software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
Hi all, apt-spy and pciutils (and possibly others) contain methods to update a database integral to their operation. - `apt-spy update` downloads the list of available Debian mirrors to /usr/share/apt-spy (see #277816). - `update-pciids` downloads a new /usr/share/misc/pci.ids I think these are both in violation with the FHS, which states (Chapter 4, emphasis mine, using caps instead of asterisks for readability): "/usr is shareable, READ-ONLY DATA. That means that /usr should be shareable between various FHS-compliant hosts and MUST NOT BE WRITTEN TO." The apt-apy maintainer thinks this is okay because (from the bug report): apt-spy does not "dynamically update". It updates *if and ONLY if* you ask it to. I do not see this as a violation of the spirit of the FHS. I'm more than happy to have discussion about this. If this holds, then why does `apt-get update` modify files in /var/lib/apt/lists, and why is /var/lib/dpkg/status not really /usr/lib/dpkg/status? Well, two wrongs don't make a right, nor does APT/dpkg's choice for /var make using /usr for changeable resource data wrong for everyone, but I still think that apt-spy's mirror list and the PCI IDs should be kept in /var, since they are variable data. Looking forward to comments! -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: an idea for next generation APT archive caching
also sprach Wouter Verhelst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.22.2121 +0200]: > Oh, absolutely. One way could be to talk to the apt-cacher and > apt-proxy developers and help fixing bugs in their software, > instead of calling your not even fully thought out idea (which > surely hasn't proven itself) the "next generation". It's an RFC. It's an idea that I liked. Sorry for claiming it next generation. -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
debconf and backing up ... a bug?
debconf-devel(7) states that GO returns 30 if (a) it did not display a question (due to priority or seen status) or (b) the user chose to backup (with the backup capability) enabled. Is it just me, or is this a mistake? I mean, how are you supposed to distinguish between backing up and debconf using the cached or default value instead of asking the user? -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
[solved] debconf and backing up ... a bug?
also sprach martin f krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.26.0956 +0200]: > (a) it did not display a question (due to priority or seen status) nevermind. db_input returns this... it's very weird. sometimes, the following echoes 30 in bash 3: db_input ... || true when in fact it never should. i will do some researching... -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
For reference, here are two points that came up on IRC: - The administrator has no place in /usr, it's the package manager's domain. - Tools keep MD5 sums for files installed. When a file in /usr changes, it is usually an indication of something fishy; thus, certain programmes will fire alarms. Lastly, the policy promises that /usr can be read-only and guarantees software to be fully functional. -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.26.1916 +0200]: > > Lastly, the policy promises that /usr can be read-only and > > guarantees software to be fully functional. > > Now, where is the possible policy bug? Section 9.1.1 of the policy. The software writes to /usr, which is to be treated as read-only at any time other than package management. Thus, effectively, dpkg is the only tool allowed to manipulate files in /usr, though other tools are used from time to time (e.g. ln(1)), but only during installation or removal of the owner package. -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Manoj Srivastava <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.26.2104 +0200]: > Again, what's the policy bug? #277816 < vorlon> Manoj: it's not a policy bug, just a shitty subject line. I guess I could not say it better. It's not a bug in the policy, just a bug according to policy. -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach paddy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.26.2114 +0200]: > Are we reading the same policy? There is only one. > Debian Policy Manual > Chapter 9 - The Operating System > 9.1 Filesystem hierarchy > 9.1.1 Filesystem Structure > > The location of all installed files and directories must > comply with the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard (FHS) ... Exactly. > What software writes to /usr ? As noted in the OP, apt-spy, pciutils, and probably others. -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.26.2057 +0200]: > You should probably tell us non-chatters what "The software" is... I believe the original post had the reference: apt-spy, pciutils, usbutils, possibly others. Note that usbutils and apt-spy are already fixed. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Chris Cheney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.29.0823 +0200]: > dpkg should not put files in /usr when it extracts programs either if > /usr MUST NOT BE WRITTEN TO... ;) Come on! The FHS regulates what normal software can/should do, partially so that package managers can work reliably. dpkg is the package manager, thus it is exempt from the FHS. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Wouter Verhelst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.10.29.1002 +0200]: > > > dpkg should not put files in /usr when it extracts programs either if > > > /usr MUST NOT BE WRITTEN TO... ;) >^^ > > Come on! The FHS regulates what normal software can/should do, > > partially so that package managers can work reliably. dpkg is the > > package manager, thus it is exempt from the FHS. I noted the smiley. I still wanted to make it explicit. In fact, I should have been even clearer. The FHS applies to the filesystem structure are run-time, not at installation time. It guides the installation, but only such that when the installation phase is complete, the system can switch to run-time and be FHS-compliant from the start onwards. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: software updates file in /usr -- policy bug?
