Re: Improving Onboarding Experiences - Updating PMC Chair onboarding
Ayush Saxena wrote on 7/30/23 2:49 PM: Hi Shane, Thanx for the work, Read it & it is really very helpful!!! Yay! Someone actually read it! Just two minor doubts or confusion: First, Chairs are responsible for sharing any Board feedback with your PMC Doesn't the feedback come directly to the PMC & anyone from the PMC can answer? Context: There was an email from Rich to all dev lists [1] which read: ``` Every PMC member can, and should, respond when the Board sends email to your private list. You should not wait for the PMC Chair to respond. The Board views the entire PMC as responsible for the project, not just one member. ``` Both are true. The whole PMC should feel empowered to help oversee the project, including answering any board questions. But the board holds the chair personally responsible for making sure board questions are answered. Otherwise, we sometimes get the case where the committee of many people each assume someone else is handling it, and questions never get answered. In particular, the board will sometimes replace the chair when a project's reports or answers aren't sufficient. That's generally either a sign that "Hey, your PMC *really* needs to shape up your projects", and the board tells the PMC to pick a new chair who's more active (this sometimes happens when the chair changes jobs or goes away). Second, While any PMC member can handle some PMC updates, in some cases only the Chair may have permissions to make roster updates. This sounds a little bit incomplete, What are some of those cases? Can we link that as well. Most of the things any member can handle via Whimsy - apache id creation AFAIK Both are true. The purpose of this specific bit of content is to only have the minimal required/recommended setup steps for becoming a new Chair. Everything else - like what those cases are - should be documented on the existing /dev/pmc.html page. Does that make sense? -- - Shane ComDev PMC The Apache Software Foundation -Ayush [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/xyfpw41m65wrk3ftds4jtvyzjoxhtx70 On Mon, 31 Jul 2023 at 00:04, Shane Curcuru wrote: I plan to update the email and how-to information we provide to new PMC members. Please comment or make any factual corrections on the wiki: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/PMC+Chair+Onboarding+Change+Proposal I'll be working with M&P to see where this fits on the a.o/dev tree. -- - Shane ComDev PMC The Apache Software Foundation - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Improving Onboarding Experiences - Updating PMC Chair onboarding
Craig Russell wrote on 7/30/23 5:21 PM: Hi Shane, Thanks for taking on this task. A couple of comments: Yay! Someone else read it! 1. Congratulations on being appointed by the board as a project VP and Chair of your PMC! I do not believe that there is a "project VP". There is an ASF VP and a project Chair. So I'd change this to : Congratulations on being appointed by the board as an ASF VP and Chair of your project's PMC! The same text appears in 1) and 2) Well, people are appointed as an ASF VP of their project - like I'm V.P. Apache Whimsy. So I think either makes sense in the context here, especially for newcomers; especially since we in common conversation we often refer to project VPs. Any other opinions? All other questions are great ones that I agree should get done... by whoever's volunteering to update the *other* content in /dev/pmc.html My purpose here is to *only* write one page (or section) of content that handles the minimal onboarding steps for a new PMC Chair. I only have personal brainpower right now to work on *one* new bit of content at a time, so I'll leave the other questions for later (or, even better, someone new who wants to help make important clarifications). 2. I believe that since the adoption of these standards, the board created the concept of a Roll Call. While not needed for the welcome-to-new-pmc-chairs, the material linked should be updated to include the concept. 3. In the reporting description of new committers and PMC members: When were the newest committers or PMC members elected? [REQUIRED] The report should specially not name prospective committers or PMC members that are currently being voted or invited but have not accepted. Only committers or PMC members that have been added to the roster should be mentioned. Any in-process candidates should be included in the next report. Regards, Craig On Jul 30, 2023, at 11:34, Shane Curcuru wrote: I plan to update the email and how-to information we provide to new PMC members. Please comment or make any factual corrections on the wiki: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/PMC+Chair+Onboarding+Change+Proposal I'll be working with M&P to see where this fits on the a.o/dev tree. -- - Shane ComDev PMC The Apache Software Foundation -- - Shane Member The Apache Software Foundation - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Improving Onboarding Experiences - Updating PMC Chair onboarding
