investment of effort you can invest a
similar small amount of effort in writing a Free version of his client and
include it with your library, thus destroying his market.
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Måns Rullgård writes:
> Actually, copyright law talks a great deal about derivative works,
> without ever going to the trouble of defining them...
The US statute does so, but US case law defines them fairly well.
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Henning Makholm writes:
> I still wonder what the people posting here are thinking, though.
Probably the same thing as the one who emailed me personally (cc'ing
debian-user) asking for help with his "AO*L a*rt fi*le" problem.
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William Ballard writes:
> After all, we have Christian Syria and Christian Lebanon out of it.
There were Christians in Syria and Lebanon _long_ before the
Crusades.
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William Ballard writes:
> The Bible should be in Debian. But the Koran, the Torah, and the Vishnu
> texts (name escapes me at the moment) should all be in there too.
Debian is not Project Gutenberg. Debian is about _software_.
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Debian".
And while I do not object to bible (or koran, or devil-worship) software, I
think that saying that it _should_ be in Debian is excessive. Debian can
do very well without religious software. This is obscure specialty stuff.
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Glenn Maynard writes:
> gnu-standards is obviously unlikely to be relicensed, and can't be
> rewritten
Of course it could be rewritten (though a rewrite should be retitled).
Standards are ideas, not expression.
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Philippe De Swert writes:
> I am just wondering if it is not the responabilty of the actual Debian
> user not to violate his local laws.
Of course it is. Unfortunately, governments don't generally agree.
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mean "you can leave this out
if you want to". It might be best to not use it at all as it seems to
engender some confusion.
Note also that the RFC says the the imperatives it defines should be used
sparingly.
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t reason alone. I also haven't seen a convincing argument
that they are beneficial. Why don't standard ABIs suffice?
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x27;s to say that some program isn't relying on the former (buggy)
> operation of the library?
How could the program do that without being buggy itself?
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Andi writes:
> "preferred form for modification" is _only_ a GPL-term and not part of
> the SC.
The SC is not a legal document. Common sense should suffice to conclude
that obfuscated source does not comply with the DFSG.
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Stephen Gran writes:
> You have the changelogs. Use them.
The changelogs are in the Packages file?
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verything that differentiates this
guy from his competitors may be in the embedded code.
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Nicolas writes:
> I already thought about it, but I fnind it quite confusing when I cannot
> run /etc/init.d/foobar by hand as soon as it is not enabled on startup.
Your script should check $PRERUNLEVEL. It will be N if you are booting.
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I wrote:
> Your script should check $PRERUNLEVEL. It will be N if you are booting.
That should be $PREVLEVEL.
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. If you also want to prevent the service from being
started on a runlevel change you have to do something else such as checking
$0.
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I wrote:
> If you also want to prevent the service from being started on a runlevel
> change you have to do something else such as checking $0.
Init exports RUNLEVEL, PREVLEVEL, and INIT_VERSION. Thus INIT_VERSION will
be set if you are booting or changing runlevels.
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Josselin Mouette writes:
> Why in the world would you then want to install a metapackage if its
> selection doesn't suit you?
Most users do not understand meta-packages. They decide to "run Gnome"
rather than "run KDE" and so they install Gnome.
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Thiemo Seufer writes:
> I haven't found an -f option in diff.
Look at the info docs.
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y a miniscule fraction of Web pages are Free. I guess that puts Firefox
in contrib.
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Norbert Tretkowski writes:
> There's no label saying "if you don't like these wires, remove them".
And cars never grow unwanted wires.
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ot thinking straight.
Rm is the tool that we provide for removing things.
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emselves on we should try to blunt the sharp
edges a bit, if possible.
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writing Linux programs don't.)
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Justin Pryzby writes:
> It occurs to me that help output to stderr is arguably appropriate if an
> invalid option is given
But '--help' is not an invalid option.
I'll have to check my packages.
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with a su
Francesco P. Lovergine writes:
> It depends on programs, sometimes the same usage function is used for
> either --help or invalid options.
Sure, but the output should still be directed correctly.
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William Ballard writes:
> The exim4 config asks you if you want itty bitty or one monolothic config
> file. It offers you the option of doing it the upstream way.
Does it tell you which is the upstream way? Most new users won't know.
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fferent from
> upstream's.
I have made similar changes, but I also patched the documentation. Many
DDs do not do so, confusing users.
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gs are flags for the debconf package
configuration system which should have been run during installation at
which point it would have set up the config for you after asking you some
questions. Either there is a bug or you did something strange.
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alter my email configuration. At least make enabling the change a Debconf
question.
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Brian Nelson writes:
> That's an overstatement. Simply having two architectures (i386 and ppc)
> would be enough to reveal nearly all portability bugs.
It required several architectures to uncover all of the portability bugs in
Chrony. ppc was not one of them.
