[PHP] FW: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
I have no idea what I am doing - and I hate to think this message is actually going to be read by everyone in a general mailing list. But - since the attempt to reach a human 'owner' didn't work and the general-help doesn't yield results I may just have to conclude that this won't work, either. If the message does reach a 'live' audience, I apologize for my stupidity and hope that someone can see where I've gone astray. I don't have many options beyond taking instructions literally... John B. Moss -Original Message- From: PHP Lists Owner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 6:45 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners This is an automated response to your message to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" If you are trying to post to one of the PHP mailing lists, the correct address looks something like [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you are having problems unsubscribing, follow the directions located online at http://php.net/unsub Thanks! --- Your original email is below. Received: (qmail 32461 invoked by uid 1010); 31 Oct 2007 13:45:08 - Delivered-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Delivered-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: (qmail 32446 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2007 13:45:08 - Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 31 Oct 2007 13:45:08 - Return-Path: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]; sender-id=unknown Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]; spf=permerror; sender-id=unknown Received-SPF: error (pb1.pair.com: domain addr1.com from 69.41.130.97 cause and error) X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Host-Fingerprint: 69.41.130.97 mail.meadowcrk.com Windows 2000 SP4, XP SP1 Received: from [69.41.130.97] ([69.41.130.97:2877] helo=mail.meadowcrk.com) by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP id 80/32-20788-2E688274 for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Wed, 31 Oct 2007 08:45:07 -0500 Received: from JBMMachine [66.45.174.21] by mail.meadowcrk.com with ESMTP (SMTPD-9.21) id A6DD051C; Wed, 31 Oct 2007 06:45:01 -0700 From: "John Moss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> References: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: RE: ezmlm response Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 06:44:45 -0700 Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_NextPart_000_0057_01C81B89.87E12D50" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Thread-Index: AcgbwB3w3bfuOEYOQrmO4WAs/tT4XgAAHTKg In-Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --=_NextPart_000_0057_01C81B89.87E12D50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello ~ I feel so stupid! I am trying to learn php, so am attempting to get involved with a php-related mailing list. The problem: I have no familiarity - none - with mailing list protocols. So - it seems simple - get on a mailing list, ask for help in getting through what I need to know, then participate as my need to know directs me. I find a mailing list related to php - I think. Seems right - "lists.php.net". I 'subscribe' (I think) to a 'General user list' which suggests "This is a really high volume general list for PHP users". I think this is what I want - but I have no idea what subscribing to it means, other than to suppose that I will get some emails from the group. I chose to get the 'Digest', as opposed to the 'Normal', list since I interpret this to mean I get 1 (or 2) mailings a day with many messages embedded, as opposed to many many messages all day long, all the time. Since I have no idea (and doubt) that I am interested in all of these, and since I want to pick and choose what I read, I'm guessing the 'Digest' suits my purpose. Problem: how to see what's actually involved, once I receive my subscription confirmation? It seems to me that a 'help' function is the answer, but - look below - when I send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - I receive this message in response! Repeating the request means getting this response each time! Apart from feeling that this is insane, where do I turn? How do I find out what is on the list, begin receiving messages, and determine the protocol for participating? For folks who have been on mailing lists since the beginning of the web, this all seems foolish I'm sure. But if I can't take the suggestion for accessing help literally (why not?) it seems there should be a logical substitution argument that would apply. To explain: if in the example I am to replace 'lists.php.net' with something else, in order to get general help, what might that something else be? Where do I deduce the name/rep
[PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
Thank you, Daniel Brown, Richard Buskirk, Robert Cummings, David Giragosian ~ and anyone else who may have jumped in to my message within the last minute or two, trying to help me. Below is the message I was writing to ask someone (who I didn't know) just how to participate in a mailing list. I've never done this - but it seems all I had to do was send a message to this address. Strange. For me, strange indeed. But - I am appreciative of the concept and a little bewildered by the options that seem to be available... OK - stupidity aside - I have a real question and don't know how to find an answer. I write html, have for years. I have many web sites, and lately have run aground trying to determine how my competition is able to load pages exceedingly fast. It appears the site uses php, and crosslinks to pages within the site load blindingly fast. There does not appear to be frames involved, but the tables that contain the web page bracket a display area in the center of each page that makes the site appear to be frame oriented. My question: how is php able to load this page so quickly? I realize that I might not be permitted to show a page (provide a URL) as an illustration of my point - I am certainly not advertising anything. The site in question belongs to a volunteer fire department, and I am donating my time trying to create a