Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Dennis Putnam]

Hi Mark,

Just a little confusing with respect to the documentation which says:

python manage.py hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
$var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbo


So the documentation should say for some installations:

django-admin hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
$var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbox

Is that right?

On 2/13/2020 3:40 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 2/13/20 11:36 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
>> Hi Mark,
>>
>> Sorry for being a PITA but I can't find manage.py. Indeed I can't find
>> any mailman files other than in /opt/mailman which has no /bin.
>> Apparently version 3 uses different directories than what I've been
>> using (/usr/lib/Mailman and /var/lib/mailman).
>
> It's probably not called manage.py in your installation. In a 'default'
> Django install, manage.py is the name of the Django administratitve
> command. In your case, it could be called django-admin or something else
> depending on how Postorius/HyperKitty were installed.
>
>
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Dennis Putnam]

Hi Mark,

Another issue with these servers. The admin says 'pip3' was used to
install mailman. I thought 'pip' was a python installer. Unfortunately I
cannot find where it put the stuff. So the documentation that specifies
$prefix is of no use since I don't know what that is. This is RHEL so
does anyone know where things wind up? Specifically I'm looking for all
the icons to copy to my httpd directory. TIA

On 2/13/2020 3:40 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 2/13/20 11:36 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
>> Hi Mark,
>>
>> Sorry for being a PITA but I can't find manage.py. Indeed I can't find
>> any mailman files other than in /opt/mailman which has no /bin.
>> Apparently version 3 uses different directories than what I've been
>> using (/usr/lib/Mailman and /var/lib/mailman).
> It's probably not called manage.py in your installation. In a 'default'
> Django install, manage.py is the name of the Django administratitve
> command. In your case, it could be called django-admin or something else
> depending on how Postorius/HyperKitty were installed.
>
>
> --
> Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/dap1%40bellsouth.net



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Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Mark Sapiro]

On 2/14/20 7:09 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> 
> Just a little confusing with respect to the documentation which says:
> 
> python manage.py hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
> $var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbo
> 
> 
> So the documentation should say for some installations:
> 
> django-admin hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
> $var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbox
> 
> Is that right?


It is correct that in some installations the command to invoke Django
may be django-admin. Whether our documentation should cover every
possible packaging decision made by a packager or installer is a
separate issue. My opinion is the people who do this
packaging/installation should provide supplemental documentation where
appropriate.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan



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Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Mark Sapiro]

On 2/14/20 7:49 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> 
> Another issue with these servers. The admin says 'pip3' was used to
> install mailman. I thought 'pip' was a python installer.


Some distros call pip for Python 3 pip3.

> Unfortunately I
> cannot find where it put the stuff. So the documentation that specifies
> $prefix is of no use since I don't know what that is. This is RHEL so
> does anyone know where things wind up? Specifically I'm looking for all
> the icons to copy to my httpd directory. TIA


And neither can I. I know nothing about any Mailman 3 packages for RHEL
nor do I know what decisions the packager/installer made. You can find
information about Mailman core with

mailman info --verbose

This will tell you about Mailman Core, but not Django (Hyperkitty and
Postorius). For those, if you look at the django-admin command, it will
probably set PYTHONPATH and DJANGO_SETTINGS_MODULE. The name of the
DJANGO_SETTINGS_MODULE with a .py extension added is a file in
PYTHONPATH which contains the base settings for Hyperkitty and Postorius
and it probably also imports a local settings module (.py file) that
contains local overrides.

If Mailman was installed in a virtualenv, most software things will be
in that virtualenv in places like bin/ and lib/python.x.y/site-packages

What documentation are you looking at? Nothing I know of for Mailman 3
mentions $prefix or icons to be copied to your web server.

I am very confused over what you are trying to do. On the one hand, you
appear to be migrating lists to a server with Mailman 3 already
installed, and on the other you are asking about things that only an
installer should be concerned with

-- 
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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan



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Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Dennis Putnam]

Hi Mark,

I guess there needs to be a caveat in the documentation indicating
different distros will need different commands. This project is turning
into a nightmare since I know nothing about django and they way mailman
3 is installed is radically different. Hyperkitty was installed but when
I run the command it fails.

