[Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Timmie]

Hello,
I am stepping forward into learning python and write my first programs now.
To facilitate my development I have a question:

Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from it or
visualize its structure in another form?


There was a discussion about that soem time ago. 
OT: Flow chart -
http://news.gmane.org/find-root.php?message_id=%3c1103452504.92b04ebcjerimed%40myrealbox.com%3e

Is there any solution that can be used without leaning UML?

Kind regards,
Timmie


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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Kent Johnson]

Timmie wrote:
> Hello,
> I am stepping forward into learning python and write my first programs now.
> To facilitate my development I have a question:
> 
> Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from it 
> or
> visualize its structure in another form?

http://pycallgraph.slowchop.com/ will show the call graph
epydoc 3.0 can create a variety of graphics including call graph, 
package diagram and class diagrams:
http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/whatsnew.html

Stepping through code in a debugger is a good way to understand it. 
Winpdb is a good choice:
http://www.digitalpeers.com/pythondebugger/

> Is there any solution that can be used without leaning UML?

UML is pretty much the standard these days for representing class structure.

But if you are just learning Python and you are writing the programs 
that you are trying to understand, I don't know why you need these kinds 
of tools. You shouldn't be writing code that you need a flow chart 
generator to understand! Maybe you need to slow down a little and write 
programs that you do understand first? Or perhaps use a debugger to help.

You can ask specific questions here, if there is a bit of code you are 
struggling with.

Kent
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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[bhaaluu]

Greetings,

On Nov 6, 2007 4:15 AM, Timmie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello,
> I am stepping forward into learning python and write my first programs now.
> To facilitate my development I have a question:
>
> Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from it 
> or
> visualize its structure in another form?
>

I have found that a very simple and inexpensive way to look at Python
code while it's running is to insert a couple of lines in the code at the
points you want to look at:

print variableName
raw_input("Pause")

The 'print variableName' will print the value the variable is pointing to,
and 'raw_input("Pause") acts like a breakpoint, stopping program execution
so you can check out what's happening. Two other items of interest are:

dir (itemName)
type (itemName)

Both are extremely helpful when you're first learning Python. They're useful
for discovering the modules and attributes in classes, and checking the
type of objects.

You can use these in addition to any graphical output tools you find.

(Just Another Noob.)
-- 
b h a a l u u at g m a i l dot c o m
http://www.geocities.com/ek.bhaaluu/python/index.html

>
> There was a discussion about that soem time ago.
> OT: Flow chart -
> http://news.gmane.org/find-root.php?message_id=%3c1103452504.92b04ebcjerimed%40myrealbox.com%3e
>
> Is there any solution that can be used without leaning UML?
>
> Kind regards,
> Timmie
>
>
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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Wesley Brooks]

Following on from the comments above two things I've found really
helpful are the __doc__ strings and the exec command.

for example:

>>> a = 'a random string'
>>> dir(a)
['__add__', '__class__', '__contains__', '__delattr__', '__doc__',
'__eq__', '__ge__', '__getattribute__', '__getitem__',
'__getnewargs__', '__getslice__', '__gt__', '__hash__', '__init__',
'__le__', '__len__', '__lt__', '__mod__', '__mul__', '__ne__',
'__new__', '__reduce__', '__reduce_ex__', '__repr__', '__rmod__',
'__rmul__', '__setattr__', '__str__', 'capitalize', 'center', 'count',
'decode', 'encode', 'endswith', 'expandtabs', 'find', 'index',
'isalnum', 'isalpha', 'isdigit', 'islower', 'isspace', 'istitle',
'isupper', 'join', 'ljust', 'lower', 'lstrip', 'partition', 'replace',
'rfind', 'rindex', 'rjust', 'rpartition', 'rsplit', 'rstrip', 'split',
'splitlines', 'startswith', 'strip', 'swapcase', 'title', 'translate',
'upper', 'zfill']
>>> print a.strip.__doc__
S.strip([chars]) -> string or unicode

Return a copy of the string S with leading and trailing
whitespace removed.
If chars is given and not None, remove characters in chars instead.
If chars is unicode, S will be converted to unicode before stripping
>>>

exec is also very useful. It allows you to run python code that is in
a string, for example (Be it a simple and rather useless example!) the
string; "print 1 + 2 ":

>>> exec("print 1 + 2")
3
>>>

Taking both one step further if you can extract all the __doc__
strings for all the objects listed from the dir of an object:

a = 'a random string'
for i in dir(a):
command = "print str." + i + ".__doc__"
exec(command)

This will print out all the __doc__ strings for functions you can call
on your string object a. This is particually helpful when you know
what you want to do to something (for instance capitalise the first
letter each word in a string) but don't know what function to call.

