[Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names

2013-05-26 Thread Sébastien Durand
Hi all,

"There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it."

We all love this mantra.

But one thing that often confuses people : function naming. The standard
library is kind of inconsistent. Some functions are separated by
underscores and others aren't. It's not intuitive and new pythonistas end
up constantly reading the doc. (Time saving one char typing vs time
guessing function names.)

Would it be a good idea to clarify PEP 8 on this ? I mean for future
libraries.

Regards,

Sébastien
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names

2013-05-26 Thread Andriy Kornatskyy
PEP8 consistency is a question to the development team commitment. Nothing 
prevents you add pep8 checks to build process, contribute fixes.

This inconsistency has been analyzed for various web frameworks recently:

http://mindref.blogspot.com/2012/10/python-web-pep8-consistency.html

No much in the list are paying attention to this...

Andriy



> Date: Sun, 26 May 2013 11:48:50 +0200 
> From: se8@gmail.com 
> To: python-dev@python.org 
> Subject: [Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names 
> 
> Hi all, 
> 
> "There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it." 
> 
> We all love this mantra. 
> 
> But one thing that often confuses people : function naming. The 
> standard library is kind of inconsistent. Some functions are separated 
> by underscores and others aren't. It's not intuitive and new 
> pythonistas end up constantly reading the doc. (Time saving one char 
> typing vs time guessing function names.) 
> 
> Would it be a good idea to clarify PEP 8 on this ? I mean for future 
> libraries. 
> 
> Regards, 
> 
> Sébastien 
> 
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names

2013-05-26 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 7:48 PM, Sébastien Durand  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> "There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it."
>
> We all love this mantra.
>
> But one thing that often confuses people : function naming. The standard
> library is kind of inconsistent. Some functions are separated by underscores
> and others aren't. It's not intuitive and new pythonistas end up constantly
> reading the doc. (Time saving one char typing vs time guessing function
> names.)
>
> Would it be a good idea to clarify PEP 8 on this ? I mean for future
> libraries.

As far as I am aware, there's nothing to clarify: new code should use
underscores as word separators, code added to an existing module or
based on existing API should follow the conventions of that module or
API. This is what PEP 8 already says.

The standard library is inconsistent because it's a 20 year old code
base with severe backwards compatibility constraints, and much of it
was written before there was even a PEP process, let alone PEP 8.

We did do one wholesale conversion to PEP 8 compliance (for the
threading module) and decided the cost/benefit ratio was too low to
justify ever doing that again. We do have a general guideline
requiring PEP 8 compliance for *new* modules added to the standard
library.

Cheers,
Nick.

--
Nick Coghlan   |   ncogh...@gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names

2013-05-26 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
Nick Coghlan writes:

 > threading module) and decided the cost/benefit ratio was too low to
 > justify ever doing that again.

I think you just failed Econ 101, Nick.

I-teach-that-s**t-for-a-living-ly y'rs,

P.S. Of course we all understood what you meant. :-)
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Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 8 and function names

2013-05-26 Thread Mark Lawrence

On 26/05/2013 14:02, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:

Nick Coghlan writes:

  > threading module) and decided the cost/benefit ratio was too low to
  > justify ever doing that again.

I think you just failed Econ 101, Nick.

I-teach-that-s**t-for-a-living-ly y'rs,

P.S. Of course we all understood what you meant. :-)



Yet another reference to Orwell's worst room in the world, what does 
this imply about Python? :)


--
If you're using GoogleCrap™ please read this 
http://wiki.python.org/moin/GoogleGroupsPython.


Mark Lawrence

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Re: [Python-Dev] __subclasses__() return order

2013-05-26 Thread Simon Cross
I've used __subclasses__ as an easy way to register components by
sub-classing a base component. I didn't rely on the ordering. I guess
the current order depends on the order in which modules are imported
and so is pretty fragile anyway?
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