Apache Projects and Discussion Forums

2023-05-15 Thread David Mackey 
Hi All,

At yesterday's meeting I suggested that discussion forums might be useful
for managing tension in communications and increasing the visibility /
popularity of the Solr project. At the time this didn't seem viable due to
the centrality of mailing lists to ASF's communications but Eric suggested
that if other projects where using forums that Solr could as well.

*(ASF Projects Using Discussion Forums)*
I did some research and discovered that a number of ASF projects are using
forums:

   - Airflow , Pulsar
   , RocketMQ
   , ShardingSphere
   , StreamPipes
   , and Doris
    are all using GitHub Discussions
   .
   - TVM  uses Discourse
   .
   - OpenOffice.org  uses phpBB
   

   .

*(Refined Role Proposal for Discussion Forums)*
Understanding better the fundamental nature of mailing lists to ASF
projects I'd like to suggest a more tightly scoped implementation of
discussion forums for the Solr project:

   - As an adjunct to, not replacement of, mailing lists.
   - With a focus on answering questions that users/developers have that
   are informational rather than decision making.
   - And perhaps some early stage idea discussions before they are ready
   for a serious proposal.

(*Advantages of Discussion Forums to Solr Community)*
I think this would offer the Solr community a few different advantages:

   - *Visible Vitality *- The Solr project has vitality but it isn't
   entirely visible. An active forum (discuss.elastic.co) can provide this
   visibility.
   - *Redundant Question Reduction* - Forums provide a way for users to
   find answers to questions that might otherwise be asked repeatedly in Slack
   chats or on the mailing lists.
   - *Content Creation* - Users create valuable content (which is indexed
   by search engines) through their discussions.
   - *Noise Reduction* - If at least some informational / idea discussions
   were occurring in the forums the volume of emails on the mailing list would
   be reduced.

*(Recommended Implementation)*
While GitHub Discussions would be the easiest to implement I would
recommend Discourse. GitHub is developer-centric and as such would likely
exclude most (non-dev) users.

Discourse (the org) offers Discourse (the software) as a hosted service for
free 
to open source projects.

I'm happy to help if this is something the Solr community would be
interested in. Thanks for taking the time to read and consider.

