Kyle +1, personally its not as if they are forcing systemd on you they
aren't locking you out of your choice of an init system I've seen too many
people either unaware of this or have failed to remember that arch(as well
as linux in general) is a system of choices of which if you happen to find
som
According to Justin Strickland:
heh seems most of this blaze has to do with users who are unfamiliar with
systemd and by convention afraid of it, I suppose the devs could lay down the
law and just be like 'this is what arch is going to ship with and this is what
we are going to support get ove
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 01:52:05AM -0400, Justin Strickland wrote:
> heh seems most of this blaze has to do with users who are unfamiliar with
> systemd and by convention afraid of it
I've seen a couple of people for whom this is probably true.
But I have seen a couple of posts that seem more ed
On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 10:53:35AM +0530, gt wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 05:28:03PM +0200, Heiko Baums wrote:
> > Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 17:08:53 +0200
> > schrieb Thomas Bächler :
> >
> > > This is a technical mailing list. If you want to discuss technical
> > > topics about Arch, you're in the
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 05:28:03PM +0200, Heiko Baums wrote:
> Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 17:08:53 +0200
> schrieb Thomas Bächler :
>
> > This is a technical mailing list. If you want to discuss technical
> > topics about Arch, you're in the right place. If you want to state
> > your _opinion_, get yours
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 6:47 PM, Tobias Frilling
wrote:
> I think we all forgot the most fundamental rule in dealing with trolls:
>
> Do *not* feed the trolls!
>
> If you found someone guilty of being a troll, don't argue. Doesn't matter how
> wrong he is or how stupid his opinions, he won'
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Sander Jansen wrote:
> It's not exactly rocket science. Other forums and mailing lists have
> moderators and rules.
The alternative is not rocket science either; ignore the threads you
don't care about. And other mailing lists do that as well (e.g. LKML).
--
Fe
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:42 PM, Tom Rand wrote:
> look at the end of the day this is a place for archlinux support &
> discussions with dev's, this is why there are policies for this & other forms
> of
> communication with the dev's & users.
> it is not about free speach or whether this is auth
2012/8/16 Tobias Frilling
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
> I think we all forgot the most fundamental rule in dealing with trolls:
>
> Do *not* feed the trolls!
>
> If you found someone guilty of being a troll, don't argue. Doesn't matter
> how
> wrong he is or how stup
Am Fri, 17 Aug 2012 01:56:57 +1000
schrieb Gaetan Bisson :
> Why would any of us care about your personal life?
>
> ...
>
> Your head must be such as mess if you can make sense of the above...
>
> ...
>
> Do either. And when you have five seconds please reflect on why none
> of us would read yo
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02:57PM +0200, fredbezies wrote:
> > Last threads on systemd was useless.
>
> I disagree. In the last thread, I had to really dig for outside information
> to understand both sides of the argument. My research and tinkering has lead
> me to the following valuable c
On Aug 16, 2012 5:50 PM, "Calvin Morrison" wrote:
>
> On 16 August 2012 11:47, Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia
> wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 03:15:36PM +0200, Thomas B?chler wrote:
> >> > That's not more pragmatic,
> >>
> >> It is. Person X is annoying everyone, so person X can't post any
l
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
I think we all forgot the most fundamental rule in dealing with trolls:
Do *not* feed the trolls!
If you found someone guilty of being a troll, don't argue. Doesn't matter how
wrong he is or how stupid his opinions, he won't change his mind; yo
Am 16.08.2012 17:50, schrieb Calvin Morrison:
>
> This is sort of how I feel about Tom and other who have gotten very
> upset and taken leave of the list.
>
> http://xkcd.com/386/
>
I plead guilty.
signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 12:00:55PM -0400, Calvin Morrison wrote:
> Right, but he has even said (along with others) that "nobody is gonna
> change their mind, who cares about them, they're just trolls..." to
> that effect.
>
> Why bother fighting something so stupid, if even you admit it is stupid?
On 16 August 2012 11:59, Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia
wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:50:20AM -0400, Calvin Morrison wrote:
>> On 16 August 2012 11:47, Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia
>> wrote:
>> > Those of us who are used to the internet don't get annoyed
>> > by other peoples' silliness.