comparable page for my own volunteer fire department. I just can't seem to figure out what this php is all about and how it might help load a page so fast. Below is from that original behemoth of a message that you all laughed at... Thank you for your time! John B. Moss I feel so stupid! I am trying to learn php, so am attempting to get involved with a php-related mailing list. The problem: I have no familiarity - none - with mailing list protocols. So - it seems simple - get on a mailing list, ask for help in getting through what I need to know, then participate as my need to know directs me. I find a mailing list related to php - I think. Seems right - "lists.php.net". I 'subscribe' (I think) to a 'General user list' which suggests "This is a really high volume general list for PHP users". I think this is what I want - but I have no idea what subscribing to it means, other than to suppose that I will get some emails from the group. I chose to get the 'Digest', as opposed to the 'Normal', list since I interpret this to mean I get 1 (or 2) mailings a day with many messages embedded, as opposed to many many messages all day long, all the time. Since I have no idea (and doubt) that I am interested in all of these, and since I want to pick and choose what I read, I'm guessing the 'Digest' suits my purpose. Problem: how to see what's actually involved, once I receive my subscription confirmation? It seems to me that a 'help' function is the answer, but - look below - when I send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - I receive this message in response! Repeating the request means getting this response each time! Apart from feeling that this is insane, where do I turn? How do I find out what is on the list, begin receiving messages, and determine the protocol for participating? For folks who have been on mailing lists since the beginning of the web, this all seems foolish I'm sure. But if I can't take the suggestion for accessing help literally (why not?) it seems there should be a logical substitution argument that would apply. To explain: if in the example I am to replace 'lists.php.net' with something else, in order to get general help, what might that something else be? Where do I deduce the name/replacement value? Why don't the instructions for doing this exist? Why isn't there 'Help' for getting 'help'? I can read as well as the next person: "This is a generic help message. The message I received wasn't sent to any of my command addresses." What is meant by the term 'my command addresses'? I sent the message as explicitly directed. If the 'command address' is something which replaces 'lists.php.net' how am I to understand that, if directed to get help and a description of available commands from that address? I am attempting to send this message directly, but if this fails I will attempt the 'Forward:' technique, as explained also below. John B. Moss My mailbox is spam-free with ChoiceMail, the leader in personal and corporate anti-spam solutions. Download your free copy of ChoiceMail from www.digiportal.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
Hi ~ is there a 'best way' to address a list, like 'Hi everyone'? As said in a previous message I have many web sites, and lately have run aground trying to determine how php is able to load related site pages so quickly? Is it OK to provide a URL as an illustration of my point - I am certainly not advertising anything. The site in question belongs to a volunteer fire department (http://www.mhfd32.com/index.php), and I am donating my time trying to create a comparable page for my own volunteer fire department. What I'm trying to accomplish for myself is the speed which is evident in loading the centerpieces as you click on the bulleted items, left center. A list-related question: I signed up for getting my messages all together once a day - how do I change this request? I run afoul of the mail protocols and had a deuce of a time just getting this far? If you are replying to me in the list - sigh - I cannot see it yet. If ever :-( John B. Moss My mailbox is spam-free with ChoiceMail, the leader in personal and corporate anti-spam solutions. Download your free copy of ChoiceMail from www.digiportal.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
Thanks, Daniel, Robert and David ~ I'm struggling to maintain protocol here and I appreciate some of you mailing me privately. I would prefer to respond and use the list - but I'm still signed up for once-a-day delivery and have no idea how to change this option - yet. :-) I am VERY computer literate, and VERY message-oriented ILLITERATE. I have coded HTML for years, and although not a fancy programmer I think my pages are OK. Could be better, but OK. (http://www.miscelpage.com, http://www.boundarycountyfire.com, http://www.curleycreek.com, http://www.theonlinewriter.com, etc. etc., etc) PHP is new to me, and this page - http://www.mhfd32.com/index.php - seems to fly when loading fresh pages. For example, select 'Apparatus' from the Menu Options and watch how fast the center of the page loads... I know about bandwidth and server speed and latency and hardware/connectivity considerations. I suspect the programmer implementation of php functionality is the answer to my perceptions. Hence my dire need to understand how php can help me... :-) Like - what is a 'header'? Everything prior to the statement? I don't think that's what is meant... John B. Moss Daniel ~ I got your message, and wonder how to 'modify my preferences'? I know you suggested I could unsubscribe and re-subscribe at the http://www.php.net/mailing-lists.php link - is there a faster (better) way? Thank you. -Original Message- From: Daniel Brown [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 8:16 AM To: Robert Cummings Cc: John Moss; php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners On 10/31/07, Robert Cummings <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 2007-10-31 at 07:29 -0700, John Moss wrote: > > Thank you, Daniel Brown, Richard Buskirk, Robert Cummings, David > > Giragosian ~ and anyone else who may have jumped in to my message > > within the last minute or two, trying to help me. No