Sincerely,
Dave Mackey

Re: Apache Projects and Discussion Forums

2023-05-18 Thread David Mackey 
Director @ Sease Ltd.
> > > *Apache Lucene/Solr Committer*
> > > *Apache Solr PMC Member*
> > >
> > > e-mail: a.benede...@sease.io
> > >
> > >
> > > *Sease* - Information Retrieval Applied
> > > Consulting | Training | Open Source
> > >
> > > Website: Sease.io <http://sease.io/>
> > > LinkedIn <https://linkedin.com/company/sease-ltd> | Twitter
> > > <https://twitter.com/seaseltd> | Youtube
> > > <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDx86ZKLYNpI3gzMercM7BQ> | Github
> > > <https://github.com/seaseltd>
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, 15 May 2023 at 22:12, Ishan Chattopadhyaya <
> > > ichattopadhy...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > This is a great idea! I think this is a much better alternative than
> > > > current user and dev lists, which are handicapped by an atrocious UX
> > for
> > > > browsing archives (PonyMail).
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, 16 May, 2023, 1:34 am David Mackey, 
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi All,
> > > > >
> > > > > At yesterday's meeting I suggested that discussion forums might be
> > > useful
> > > > > for managing tension in communications and increasing the
> visibility
> > /
> > > > > popularity of the Solr project. At the time this didn't seem viable
> > due
> > > > to
> > > > > the centrality of mailing lists to ASF's communications but Eric
> > > > suggested
> > > > > that if other projects where using forums that Solr could as well.
> > > > >
> > > > > *(ASF Projects Using Discussion Forums)*
> > > > > I did some research and discovered that a number of ASF projects
> are
> > > > using
> > > > > forums:
> > > > >
> > > > >- Airflow <https://airflow.apache.org/community/>, Pulsar
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/pulsar/discussions>, RocketMQ
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/rocketmq>, ShardingSphere
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/shardingsphere>, StreamPipes
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/streampipes>, and Doris
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/doris> are all using GitHub
> > Discussions
> > > > ><https://github.com/apache/airflow/discussions>.
> > > > >- TVM <https://tvm.apache.org/> uses Discourse
> > > > ><https://discuss.tvm.apache.org/>.
> > > > >- OpenOffice.org <http://openoffice.org/> uses phpBB
> > > > ><
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://forum.openoffice.org/en/forum/index.php?sid=b4a0ff493ecb816d6a05cceaeee19283
> > > > > >
> > > > >.
> > > > >
> > > > > *(Refined Role Proposal for Discussion Forums)*
> > > > > Understanding better the fundamental nature of mailing lists to ASF
> > > > > projects I'd like to suggest a more tightly scoped implementation
> of
> > > > > discussion forums for the Solr project:
> > > > >
> > > > >- As an adjunct to, not replacement of, mailing lists.
> > > > >- With a focus on answering questions that users/developers have
> > > that
> > > > >are informational rather than decision making.
> > > > >- And perhaps some early stage idea discussions before they are
> > > ready
> > > > >for a serious proposal.
> > > > >
> > > > > (*Advantages of Discussion Forums to Solr Community)*
> > > > > I think this would offer the Solr community a few different
> > advantages:
> > > > >
> > > > >- *Visible Vitality *- The Solr project has vitality but it
> isn't
> > > > >entirely visible. An active forum (discuss.elastic.co) can
> > provide
> > > > this
> > > > >visibility.
> > > > >- *Redundant Question Reduction* - Forums provide a way for
> users
> > to
> > > > >find answers to questions that might otherwise be asked
> repeatedly
> > > in
> > > > > Slack
> > > > >chats or on the mailing lists.
> > > > >- *Content Creation* - Users create valuable content (which is
> > > indexed
> > > > >by search engines) through their discussions.
> > > > >- *Noise Reduction* - If at least some informational / idea
> > > > discussions
> > > > >were occurring in the forums the volume of emails on the mailing
> > > list
> > > > > would
> > > > >be reduced.
> > > > >
> > > > > *(Recommended Implementation)*
> > > > > While GitHub Discussions would be the easiest to implement I would
> > > > > recommend Discourse. GitHub is developer-centric and as such would
> > > likely
> > > > > exclude most (non-dev) users.
> > > > >
> > > > > Discourse (the org) offers Discourse (the software) as a hosted
> > service
> > > > for
> > > > > free <
> > > > https://blog.discourse.org/2018/11/free-hosting-for-open-source-v2/>
> > > > > to open source projects.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm happy to help if this is something the Solr community would be
> > > > > interested in. Thanks for taking the time to read and consider.
> > > > >
> > > > > Sincerely,
> > > > > Dave Mackey
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

Re: [DISCUSS] Community Virtual Meetup, June 2023

2023-06-07 Thread David Mackey 
I'd like to discuss briefly if we want to take any next steps on pursuing a
discussion forum or let it lie. Current options would be getting a free
open source account with Discourse or using Sease's forums as Alessandro
offered.

On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 2:02 PM Alessandro Benedetti 
wrote:

> The 16th at 11 EST works beautifully for me!
> Thanks Eric for organizing this!
>
> Cheers
>
> On Wed, 7 Jun 2023, 17:58 Eric Pugh,  wrote:
>
> > I wanted to follow up with folks about the June meetup, especially as
> it's
> > been pretty quiet!
> >
> > I'd live to propose next week, June 16th, at either 11 AM EST or 3 PM
> > EST.   Please let me know if you have a preference, and if no one speaks
> up
> > in the next day or so, I'll pick one ;-).
> >
> > So far it's Jason and I ;-)
> >
> >
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/SOLR/2023-06-16+Meeting+notes
> >
> > Eric
> >
> >
> > On 2023/05/30 13:04:15 Jason Gerlowski wrote:
> > > Hey,
> > >
> > > Thanks for volunteering Eric!  That time and date work great for me,
> > > though maybe others have opinions before we lock that in.  (I know
> > > this thread was created really far in advance, so maybe this reply
> > > will bring it to people's attention again.)
> > >
> > > It looks like the Confluence page for this June already exists as
> > > well, so folks can start adding their topics there as well?
> > >
> > > Best,
> > >
> > > Jason
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 31, 2023 at 2:38 PM Eric Pugh
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi all..   I won’t be at the April meetup, as I’ll be shepherding 20
> > high school students on a trip to Spain ;-).
> > > >
> > > > However, I’d love to go ahead and sign up for hosting in June.I’m
> > proposing June 8th at 11:00 EST.
> > > >
> > > > I’ll go ahead and create the wiki page, and then do the other steps
> in
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/SOLR/Meeting+notes closer to
> > that date ;-)
> > > >
> > > > Eric
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > Eric Pugh | Founder & CEO | OpenSource Connections, LLC |
> 434.466.1467
> > | http://www.opensourceconnections.com <
> > http://www.opensourceconnections.com/> | My Free/Busy <
> > http://tinyurl.com/eric-cal>
> > > > Co-Author: Apache Solr Enterprise Search Server, 3rd Ed <
> >
> https://www.packtpub.com/big-data-and-business-intelligence/apache-solr-enterprise-search-server-third-edition-raw
> > >
> > > > This e-mail and all contents, including attachments, is considered to
> > be Company Confidential unless explicitly stated otherwise, regardless of
> > whether attachments are marked as such.
> > > >
> > >
> > > -
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@solr.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@solr.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
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> >
> >
>