[2012-08-16 09:47:11 -0600] Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia:
> Those of us who are used to the internet don't get annoyed
> by other peoples' silliness.
Let's all settle for a mediocre Internet and learn to cope with it.
--
Gaetan
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 11:50:20AM -0400, Calvin Morrison wrote:
> On 16 August 2012 11:47, Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia
> wrote:
> > Those of us who are used to the internet don't get annoyed
> > by other peoples' silliness.
>
> This is sort of how I feel about Tom and other who have gotten ve
[2012-08-16 17:28:03 +0200] Heiko Baums:
> If I have concerns about systemd for good
> reasons, even if they are not "technical" but, say if you like,
> "personal"?
Why would any of us care about your personal life?
> Well, the "personal" concerns can easily become "technical"
> ones sooner or la
On 16 August 2012 11:47, Anthony ''Ishpeck'' Tedjamulia
wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 03:15:36PM +0200, Thomas B?chler wrote:
>> > That's not more pragmatic,
>>
>> It is. Person X is annoying everyone, so person X can't post any longer.
>
> You seem to be conflating pragmatism with bigotry.
>
>
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 03:15:36PM +0200, Thomas B?chler wrote:
> > That's not more pragmatic,
>
> It is. Person X is annoying everyone, so person X can't post any longer.
You seem to be conflating pragmatism with bigotry.
Those of us who are used to the internet don't get annoyed
by other peopl
Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 17:08:53 +0200
schrieb Thomas Bächler :
> This is a technical mailing list. If you want to discuss technical
> topics about Arch, you're in the right place. If you want to state
> your _opinion_, get yourself a blog.
And if this opinion is about something going on (for the bet
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 8:08 AM, Felipe Contreras
wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>> Am 16.08.2012 14:14, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
>
Am 16.08.2012 16:57, schrieb Heiko Baums:
> Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:22:58 +0200
> schrieb Thomas Bächler :
>
>> So you're saying that instead of fixing the problem, every user should
>> remove the offending posts.
>>
>> The problem here are a small handful of people who start flames and
>> spread F
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Heiko Baums wrote:
> Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:22:58 +0200
> schrieb Thomas Bächler :
>
>> So you're saying that instead of fixing the problem, every user should
>> remove the offending posts.
>>
>> The problem here are a small handful of people who start flames and
>
On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02:57PM +0200, fredbezies wrote:
> Last threads on systemd was useless.
I disagree. In the last thread, I had to really dig for outside information to
understand both sides of the argument. My research and tinkering has lead me
to the following valuable conclusions:
Am Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:22:58 +0200
schrieb Thomas Bächler :
> So you're saying that instead of fixing the problem, every user should
> remove the offending posts.
>
> The problem here are a small handful of people who start flames and
> spread FUD. Banning a handful of people from the list is an
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 03:29:32PM +0200, Felipe Contreras wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:19 PM, Vytautas Stankevičius
> wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Felipe Contreras
> > wrote:
> >> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Bächler
> >> wrote:
> >>> I want to squash the noise
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:19 PM, Vytautas Stankevičius
wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Felipe Contreras
> wrote:
>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>>> I want to squash the noise that has turned this list from a helpful and
>>> nice place to discuss with develope
On 16 August 2012 09:19, Vytautas Stankevičius wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Felipe Contreras
> wrote:
>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>>> I want to squash the noise that has turned this list from a helpful and
>>> nice place to discuss with developers and u
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 4:17 PM, Felipe Contreras
wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>> I want to squash the noise that has turned this list from a helpful and
>> nice place to discuss with developers and users into the place it has
>> been the last few days.
>
> That
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
> Am 16.08.2012 15:08, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>>> Am 16.08.2012 14:14, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
> I'm an old archlinux
Am 16.08.2012 15:08, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
>> Am 16.08.2012 14:14, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
and for
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 2:19 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
> Am 16.08.2012 14:14, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
>>> I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
>>> and for a long time, I was very satisfied with arch-general.
> The problem here are a small handful of people who start flames and
> spread FUD. Banning a handful of people from the list is an easier
> solution IMO. I am generally against such measures, but it seems we will
> have no choice.
>
Can we please make the difference between flaming and trolling s
On 08/16/2012 03:22 PM, Thomas Bächler wrote:
We're all consenting adults here. Just hit that delete button, ESC-d, Del or
adjust your scorefile/junk filter
So you're saying that instead of fixing the problem, every user should
remove the offending posts.