Another instance when exec comes in handy is when receiving input from
a user in a user interface. If used in this way you should be careful
to check the data (parse) to ensure the user isn't running code that
will cause your program problems. For example exec("import
sys\nsys.exit()") would close the python interpreter, which will lead
to your program crashing.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$ python
Python 2.5 (r25:51908, Apr 10 2007, 10:27:40)
[GCC 4.1.2 20070403 (Red Hat 4.1.2-8)] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> exec("import sys\nsys.exit()")
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$

Cheers,

Wesley.

On 06/11/2007, bhaaluu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> On Nov 6, 2007 4:15 AM, Timmie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hello,
> > I am stepping forward into learning python and write my first programs now.
> > To facilitate my development I have a question:
> >
> > Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from 
> > it or
> > visualize its structure in another form?
> >
>
> I have found that a very simple and inexpensive way to look at Python
> code while it's running is to insert a couple of lines in the code at the
> points you want to look at:
>
> print variableName
> raw_input("Pause")
>
> The 'print variableName' will print the value the variable is pointing to,
> and 'raw_input("Pause") acts like a breakpoint, stopping program execution
> so you can check out what's happening. Two other items of interest are:
>
> dir (itemName)
> type (itemName)
>
> Both are extremely helpful when you're first learning Python. They're useful
> for discovering the modules and attributes in classes, and checking the
> type of objects.
>
> You can use these in addition to any graphical output tools you find.
>
> (Just Another Noob.)
> --
> b h a a l u u at g m a i l dot c o m
> http://www.geocities.com/ek.bhaaluu/python/index.html
>
> >
> > There was a discussion about that soem time ago.
> > OT: Flow chart -
> > http://news.gmane.org/find-root.php?message_id=%3c1103452504.92b04ebcjerimed%40myrealbox.com%3e
> >
> > Is there any solution that can be used without leaning UML?
> >
> > Kind regards,
> > Timmie
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Tutor maillist  -  Tutor@python.org
> > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
> >
> ___
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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Scott SA]

On 11/6/07, Wesley Brooks ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:

>Taking both one step further if you can extract all the __doc__
>strings for all the objects listed from the dir of an object:
>
>a = 'a random string'
>for i in dir(a):
>command = "print str." + i + ".__doc__"
>exec(command)
>
>This will print out all the __doc__ strings for functions you can call
>on your string object a. This is particually helpful when you know
>what you want to do to something (for instance capitalise the first
>letter each word in a string) but don't know what function to call.

While not as educational from one perspective, I've found the epydoc package 
quite useful. It extracts all of the doc strings and formats them in a nice, 
easy to read, layout.



Scott
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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Dave Kuhlman]

On Tue, Nov 06, 2007 at 07:36:51AM -0500, Kent Johnson wrote:
> Timmie wrote:
> > Hello,
> > I am stepping forward into learning python and write my first programs now.
> > To facilitate my development I have a question:
> > 
> > Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from 
> > it or
> > visualize its structure in another form?
> 
> http://pycallgraph.slowchop.com/ will show the call graph
> epydoc 3.0 can create a variety of graphics including call graph, 
> package diagram and class diagrams:
> http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/whatsnew.html
> 
> Stepping through code in a debugger is a good way to understand it. 
> Winpdb is a good choice:
> http://www.digitalpeers.com/pythondebugger/
> 

There are a variety of IDEs (integrated development environments)
that may help.  See:

http://wiki.python.org/moin/IntegratedDevelopmentEnvironments

Two that I've looked at:

- Geany -- http://geany.uvena.de/

- Eric -- http://www.die-offenbachs.de/eric/index.html -- Eric was
  easy to install on Debian GNU/Linux, but may be more of a
  challenge on MS Windows.

Dave


-- 
Dave Kuhlman
http://www.rexx.com/~dkuhlman
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[Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Michael H. Goldwasser]

   We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
   
  Object-Oriented Programming in Python
  by Michael H. Goldwasser and David Letscher
  Prentice Hall, 2008   (available as of 10/29/2007)

   The book differs greatly from existing introductory Python books as
   it warmly embraces the object-oriented nature of Python from the
   onset.  It is also extremely comprehensive with solid fundamentals
   as well as several "advanced" topics that can be covered as
   desired.