Re: Apache Projects and Discussion Forums

2023-10-20 Thread David Mackey 
Thanks for resurrecting this topic David!

After our discussions at the June meetup I had intended to create an
account with Discourse for the Solr project using their free for open
source hosting . Unfortunately, I became ill
for an extended period and that endeavor went on the back-burner. I'm
fairly recovered now and still interested in helping, if desired.

Initially, I was going to set up the account using my email address and
then transfer it to an official Solr address once it had been set up. In
light of the universe's recent reminder of my mortality I would want to see
it start off using an official email address. If someone with an official
account wants to create the account and add me as an admin once it is set
up, I'm happy to assist. Or if there is a generic account I can be given
access to, I'm happy to perform the setup myself.

I liked your idea of running the two systems in parallel and syncing
between them. I spent some time today researching how this could be
accomplished and from what I've seen it appears theoretically possible but
practically quite difficult. Folks have expressed interest in doing it but
I found no successful implementations.

What is fairly straightforward is:

1. Importing

the existing mailing list archives
2. Setting up an ongoing, read-only sync

of new mailing list messages to Discourse.

This reduces some fragmentation - forum users would be aware of all
discussions - but mailing list users would miss out on forum messages.

Alternatively, we could make a hard cut over to Discourse, setting
us...@solr.apache.org to be ingested by Discourse. Along with an import of
all the existing messages this would ensure that all discussions were
occurring through a single channel. We'd have to use the mailing list mode
 to force
Discourse to send all the messages to all subscribers if we wanted to
imitate the mailing list behavior.

This could be done for a short period but I'd recommend against doing it
long-term as it recreates one of the main weaknesses of mailing lists - a
lack of scalability. Mailing lists work well with small groups but as the
size of the group increases the volume of messages increases until it
becomes impossible to manage. Users could still enable mailing list mode
for their personal accounts if they desired to receive all the messages
long-term.

Jan, regarding your suggestion that we not rule GitHub Discussions out -
I'm not strongly opposed to GHD. I agree that most Solr users are likely
developers but I also hope that this won't always be the case and that is
why I haven't been wholeheartedly in favor of GHD. I feel like GHD would
limit Solr long-term or would force another migration as Solr grew beyond
its developer-centric roots.




On Tue, Oct 17, 2023 at 2:57 AM Jan Høydahl  wrote:

>
> > GitHub is developer-centric and as such would likely, exclude most,
> non-dev, users.
>
> Last time I checked, (direct) users of Solr were developers. Not
> necessarily solr or java devs but tech people integrating or operating solr.
>
> So I’d not exclude GH discussions. The barrier to joining the solr-user
> list discussions is higher than visiting our GH page and browsing
> discussions. How many already have a GH account vs a discourse account? But
> I agree we could have several channels.
>
> Jan Høydahl
>
> > 17. okt. 2023 kl. 07:27 skrev David Smiley :
> >
> > GitHub is developer-centric and as such would likely,
> > exclude most, non-dev, users.
>

Re: Welcome Jason Gerlowski as Solr's new PMC Chair

2024-04-18 Thread David Mackey 
Thanks David for your leadership and happy to hear Jason is taking on the
mantle, congratulations!

On Thu, Apr 18, 2024 at 10:43 AM Houston Putman  wrote:

> Thanks for the past work David and thanks for the work you will be doing
> Jason!
>
> I'm glad we have such a strong group of people to share the
> responsibilities for the project!
>
> - Houston
>
> On Thu, Apr 18, 2024 at 9:20 AM David Smiley  wrote:
>
> > The PMC has voted Jason Gerlowski as Solr's new PMC Chair.  I am the
> > outgoing chair.  The change was approved by the ASF board yesterday,
> > April 17th.
> >
> > Thanks for stepping up Jason!  I'll be happy to assist as needed.
> >
> > ~ David Smiley
> > Apache Lucene/Solr Search Developer
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidwsmiley
> >
> > -
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@solr.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@solr.apache.org
> >
> >
>