Re: [Python-Dev] Integrate BeautifulSoup into stdlib?
On Thu, Mar 05, 2009 at 01:30:25PM -0500, Barry Warsaw wrote:
> Ubuntu (and probably Debian): apt-get install python-lxml
Tested in Debian: yes, the incantation works.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:43:33AM +, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > As for owner and group, I think there is a very good reason that it doesn't > copy > them: under Linux, only root can change these properties. Only root can change file ownership - and yes, there are scripts that run with root privileges, so why not copy? As for group ownership - any user can change group if [s]he belongs to the group. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:56:13AM +, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > Oleg Broytmann phd.pp.ru> writes: > >Only root can change file ownership - and yes, there are scripts that > > run with root privileges, so why not copy? > > Because the new function would then be useless for non-root scripts That's easy to fix - only copy ownership if the effective user id == 0. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:14:41PM -0600, Adam Olsen wrote: > Yet the ext4 > developers didn't see it that way, so it was sacrificed to new > performance improvements (delayed allocation). Ext4 is not the only FS with delayed allocation. New XFS has it, btrfs will have it. Don't know about other OS/FS (ZFS? NTFS?) Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Ext4 data loss
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 12:28:07PM +0300, Oleg Broytmann wrote: > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:14:41PM -0600, Adam Olsen wrote: > > Yet the ext4 > > developers didn't see it that way, so it was sacrificed to new > > performance improvements (delayed allocation). > >Ext4 is not the only FS with delayed allocation. New XFS has it, btrfs > will have it. Don't know about other OS/FS (ZFS? NTFS?) http://thunk.org/tytso/blog/2009/03/12/delayed-allocation-and-the-zero-length-file-problem/ Ted Tso said HFS+ and ZFS have the property as well. So no, it is not a deficiency in the Linux kernel or in Ext4 FS - it is a mainstream path in modern filesystem design. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] BLOBs in Pg (was: email package Bytes vs Unicode)
On Thu, Apr 09, 2009 at 01:14:21PM -0400, Tony Nelson wrote: > I use MySQL, but sort of intend to learn PostgreSQL. I didn't know that > PostgreSQL has no real support for BLOBs. I think it has - BYTEA data type. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] BLOBs in Pg
On Thu, Apr 09, 2009 at 04:42:21PM -0400, Steve Holden wrote:
> If I can't pass a 256-byte string into a BLOB and get it back without
> anything like this happening then there's *something* in the chain that
> makes the database useless.
import psycopg2
con = psycopg2.connect(database="test")
cur = con.cursor()
cur.execute("CREATE TABLE test (id serial, data BYTEA)")
cur.execute('INSERT INTO test (data) VALUES (%s)',
(psycopg2.Binary(''.join([chr(i) for i in range(256)])),))
cur.execute('SELECT * FROM test ORDER BY id')
for rec in cur.fetchall():
print rec[0], type(rec[1]), repr(str(rec[1]))
Result:
1
'\x00\x01\x02\x03\x04\x05\x06\x07\x08\t\n\x0b\x0c\r\x0e\x0f\x10\x11\x12\x13\x14\x15\x16\x17\x18\x19\x1a\x1b\x1c\x1d\x1e\x1f
!"#$%&\'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?...@abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz[\\]^_`abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz{|}~\x7f\x80\x81\x82\x83\x84\x85\x86\x87\x88\x89\x8a\x8b\x8c\x8d\x8e\x8f\x90\x91\x92\x93\x94\x95\x96\x97\x98\x99\x9a\x9b\x9c\x9d\x9e\x9f\xa0\xa1\xa2\xa3\xa4\xa5\xa6\xa7\xa8\xa9\xaa\xab\xac\xad\xae\xaf\xb0\xb1\xb2\xb3\xb4\xb5\xb6\xb7\xb8\xb9\xba\xbb\xbc\xbd\xbe\xbf\xc0\xc1\xc2\xc3\xc4\xc5\xc6\xc7\xc8\xc9\xca\xcb\xcc\xcd\xce\xcf\xd0\xd1\xd2\xd3\xd4\xd5\xd6\xd7\xd8\xd9\xda\xdb\xdc\xdd\xde\xdf\xe0\xe1\xe2\xe3\xe4\xe5\xe6\xe7\xe8\xe9\xea\xeb\xec\xed\xee\xef\xf0\xf1\xf2\xf3\xf4\xf5\xf6\xf7\xf8\xf9\xfa\xfb\xfc\xfd\xfe\xff'
What am I doing wrong?
