[Python-Dev] Re: Python for Windows (python-3.7.4.exe) location confusing
On Mon, 9 Sep 2019 at 06:28, Kyle Stanley wrote: > Steve Dower wrote: > > It also means that regular users can install packages without needing to be > > admin, and without corrupting other user's installs. > > Does this have any advantage over using a virtual environment? I can imagine > this might be more simple for new users (since they don't have to do anything > additional), but setting up a virtual environment to use for a separate set > of packages is very straightforward nowadays with venv. I think you underestimate how much of a barrier using a virtual environment is to a new user. In my experience, people expect to install Python, and then be able to install packages immediately. Learning about virtual environments usually comes a lot further down the learning path (*particularly* if the user is self-taught - maybe training courses get structured differently, but I suspect a lot of people learn Python by installing it and "looking stuff up on the internet"). And in case you're not aware, on Windows, if you have an all users install in the standard location (C:\Program Files), to install something you need to open a new console window running a shell "as administrator" (which is a non-obvious extra step that new users will probably have no idea how to do) and then run `pip install xxx` in that shell. Doing pip install from your working shell fails with permission errors, even if you have admin rights (pip doesn't include the mechanisms needed to "request elevation" for itself, and there's no straightforward equivalent of the Unix sudo command for this). Paul ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/IWSLBVLHMJNL7VBZLMNLVPEROLTNBZMP/
[Python-Dev] Re: Python for Windows (python-3.7.4.exe) location confusing
Paul answered sufficiently for the venv part, but I wanted to address this point. On 09Sep2019 0621, Kyle Stanley wrote: +1, Particularly on this part. If the user installing Python has administrative access, I don't see much of a reason for them to have to install a separate launcher and installation. Recommending a global py.exe install for them seems to be far more straight forward. I'm not certain as to whether or not we are able to collect statistics on this, but I would not be at all surprised if the majority of users installing Python had administrative access on the device they're installing it on. While I think the ability to allow non-admin users to install packages in their own install is very useful, it should not come at the expense of making the process confusing for those with administrative privileges. User with administrative privileges are by implication better able to handle decisions such as this. If they are not, they should not be administrating a machine. Anecdotally (since it's very hard to collect demographic data here), the majority of Python users under the age of 18 do not have administrative privileges. You are literally saying that these kids should be given a harder time installing Python than someone who owns and maintains their own machine. Forgive me for disagreeing with you. As I said on the bug related to this (https://bugs.python.org/issue37745), I'm happy to accept patches to improve the wording. I'm also willing to consider changing the default option for clean installs to not install the launcher for All Users (basically flip that checkbox, and perhaps remove it from the front page). But the flow of the installer has I believe proven itself well with a broad range of users. Nothing in this thread has come anywhere near suggesting otherwise with anything like the feedback I've heard from users. Cheers, Steve ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/3BJISHHSVFLNP43AG7ZV73BB7E3CTUE6/
[Python-Dev] 3.7.5rc1 cutoff ahead
https://discuss.python.org/t/3-7-5rc1-cutoff-ahead/2288 A reminder: it is time for the next quarterly maintenance release of Python 3.7. The cutoff for **3.7.5rc1** is scheduled for this coming Monday (2019-09-16) by the end of day AOE. Please review open issues and ensure that any that you believe need to be addressed in 3.7.5 are either resolved or marked as a **release blocker**. Any assistance you can provide in helping resolve issues will be greatly appreciated. Following the rc1 cutoff, changes merged to the 3.7 branch will be released in 3.7.6 three months from now unless you mark the issue as a release blocker prior to **3.7.5 final**, planned for release on **2019-09-30** and explain why the change should be cherry-picked into the final release. Thanks to everyone who has been helping to ensure the continued success of Python 3.7! Our users truly appreciate it and are showing their confidence in us by the rapid adoption of these latest releases. P.S. A number of core developers are participating in this year's core developer sprint taking place this week in London. So it is a good time to catch many of us in the same place at the same time (and British Summer Time, at that). https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0537/ -- Ned Deily n...@python.org -- [] ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/JFLLZSZWFCX43P5MD2WSNCV3WQFCMIMH/