problem! > > I realize that I > > might not be permitted to show a page (provide a URL) as an > > illustration of my point - I am certainly not advertising anything. > > The site in question belongs to a volunteer fire department, and I > > am donating my time trying to create a comparable page for my own volunteer fire department. You're not only allowed to post links, but you're encouraged to do so, especially if there's a problem or error message that we should be able to see to help you to debug the issue. So feel free to post links to examples, so long as it's not SPAM'ing the hell out of the list for penis pills and the like. I'm sure you'll find more than one (myself included) volunteer firefighters, EMTs, and rescuers on here, in fact. > PHP is merely an interpreter. The speed of any page to load in a > browser depends on a number of factors. Four of the most important > factors are the following: > > 1. what is being loaded? How much programming is necessary to >achieve the outcome. > > 2. How fast is the server hardware that handles the processing. > > 3. How good is the connection to the remote server. This includes >both bandwidth and latency (latency being the round trip time >to make a request of any kind for the server). > > 4. How well did the programmer implement the functionality >needed. It's one thing to have a heavy load of processing, >it's another to use bad algorthms that bog down the server. Adding to Rob's points, it should be expanded on Point #3 that traffic will also be a major factor in the available bandwidth and latency. And to further the latency point, the "round-trip" time will usually take longer, logically, if your server is across the country than, say, in your home county. So the site you'd like to mimic may be hosted nearer to you than the physical machine hosting your department's current website. Keep in mind that, for locally-oriented websites, it's best to host as local as possible, since that's from where the vast majority of your traffic will originate. Finally on that point, browser processing speeds (due to local CPU/RAM/other constraints) may have either a positive or negative impact on the experience. Expanding Point #1, keep in mind that graphic- and media-intensive websites (including Flash) will no doubt take longer to fully load. Lastly, expanding on Point #4, not only does it depend on how well the underlying code was written, but also how much pre-processing is required of PHP (or whatever server-side dynamic language is being used) for each time the page is requested. If there is caching in place, or functions and routines are only called when absolutely necessary. My ma
RE: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
Thanks Jay, I'll try it. I know how to include, but haven't seen any php code yet except what you've illustrated. Now I have the concept and will do some testing. I appreciate this list being available to ask specific php questions - and I thank you for your time and help. Much appreciated - ~ John PS. I unsubscribed and resubscribed so as to get individual responses. Am now definitely getting more mail than I know what to do with - :-) -Original Message- From: Jay Blanchard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 10:12 AM To: John Moss; Daniel Brown; Robert Cummings Cc: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: RE: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners [snip] Like - what is a 'header'? Everything prior to the statement? I don't think that's what is meant... [/snip] A header/footer is a separate HTML/PHP page that is included with the page call; All you have to do is create the header and/or footer and include them with each page. Since the content is typically static in these included files they are cached and therefore loaded from cache each time they are called making things very quick. This is your very first step in creating reusable components for your web applications. You can see that this will become a very powerful tool/technique. My mailbox is spam-free with ChoiceMail, the leader in personal and corporate anti-spam solutions. Download your free copy of ChoiceMail from www.digiportal.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners
Thanks, Alan - I probably should admit to being totally complacent! I haven't gone back to validate those pages for years (they 'appear' to work) and am chagrined to find so many errors! I have my work cut out for me - and honestly appreciate the time you've taken to provide feedback. Thank you VERY much! Also, thanks to everyone who responded to share php "header/footer include' logic with me. I believe the answer to my 'speed' issue is php caching, and I'm a happy camper now. I think. :-) John B. Moss -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Milnes Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 4:52 PM To: php-general@lists.php.net Subject: Re: [PHP] RE: Reaching the PHP mailing list owners > I am VERY computer literate, and VERY message-oriented ILLITERATE. I > have coded HTML for years, and although not a fancy programmer I think > my pages are OK. Could be better, but OK. (http://www.miscelpage.com, > http://www.boundarycountyfire.com, http://www.curleycreek.com, > http://www.theonlinewriter.com, etc. etc., etc) One thing to watch - it's not strictly a PHP problem but it may influence the speed of your pages - is that your pages aren't valid html, see the results from the validator below:- http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.boundarycountyfire.com&ch arset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=Inline&group=0 http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.miscelpage.com&charset=%2 8detect+automatically%29&doctype=Inline&group=0 http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theonlinewriter.com%2F&ch arset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=Inline&group=0 Best to get these fixed before you go much further. Cheers Alan My mailbox is spam-free with ChoiceMail, the leader in personal and corporate anti-spam solutions. Download your free copy of ChoiceMail from www.digiportal.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