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Issue5434: datetime.monthdelta
On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 01:18:01AM -0500, Jess Austin wrote: > I'm new to python core development, and I've been advised to write to > python-dev concerning a feature/patch I've placed at > http://bugs.python.org/issue5434, with Rietveld at > http://codereview.appspot.com/25079. I have read the python code and it looks good. I often have a need to do month-based calculations. > This patch adds a "monthdelta" class and a "monthmod" function to the > datetime module. The monthdelta class is much like the existing > timedelta class, except that it represents months offset from a date, > rather than an exact period offset from a date. I'd rather see the code merged with timedelta: timedelta(months=n). Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Dates in python-dev
On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 05:29:29PM +0100, MRAB wrote: > I've recently subscribed to this list and received my first "Summary of > Python tracker Issues". What I find annoying are the dates, for example: > > ACTIVITY SUMMARY (04/17/09 - 04/24/09) > > 3 x double-digits (have we learned nothing from Y2K? :-)) with the > _middle_ ones changing fastest! > > I know it's the US standard, but Python is global. Could we have an > 'international' style instead, say, year-month-day: > > ACTIVITY SUMMARY (2009-04-17 - 2009-04-24) +1000 from me! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 383: Non-decodable Bytes in System Character Interfaces
On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 05:00:17PM +0200, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > I recognize that for other languages (without trivial transliterations) > the problem is more severe, and people are more likely to create > files with Cyrillic, or Japanese, names (say) if the systems accepts > them at all. In different encodings on the same filesystem... Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 383 (again)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 09:30:01AM +0200, Thomas Breuel wrote: > Programmers may find it inconvenient that they have to spend time figuring > out and deal with platform-dependent file system encoding issues and > errors. But internationalization and unicode are hard, that's just a fact > of life. Until it's hard there will be no internationalization. A fact of life, damn it. Programmers are lazy, and have many problems to solve. > end user gets an > error, submits a bug, and the programmer figures out how to deal with the > encoding issues correctly. And the programmer answers "The program is expected a correct environment, good filenames, etc." and closes the issue with the resolution "User error, will not fix". I am not arguing for or against the PEP in question. Python certainly has to have a way to make portable i18n less hard or else the number of portable internationalized program will be about zero. What the way should be - I don't know. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 383 (again)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 10:37:45AM +0200, Thomas Breuel wrote: > Returning an error for an incorrect encoding doesn't make > internationalization harder, it makes it easier because it makes debugging > easier. What is a "correct encoding"? I have an FTP server to which clients with different local encodings are connecting. FTP protocol doesn't have a notion of encoding so filenames on the filesystem are in koi8-r, cp1251 and utf-8 encodings - all in one directory! What should os.listdir() return for that directory? What is a correct encoding for that directory?! If any program starts to raise errors Python becomes completely unusable for me! But is there anything I can debug here? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 383 (again)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 11:32:26AM +0200, Thomas Breuel wrote: > On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 11:00, Oleg Broytmann wrote: > > I have an FTP server to which clients with different local encodings > > are connecting. FTP protocol doesn't have a notion of encoding so filenames > > on the filesystem are in koi8-r, cp1251 and utf-8 encodings - all in one > > directory! What should os.listdir() return for that directory? What is a > > correct encoding for that directory?! > > I don't know what it should do (ftplib needs to worry about that). There is no ftplib there. FTP server is ProFTPd, ftp clients of all sort, one, e.g., an ftp client built-in into an automatic web-camera. I use python programs to process files after they have been uploaded. The programs access FTP directory as a part of local filesystem. > I do know > what it shouldn't do, however: it sould not return a utf-8b string which, > when used to create a file, will create a file reproducing the byte sequence > of the remote machine; that's wrong. That certainly wrong. But at least the approach allows python programs to list all files in a directory - currently AFAIU os.listdir() silently skips undecodeable filenames. And after a program gets all files it can process it further - it can cleanup filenames (base64-encode them, e.g.), but at least it can do something, where currently it cannot. PS. It seems I started to argue for the PEP. Well, well... Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] PyPI copyright
http://pypi.python.org/pypi "Copyright © 1990-2007, Python Software Foundation" :s/2007/2009/ Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Easy way to detect filesystem case-sensitivity?
On Fri, May 08, 2009 at 09:52:40AM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote: > Thanks for the help to everyone. I ended up simply taking __file__, making > it all uppercase (or lowercase if it is already uppercase) and then doing > os.path.exists() on the modified name. Seems to work. What if __file__ is on a different filesystem with different rules (consider NFS, SMB/CIFS, etc.)? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] question about docstring formatting
On Thu, May 28, 2009 at 09:06:03AM -0400, Jeremy Hylton wrote:
> It says that the summary line may be used by automatic indexing tools,
> but is there any evidence that such a tool actually exists?
epydoc, for one.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial and linefeeds
On Thu, Jun 04, 2009 at 09:02:53AM -0400, Jason R. Coombs wrote: > It seems that within the hg repository, everything has been converted to LF > for line endings. I suspect this is because HG provides no integrated > support for line-ending conversions and because the hg to svn bridge is > probably running on a Unix OS. http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/FAQ#FAQ.2BAC8-TechnicalDetails.What_about_Windows_line_endings_vs._Unix_line_endings.3F Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Mercurial, linefeeds, and Visual Studio
On Thu, Jun 04, 2009 at 03:20:56PM +0100, Paul Moore wrote: > Essentially, pcbuild.sln is a binary file, and should be treated as > such. Maybe it's an error in the Subversion setup that it's treated as > text at all... Subversion has a built-in notion of eol-conversion (don't know if it was used for this particular file). Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] expy: an expressway to extend Python
On Mon, Jul 20, 2009 at 09:19:10PM -0700, Yingjie Lan wrote: > This is to announce the initial release of expy 0.1.0. > More details at http://expy.sourceforge.net/ What is it (the announcement is too brief and I'm not going to click on a link without a real need)? How does it help core developers to develop Python (if you posted this to the python-dev mailing list instead of c.l.p or c.l.p.a)? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] expy: an expressway to extend Python
On Tue, Jul 21, 2009 at 11:22:19AM -0700, Yingjie Lan wrote:
> @function(double) #return type: double
> def sqrt(x=double): #argument x: double
Python 3.0 has arguments and return value annotations:
http://docs.python.org/3.0/whatsnew/3.0.html#new-syntax
http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-3107/
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] expy: an expressway to extend Python
On Tue, Jul 21, 2009 at 04:26:52PM -0400, Eric Entin wrote: > I think the point of his software is to make it easier to interface Python > with C code I think I understand that. And I think this > > > @function(double) #return type: double > > > def sqrt(x=double): #argument x: double is how C functions are declared in Python, so I think annotations is the way to go for such declarations. > >Python 3.0 has arguments and return value annotations: > > > > http://docs.python.org/3.0/whatsnew/3.0.html#new-syntax > > http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-3107/ Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 385: the eol-type issue
On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 02:35:02PM +0100, MRAB wrote:
> Instead of just talking about line endings, could each file have a
> specific 'filetype'?
EOL-conversion, MIME type and encoding (charset) are three different
concepts. Yes, all of them must be supported, but not necessary in one
configuration mechanism.