   This book is based on materials developed after switching our
   curriculum to the use of Python for an object-oriented CS1 course.
   Since the primary market is an introductory course, we do not
   assume any previous programming experience for our readers.  This
   should make it a very good match for those who wish to self-study.
   The book includes 93 end-of-chapter "practice" problems with full
   solutions in an appendix, as well as an additional 300
   end-of-chapter exercises.  There is also an appendix that helps
   readers who have finished the book transition their skills to
   additional language, showing side-by-side examples of code in
   Python, Java and C++.

   More information can be found at http://www.prenhall.com/goldwasser

With regard,
Michael Goldwasser

   +---+
   | Michael Goldwasser|
   | Associate Professor   |
   | Dept. Mathematics and Computer Science|
   | Saint Louis University|
   | 220 North Grand Blvd. |
   | St. Louis, MO 63103-2007  |
   |   |
   | Office: Ritter Hall 6 |
   | Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  |
   | URL:euler.slu.edu/~goldwasser |
   | Phone:  (314) 977-7039|
   | Fax:(314) 977-1452|
   +---+

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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Rikard Bosnjakovic]

On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.

[...yadayada...]

I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial advertisements.


-- 
- Rikard.
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Re: [Tutor] visualizing code structure / flow charting

[Timmie]

> > Is there a tool which I can run on my code and then get a flow chart from 
it or
> > visualize its structure in another form?
> 
> http://pycallgraph.slowchop.com/ will show the call graph
I think this is exactly what I was after. I still need to install Graphviz but 
from the homepage it seems the right one.

> epydoc 3.0 can create a variety of graphics including call graph, 
> package diagram and class diagrams:
> http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/whatsnew.html
This one is a alternative to pydoc, right?
But from what I read on the web page it only focusses on the modules and 
libraries whereas pycallgraph looks at the actual script you write.

> Stepping through code in a debugger is a good way to understand it. 
> Winpdb is a good choice:
> http://www.digitalpeers.com/pythondebugger/
I good hint. Thanks. Although I wasn't really after a debugger It looks nice.

 
> > Is there any solution that can be used without leaning UML?
> UML is pretty much the standard these days for representing class structure.
Yes, I know. But like epydoc does care if it in it's lastest version I do not 
need to get into the basics and can stick to deepen my python skills.
 
> But if you are just learning Python and you are writing the programs 
> that you are trying to understand,
I understand /my/ own programs.

> I don't know why you need these kinds 
> of tools. You shouldn't be writing code that you need a flow chart 
> generator to understand! 
I would like to employ a lot of modules and ready made libraries that are 
around in the wild and also extend and write my own modules because I am 
heading towards number crunching with scipy/numpy et. al.

Even if the basic script is well written and documented and kept short I would 
like to use the graphs to get a quick overview on what is done at what point, 
which modules are imported. This could also help to validate and improve the 
approach my script is based on. Furthermore, flow charts can be included into 
publications and discussed in presentations.

I hope my needs are now a litte understandable.

For the real debugging I will follow the hints the other posters pointed out 
anserwing my question. Thanks for your help on that.

> You can ask specific questions here, if there is a bit of code you are 
> struggling with.
I know and am thankful for this patient atmosphere here!

Kind regards,
Timmie

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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Kent Johnson]

Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
> On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
>>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
> 
> [...yadayada...]
> 
> I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial advertisements.

I don't think there is a specific rule about that. I'm happy to have 
on-topic announcements which I think this is. IIRC I announced the new 
edition of Learning Python and Wesley Chun announced the new edition of 
his book, Core Python.

Kent
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[jay]

I agree as well.  Its not like there is a flood of these books coming
out, or emails slamming the list announcing them.

Jay

On Nov 6, 2007 1:38 PM, Kent Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
> > On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
> >
> > [...yadayada...]
> >
> > I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial advertisements.
>
> I don't think there is a specific rule about that. I'm happy to have
> on-topic announcements which I think this is. IIRC I announced the new
> edition of Learning Python and Wesley Chun announced the new edition of
> his book, Core Python.
>
> Kent
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Jeff Johnson]

As far as I am concerned this may be a commercial advertisement, but is 
it a book on Python to help people learn Python.  I get all of my 
information from books and then turn to the lists (Tutor being one) to 
get my questions asked or what I have learned clarified.  I have a 
difficult time reading on line and prefer books.

So I for one appreciate the post.

Thank you,

Jeff

Jeff Johnson
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
SanDC, Inc.
623-582-0323
Fax 623-869-0675

Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
> On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
>>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
> 
> [...yadayada...]
> 
> I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial advertisements.
> 
> 
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Chris Calloway]

Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.