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_for_ _the_ _same_ _target_
_architecture_ and then compare the binaries. I don't see why they should
differ.
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me a couple of
times a year.
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Joe Wreschnig writes:
> I don't know what the official standards for the character set and
> terminal specifications are...
Whatever IBM said they were. I believe they are in the IBM PC Technical
Reference Manual: I've got one around here somewhere.
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t hard
to tell the difference between appalling style and deliberate obfuscation.
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I fix up the
latter in Exim.
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ake the necessary
adjustments before delivering the mail to my ISP's smarthost. The only
change I've ever found necessary, though, is to forge the HELO command used
by my MTA when talking to the smarthost.
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with a subjec
onfig is not kernel-specific. It's just a little Perl program that
edits some PPP files. While I have never tried it, I see no reason why it
wouldn't work on Solaris or BSD.
I'm quite surprised that the Hurd still doesn't support PPP.
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Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt writes:
> I'd like to know if anyone cares about using these binary signatures
I do.
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Marc Haber writes:
> So, most of the DD's do not care about security at all.
I think that DD's do not use dpkg-sig and debsigs because they believe them
to be hard to use and not supported by the infrastructure or by policy.
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Olaf van der Spek writes:
> Security is more than package signatures.
What is your specific proposal?
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I wrote:
> I think that DD's do not use dpkg-sig and debsigs because they believe
> them to be hard to use and not supported by the infrastructure or by
> policy.
Marc Haber writes:
> dpkg-sig is harly "hard to use".
Please re-read what I wrote.
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-
Erinn Clark writes:
> Surely flaming people on mailing lists as a way to get things done is not
> something people want to encourage in NMs... right?
Right. After all, as we all know, no DD would ever do such a thing.
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e pointless than it already is.
I don't see why we need to concern ourselves about it, though. Intel has
lawyers. If they have to disqualify some candidates for legal reasons they
can do so without our help.
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ncern ourselves about it.
BTW the US is not the only country with such laws.
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and
uses '.' where you would use ',' in numbers.
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o do so, but
> in my experience Ubuntu developers have been very cooperative when they
> have been approached. So I don't see a big problem.
I don't either. After all, most users don't file bug reports, and Ubuntu
is (in my view), a user. It would be nice to have their feedback
sent in Ubuntu sounds like spam to me...
It doesn't to me. I am pleased when downstream distributions notify me
that they are using my packages.
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I wrote:
> I am pleased when downstream distributions notify me that they are using
> my packages.
mdz writes:
> Have you ever received such a notification?
Yes.
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g is likely to be present in the corresponding Debian package. If
you are wrong once in a while it's hardly the end of the world.
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Ubuntu should be sorting out whether such problems are present in Debian
> before sending them to the Debian maintainer.
Ubuntu should certainly first try to make sure the problem is not theirs.
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Andrew writes:
> Aren't we in a similar situation with other stuff that is in main
> already? rsync springs to mind.
Don't forget the Linux kernel.
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is, or is it just libel?
> ...what's stopping us from officially discouraging Ubuntu's existence?
The fact that most of us are interested in cooperation or at least peaceful
coexistence.
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and/or redistribute them.
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Pierre Habouzit writes:
> I strongly oppose to such an expulsion.
So do I.
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o
response. Can someone who is not going on vacation please supply the
appropriate address?
John Hasler
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Hasler)
Dancing Horse Hill
Elmwood, WI
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e.
"Thin-skinned" people often react to hostility by simply going away.
Often, they do so even when the hostility was not directed at them.
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t work, go fix it or I'll be
> REAL angry and how you dare you release such a [EMAIL PROTECTED]' kind).
That sort of hostility is much easier to deal with calmly than hostility
from fellow developers.
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with a subject of &
from easily
> scratchable/dentable/etc. aluminum.
Sounds like a good reason to buy a used PowerBook.
"Durable plastic" is an oxymoron.
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ded) will generally be considered a bug, but will not
necessarily render a package unsuitable for distribution. Guidelines
denoted by may (or optional) are truly optional and adherence is left to
the maintainer's discretion.
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languages. Such is the case here.
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xecutable on itself into
> /usr/bin/
You are correct.
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Jochen Voss writes:
> Any references for this? I was a little bit disappointed that the FHS
> was so unclear about /usr/bin and I do not know where else to look.
While the FHS is not as explicit as it might be, with the application of a
bit of common sense it is sufficiently clear.
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Thomas Hood wrote:
> Should Debian initscripts use lsb init-functions?
Where can we find these functions?
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. Why not check to see if
> the food is rotten before it gets to the consumer?
That's what Unstable is for.
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w to handle the development in such a way the resulting
> firmware can be released under a free license without any legal risks.
Unless you've signed an NDA you're fine. Just do it.
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free
> firmware?
As long as they don't copy any protected code you'll be fine.
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te the IBM BIOS...