Subversion handles these issues by providing svn:eol-style and
svn:mime-type (handles both MIME type and charset) properties on a
file-by-file basis.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 385: Mercurial issues
On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 05:50:03PM +0400, Oleg Broytmann wrote: >Subversion handles these issues by providing ... > svn:mime-type (handles both MIME type and charset) > file-by-file basis. Dirkjan, how does Mercurial handles charsets? If I have three files in my repository - one in utf-8, another in koi8-r, and the third in cp1251 encoding - I certainly don't want to convert them back and force, but I want hg web interface to provide charset in the Content-Type header. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 385: Mercurial issues
On Wed, Aug 05, 2009 at 04:04:24PM +0200, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: > On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 15:57, Oleg Broytmann wrote: > > Dirkjan, how does Mercurial handles charsets? If I have three files in > > my repository - one in utf-8, another in koi8-r, and the third in cp1251 > > encoding - I certainly don't want to convert them back and force, but I > > want hg web interface to provide charset in the Content-Type header. > > It doesn't currently have any way to provide out-of-band charset info. Perhaps that's not a big issue for Python, but it's certainly a big issue for me. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 385: the charset issue
On Thu, Aug 06, 2009 at 12:12:08AM +1000, Nick Coghlan wrote: > Yep - while SVN does support full mime_type specification for files, I > don't think we have ever used it. These files are in 8859-1 encoding (names in comments, at least): http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk/Lib/encodings/punycode.py http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk/Lib/test/test_csv.py http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk/Tools/i18n/msgfmt.py http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk/Tools/i18n/pygettext.py If they are not marked as "text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1" I think it's a bug. Either they should be marked, or converted to ascii or utf-8; the coding pseudocomment (directive) should be changed accordingly. Probably there are other files. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 385: Mercurial issues
On Thu, Aug 06, 2009 at 12:34:39AM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > Oleg Broytmann writes: > >Dirkjan, how does Mercurial handles charsets? If I have three files in > > my repository - one in utf-8, another in koi8-r, and the third in cp1251 > > encoding - I certainly don't want to convert them back and force, but I > > want hg web interface to provide charset in the Content-Type header. > > How is this relevant to PEP 385? I hope the answer is "not at all". There are non-utf8 non-ascii files in the Python source tree. Either there should be a way to handle them in Mercurial or they have to be converted to UTF-8 in a proper way (i.e., don't forget to rewrite charset directives). Other tan that - I am pondering a switch from SVN to hg in other projects using Python process as an example and asking questions that are slightly off-topic (but only slightly). > I've been there, done that, and my answer is "never again". (I'm not > telling you what to do with *your* repository, just that I don't see > any good reason for having any encodings but UTF-8 in Python's.) We have files in at least two different encodings - utf-8 and cp1251 for user-visible text-files on w32. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] VC++ versions to match python versions?
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 03:22:50PM +0100, Chris Withers wrote: > Is the Express Edition of Visual C++ 2008 suitable for compiling > packages for Python 2.6 on Windows? > (And Python 2.6 itself for that matter...) > > Ditto for 2.5, 3.1 and the trunk (which I guess becomes 3.2?) These two I know for sure: Python 2.5: MSVC-7.1 (VC++ 2003) Python 2.6: MSVC-9.0 (VS 2008) Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3144: IP Address Manipulation Library for the Python Standard Library
> http://ipaddr-py.googlecode.com/svn/branches/2.0.x/ipaddr.py : > def IP(address, host=False, version=None): > """Take an IP string/int and return an object of the correct type. > > Args: > ip_str: ... The arg is 'address', not 'ip_str'. There are two classes, IPv4 and IPv6 whose __new__ never create an instance of its class, instead they create instances of other classes. Why IPv4 and IPv6 are classes and not (factory) functions (like function IP)? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3144: IP Address Manipulation Library for the Python Standard Library
On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 01:53:36PM -0700, Peter Moody wrote:
> hold over from when I was trying to be too fancy. fixed as well.
Thank you. The PEP and the code is Ok for me. Something like this should
be in the stdlib. Currently I'm using IPy.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3144: IP Address Manipulation Library for the Python Standard Library
http://ipaddr-py.googlecode.com/svn/branches/2.0.x/ipaddr.py > _compat_has_real_bytes = bytes != str Wouldn't it be nicer "bytes is not str"? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] how to debug httplib slowness
On Fri, Sep 04, 2009 at 04:02:39PM +0100, Chris Withers wrote: > So, httplib does this: > > GET / HTTP/1.1 [skip] > While wget does this: > > GET / HTTP/1.0 [skip] > - Apache responds with a chunked response only to httplib. Why is that? Probably because wget uses HTTP/1.0? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3145 (With Contents)
On Tue, Sep 15, 2009 at 12:25:35PM -0400, Eric Pruitt wrote: > A search for "python asynchronous subprocess" will turn up numerous > accounts of people IMHO there is no need to refer to a search. It'd be enough to say "There are many people...". > kernel 32 DLL Why not just name it kernel32.dll? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Distutils ML wrap-up: setup.cfg new format
On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 03:21:06PM +0200, Tarek Ziad? wrote: > I realize that it's a good thing to send in. > python-dev such wrapup on distutils design > decisions, to keep everyone informed and get > more feedback when required. Sure it is. > I will try to do it for every upcoming changes > that are not going in a PEP process (when it's not > a 'big' change). Thank you! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] first draft of bug guidelines for www.python.org/dev/
On Thu, Jul 20, 2006 at 08:52:34PM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote: > * Summary > A one-line describing the problem so as to make it easy for > developers to spot whether they have the expertise needed to work on > the bug. Summary is also displayed as a title on index and search pages, so it is important to make the summary right - short and descriptive. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] draft for bug guidelines
On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 12:21:06PM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote: > Start a new bug "Before starting a new bug please try to search if the bug has already been reported. It it has - do not start a new report, add your comments to the existing report." Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] draft of patch guidelines
On Thu, Aug 24, 2006 at 12:22:42PM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote: > Read the Developer Intro to understand the scope of your proposed change "Search through the PEPs, developer mailing lists and patches. Has a similar patch already been proposed? Has it been accepted, postponed or rejected? Learn the reasons why it's been postponed or rejected." Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New relative import issue
On Tue, Sep 19, 2006 at 03:46:59PM +1200, Greg Ewing wrote:
> There really shouldn't be
> any such thing as sys.path -- the view that any
> given module has of the package namespace should
> depend only on where it is
I do not understand this. Can you show an example? Imagine I have two
servers, Linux and FreeBSD, and on Linux python is in /usr/bin, home is
/home/phd, on BSD these are /usr/local/bin and /usr/home/phd. I have some
modules in site-packages and some modules in $HOME/lib/python. How can I
move programs from one server to the other without rewriting them (how can
I not to put full paths to modules)? I use PYTHONPATH manipulation - its
enough to write a shell script that starts daemons once and use it for many
years. How can I do this without sys.path?!