[Python-Dev] The Python 2 death march
Hi all, It's finally time to schedule the last releases in Python 2's life. There will be two more releases of Python 2.7: Python 2.7.17 and Python 2.7.18. Python 2.7.17 release candidate 1 will happen on October 5th followed by the final release on October 19th. I'm going to time Python 2.7.18 to coincide with PyCon 2020 in April, so attendees can enjoy some collective catharsis. We'll still say January 1st is the official EOL date. Thanks to Sumana Harihareswara, there's now a FAQ about the Python 2 sunset on the website: https://www.python.org/doc/sunset-python-2/ Regards, Benjamin ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/APWHFYQDKNVYQAK3HZMBGQIZHAVRHCV2/
[Python-Dev] Re: The Python 2 death march
It says it's feeling fine ;-) Regards Antoine. On Mon, 09 Sep 2019 14:29:51 +0100 "Benjamin Peterson" wrote: > Hi all, > It's finally time to schedule the last releases in Python 2's life. There > will be two more releases of Python 2.7: Python 2.7.17 and Python 2.7.18. > > Python 2.7.17 release candidate 1 will happen on October 5th followed by the > final release on October 19th. > > I'm going to time Python 2.7.18 to coincide with PyCon 2020 in April, so > attendees can enjoy some collective catharsis. We'll still say January 1st is > the official EOL date. > > Thanks to Sumana Harihareswara, there's now a FAQ about the Python 2 sunset > on the website: https://www.python.org/doc/sunset-python-2/ > > Regards, > Benjamin ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/BYYJTWPS3V4DBJKEZLNWGKAX5RHKVYOI/
[Python-Dev] [RELEASED] Python 3.5.8rc1 is released
On behalf of the Python development community, I'm chuffed to announce the availability of Python 3.5.8rc1. Python 3.5 is in "security fixes only" mode. This new version only contains security fixes, not conventional bug fixes, and it is a source-only release. You can find Python 3.5.8rc1 here: https://www.python.org/downloads/release/python-358rc1/ I think Python 3.5 may just barely outlive 2.7, //arry/ ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/K4CGZNBCUZPS7LL2NE46GZ7NWRCYEOQU/
[Python-Dev] Re: The Python 2 death march
it's getting better? ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/C52ZRWV5XXYXS7VRDNH6I7IDIMO2A2PM/
[Python-Dev] Re: The Python 2 death march
On 09/09/2019 15:51, brian.sk...@gmail.com wrote: it's getting better? No it's not, it'll be stone dead in a moment. -- Rhodri James *-* Kynesim Ltd ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/AUMYGJ444W53RFXK5LGUX46UGDBC4RCB/
[Python-Dev] Re: The Python 2 death march
It's not dead, it's just restin' after a particularly heavy release process. regards Steve Holden On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 4:24 PM Rhodri James wrote: > On 09/09/2019 15:51, brian.sk...@gmail.com wrote: > > it's getting better? > > No it's not, it'll be stone dead in a moment. > > -- > Rhodri James *-* Kynesim Ltd > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org > To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ > Message archived at > https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/AUMYGJ444W53RFXK5LGUX46UGDBC4RCB/ > ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/JIMW7GYCMUVBCNJRORMHLCH2Z46SCKKS/
[Python-Dev] Re: Python for Windows (python-3.7.4.exe) location confusing
On 9/9/2019 2:48 AM, Steve Dower wrote: User with administrative privileges are by implication better able to handle decisions such as this. If they are not, they should not be administrating a machine. Most home machines are administered by people that should not be "administrating" a machine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list -- python-dev@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to python-dev-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/python-dev.python.org/ Message archived at https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/2LQT5VKDV5PS4DL4VURQ5JKPZLKXVRYJ/
