[opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Glen Canaday]

Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the 
rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?

--GC
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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Moriz Gupte]

I feel you are right. Makes more sense to have it implemented client side
for many soft body dynamic behaviors... eg cloth, hair etc...
but I think in areas where rigid body behaviors impact local soft body
dynamics, there will be lots of timing and synch problems to deal with.
So there's where I think that perhaps all physics need to be done at the
same site.
R

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Glen Canaday  wrote:

>
>
> Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the
> rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?
>
> --GC
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'Consider how the lilies grow. They do not labor or spin.'
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University, PocatelloTel: 208-282-5333
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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Glen Canaday]

I came to the same conclusion, with the exception that a lookahead for a 
collision would be helpful in the client. If they use the same physics 
engine and the client does no more than implement a collision check, I 
think it could be a good thing. I'm looking at several free physics 
engines atm and thought I would clear my thinking up some. Collisions 
with soft bodies deform the collision mesh itself so yeah it gets a 
little tricky when you split them.


--GC

On 04/07/2010 11:14 AM, Moriz Gupte wrote:
I feel you are right. Makes more sense to have it implemented client 
side for many soft body dynamic behaviors... eg cloth, hair etc...
but I think in areas where rigid body behaviors impact local soft body 
dynamics, there will be lots of timing and synch problems to deal with.
So there's where I think that perhaps all physics need to be done at 
the same site.

R

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Glen Canaday > wrote:




Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the
rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?

--GC
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--
'Consider how the lilies grow. They do not labor or spin.'
Rameshsharma Ramloll PhD Research Assistant Professor Idaho State 
University, PocatelloTel: 208-282-5333

More info at http://tr.im/RRamloll



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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Jacek Antonelli]

Personally, I would keep soft body effects as purely client-side eye
candy, without any impact on the world, like flexi prims and particles
are today. Sending the deformation data from the server to the client,
or vice versa, would be very bandwidth intensive, and a huge headache
to keep in sync. And some users would need to disable the feature
altogether, because it would also be costly to process the effect.

- Jacek

On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 2:48 PM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
> I came to the same conclusion, with the exception that a lookahead for a
> collision would be helpful in the client. If they use the same physics
> engine and the client does no more than implement a collision check, I think
> it could be a good thing. I'm looking at several free physics engines atm
> and thought I would clear my thinking up some. Collisions with soft bodies
> deform the collision mesh itself so yeah it gets a little tricky when you
> split them.
>
> --GC
>
> On 04/07/2010 11:14 AM, Moriz Gupte wrote:
>
> I feel you are right. Makes more sense to have it implemented client side
> for many soft body dynamic behaviors... eg cloth, hair etc...
> but I think in areas where rigid body behaviors impact local soft body
> dynamics, there will be lots of timing and synch problems to deal with.
> So there's where I think that perhaps all physics need to be done at the
> same site.
> R
>
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
>>
>>
>> Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the
>> rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?
>>
>> --GC
>> ___
>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
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>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
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>
>
>
> --
> 'Consider how the lilies grow. They do not labor or spin.'
> Rameshsharma Ramloll PhD Research Assistant Professor Idaho State
> University, PocatelloTel: 208-282-5333
> More info at http://tr.im/RRamloll
>
>
>
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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Lear Cale]

I agree with Jacek -- at least for 1st cut, make it so that flexi hair
doesn't pierce anyone's body, but no effect on collisions.

This would keep it simple and fix the biggest issue for most people.


On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 7:39 PM, Jacek Antonelli
 wrote:
> Personally, I would keep soft body effects as purely client-side eye
> candy, without any impact on the world, like flexi prims and particles
> are today. Sending the deformation data from the server to the client,
> or vice versa, would be very bandwidth intensive, and a huge headache
> to keep in sync. And some users would need to disable the feature
> altogether, because it would also be costly to process the effect.
>
> - Jacek
>
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 2:48 PM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
>> I came to the same conclusion, with the exception that a lookahead for a
>> collision would be helpful in the client. If they use the same physics
>> engine and the client does no more than implement a collision check, I think
>> it could be a good thing. I'm looking at several free physics engines atm
>> and thought I would clear my thinking up some. Collisions with soft bodies
>> deform the collision mesh itself so yeah it gets a little tricky when you
>> split them.
>>
>> --GC
>>
>> On 04/07/2010 11:14 AM, Moriz Gupte wrote:
>>
>> I feel you are right. Makes more sense to have it implemented client side
>> for many soft body dynamic behaviors... eg cloth, hair etc...
>> but I think in areas where rigid body behaviors impact local soft body
>> dynamics, there will be lots of timing and synch problems to deal with.
>> So there's where I think that perhaps all physics need to be done at the
>> same site.
>> R
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the
>>> rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?
>>>
>>> --GC
>>> ___
>>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
>>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
>>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
>>> privileges
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> 'Consider how the lilies grow. They do not labor or spin.'
>> Rameshsharma Ramloll PhD Research Assistant Professor Idaho State
>> University, PocatelloTel: 208-282-5333
>> More info at http://tr.im/RRamloll
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Glen Canaday]

I'm only playing with the idea. Soft-body would have to be client-side 
only. if you think your SL is laggy NOW, imagine if it were also sending 
the vertex data back and forth to the sim. That would make SL unusable. 
It's a fun idea, though... I can imagine fields of waving grass, rubber 
couches and trampolines, and well as a little bit o' jiggle when ya 
walk, ya know, jes for fun :) Prim clothes and flexi hair that actually 
drapes, etc.