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Importing .pyc in -O mode and vice versa
On Sat, Nov 04, 2006 at 04:47:37PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > Patch #1346572 proposes to also search for .pyc when OptimizeFlag > is set, and for .pyo when it is not set. The author argues this is > for consistency, as the zipimporter already does that. > > This reasoning is somewhat flawed, of course: to achieve consistency, > one could also change the zipimporter instead. > > However, I find the proposed behaviour reasonable: Python already > automatically imports the .pyc file if .py is not given and vice > versa. So why not look for .pyo if the .pyc file is not present? > > What do you think? +1 from me. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] OT: World's oldest ritual discovered. Worshipped the python 70, 000 years ago
http://www.apollon.uio.no/vis/art/2006_4/Artikler/python_english (-: Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] OT: World's oldest ritual discovered. Worshipped the python 70, 000 years ago
On Sat, Dec 02, 2006 at 12:34:22AM -0800, Talin wrote: > I noticed the other day that the word "Pythonic" means "Prophetic", This is, of course, due to the Greek mythology and the oracle at Delphi! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Python_%28mythology%29 Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Adding resume (206) support to urllib(2)
On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 08:30:00AM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > If you add protocol-specifics to urllib, the abstraction that urllib > provides goes away, and you are better off (IMO) to use the underlying > protocol library in the first place. IMO you better don't because urllib2 provides not only an abstraction, but a lot of services (authenticated proxies, cached FTP files)... Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Adding resume (206) support to urllib(2)
On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 09:05:49AM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > As for authenticated proxies: I think they ought to be implemented > in httplib as well. Agree. > If everybody wants to become urllib just a better library to access > http servers, I probably can't do much about it, though. HTTP is one of the most widely known and used protocol. Would you better have big httplib and small abstract urllib? so abstract it doesn't allow a user to change protocol-specific handling? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Adding resume (206) support to urllib(2)
On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 10:00:48PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > Personally, I think very elaborate support for HTTP in httplib, and very > few generalizations and abstractions in urllib* would be the "right" > way to do it, IMO. For example, there might be the notion of an > "http session" object where a single application request can resolve > to multiple http requests (with redirection, authentication negotiation, > cookies, 100 continue, implicit headers, etc). I see. > For compatibility, urllib* can't drop features Leave it for py3k, then. > and we'd need > contributors who contribute such a refactoring That's the hardest part. > If applications use urllib *only* for http, and > *only* because it has these multi-request, implicit headers > features, something is wrong with the abstractions. I think I agree. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Cached Property Pattern
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2005-September/056782.html
On Fri, Dec 29, 2006 at 02:40:05AM -0500, Calvin Spealman wrote:
> To this end, should a cachedproperty builtin be included to do this
The issue was discussed a year ago:
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2005-September/056782.html
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2005-October/057120.html
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Cached Property Pattern
On Fri, Dec 29, 2006 at 09:55:46AM -0500, Calvin Spealman wrote: > It may have been discussed before, but there does not seem to have > been any resolution on the issue. Am I missing something or did the > discussion just kind of stop, with no solution or agreement ever > reached? In which case, reviving the question is not a bad idea, is > it? I don't remember any resolution. I think submitting a small module to the patch tracker would be the simplest way to revive the discussion. > On 12/29/06, Oleg Broytmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2005-September/056782.html > > http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2005-October/057120.html Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New syntax for 'dynamic' attribute access
On Tue, Feb 13, 2007 at 10:10:37AM +, Steve Holden wrote: > Python further away from the "Computer Programming for Everyone" arena > and closer to the "Systems Programming for Clever Individuals" camp. That's because Python is being developed by "Clever Individuals" and not by "Computer Programming for Everyone Committee". Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New syntax for 'dynamic' attribute access
On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 03:24:30PM +, Steve Holden wrote: > Oleg Broytmann wrote: > > On Tue, Feb 13, 2007 at 10:10:37AM +, Steve Holden wrote: > >> Python further away from the "Computer Programming for Everyone" arena > >> and closer to the "Systems Programming for Clever Individuals" camp. > > > >That's because Python is being developed by "Clever Individuals" and not > > by "Computer Programming for Everyone Committee". > > > I agree that the developers are Clever Individuals. So clever, in fact, > that they realise Python needs to be as approachable as possible, not a > language for them alone. Anyway I don't believe it's possible to create a CP4E language without a "CP4E Steering Committee", and I think such committee it Python land is... dormant at present... Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New syntax for 'dynamic' attribute access
On Thu, Feb 15, 2007 at 12:48:48AM +, Steve Holden wrote: > Given that they say "a camel is a horse designed by a committee" Metaphors can go that far but not farther. And, BTW, camels are very suited for their environments... I am not afraid of committees for large tasks. Well, that has to be a small committee ruling by a cleverest ruler. > require a > single individual with good language design skills and the ability to > veto features that were out of line with the design requirements. A lot > like a BDFL, really. Of course, but I don't know if "CP4E" idea is still on his agenda and with what priority. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New syntax for 'dynamic' attribute access
On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 12:40:54PM +1300, Greg Ewing wrote: > The quote is actually "a camel is a *racehorse* designed by a committee". > Camels are very good at surviving in the desert, but not so good at > winning a horse race (not camel race). Which is the point of the saying. That changes the meaning, but... have you ever tried to ride a horse designed by a group of Clever Individuals loosely connected by email? ;) I am afraid of even thinking of its ugliness and speed. (-: I think a committee is better than nothing, and I believe CP4E has been dropped from the agenda. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New syntax for 'dynamic' attribute access
On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 01:42:54PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > Ah, this passive voice again, and again the assumption that there is an > agenda of python-dev. Exactly opposite. There is no agenda, and thus there is no pojnt in trying to prevent new features in Python language based on the idea the features are not "4E". Python, IMHO, has gone far beyond "4E" already. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Embedded Python:: C/Python: Is Py_Finalize() necessary between embedded function calls?
On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 04:24:19AM -0800, Sydney Pang wrote:
> do I have to call Py_Finalize() at
> the end of each Python embedded C function?