also sprach Anthony Towns [2004.10.30.0713 +0200]: > Having apt-spy dpkg-divert the file in /usr on install, and > replace it with a symlink to a file in /var/lib, and then update > the file in /var/lib when invoked seems the obviously correct way > to deal with this, no? Why dpkg-divert? Why have a symlink in /usr at all (unless there is another software that hardcodes the path...) -- Please do not CC me when replying to lists; I read them! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, and user `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#281695: ITP: pstat -- a simple parser for process status information
Package: wnpp Severity: wishlist * Package name: pstat Version : 0.1.0 Upstream Author : martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> * URL : http://madduck.net/~madduck/scratch/pstat * License : Artistic Description : a simple parser for process status information pstat is a simple shell script that parses /proc/*/stat and outputs it in human-readable form. It also allows output to be formatted for easy parsing. I needed this tool for debugging, found ps(1) syntax too cumbersome, and thus rolled it out. It may well be too trivial for inclusion in Debian. Then again, maybe it will be useful to others too. -- System Information: Debian Release: 3.1 APT prefers testing APT policy: (600, 'testing'), (98, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental') Architecture: i386 (i686) Kernel: Linux 2.6.8-cirrus Locale: LANG=en_GB, LC_CTYPE=en_GB.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) -- .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#284642: ITP: dpkg-reversion -- change the version of a DEB file
Package: wnpp Severity: wishlist * Package name: dpkg-reversion Version : 0.1.5 Upstream Author : martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> * URL : http://madduck.net/~madduck/scratch/dpkg-reversion * License : Artistic Description : change the version of a DEB file I needed a tool to change the version number of DEB files after repacking them with dpkg-repack. So I wrote one. Very simple, does not really warrant its own package, but devscripts is also not really the place for it. It is unlikely to become part of dpkg-repack, though you never know (see #284086). Suggestions welcome. Otherwise I will provide a package soon. According to Goswin, this will also come in handy for the amd64 port. -- System Information: Debian Release: 3.1 APT prefers testing APT policy: (600, 'testing'), (98, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental') Architecture: i386 (i686) Kernel: Linux 2.6.9-cirrus Locale: LANG=en_GB, LC_CTYPE=en_GB.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) -- .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#284642: ITP: dpkg-reversion -- change the version of a DEB file
also sprach Scott James Remnant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.08.0909 +0100]: > Generally the dpkg-* namespace is reserved for features that are > intended for integration into dpkg at some point. well, by all means then. If dpkg-repack and dpkg-www are intended for integration into dpkg, then reversion should be too. I really think reversion should be available. > Can you please use deb-reversion instead? I could, and I do not have a preference. What do others say? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
dpkg-reversion: how about debedit?
retitle 284642 ITP: debedit -- script to edit DEB files with hooks or interactively thanks Together with Goswin, I have now given dpkg-reversion the ability to invoke a hook on the unpacked binary package. He is now using it to test moving /lib64 from base-files to libc6 on amd64 and to change the debian/control:Architecture field on packages like OO.o -- for amd64. The script could be used as a generic DEB file editor with automated versioning. I only need it for the version change, but the possibilities are endless. Thus I propose to rename this ITP/package to debedit. What do you say? Version 0.1.16 is still at deb http://people.debian.org ~madduck/packages/stage/dpkg-reversion/ deb-src http://people.debian.org ~madduck/packages/stage/dpkg-reversion/ Comments, suggestions, patches, improvements welcome. -- .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
attn: matt hope -- your mail bounces
This is probably related to your university address, which also bounces with "too many hops". - Forwarded message from Mail Delivery System <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Too many hops - End forwarded message - -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^."<*>"|tr "<*> mailto:"; [EMAIL PROTECTED] invalid/expired pgp subkeys? use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED] still looking for the glorious results of my misspent youth. say, do you have a map to the next joint? signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: dpkg-reversion: how about debedit?
also sprach Mike Hommey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.09.0359 +0100]: > Sounds good. > Could it be used for dh_striping the content of a package ? It is an unpacked DEB file, not a Debian source package, so I am not sure how much use the debhelper suite will be. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: dpkg-reversion: how about debedit?