Further,
Clever people always have a l
Am 16.08.2012 08:10, schrieb Dennis Herbrich:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 12:53:02AM -0400, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
>> As far as ML noise goes, that's what killfiles and client-side filters
>> are for, no? People can (or at least should be able to) configure their
>> mailreaders to mute people or topic
Am 16.08.2012 14:14, schrieb Felipe Contreras:
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
>> I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
>> and for a long time, I was very satisfied with arch-general. But some
>> people - can we define them as bottom holes ? -
On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 10:02 PM, fredbezies wrote:
> I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
> and for a long time, I was very satisfied with arch-general. But some
> people - can we define them as bottom holes ? - are rotting this
> mailing list, and the community t
> Congratulations to the trolls on the
> effect they've had.
Except I would see some of your posts as trolling and I'm sure you
would see some of mine as trolling too.
I have tried not to but have re-iterated some things when I have felt
that blatant inaccuracies have come along and I am sorry fo
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 3:49 PM, Jeremiah Dodds
wrote:
> With "-general" MLs, I don't really see the point of censorship of
> anything that isn't blatant spam, which the systemd threads are not. I
> particularly don't see the point when it's generally trivial for people
> who are bothered by some
Thomas Rand writes:
> On 16 August 2012 08:54, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
>> B: If it's noise to you, kill or filter out the threads in your
>> reader.
>
> how about the OP takes his argument to another place considering they
> are off topic & here to insight argument. The only on topic part was
> th
On 16 August 2012 08:54, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
> Thomas Rand writes:
>
>> On 16 August 2012 06:53, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
>>>
>>> I tend to prefer systems that provide mailing lists and forums as two
>>> separate frontends to the same data.
>>>
>>> As far as ML noise goes, that's what killfiles a
Thomas Rand writes:
> On 16 August 2012 06:53, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
>>
>> I tend to prefer systems that provide mailing lists and forums as two
>> separate frontends to the same data.
>>
>> As far as ML noise goes, that's what killfiles and client-side filters
>> are for, no? People can (or at
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 12:53:02AM -0400, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
> As far as ML noise goes, that's what killfiles and client-side filters
> are for, no? People can (or at least should be able to) configure their
> mailreaders to mute people or topics they want to mute.
This. This so very much.
We'
On 16 August 2012 06:53, Jeremiah Dodds wrote:
> Oon-Ee Ng writes:
>
>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Denis A. Altoé Falqueto
>> wrote:
>>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 7:33 PM, Oon-Ee Ng wrote:
On 16 Aug 2012 04:57, "set" wrote:
> Aren't there any moderators who can kick off trouble ma
Oon-Ee Ng writes:
> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Denis A. Altoé Falqueto
> wrote:
>> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 7:33 PM, Oon-Ee Ng wrote:
>>> On 16 Aug 2012 04:57, "set" wrote:
Aren't there any moderators who can kick off trouble makers ?
>>> That's not how MLs work. Unfortunately
>
On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Denis A. Altoé Falqueto
wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 7:33 PM, Oon-Ee Ng wrote:
>> On 16 Aug 2012 04:57, "set" wrote:
>>> Aren't there any moderators who can kick off trouble makers ?
>>>
>> That's not how MLs work. Unfortunately
>
> I think there are list man
On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 7:33 PM, Oon-Ee Ng wrote:
> On 16 Aug 2012 04:57, "set" wrote:
>> Aren't there any moderators who can kick off trouble makers ?
>>
> That's not how MLs work. Unfortunately
I think there are list management software that can allows moderation
But there should be someone wi
On 16 Aug 2012 04:57, "set" wrote:
>
> Le mercredi 15 août 2012 22:02:57 fredbezies a écrit :
> > Hello.
> >
> > I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
> > and for a long time, I was very satisfied with arch-general. But some
> > people - can we define them as bottom
Le mercredi 15 août 2012 22:02:57 fredbezies a écrit :
> Hello.
>
> I'm an old archlinux user (first installation back in december 2008),
> and for a long time, I was very satisfied with arch-general. But some
> people - can we define them as bottom holes ? - are rotting this
> mailing list, and t
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