As far I understand you only need to call Py_Initialize() and
Py_Finalize() once per every embedded interpreter, not for an every
function.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Encouraging developers
On Mon, Mar 05, 2007 at 07:30:20PM +, Phil Thompson wrote: > 1. Don't suggest to people that, in order to get their patch reviewed, they > should review other patches. The level of knowledge required to put together > a patch is much less than that required to know if a patch is the right one. I am afraid this could lead to proliferation of low-quality patches. A patch must touch at least code, documentation and tests, be tested itself and must not break other tests. These requirements demand higher expertise. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 01:36:03PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > #1115886 complains that in the file name '.cshrc', the > entire file name is treated as an extension, with no > root. > > #1462106 contains a patch for that, changing the behavior > so that there will always be a root file name (and no > extension if the file is just a dotfile). > > Should this be changed? Opinions? Yes. In .pythonrc.py .pythonrc is the root, and .py is the extension. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 02:44:52PM +0100, Hans Meine wrote: > a leading dot does not start an > extension, but marks a file as "hidden". The latter is on UNIX, and while On Unix - I mean in the OS itself - there are no such things as "roots", "extensions" and "hidden files". All these are only conventions in the user programs. The current behaviour is not a bug in a strict sense, but it is inconvenient and hence should be changed. > this is different on Windows, I cannot imagine that anyone would > a) have dotfiles under that OS I have. (-: I often copy files from an ext3 partition to a FAT partition on my dual-booting desktop. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 04:00:01PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > >Yes. In .pythonrc.py .pythonrc is the root, and .py is the extension. > > Ah, it would do that already: with multiple dots, the last one always > provides the extension. Ah, sorry. I messed it with .split(). Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 04:07:16PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote:
> Oleg Broytmann schrieb:
> > On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 04:00:01PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote:
> >>>Yes. In .pythonrc.py .pythonrc is the root, and .py is the extension.
> >> Ah, it would do that already: with multiple dots, the last one always
> >> provides the extension.
> >
> >Ah, sorry. I messed it with .split().
>
> Ok - now I'm confused: do you consider this behavior
> (splitext('.pythonrc') == ('', '.pythonrc')) correct
> or not?
I messed this in the sense that I have ran .split('.pythonrc.py'), got
('', '.pythonrc.py') and thought there is a problem. .split() works fine.
Even .splitext() works fine with multiple dots:
>>> os.path.splitext("/bin/.pythonrc.py")
('/bin/.pythonrc', '.py')
but
>>> os.path.splitext(".pythonrc")
('', '.pythonrc')
and I think it should be
('.pythonrc', '')
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Tue, Mar 06, 2007 at 08:49:00AM -0800, Ilya Sandler wrote: > I think it's reasonable to expect that > > splitext( a+"." + b) == (a, .b ) > > for any a,b which have no dots in them... Except for an empty 'a', in what case 'b' is the name, not the extension. Well, 'a' cannot be empty because it's the name, but 'b' can be empty. For ".pythonrc.py" ".pythonrc" is the name and ".py" is the extension. For ".pythonrc" ".pythonrc" is the name and there is no extension. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] splitext('.cshrc')
On Thu, Mar 08, 2007 at 06:54:30PM +0100, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > back_name = splitext(name[0]) + '.bak' back_name = splitext(name)[0] + '.bak' Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] datetime module enhancements
On Sun, Mar 11, 2007 at 11:02:39AM -0500, Tony Nelson wrote: > Apple's old MacOS had a very flexible LongDateRecord and date utilities. > Nearly anything one could do to a date had a useful meaning. Perhaps > Python should be different, but I've found Apple's date calculations and > date parsing to be very useful, in a Pythonic sort of way. Python world has excellent mxDateTime that does a very good job of date parsing and date/time arithmetic! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] HTTP responses and errors
On Tue, Mar 27, 2007 at 04:12:06PM +, Facundo Batista wrote: > (didn't know about "annotate"). It is also known under the name "blame"! ;) Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] HTTP responses and errors
On Tue, Mar 27, 2007 at 07:14:35PM +0200, "Martin v. L?wis" wrote: > Oleg Broytmann schrieb: > > On Tue, Mar 27, 2007 at 04:12:06PM +, Facundo Batista wrote: > >> (didn't know about "annotate"). > > > >It is also known under the name "blame"! ;) > > Or "praise", depending on your mood :-) But "blame" is its official primary name! > svn praise blame (praise, annotate, ann): Output the content of specified files or URLs with revision and author information in-line. usage: blame [EMAIL PROTECTED] See? (-: Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] More exposure for PEP8 (was: context manager - generator interaction?)
On Fri, Apr 06, 2007 at 10:58:41AM -0400, Barry Warsaw wrote:
> It might even be worthwhile to give PEP 8
> more exposure in the tutorial or on the documentation ToC page.
And bundle the PEP with the distributed documentation.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Summaries and the New Lists
On Tue, Apr 24, 2007 at 04:37:14PM -0400, Calvin Spealman wrote: > So, the question I pose is how would everyone like to see this > resolved? As I see it, there are two things I can do. I can either > summaries each list separately, and try to sort out the cross overs. > Or, I can start pulling in all three development lists into all the > summaries. I prefer the second option I prefer the second, too. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Iterating over objects of unknown length
Hello!
(This seems like a "developing with Python" question and partially it is
but please read on.)
I have a class that represents SQL queries. Instances of the class can
be iterated over. As an SQL query doesn't know in advance if it will
produce any row the class doesn't implement __len__(). Moreover, users of
the class sometimes write
if sqlQuery:
for row in sqlQuery: ...
else:
# no rows
which is a bug (the query doesn't know if it's True or False; to find it
out the user have to execute the query by trying to iterate over it). To
prevent users from writing such code the class implements __nonzero__()
that always raises an exception.
Unfortunately, I found some libraries test the object in boolean context
before iterating over it and that, of course, triggers the exception from
__nonzero__().
Even worse, some libraries test the object in boolean context regardless
of iterating over it. For example, logging module (this is where my
question becomes "developing for Python") triggers the exception in such
simple case:
logginig.debug("Query: %s", sqlQuery)
Funny, the code
logginig.debug("Query: %s, another: %s", sqlQuery, another_value)
doesn't trigger the exception. This is due to the code in
logginig/__init__.py:
if args and (len(args) == 1) and args[0] and (type(args[0]) ==
types.DictType):
args = args[0]
(class LogRecord, method __init__). "and args[0]" triggers the exception.
My questions are:
1. Should I consider this a bug in the logging module (and other libraries)
and submit patches?