Why is this book $102?

-- 
Sincerely,

Chris Calloway
http://www.seacoos.org
office: 332 Chapman Hall   phone: (919) 962-4323
mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599



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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[wesley chun]

On 11/6/07, Kent Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
> > On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
> > I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial advertisements.
>
> I don't think there is a specific rule about that. I'm happy to have
> on-topic announcements which I think this is. IIRC I announced the new
> edition of Learning Python and Wesley Chun announced the new edition of
> his book, Core Python.


i also make announcements for my upcoming public Python courses, which
happen b/w 2-4 times a year.  it's very infrequent, and although could
be seen as commercial advertisments, is definitely for the benefit of
the community and helps put food on my table.  some have complained
about it, but many more others have said things to the effect of,
"*thanks* for posting your course announcements... i've been wanting
to take your class," or "i wouldn't have been able to find out about
it any other way," etc.  bottom line:

if infrequent:
GOOD
else:
SPAM

-- wesley
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2007,2001
http://corepython.com

wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com
python training and technical consulting
cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca
http://cyberwebconsulting.com
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Alex Ezell]

On 11/6/07, Chris Calloway <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
> >We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>
> Why is this book $102?

Supply and demand aside, I suspect the market for this, based on both
the publisher and the author's employment, is mostly
educational/collegiate. Therefore, this book is likely to be assigned
as a textbook and can command a premium price from buyers who have
little to no choice but to buy it. Additionally, it may not be
marketed on the wider bookstore shelves, so must make the most of the
market which it does reach.

That's all conjecture. What I do know is fact is that I can't afford it.

/alex
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Michael H. Goldwasser]

Thanks to the many voices supporting our decision to post to Tutor.
We only posted to the most directly relevant mailing lists (announce,
tutor, edusig).  As an introductory book, it seemed quite appropriate
for tutor.

In fact, the topic of our (developing) book was raised in a thread on
Tutor this past August 9/10th. Ironically, the topic at that time is
the same as that raised by Chris Calloway's question today, about the
$102 list price. 

The discrepency is because this is being published primarily as an
academic book through Prentice Hall's Education line (as opposed to
the Prentice Proffessional label that publishes books such as Wesley
Chun's Core Python Programming).  I'm not on the business side, so I
don't know that I understand all the factors; could be a combination
of the captive audience together with a lot of additional money spent
on sending review copies to educators and sending representatives to
campuses.  In any event, we believe that the book can be quite useful
outside the traditional classroom for new programmers or those new to
object-oriented programming.

Best regards,
Michael


On Tuesday November 6, 2007, jay wrote: 

>I agree as well.  Its not like there is a flood of these books coming
>out, or emails slamming the list announcing them.
>
>Jay
>
>On Nov 6, 2007 1:38 PM, Kent Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
>> > On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >
>> >>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>> >
>> > [...yadayada...]
>> >
>> > I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial 
> advertisements.
>>
>> I don't think there is a specific rule about that. I'm happy to have
>> on-topic announcements which I think this is. IIRC I announced the new
>> edition of Learning Python and Wesley Chun announced the new edition of
>> his book, Core Python.
>>
>> Kent



On Tuesday November 6, 2007, Chris Calloway wrote: 

>Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
>>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>
>Why is this book $102?
>
>-- 
>Sincerely,
>
>Chris Calloway
>http://www.seacoos.org
>office: 332 Chapman Hall   phone: (919) 962-4323
>mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599


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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Eric Brunson]

Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
> Thanks to the many voices supporting our decision to post to Tutor.
> We only posted to the most directly relevant mailing lists (announce,
> tutor, edusig).  As an introductory book, it seemed quite appropriate
> for tutor.
>
> In fact, the topic of our (developing) book was raised in a thread on
> Tutor this past August 9/10th. Ironically, the topic at that time is
> the same as that raised by Chris Calloway's question today, about the
> $102 list price. 
>
> The discrepency is because this is being published primarily as an
> academic book through Prentice Hall's Education line (as opposed to
> the Prentice Proffessional label that publishes books such as Wesley
> Chun's Core Python Programming).  

I.e. the students have to buy it no matter what because the professor 
says so, so we may as well rake them over the coals.  Their rich parents 
are paying for it anyway, so who cares. 

Not that I'm bitter or anything.  ;-)

Sincerely insincerely,
e.