Compaq used the "clean room" technique because a) the BIOS requirements are
such that many problems have only one solution and so Compaq's code was
certain to be very similar (or even identical) to IBM's in many places and
b) they expected IBM to sue and want
Matthew Garrett writes:
> In general, the law doesn't allow us to modify the license attached to a
> piece of software.
That has nothing to do with creating a derivative of a license for use
elsewhere.
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small.
For nearly everyone else software is free if you don't have to pay for it.
Should we then package everything that won't get us sued?
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. US copyright
law grants specific rights to the owner of a copy of a piece of software.
Better to be more specific, though.
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Transcode is not in Debian because the codecs are not DFSG-compliant.
Look at <http://apt-get.org> for an unofficial package.
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/mysql-query-browser
> They have "Adam Majer is responsible for this Debian package" with a
> link to Debian's QA.
For me they have:
"John Hasler is the maintainer of the following distribution packages:
Ubuntu Linux :: hoary :: pppconfig"
> Anyway, the bottom line i
should examine
the license in every single package.
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Russ Allbery writes:
> So far as I know, a base package (section base) has no particular special
> meaning from a dependency perspective, although I believe that section
> may be reserved for required packages (but am not sure).
There are optional packages in base.
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They also
resulted from deliberate policies of attempting to lock-in customers with
"differentiation".
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s why they are generally frowned
> upon.
I agree that they may have drawbacks, but I don't believe that they can
cause the sort of damage that the Unix wars caused.
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are assuming that everyone has been paying close attention to Ubuntu
and it's activities. While I have the impression that many Debian "senior
developers" are involved with it, I can name only one who I am sure is and
one who I am sure isn't.
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NOKUBI Takatsugu writes:
> BTW, there is the "n-gram" word in libdigest-nilsimsa-perl package's
> description without explain of the word.
Where it helps to render the description incomprehensible.
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with a su
do most of
the CEOs of the pro-patent companies). They believe that the OSS companies
can just pay the royalties and all will be fine.
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eased into the public domain?
It is not possible for a work to be both "public domain" and "educational
use only".
Do you mean that Microsoft has patented an invention that was published in
the referenced work, or that they are infringing the copyright?
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At about the time that it sued IBM
it changed its name to "The SCO Group" and now calls itself SCO.
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t;/etc/init.d/networking stop", which is all
> that you are proposing.
Roberto C. Sanchez writes:
> I agree. I rather like being able to configure run levels to my liking.
Why would defaulting to something other than the current flat arrangement
prevent you from configuring your ru
ns expect more runlevels. It's the
_lack_ that confuses them.
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Roberto C. Sanchez writes:
> Where, pray tell, is a newbie going to learn about [runlevels]?
a) By having used Red Hat.
b) By reading up on Linux before trying to use it (yes, some people _do_
that).
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you from continuing to customize
your runlevels. We are mererly proposing to change the default, not to
impose anything on you.
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Wouter Verhelst writes:
> In practice, many third-party applications will make assumptions about
> the availability and configuration of runlevels...
Seems to me that the most likely such assumption is that the runlevels are
Red Hat-like.
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the suggestion that the default runlevels be what
most people expect them to be.
And it _does_ come with "predefined options and settings": ones unique to
Debian.
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Humberto Massa Guimarães writes:
> But is non-rebranded Firefox *really* distributable by us under GPL#6,
> "no further restrictions"?
Yes. Copyright and trademark are completely orthogonal.
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what runlevels are and how to
use them but have no idea how to change them. The advice to boot to
runlevel 3 to fix X is commonly seen even on debian-user.
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ure that package names infringe.
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Peter Samuelson writes:
> I'm curious to know where you got that impression. I just reread the
> DFSG and it makes no mention of copyrights, trademarks or patents.
The legislative history of the DFSG makes it quite clear that it was only
intended to apply to copyrights.
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Bernardo Arlandis Mañó writes:
> Even when a package is free that doesn't mean you can name it using a
> trademark name, that would be an illegal use of a trademark.
it is not at all clear that that is true. A trademark owner does not have
anywhere near the rights of a copyright owne
inced that any of these constitute trademark infringement.
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Luca writes:
> Under gnome you can find gpppkill and gpppon, but they can't manage
> provider setting.
Gpppon doesn't need to manage settings. It uses the same settings as
pon/poff, which can be managed with pppconfig.
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y what it is being claimed we may not do
without explicit permission[1].
[1] I doubt that trademark law reaches that far, but I am not a lawyer.
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related parts and services) using that mark.
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let's accept the "arrangement" and move on. There is no DFSG problem
here even if we do accept the notion that the DFSG applies to trademarks.
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Eric Dorland writes:
> If we don't need the "arrangement", why exactly would we accept it
> anyway?
Because they want it and it costs us nothing to give it to them. They are
our friends. Let's accommodate them where we can.
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