I'm only dreaming it up. The client would have to anticipate collisions 
a few frames before they occur to keep it more realistic, and then the 
server would have a few server frames to report that the collision 
actually happened like it already does. No server changes in mind.

It would require that changes be made to the avatar meshes.

--GC


On 04/07/2010 07:39 PM, Jacek Antonelli wrote:
> Personally, I would keep soft body effects as purely client-side eye
> candy, without any impact on the world, like flexi prims and particles
> are today. Sending the deformation data from the server to the client,
> or vice versa, would be very bandwidth intensive, and a huge headache
> to keep in sync. And some users would need to disable the feature
> altogether, because it would also be costly to process the effect.
>
> - Jacek
>
> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 2:48 PM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
>
>> I came to the same conclusion, with the exception that a lookahead for a
>> collision would be helpful in the client. If they use the same physics
>> engine and the client does no more than implement a collision check, I think
>> it could be a good thing. I'm looking at several free physics engines atm
>> and thought I would clear my thinking up some. Collisions with soft bodies
>> deform the collision mesh itself so yeah it gets a little tricky when you
>> split them.
>>
>> --GC
>>
>> On 04/07/2010 11:14 AM, Moriz Gupte wrote:
>>
>> I feel you are right. Makes more sense to have it implemented client side
>> for many soft body dynamic behaviors... eg cloth, hair etc...
>> but I think in areas where rigid body behaviors impact local soft body
>> dynamics, there will be lots of timing and synch problems to deal with.
>> So there's where I think that perhaps all physics need to be done at the
>> same site.
>> R
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Glen Canaday  wrote:
>>  
>>>
>>> Soft body physics are best implemented in a local viewer, leaving the
>>> rigid-body collision detection to the server, am I right in this?
>>>
>>> --GC
>>> ___
>>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
>>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
>>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
>>> privileges
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> 'Consider how the lilies grow. They do not labor or spin.'
>> Rameshsharma Ramloll PhD Research Assistant Professor Idaho State
>> University, PocatelloTel: 208-282-5333
>> More info at http://tr.im/RRamloll
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
>> privileges
>>
>>  

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Re: [opensource-dev] Soft body physics

[Robert Martin]

What may be a stopgap would be to have different "levels" of collision detection

so if you have say 4 levels of detection then do the lowest level on
the server and work with the other 3 levels client side (have a skirt
bounce back from the legs but leave exactly which way it bounces on
clientside)

-- 
Robert L Martin
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Re: [opensource-dev] Snowglobe 2.0 sync with Viewer 2.0

[Dzonatas Sol]

I just checked out revision 3313 from 
https://svn.secondlife.com/svn/linden/projects/2010/snowglobe/trunk

After plain  ./develop.py with no options , i got an error

$ make
[  0%] Built target cmake
[  0%] Built target llaudio
[  3%] Built target stage_third_party_libs
[  3%] Built target llcommon_tests
[  3%] Building CXX object llcommon/CMakeFiles/llcommon.dir/llcoros.o
In file included from 
/home/dzonatas/workspace/snowglobe.2.0/indra/../libraries/include/boost/coroutine/coroutine.hpp:44,
 from 
/home/dzonatas/workspace/snowglobe.2.0/indra/llcommon/llcoros.h:39,
 from 
/home/dzonatas/workspace/snowglobe.2.0/indra/llcommon/llcoros.cpp:39:
/home/dzonatas/workspace/snowglobe.2.0/indra/../libraries/include/boost/coroutine/detail/coroutine_impl.hpp:59:
 
error: declaration of 'typedef class 
boost::coroutines::detail::context_base 
boost::coroutines::detail::coroutine_impl::context_base'
/home/dzonatas/workspace/snowglobe.2.0/indra/../libraries/include/boost/coroutine/detail/context_base.hpp:55:
 
error: changes meaning of 'context_base' from 'class 
boost::coroutines::detail::context_base'
make[2]: *** [llcommon/CMakeFiles/llcommon.dir/llcoros.o] Error 1
make[1]: *** [llcommon/CMakeFiles/llcommon.dir/all] Error 2
make: *** [all] Error 2


Haven't fully tracked this one down, so didn't file a jira.