2. Or should I stop raising exceptions in __nonzero__()?
In this particular case with logging the fix is simple - do "and args[0]"
after type check.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Iterating over objects of unknown length
On Wed, Sep 26, 2007 at 09:29:10AM -0700, Guido van Rossum wrote: > But I also fail to see why you would be so draconian as to disallow > truth testing of a query altogether. Your query looks like an > iterator. There are tons of other iterators in the language, library > and 3rd party code, and it would be madness to try to fix all of them > in the way you suggest just because some users don't get the concept > of iterators. Seems me myself didn't get it: On Wed, Sep 26, 2007 at 12:33:33PM -0400, Phillip J. Eby wrote: > This isn't consistent with iterators; e.g.: > > >>> x=iter([]) > >>> if x: print "yes" > ... > yes On Wed, Sep 26, 2007 at 09:29:10AM -0700, Guido van Rossum wrote: > So I'm for #1 *and* #2. I see now. Thank you! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Iterating over objects of unknown length
On Thu, Sep 27, 2007 at 01:33:47PM +1200, Greg Ewing wrote: > Oleg Broytmann wrote: > >if sqlQuery: > > for row in sqlQuery: ... > >else: > > # no rows > > > >To prevent users from writing such code the class implements __nonzero__() > >that always raises an exception. > > I'm not sure I like that idea. It's common practice to write > 'if x:' as a shorthand for 'if x is not None:' when it's known > that x is an object that doesn't have a notion of emptiness. > Another thing is that any code doing "if x" to test for > emptiness is clearly expecting x to be a sequence, *not* > an iterator, and you've violated the contract by passing > it one. This is what you may be running into with the libraries > you mention. In most cases the code in those libraries is, using the word of Mr. van Rossum, "archaic". It was developed for old versions of Python (long before Python has got the iterator protocol). I will file bug reports and patches (I have filed one about logginig/__init__.py) to allow developers to either fix the code or document the fact the code really requires a finite sequence. Unfortunately now when my code no longer raises an exception it would be harder to spot the buggy libraries. > Generally I think it's a bad idea to try to protect people > from themselves when doing so can interfere with legitimate > usage. I agree. I admitted in mailing list it was my design mistake. The offending __nonzero__ was removed from SVN today. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] MacOSX -framework options and distutils weirdness
On Fri, Oct 12, 2007 at 09:21:15PM +1300, Greg Ewing wrote: > So the bizarre state of affairs is that if distutils > runs gcc through a shell script, it works, but if > it runs gcc directly, it doesn't work. > > Anyone have any ideas on how that can happen? Do you have a few different copies of gcc installed with setup.py called the wrong one and your shell script the right one? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] [poll] New name for __builtins__
On Thu, Nov 29, 2007 at 10:27:37AM -0500, Barry Warsaw wrote: > > Perhaps someone here can draw some inspiration from __monty__ python's > > flying __circus__. It would be nice to have a name with a pythonic > > __ground__. > > Clearly then, it should be called __bruce__. No, __spam__! __Oleg__Stressed__by__undersores__'ly yours. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] [poll] New name for __builtins__
On Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 11:22:03AM +1300, Greg Ewing wrote:
> The next step up from global would be __galactic__.
Let me skip __universe[al]__ and go directly to The Ultimate Questions:
Is there __life__ after __death__? Does __Deity__ exist? What attributes,
properties and keys has __He__ got?
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] [poll] New name for __builtins__
On Fri, Nov 30, 2007 at 03:05:18PM -0800, Guido van Rossum wrote: > On Nov 30, 2007 2:17 PM, Nicko van Someren <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > +1 for __universal__ > > It's almost as if nobody has seen my proposal to leave __builtins__ > alone and rename the __builtin__ module instead. I saw it, and I think it'd be the best. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] blocking a non-blocking socket
On Sun, Dec 02, 2007 at 12:23:01PM -0800, Bill Janssen wrote: [skip] > Or, should I just set the timeout: > > timeout = self.gettimeout() > try: > self.settimeout(None) > self.do_handshake() > finally: > self.settimeout(timeout) Yes, this is the correct solution for all cases: if the timeout is None (socket is blocking) or 0 (non-blocking) or not-0 (blocking with timeout) - just set it back. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New Standard Library Module
On Wed, Dec 05, 2007 at 06:17:34PM +, Michael Foord wrote: > Can I suggest a new module for the standard library: 'antigravity.py'. A friend of mine (the person who has suggested "raise without arguments") recommends implementing it in two phases. The first should be from __future__ import antigravity XKCD'ly yours ;) Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Return type of round, floor, and ceil in 2.6
On Sat, Jan 05, 2008 at 05:35:45PM -0200, Facundo Batista wrote: > 2008/1/5, Art Rasmussen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Added Python to the referenced article (because I believe Python > > should be seen everywhere C#, PHP, Visual Basic, etc., are seen). > > Please let me know if the article needs updating/fixing. > > Well, don't know. > > It talks about the rounding in Python, but mentioning only the binary > floating point. In Decimal you have a lot of different roundings > available... it's worth to mention them? IMO it's worth to mention the existing of them, briefly. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] pkgutil, pkg_resource and Python 3.0 name space packages
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 11:12:43PM +, Paul Moore wrote: > If we want a "guaranteed-stdlib" package form, we should probably have > a top-level package, "std" or whatever. py. > That notion has, I believe, > been shot down before (no time to look up references now). Mr Van Rossum has spoken against it many times. Now I think - if we don't want a separate Python's top-level namespace may be we should think about a separate top-level non-Python's (3rd parties') namespace? With it we could have database.sqlite (Python's sqlite) and user.database.sqlite (a newer version); and by doing import database.sqlite you know exactly what version you are importing. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] pkgutil, pkg_resource and Python 3.0 name space packages
On Sun, Jan 06, 2008 at 04:23:59PM -0800, Guido van Rossum wrote: > I don't want "py" or "python" to be > part of the stdlib package namespace. *If* (part of) the stdlib has to > live under a single distinguished name, pick something like "std" or > "core". When I'm using Python I already know I'm using Python, I don't > want to be reminded of that fact on every import line. When I'm using Jython - am I using Python of Java? After from java.lang import Class should it be from py import exceptions or from core import exceptions ? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PEP: per user site-packages directory
On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 11:41:47PM +, Jon Ribbens wrote:
> It makes sense, but personally I have never heard before of ~/.local.
> Whereas ~/bin is something I am quite familiar with.
Me too. python-dev is the only place I have heard of ~/.local. I have
been using Linux (different distributions), Solaris and FreeBSD for quite
a long time (though I have never used GNOME/KDE/etc.)