# django-admin hyperkitty_import -l rusht...@csdco.com rushtalk.mbox
No Django settings specified.
Unknown command: 'hyperkitty_import'
Type 'django-admin help' for usage.

The last line being of no use.

I'm also struggling with the web UI which is what prompted my other
email about where the icons are stored. It almost seems like the web UI
is just a radically different and does not use Apache in the same way
any more.

On 2/14/2020 11:37 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 2/14/20 7:09 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
>> Hi Mark,
>>
>> Just a little confusing with respect to the documentation which says:
>>
>> python manage.py hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
>> $var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbo
>>
>>
>> So the documentation should say for some installations:
>>
>> django-admin hyperkitty_import -l foo-l...@example.com 
>> $var_prefix/archives/private/foo-list.mbox/foo-list.mbox
>>
>> Is that right?
>
> It is correct that in some installations the command to invoke Django
> may be django-admin. Whether our documentation should cover every
> possible packaging decision made by a packager or installer is a
> separate issue. My opinion is the people who do this
> packaging/installation should provide supplemental documentation where
> appropriate.
>
>
> --
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> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users
> Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3
> Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9
> Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/
> Unsubscribe: 
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/dap1%40bellsouth.net



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Re: [Mailman-Users] Server Migration

[Mark Sapiro]

On 2/14/20 9:11 AM, Dennis Putnam wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> 
> I guess there needs to be a caveat in the documentation indicating
> different distros will need different commands. This project is turning
> into a nightmare since I know nothing about django and they way mailman
> 3 is installed is radically different. Hyperkitty was installed but when
> I run the command it fails.
> 
> # django-admin hyperkitty_import -l rusht...@csdco.com rushtalk.mbox
> No Django settings specified.
> Unknown command: 'hyperkitty_import'
> Type 'django-admin help' for usage.


The django-admin command you are running does not specify PYTHONPATH and
DJANGO_SETTINGS_MODULE. I use a wrapper command like:

#!/bin/bash
. /opt/mailman/mm/venv/bin/activate
cd /opt/mailman/mm
export PYTHONPATH=/opt/mailman/mm
export DJANGO_SETTINGS_MODULE=settings
django-admin $@

to activate the virtualenv that Mailman is installed in, set things for
the environment and invoke the actual django-admin command. There may
not be a virtualenv in your case, and you don't know the appropriate
values for PYTHONPATH and DJANGO_SETTINGS_MODULE.

We don't know these answers. You need to be talking with the people who
installed Mailman on the server.


> I'm also struggling with the web UI which is what prompted my other
> email about where the icons are stored. It almost seems like the web UI
> is just a radically different and does not use Apache in the same way
> any more.


That is true. It is a Django 'project' Django is a wsgi application
which may run under mod_wsgi in Apache or a wsgi server like uwsgi or
gunicorn that is proxied to from apache.

Very little of the detail you know about Mailman 2.1 is relevant to
Mailman 3, particularly where the web server is concerned.

-- 
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan



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[Mailman-Users] genalises - no aliases for one od the ists

[Jutta Wrage]

Hello!

We are using Mailman 2.1.26

Now I discovered a problem:

genaliases creates 2 files and in one of them there is one mailing lists 
missing.

aliases has 11 lists
virtual-mailman has 10 lists

Is it possible to debug this somehow?
Exim does not accept mail for the missing list: 550 Unrouteable address

/usr/bin/python points to Python 2.7.17

I could add the missing lines in virtual-mailman manually, but once genaliases 
is run again the additional entries will be up and away again.

Any suggestions?