> I'm not on the business side, so I
> don't know that I understand all the factors; could be a combination
> of the captive audience together with a lot of additional money spent
> on sending review copies to educators and sending representatives to
> campuses.  In any event, we believe that the book can be quite useful
> outside the traditional classroom for new programmers or those new to
> object-oriented programming.
>
> Best regards,
> Michael
>
>
> On Tuesday November 6, 2007, jay wrote: 
>
>   
>>I agree as well.  Its not like there is a flood of these books coming
>>out, or emails slamming the list announcing them.
>>
>>Jay
>>
>>On Nov 6, 2007 1:38 PM, Kent Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote:
>>> > On 06/11/2007, Michael H. Goldwasser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>>> >
>>> > [...yadayada...]
>>> >
>>> > I thought this list was supposed to be clean from commercial 
>> advertisements.
>>>
>>> I don't think there is a specific rule about that. I'm happy to have
>>> on-topic announcements which I think this is. IIRC I announced the new
>>> edition of Learning Python and Wesley Chun announced the new edition of
>>> his book, Core Python.
>>>
>>> Kent
>> 
>
>
>
> On Tuesday November 6, 2007, Chris Calloway wrote: 
>
>   
>>Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
>>>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>>
>>Why is this book $102?
>>
>>-- 
>>Sincerely,
>>
>>Chris Calloway
>>http://www.seacoos.org
>>office: 332 Chapman Hall   phone: (919) 962-4323
>>mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599
>> 
>
>
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Eric Lake]

For that price the book better write my code for me.

Alex Ezell wrote:
> On 11/6/07, Chris Calloway <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
>>>We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>> Why is this book $102?
> 
> Supply and demand aside, I suspect the market for this, based on both
> the publisher and the author's employment, is mostly
> educational/collegiate. Therefore, this book is likely to be assigned
> as a textbook and can command a premium price from buyers who have
> little to no choice but to buy it. Additionally, it may not be
> marketed on the wider bookstore shelves, so must make the most of the
> market which it does reach.
> 
> That's all conjecture. What I do know is fact is that I can't afford it.
> 
> /alex
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Jeff Johnson]

I have been developing software for over 25 years in various languages. 
  I am new to Python because for me it is the very best fit for my 
business going forward.  People ask me how do I keep up with the 
industry - probably the fastest moving industry there is.  Books, email 
lists and conferences is how I keep up.  I make a good living writing 
software and books and conferences are my education.

I can certainly sympathize with you if you are new to the programming 
world or can't afford books or conferences.  I was in that situation for 
many years.  There are tons of affordable or free resources for Python.

I went to Amazon and ordered the book right away.

Jeff

Jeff Johnson
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
SanDC, Inc.
623-582-0323
Fax 623-869-0675

Eric Lake wrote:
> For that price the book better write my code for me.
> 
> Alex Ezell wrote:
>> On 11/6/07, Chris Calloway <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Michael H. Goldwasser wrote:
We are pleased to announce the release of a new Python book.
>>> Why is this book $102?
>> Supply and demand aside, I suspect the market for this, based on both
>> the publisher and the author's employment, is mostly
>> educational/collegiate. Therefore, this book is likely to be assigned
>> as a textbook and can command a premium price from buyers who have
>> little to no choice but to buy it. Additionally, it may not be
>> marketed on the wider bookstore shelves, so must make the most of the
>> market which it does reach.
>>
>> That's all conjecture. What I do know is fact is that I can't afford it.
>>
>> /alex
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>> Tutor maillist  -  Tutor@python.org
>> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/tutor
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[wesley chun]

> In fact, the topic of our (developing) book was raised in a thread on
> Tutor this past August 9/10th. Ironically, the topic at that time is
> the same as that raised by Chris Calloway's question today, about the
> $102 list price.


fyi, here is a link to the 1st post of the august thread from kent:
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/tutor/2007-August/056230.html

the sale price was excellent back then (45%) but now gone since the
school year's started. :-) at least you can get a 12% discount from
bookpool (but they're [understandably] OoS at the moment). anyhow, i
look fwd to learning something from michael's and david's book.

additionally, here is a short article on pricing in the book industry
that may some more light:
http://publishing.articlesarchive.net/retail-margin-trade-discount-what-it-means-for-the-author.html

cheers,
-- wesley
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Core Python Programming", Prentice Hall, (c)2007,2001
http://corepython.com

wesley.j.chun :: wescpy-at-gmail.com
python training and technical consulting
cyberweb.consulting : silicon valley, ca
http://cyberwebconsulting.com
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Re: [Tutor] New Introductory Book

[Kent Johnson]

Jeff Johnson wrote:

> I went to Amazon and ordered the book right away.

I hope you will tell us about it when you receive your copy!

Kent
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