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP: per user site-packages directory
On Tue, Jan 15, 2008 at 01:21:46PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > It took me a while to find a reference to .local. It's part of the > FreeDesktop.Org standards: > http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/basedir-spec-0.6.html The site only mentions $HOME/.local/share, there is no $HOME/.local/bin at the site. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev Digest, Vol 54, Issue 57
On Tue, Jan 15, 2008 at 12:11:37PM -0800, Daniel Arbuckle wrote: > I use ~/local, with a layout analogous to /usr, all the time. It's not > a standard, but in my experience it is by far the best solution to > installing things in the home directory. It doesn't matter much > whether you call it local or .local or .pythonlocal (although that > last would limit the utility somewhat, by implying that other things > should be installed there). It does matter that it be a _subdirectory_ > of ~, and that it be structured like /usr. ~/.python ~/.python/bin ~/.python/lib ~/.python/lib/python2.5 Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev Digest, Vol 54, Issue 57
On Tue, Jan 15, 2008 at 02:34:02PM -0600, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Oleg>~/.python > Oleg>~/.python/bin > Oleg>~/.python/lib > Oleg>~/.python/lib/python2.5 > > The drawback of this approach is that it implies that Perl, Tcl, IPython, > etc. belong in their own .whatever directory. How many users install (parts of) all of these into their homes? > The IT folks here at work do > things that way (though not in home directories). If I want to build a > package which relies on zlib, libpng, libtiff, libjpeg, etc., imagine what > my CPPFLAGS, CFLAGS and LDFLAGS arguments look like. :barf: Why not use GNU stow? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev Digest, Vol 54, Issue 57
On Wed, Jan 16, 2008 at 06:31:42AM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> I think both for UI reasons (given above) and for API reasons (given
> by others) there should be a separate ~/SOMETHING/{bin,etc,lib,share}
> hierarchy for user-specific packaged contents. I like ~/.local a
> little better than ~/local, but both work for me.
Having ~/.python allows me remove it with just one command. It's harder
to clear ~/.local/{bin,lib} without affecting whatever I want to preserve
there.
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] #! magic (was PEP: per user site-packages directory)
On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 06:00:31PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > #!/usr/bin/env python -E -s On most Unicies #! magic may have only one parameter after the program; the program here is env, the parameter is python, and that's all. Adding python options will result in different errors - some platforms silently ignores the options, some reports an error, some tries to find "python -E -s" in the PATH and report "Bad command or file name". Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #! magic
On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 06:25:57PM +0100, Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven wrote: > -On [20080120 18:12], Oleg Broytmann ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > > On most Unicies #! magic may have only one parameter after the program; > >the program here is env, the parameter is python, and that's all. Adding > >python options will result in different errors - some platforms silently > >ignores the options, some reports an error, some tries to find "python -E -s" > >in the PATH and report "Bad command or file name". > > IEEE Std 1003.1, 2004: > > The shell reads its input A shell has nothing to do with it as it is the OS (exec system call) that upon reading the magic of the file sees #! and executes the program (up to the first space) and pass to the program the first (and the only) parameter. #! /usr/bin/env python -O [trying to execute the script on Linux] /usr/bin/env: python -O: No such file or directory Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev Digest, Vol 54, Issue 57
On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 06:46:31PM +0100, Jan Claeys wrote: > Op woensdag 16-01-2008 om 02:33 uur [tijdzone +0100], schreef Christian > Heimes: > > Bill Janssen wrote: > > > Good point, but I prefer ~/Library/Python to either of these. > > > > ~/Library/ is a Mac OS X thing. I haven't seen it on other Unix systems. > > There is (at least) one linux distro using it, but it's not very > well-known. Gobo Linux? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #! magic
On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 07:30:03PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > Oleg Broytmann wrote: > > #! /usr/bin/env python -O > > > >[trying to execute the script on Linux] > > > > /usr/bin/env: python -O: No such file or directory > > > > Oleg. > > Oh right. I was sure that I've seen a shebang with options somewhere. It > might have been a shell script or a perl script. Yes, one can write #! /usr/bin/python -O This works. The OS (exec system call) splits the string into a program (python) and a single parameter (-O), and python knows how to handle -O. The problem with #! /usr/bin/env python -O is that exec splits it into a program (env) and a single parameter (python -O) and env doesn't know how to run "python -O". > Yet another python executable could solve the issue I doubt it. It is env that doesn't know how to run "python -O" in my example, not python's problem. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python-Dev Digest, Vol 54, Issue 57
On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 07:34:02PM +0100, Jan Claeys wrote: > Op zondag 20-01-2008 om 20:46 uur [tijdzone +0300], schreef Oleg > Broytmann: > > On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 06:46:31PM +0100, Jan Claeys wrote: > > > Op woensdag 16-01-2008 om 02:33 uur [tijdzone +0100], schreef Christian > > > Heimes: > > > > ~/Library/ is a Mac OS X thing. I haven't seen it on other Unix systems. > > > > > > There is (at least) one linux distro using it, but it's not very > > > well-known. > > > >Gobo Linux? > > Now that I think about it, I'm not sure they use it under $HOME too, but > I was thinking about that distro, yes, as they use such a scheme for the > rest of their system (and it seems natural to do so throughout then). I don't know if they have a scheme for $HOME. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #! magic
On Mon, Jan 21, 2008 at 12:17:20AM +0200, Tristan Seligmann wrote: > * Oleg Broytmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-01-20 20:12:38 +0300]: > > > On Sun, Jan 20, 2008 at 06:00:31PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > > > #!/usr/bin/env python -E -s > > > >On most Unicies #! magic may have only one parameter after the program; > > the program here is env, the parameter is python, and that's all. Adding > > python options will result in different errors - some platforms silently > > ignores the options, some reports an error, some tries to find "python -E > > -s" > > in the PATH and report "Bad command or file name". > > Distro tools shouldn't be using /usr/bin/env in any case. Does > > #!/usr/bin/python -E -s > > work? No: Unknown option: - usage: /usr/bin/python [option] ... [-c cmd | -m mod | file | -] [arg] ... Try `python -h' for more information. -Es together work. I think this is why Unix has the tradition of combining options. PS. My python doesn't understand -s, so I tested a different options, but the result is the same. There are Unix variants that understand many options (I believe FreeBSD allows them) but most allow no more than one parameter in #!. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #! magic
On Mon, Jan 21, 2008 at 12:01:29PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > The arg -Es may work because Python's arg parser doesn't recognize it as > two args -E -s but as the arg -E. Thank goodness python is better than that: $ python -Es Unknown option: -s usage: python [option] ... [-c cmd | -m mod | file | -] [arg] ... Try `python -h' for more information. $ python -E -s Unknown option: -s usage: python [option] ... [-c cmd | -m mod | file | -] [arg] ... Try `python -h' for more information. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Incorrect documentation of the raw_input built-in function
On Thu, Jan 24, 2008 at 12:36:51PM -0500, Isaac Morland wrote:
> What about an option (maybe even a default) to send the prompt to stdin?