Philippe (Merov) Bossut wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Yes, there were a bunch of missed added files and other issues that 
> actually made the repository not complete, and therefore, not 
> buildable. I did a serie of commits today to fix that. I've been able 
> to build on Mac and Windows at least.
>
> Now, I'm still working on fixing the opensrc-build.sh script which is 
> used to produced the binaries. I hope to get build to pass on 
> Parabuild for Mac and Windows shortly.
>
> Thanks for your patience.
>
> Cheers,
> - Merov
> 
>
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Re: [opensource-dev] Build failure in resource complier using VC++ Express 2008 (VC90)

[Nicky Perian]

Ding!!! Maybe these files are in the Artwork, that I had not updated for some 
time. Updated Artwork and Libraries and got a build complete of 
secondlife-bin.exe using vc90.






From: Nicky Perian 
To: Nicky Perian ; Philippe (Merov) Bossut 

Cc: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 4:31:58 PM
Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Build failure in resource complier using VC++ 
Express 2008 (VC90)


I found the missing header in windows but, the cursor files below are to be 
found,

1>llstartup.cpp
1>Compiling resources...
1>Microsoft (R) Windows (R) Resource Compiler Version 6.1.6723.1
1>Copyright (C) Microsoft Corporation.  All rights reserved.
1>..\..\newview\res\viewerRes.rc(122) : error RC2135 : file not found: 
toolopen.cur
1>..\..\newview\res\viewerRes.rc(123) : error RC2135 : file not found: 
toolsit.cur
1>..\..\newview\res\viewerRes.rc(124) : error RC2135 : file not found: 
toolbuy.cur
1>Build log was saved at 
"file://c:\SL_SVN\trunk\indra\build-VC90\newview\secondlife-bin.dir\RelWithDebInfo\BuildLog.htm"
1>secondlife-bin - 3 error(s), 0 warning(s)
== Build: 0 succeeded, 1 failed, 62 up-to-date, 0 skipped ==






From: Nicky Perian 
To: Philippe (Merov) Bossut 
Cc: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 1:42:48 PM
Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Build failure in resource complier using VC++ 
Express 2008 (VC90)


This may well be caused by my hacks trying to get VC90 to build. However, it 
shows up in secondlife-bin build which is not where I have been working. 
secondlife-bin has built before w/o error under VC90.
http://pastebin.com/JK6fNvkz









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[opensource-dev] Another crazy idea... what list for this one?

[Glen Canaday]

What would the appropriate list for this be? I'm pretty sure it's not 
this one,

Anyone know of a flash desktop exporter? For two-way web interaction 
with your own desktop? Killer app for shared media... using your own 
computer! ;)

I've thought of perhaps a web-based desktop environment to render / 
export my X display to my web server with which I can then interact and 
work while logged into SL. Perhaps a buffer program that captures the X 
drawables and hands them to a flash app for web-based display. Imagine 
remote server admin possibilities, etc... not having to minimize SL to 
check job progress; share the desktop as if you were in the same room. 
Devs could literally be looking at a desktop thousands of miles away 
like gotomeeting, watching the same compile messages fly by, using the 
same primary display from inworld without the hassle of the software 
incompatibilities that gotomeeting and ultravnc have beyond running the 
exporter itself. Export a second desktop or stretch it across two 
shared-media prims like dual monitor setups in RL. The virtual workplace 
redefined. Office in your underwear, 'cept your av is wearing the ugly, 
ill-fitting business suit your boss likes.

--GC

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Re: [opensource-dev] Another crazy idea... what list for this one?

[Tateru Nino]

Something like FlashVNC?

On 8/04/2010 3:08 PM, Glen Canaday wrote:
> What would the appropriate list for this be? I'm pretty sure it's not 
> this one,
>
> Anyone know of a flash desktop exporter? For two-way web interaction 
> with your own desktop? Killer app for shared media... using your own 
> computer! ;)
>
> I've thought of perhaps a web-based desktop environment to render / 
> export my X display to my web server with which I can then interact and 
> work while logged into SL. Perhaps a buffer program that captures the X 
> drawables and hands them to a flash app for web-based display. Imagine 
> remote server admin possibilities, etc... not having to minimize SL to 
> check job progress; share the desktop as if you were in the same room. 
> Devs could literally be looking at a desktop thousands of miles away 
> like gotomeeting, watching the same compile messages fly by, using the 
> same primary display from inworld without the hassle of the software 
> incompatibilities that gotomeeting and ultravnc have beyond running the 
> exporter itself. Export a second desktop or stretch it across two 
> shared-media prims like dual monitor setups in RL. The virtual workplace 
> redefined. Office in your underwear, 'cept your av is wearing the ugly, 
> ill-fitting business suit your boss likes.
>
> --GC
>
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>   

-- 
Tateru Nino
http://dwellonit.taterunino.net/

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