Jutta


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Re: [Mailman-Users] genalises - no aliases for one od the ists

[Mark Sapiro]

On 2/14/20 11:26 AM, Jutta Wrage wrote:
> Hello!
> 
> We are using Mailman 2.1.26
> 
> Now I discovered a problem:
> 
> genaliases creates 2 files and in one of them there is one mailing lists 
> missing.
> 
> aliases has 11 lists
> virtual-mailman has 10 lists

The list is not in virtual-mailman because the the list's host_name is
not in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS. If the host_name is not correct,
which seems likely, you can change it in the list admin General Options
page (in the Additional settings section near the bottom). If it is
correct you will need to add it to the POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS
list in mm_cfg.py.


> Exim does not accept mail for the missing list: 550 Unrouteable address


If you are using Exim, it is probably better to configure Exim as
discussed at  rather than
using aliases and virtual mappings.

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[Mailman-Users] mailman 2.1.18 for RHEL 5

[Dennis Putnam]

Since migrating to mailman 3 on the latest RHEL is going to take some
time, I need an interim solution to DMARC mitigation. I understand
version 2.1.18 will do what I need, at least until I can finish the
migration. However, I have been unable to find a repository or rpm for
that version for RHEL 5. Can someone help me out with that?



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Re: [Mailman-Users] genalises - no aliases for one od the ists

[Jutta Wrage]

Am 14.02.2020 um 20:37 schrieb Mark Sapiro:

> The list is not in virtual-mailman because the the list's host_name is
> not in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS. If the host_name is not correct,
> which seems likely, you can change it in the list admin General Options
> page (in the Additional settings section near the bottom). If it is
> correct you will need to add it to the POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS
> list in mm_cfg.py.

Hmm... I tried to add thar with no good results.

The host in config of that list is:
URL: www.host2.exmaple.com
mailinglist-address: l...@host2.example.com

I added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS containing host2.example.com

That did not work.

Just for note:

I hat torouble before with the setting being different for:

DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'www.example.com'
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'host.example.com'

Mailman added the first one to the aliases for one of the addresses and exim 
refused mails.
So I did change the url variable to host.example.com

>> Exim does not accept mail for the missing list: 550 Unrouteable address
> 
> 
> If you are using Exim, it is probably better to configure Exim as
> discussed at  rather than
> using aliases and virtual mappings.

I did follow the instructions.
Now mail for the missing list is accepted but not for the others.

The host now denies my connections.
I guess I have to wait until I can revert changes or add something making the 
10 other lists working again.

Jutta

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Re: [Mailman-Users] genalises - no aliases for one od the ists

[Mark Sapiro]

On 2/14/20 2:55 PM, Jutta Wrage wrote:
> 
> The host in config of that list is:
> URL: www.host2.exmaple.com
> mailinglist-address: l...@host2.example.com
> 
> I added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS containing host2.example.com

Did you restart Mailman? (although that shouldn't matter for genaliases)

What is the list's host_name on the General Options page? That is what
needs to be in POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS.

When you say you added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, does that mean you
added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS or does it mean you added
'host2.example.com' to the existing POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS.

In either case, do you have the correct POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS in
mm_cfg.py, not in Defaults.py?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] genalises - no aliases for one od the ists

[Jutta Wrage]

Am 15.02.2020 um 00:19 schrieb Mark Sapiro:

> Did you restart Mailman? (although that shouldn't matter for genaliases)

I did. Same for exim.

> When you say you added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS, does that mean you
> added POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS or does it mean you added
> 'host2.example.com' to the existing POSTFIX_STYLE_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS.

I added entries with different combinations.

But now having access to the server again, I did remove it completely again.

I discovered the mailing list address of the list not showing up first may have 
the address of the default host. But the web page for it is on the virtual host.

Now I have 
DEFAULT_HOST_NAME
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST
DEFAULT_URL_HOST
all set to: mainhost.example.com

Looks like it is working now without genaliases with exim4.


Now I have to find out how to make changes after upgrading by command line. The 
web server not yet ready.

Thanks for you hints

Jutta

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