>
> The Postgres command line interface psql appears to do this:
>
> $ psql 2>&1 >/dev/null
> Password:
> $
>
> (I typed my password and then I quit by typing ^D; if I type the wrong
> password, it looks the same on screen but it quits right away without
> waiting for ^D)
>
> I think ssh also does this when it needs to prompt for a password.
One cannot write to stdin:
>>> sys.stdin.write("1\n")
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "", line 1, in
IOError: [Errno 9] Bad file descriptor
But it is possible to explicitly open the current console for reading
and writing and do I/O regardless of stdin/stdout/stderr redirects:
>>> tty = open("/dev/tty", "r+")
>>> tty.write("1\n")
1
>>> line = tty.readline()
DDD
>>> line
'DDD\n'
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] trunc()
On Fri, Jan 25, 2008 at 11:32:54AM -0800, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> Does no-one thinks it means round(f) either?
I don't think so. I often emulate round(f) as int(f + 0.5).
Oleg.
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Re: [Python-Dev] [Python-checkins] r60919 - peps/trunk/pep-0008.txt
On Fri, Feb 22, 2008 at 10:12:16AM -0600, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I use "svn > annotate" from time-to-time which adds an even wider margin to the left. > In those situations I either grin and bear it or stretch my window enough to > view it without wrapping. svn blame | less -S Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Buildbots for trunk are all red
On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 02:04:47PM -0800, Brett Cannon wrote:
> Or we can get rid of bsddb and not have the problem anymore. =)
+1 for smaller stdlib and fewer problems.
Oleg.
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Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Buildbots for trunk are all red
On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 09:00:54PM +0100, Christian Heimes wrote: > Oh yeah ... ZODB4 and BDBStorage ... a dark chapter starting with high > hopes and ending in tragedy ... Several projects like Zope and > Subversion worked hard on a a Berkeley DB backend but in the end all > projects had the same fate. > > A few years ago in Geteborg/SE during lunch Jim explained me the reasons > for the cancellation. As far as I remember the conversation he used some > words I dare not to repeat in public. Some kids may read the Python dev > list. :) Sorry, can I ask an additional question? These words - what they were about? about the architecture of BDBStorage and Subversion, or about the very BerkeleyDB, or about what? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Documentation for ability to execute zipfiles & directories
On Tue, Mar 04, 2008 at 10:35:42PM +1000, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> not needing an explicit interpreter option makes it more shebang friendly
Sorry, I missed something here. How does one combine a zipfile with
a shebang script?!
Oleg.
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Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Documentation for ability to execute zipfiles & directories
On Wed, Mar 05, 2008 at 12:14:04AM +1000, Nick Coghlan wrote: > As a more helpful answer, the ZIP spec allows additional data to be > included in the file before the ZIP header. A more common way of using > this is to add a zip file on to the end of an ELF executable while still > using normal zipfile utilities to read the data in the zip file section > and ignore the executable part. > > It turns out you can actually use the same trick to prepend a shebang > line like "/usr/bin/env python" and a newline character That's what I thought, too. > - the whole zip > file is still a binary file, but that doesn't prevent the shell from > reading that first line of text and handing the file over to Python for > execution. Unix doesn't distinguish text and binary files. (-: > The fact that this actually works was also news to me when the issue I > linked in my previous post was first brought to my attention :) So it really works? Amazing! Thank you! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New/Old class exception pitfall
On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 06:35:46PM -0400, Alexander Belopolsky wrote: > class x: > pass > class y(x): > pass > try: > raise y > except y: > print "a" > except: > print "b" > > It prints 'b'. Python 2.2, 2.3, 2.4 and 2.5 on Linux: prints 'a'. Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] New/Old class exception pitfall
On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 07:18:25PM -0400, Alexander Belopolsky wrote: > I don't have my PowerBook here, but I am sure I've seen in on Mac OS > too. Only new-style class behavior is problematic. The following > code prints 'b' for me: > > __metaclass__ = type Ah, yes - with this addition it prints 'b'. > class x: > pass > class y(x): > pass > try: > raise y > except y: > print "a" > except: > print "b" Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Trove classifiers
On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 04:43:55PM +0100, Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven wrote: > -On [20080320 15:29], "Martin v. L??wis" ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: > >(Trove classifiers, >although the word "trove" means nothing to me) > > Isn't that something lifted from SourceForge? Yes, exactly. Eric Raymond claims to be the inventor, but there are different voices against him: http://damagestudios.net/blog/2005/08/15/sourceforge-founders Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Primer on distributed revision control?
On Fri, Mar 21, 2008 at 05:17:00PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > With all these distributed revision control systems now available (bzr, hg, > darcs, svk, many more), I find I need an introduction to the concepts and > advantages of repository distribution. It seems to me that it has the > potential for leading to anarchy, though I can see how some things would be > improved (working offline, maintaining local patches). It's not obvious how > I push changes back upstream. Can someone point me to some useful content > (web pages or books) which will help me wrap my brain around the ideas? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control#Distributed_revision_control http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/index.cgi/UnderstandingMercurial http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/index.cgi/CommunicatingChanges http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/latest/en/user-guide/index.html#sharing-with-peers Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Decimal(unicode)
Hello. In Python 2.5.1 the code import decimal for d in '123', u'123': x = decimal.Decimal(d) print type(x.to_eng_string()) prints In 2.5.2 it prints Why the change? Is it a bug or a feature? Shouldn't .to_eng_string() always return a str? Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Decimal(unicode)
On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 10:47:42AM -0400, Mark Dickinson wrote: > On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 9:46 AM, Oleg Broytmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >In 2.5.2 it prints > > > > > > > > > >Why the change? Is it a bug or a feature? Shouldn't .to_eng_string() > > always return a str? > > I'd call this a bug. The change is an accident, a side-effect of the fact > that in 2.5.1 the coefficient (mantissa) of a Decimal was stored as a > tuple, and in 2.5.2 it's stored as a string (which greatly improves > efficiency). > Clearly in 2.5.2 the mantissa is being stored as a unicode instance in the > second case; it should be explicitly coerced to str in Decimal.__new__. > > If others agree that it's a bug, I'll fix it. http://bugs.python.org/issue2482 Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