Thanx Shane for the clarification, makes sense to me!!! -Ayush > On 31-Jul-2023, at 4:03 PM, Shane Curcuru wrote: > > Ayush Saxena wrote on 7/30/23 2:49 PM: >> Hi Shane, >> Thanx for the work, Read it & it is really very helpful!!! > > Yay! Someone actually read it! > >> Just two minor doubts or confusion: >> First, >>> Chairs are responsible for sharing any Board feedback with your PMC >> Doesn't the feedback come directly to the PMC & anyone from the PMC can >> answer? >> Context: There was an email from Rich to all dev lists [1] which read: >> ``` >> Every PMC member can, and should, respond when the Board sends email >> to your private list. You should not wait for the PMC Chair to >> respond. The Board views the entire PMC as responsible for the >> project, not just one member. >> ``` > > Both are true. The whole PMC should feel empowered to help oversee the > project, including answering any board questions. But the board holds the > chair personally responsible for making sure board questions are answered. > Otherwise, we sometimes get the case where the committee of many people each > assume someone else is handling it, and questions never get answered. > > In particular, the board will sometimes replace the chair when a project's > reports or answers aren't sufficient. That's generally either a sign that > "Hey, your PMC *really* needs to shape up your projects", and the board tells > the PMC to pick a new chair who's more active (this sometimes happens when > the chair changes jobs or goes away). > >> Second, >>> While any PMC member can handle some PMC updates, in some cases only the >>> Chair may have permissions to make roster updates. >> This sounds a little bit incomplete, What are some of those cases? Can >> we link that as well. Most of the things any member can handle via >> Whimsy - apache id creation AFAIK > > Both are true. The purpose of this specific bit of content is to only have > the minimal required/recommended setup steps for becoming a new Chair. > Everything else - like what those cases are - should be documented on the > existing /dev/pmc.html page. > > Does that make sense? > > -- > - Shane > ComDev PMC > The Apache Software Foundation > >> -Ayush >> [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/xyfpw41m65wrk3ftds4jtvyzjoxhtx70 >>> On Mon, 31 Jul 2023 at 00:04, Shane Curcuru wrote: >>> >>> I plan to update the email and how-to information we provide to new PMC >>> members. Please comment or make any factual corrections on the wiki: >>> >>> >>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/PMC+Chair+Onboarding+Change+Proposal >>> >>> I'll be working with M&P to see where this fits on the a.o/dev tree. >>> >>> -- >>> - Shane >>>ComDev PMC >>>The Apache Software Foundation > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
Following up with that after short holidays - how can I (and others from the Community over Code EU) get added to the "apachecon" group so that I can create the repository and have "committer" access to it? Do I need a JIRA ticket or just karma granted by someone ? I can provide a list of ASF members to add there as a good start. On Mon, Jul 10, 2023 at 3:38 PM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Yep. That would be perfect. > > On Mon, Jul 10, 2023 at 3:29 PM Rich Bowen wrote: >> >> We could also put something under the Apachecon ldap group, which I am >> thinking of renaming to conferences or events. That might be a better match? >> >> Shosholoza, >> Rich >> >> >> On Sun, Jul 9, 2023, 02:28 Jarek Potiuk wrote: >> >> > Sure. if we have "apachecon-*" (and possibly renamed). That would be the >> > best approach. >> > >> > No problem with waiting until Rich is back. >> > >> > J. >> > >> > >> > On Sun, Jul 9, 2023 at 7:57 AM Willem Jiang >> > wrote: >> > >> > > FYI， ApacheCon Asia conference website[1] uses Hugo with a customer >> > > theme[2]. >> > > >> > > [1]https://github.com/apache/apachecon-acasia >> > > [2] >> > https://github.com/apache/apachecon-acasia/tree/master/themes/apachecon >> > > >> > > >> > > Willem Jiang >> > > >> > > Twitter: willemjiang >> > > Weibo: 姜宁willem >> > > >> > > On Sat, Jul 8, 2023 at 7:35 PM Jarek Potiuk wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > it might be simpler to manage if we used this PMC instead - >> > although >> > > > > > that requires some consensus from this PMC first to own something >> > > that >> > > > > > really belongs to conferences. >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > Yeah. That's what I am really looking for :). I would also be fine to >> > > > create >> > > > a new group ? PMC? for that if ComDev is not the right place. Maybe >> > there >> > > > are ways to set up other "entities" for the ASF structure that could >> > > serve >> > > > the purpose ? I do not (yet) know all the options - but I believe PMC >> > is >> > > not >> > > > the only option to have a separate "LDAP group". >> > > > >> > > > > One note: do you *specifically* want to copy the ComDev site repo? >> > Or >> > > > > > do you want to start with the infra-supported (but simpler design) >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Not really. We can start from scratch, I was referring more to the >> > > > integrations >> > > > that we get from INFRA: .asf.yaml, emails sent to specific discussion >> > > lists >> > > > we >> > > > can customize - generally following best practices there. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > My experience with both Hugo and Pelican is that Hugo is easier to >> > > > > customise. >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > Yes we also prefer Hugo. Airflow Summit Website - prepared entirely by >> > > the >> > > > Software >> > > > Guru team - our producers - is based on Hugo, so that would be our >> > > > preference as well. >> > > > >> > > > https://github.com/softwareguru/airflowsummit-website >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > template repo they recommend for new projects? >> > > > > >https://github.com/apache/template-site >> > > > > >> > > > > I don't think that is production ready. >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > We have quite a lot of time before our website will be public (at the >> > > very >> > > > least >> > > > 3-4 months), so we are ok to take it slowly, follow the right process, >> > > and >> > > > then >> > > > even contribute back and make them more ready - if that would be a good >> > > > start, >> > > > We are happy to do so. We could eventually also add an "ASF conference >> > > > template" >> > > > for others and possibly pave the way to follow the same "process" (but >> > I >> > > am >> > > > usually >> > > > of the opinion that in order to make something reusable, you have to >> > make >> > > > it usable >> > > > first - so that would likely be a next step and we could "lead by >> > > > example"). >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > No. AFAIK any direct write access to /apache repos can only come >> > > from >> > > > > > ASF committers who have signed an ICLA. But that's solvable for a >> > > > > > special case like this, by having an officer or PMC simply agree to >> > > > > > invite those outside individuals at Software Guru to be committers >> > > here. >> > > > > > Note also that individuals can be made committers, not companies. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > I believe signing ICLA by those individuals from Software Guru is not a >> > > > problem at all, >> > > > and they will be perfectly happy to act in their "individual" >> > capacity. I >> > > > know them personally >> > > > very well and I am sure this is not a problem. And on a personal (about >> > > > individuals) note - >> > > > they are so much personally involved with other Apache conferences >> > > > (Airflow, Beam) >> > > > and now running the Community Over Code EU, that it would make >> > absolutely >> > > > sense to make them committers. >> > > > >> > > > I think it's more of a question -
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
On Mon, 2023-07-31 at 15:51 +0200, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > Following up with that after short holidays - how can I (and others > from the Community over Code EU) get added to the "apachecon" group > so > that I can create the repository and have "committer" access to it? > > Do I need a JIRA ticket or just karma granted by someone ? I can > provide a list of ASF members to add there as a good start. > You are in fact already in that group. https://whimsy.apache.org/roster/group/apachecon?type=LDAP%20Auth%20Group - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
Hmm, Is it possible to create a repo there then (apachecon-eu - until we rename the group) - I tried to create one with boxer - https://gitbox.apache.org/boxer/?action=newrepo but it's greyed-out. Or I guess I need more karma for that one? J. On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 4:18 PM wrote: > > On Mon, 2023-07-31 at 15:51 +0200, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Following up with that after short holidays - how can I (and others > > from the Community over Code EU) get added to the "apachecon" group > > so > > that I can create the repository and have "committer" access to it? > > > > Do I need a JIRA ticket or just karma granted by someone ? I can > > provide a list of ASF members to add there as a good start. > > > > > > You are in fact already in that group. > > https://whimsy.apache.org/roster/group/apachecon?type=LDAP%20Auth%20Group > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
On Mon, 2023-07-31 at 17:40 +0200, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > Hmm, > > Is it possible to create a repo there then (apachecon-eu - until we > rename the group) - I tried to create one with boxer - > https://gitbox.apache.org/boxer/?action=newrepo but it's greyed-out. > > Or I guess I need more karma for that one? Nope, it's greyed out for me too. I would suggest opening an infra ticket. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
back full circle :) On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 7:08 PM wrote: > > On Mon, 2023-07-31 at 17:40 +0200, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Hmm, > > > > Is it possible to create a repo there then (apachecon-eu - until we > > rename the group) - I tried to create one with boxer - > > https://gitbox.apache.org/boxer/?action=newrepo but it's greyed-out. > > > > Or I guess I need more karma for that one? > > > Nope, it's greyed out for me too. I would suggest opening an infra > ticket. > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Setting up Git Project under comdev for Community Over Code EU
You are both in the apachecon auth group, so in theory you should be able to select apachecon from the drop down. However, it is not a (P)PMC, and does not have the usual LDAP setup, so perhaps the auth is not being correctly calculated. On Mon, 31 Jul 2023 at 18:26, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > back full circle :) > > On Mon, Jul 31, 2023 at 7:08 PM wrote: > > > > On Mon, 2023-07-31 at 17:40 +0200, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > Hmm, > > > > > > Is it possible to create a repo there then (apachecon-eu - until we > > > rename the group) - I tried to create one with boxer - > > > https://gitbox.apache.org/boxer/?action=newrepo but it's greyed-out. > > > > > > Or I guess I need more karma for that one? > > > > > > Nope, it's greyed out for me too. I would suggest opening an infra > > ticket. > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
