 lines of text in
> total. Extremely rude.
i did apologise in advance, and explained why i to
Oh, dear, it was so nice to have a break from the systemd flame-wars.
Could the troll-feeders please desist?
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Hi,
On 17 February 2015 at 18:20, claude juif wrote:
> Really rude answer. Really bad.
I find it really rude to send emails of about 300 lines of text in
total. Extremely rude.
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Cheers,
Andrew
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On 02/17/2015 at 11:28 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> so, marco, you wrote:
>
>> Again, you clearly do not understand well how systemd works.
>
> marco: understanding or otherwise how systemd works is not the
> point: the point is that there has been a unilateral decision across
> vi
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 5:20 PM, claude juif wrote:
>
>
> 2015-02-17 17:55 GMT+01:00 Andrew Shadura :
>>
>> Hi Luke,
>>
>> On 17 February 2015 at 17:28, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
>> wrote:
>> > <265 lines of text and counting snipped>
>>
>> In short, this is TL;DR. We've all got better things
Hi.
On Tue, Feb 17, 2015 at 06:20:34PM +0100, claude juif wrote:
>
>
> 2015-02-17 17:55 GMT+01:00 Andrew Shadura :
>
> Hi Luke,
>
> On 17 February 2015 at 17:28, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
> wrote:
> > <265 lines of text and counting snipped>
>
> In short, this is TL;D
2015-02-17 17:55 GMT+01:00 Andrew Shadura :
> Hi Luke,
>
> On 17 February 2015 at 17:28, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
> wrote:
> > <265 lines of text and counting snipped>
>
> In short, this is TL;DR. We've all got better things to waste our time
> on. Please go away. Nobody's interested in this
Hallo,
* Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton [Tue, Feb 17 2015, 04:28:04PM]:
> so to summarise:
>
> * the use of libselinux1 is dormant (i.e. whilst you can't remove it
> without inconvenience, its use is entirely optional, right from the
> kernel level)
> * its development and documentation is rational
On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 16:28:04 +
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> "i disagree with what you are saying, but i will defend your right to say it".
> i believe it was someone famous who wrote that,
Attributed to Voltaire; but does not appear in his writings.
Cheers,
Ron.
--
Hi Luke,
On 17 February 2015 at 17:28, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
wrote:
> <265 lines of text and counting snipped>
In short, this is TL;DR. We've all got better things to waste our time
on. Please go away. Nobody's interested in this any longer regardless
of their position on systemd.
Thanks
ok, so there's been quite a discussion, both on slashdot, where
amazingly the comments that filtered to the top were insightful and
respectful, and also here on debian-devel and debian-users. as i
normally use gmane to reply (and maintain and respect threads) but
this discussion is not *on* gmane,
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:22:21PM +, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Monday 16 February 2015 21:31:19 Marco d'Itri wrote:
> > On Feb 16, Alastair McKinstry wrote:
> > > The breakage of compatibility of existing systems (e.g. with /usr on a
> > > separate partition) has left a sour taste. I spent a we
Ric Moore wrote:
On 02/16/2015 07:47 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
[*SNIP*]
so the question then becomes: at a fundamental level (in a
distro-agnostic way) how to go about giving people a proper
choice (to
run systemd and associated components, or not)?
And why would their unpaid
On 02/16/2015 07:47 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler wrote:
Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
It's funny that when Wheezy (not Jessie!) came out, nobod
On Monday 16 February 2015 21:31:19 Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Feb 16, Alastair McKinstry wrote:
> > The breakage of compatibility of existing systems (e.g. with /usr on a
> > separate partition) has left a sour taste. I spent a weekend repairing
>
> systemd introduces no such breakage. Also, /usr
On Feb 16, Alastair McKinstry wrote:
> The breakage of compatibility of existing systems (e.g. with /usr on a
> separate partition) has left a sour taste. I spent a weekend repairing
systemd introduces no such breakage. Also, /usr on a separate partition
was partially broken even before systemd
Hallo,
* Lisi Reisz [Mon, Feb 16 2015, 11:42:14AM]:
> On Monday 16 February 2015 08:09:19 Marco d'Itri wrote:
> > > to debian-users: you don't have complete choice (yet), but i have
> > > demonstrated with a few hours work that there is a way to run
> > > (certain) desktop environments without requ
On 16/02/2015 16:14, Matthias Klumpp wrote:
> 2015-02-16 16:26 GMT+01:00 Alastair McKinstry :
>> [...]
>> An an example, i've been a long-term linux developer, DD; i've developed
>> and promoted Linux not just on the desktop but both in embedded systems
>> and in HPC systems. In all these I've bee
2015-02-16 16:26 GMT+01:00 Alastair McKinstry :
> [...]
> An an example, i've been a long-term linux developer, DD; i've developed
> and promoted Linux not just on the desktop but both in embedded systems
> and in HPC systems. In all these I've been comfortable that I've been
> able to adapt Linux,
On 2015-02-16 16:26, Alastair McKinstry wrote:
> On 16/02/2015 14:41, Christian Kastner wrote:
>> I'll hazard another guess, namely that the great vast majority of users
>> simply do not care. I'd be surprised if most users even know what an
>> init system does, much less what the differences betwe
On 16/02/2015 14:41, Christian Kastner wrote:
> On 2015-02-16 13:47, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
>> On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler
>> wrote:
>>> Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
>>>
On Monday 16 February 2015 14:41:32 Christian Kastner wrote:
> On 2015-02-16 13:47, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> > On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler
wrote:
> >> Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
> >>> http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_fr
On 2015-02-16 13:47, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler wrote:
>> Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
>>>
>>> http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
>>
>>
>> It's funny that when Wheezy (not Jessie!) came
On 02/16/2015 at 07:47 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler
> wrote:
>
>> Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
>>
>>> http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
>>
>> It's funny that when Wheezy (not Jes
On Mon, Feb 16, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Christian Seiler wrote:
> Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
>>
>> http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
>
>
> It's funny that when Wheezy (not Jessie!) came out, nobody complained
> that libsystemd-login0 (which is now pa
Am 16.02.2015 um 02:54 schrieb Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton:
http://lkcl.net/reports/removing_systemd_from_debian/
It's funny that when Wheezy (not Jessie!) came out, nobody complained
that libsystemd-login0 (which is now part of libsystemd0) was as a
dependency of dbus, so it is probably alrea
On Monday 16 February 2015 08:09:19 Marco d'Itri wrote:
> > to debian-users: you don't have complete choice (yet), but i have
> > demonstrated with a few hours work that there is a way to run
> > (certain) desktop environments without requiring libsystemd0 or any of
> > its dependencies, and after
Marco d'Itri:
> On Feb 16, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
>
>> to debian-developers: the technical issues are irrelevant (and can
>> always be solved over time) - it's that you are complicit in removing
>> people's software freedom right to choose what to run on their system:
>> that is why
On Feb 16, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> to debian-users: you don't have complete choice (yet), but i have
> demonstrated with a few hours work that there is a way to run
> (certain) desktop environments without requiring libsystemd0 or any of
> its dependencies, and after a little invest
Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton writes:
> i've documented the process by which it is possible to run some of the
> debian desktop window managers (TDE, fvwm, twm etc.) without the need
> for systemd or libsystemd0 or any components related to systemd
> whatsoever.
Alas, the resulting distribution i
On 02/15/2015 08:54 PM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
so the short and long of it is: i do not like it when people are not
given the freedom to choose... and that includes when, just like when
microsoft was so dominant in the 1990s, the choices they are presented
are not really a choice a
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