also sprach Mike Hommey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.09.0951 +0100]: > Well, let's say strip, then, wrapped in a little script. If i understood > correctly what your tool aims at, it would be possible to do that. Absolutely, yes. You are basically free to change anything within control.tar.gz and data.tar.gz, and these two are already properly unpacked to ./DEBIAN and . respectively. Just try it out: dpkg-reversion -k sh some_file.deb This will execute a shell and allow you to modify to your heart's content. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#284642: ITP: dpkg-reversion -- change the version of a DEB file
also sprach Tollef Fog Heen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.09.1351 +0100]: > | I really think reversion should be available. > > I think it's useless, it's not. I will probably rename it to debedit. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#284642: ITP: dpkg-reversion -- change the version of a DEB file
also sprach Adam Heath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.09.2053 +0100]: > Probably yes on dpkg-repack. Definately not for dpkg-www. Which > is a sucky name, btw. Agreed. However, if dpkg-repack goes into dpkg, why not provide a means to edit a DEB file (without having to install it) too? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#284642: ITP: dpkg-reversion -- change the version of a DEB file
also sprach Adam Heath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.11.0259 +0100]: > Well, the plan is to make the dpkg-deb interface more formalized. What I > mean, is being able to use it in a filter, with plugging input and output. Thanks for the explanation. Yes, this is the sensible to do it. > Repacking and editting then become easy to do. I agree. In the mean time, I will have debedit be part of devscripts. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
strange (or unexplainable) permissions on /var/log/*
I am trying to make sense of /var/log/*. I noticed the following peculiarities: - user.log is 0640. However, aren't "user" messages possibly relevant to users? If so, I suggest making the file 0644. - uucp.log, mail.* and news/* are 0644. I would say that these should be 0640. - why is dmesg 0644? This is not really a problem, but do users need access to the boot messages? I would appreciate comments... -- Please do not CC me on mailing list mail. .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: strange (or unexplainable) permissions on /var/log/*
also sprach Loïc Minier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.12.1706 +0100]: > I think this is "user" as in "userland", simply because this is the > default level for programs. ah, okay. also sprach Mark Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.12.1706 +0100]: > The log buffer can normally be read using the dmesg utility (or > similar code) as well as via the log file. yes, this just came up on IRC too. thanks. maybe it is possible to restrict the syscall in standard Debian the same way OpenWall does? i think logs should be 0640 and root:adm throughout. users need no log files. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: strange (or unexplainable) permissions on /var/log/*
also sprach Santiago Vila <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.12.1708 +0100]: > My mail.* files are 640 and I don't remember having done anything > special for that to happen. Judging from an IRC conversation, I should note that I just did a fresh install into VMware from the 2004-11-27 netinst ISO. The log files are: -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 2803 2004-12-10 20:20 aptitude -rw-r- 1 rootadm8208 2004-12-12 17:28 auth.log -rw-r- 1 rootadm6755 2004-12-12 01:47 auth.log.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 145602 2004-12-10 20:23 base-config.log.1 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 10539 2004-12-10 20:23 base-config.timings.1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 0 2004-12-10 15:10 btmp -rw-r- 1 rootadm 552 2004-12-12 17:22 daemon.log -rw-r- 1 rootadm 687 2004-12-11 20:16 daemon.log.0 drwxr-xr-x 3 rootroot 4096 2004-12-10 15:14 debian-installer -rw-r- 1 rootadm4139 2004-12-12 17:22 debug -rw-r- 1 rootadm4389 2004-12-10 20:20 debug.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 10823 2004-12-12 17:22 dmesg drwxr-s--- 2 Debian-exim adm4096 2004-12-12 01:25 exim4 -rw-r- 1 rootadm 19675 2004-12-12 17:22 kern.log -rw-r- 1 rootadm 19379 2004-12-10 20:20 kern.log.0 drwxr-xr-x 2 rootroot 4096 2004-12-12 17:22 ksymoops -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 292292 2004-12-12 17:28 lastlog -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-12 01:47 lp-acct -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 20:22 lp-acct.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-12 01:47 lp-errs -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 20:22 lp-errs.0 -rw-r- 1 rootadm 46 2004-12-12 17:22 lpr.log -rw-r- 1 rootadm 94 2004-12-12 01:47 lpr.log.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 15:14 mail.err -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 15:14 mail.info -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 15:14 mail.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 15:14 mail.warn -rw-r- 1 rootadm 17271 2004-12-12 17:42 messages -rw-r- 1 rootadm 18314 2004-12-12 01:47 messages.0 drwxr-sr-x 2 newsnews 4096 2004-12-10 15:14 news -rw-r- 1 rootadm 24293 2004-12-12 17:42 syslog -rw-r- 1 rootadm5624 2004-12-12 01:25 syslog.0 -rw-r- 1 rootadm5017 2004-12-11 01:25 syslog.1.gz -rw-r- 1 rootadm 72 2004-12-12 17:20 user.log -rw-r- 1 rootadm 90 2004-12-10 15:15 user.log.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-10 15:14 uucp.log -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 21120 2004-12-12 17:28 wtmp -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: strange (or unexplainable) permissions on /var/log/*
also sprach martin f krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.12.1713 +0100]: > also sprach Santiago Vila <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.12.1708 +0100]: > > My mail.* files are 640 and I don't remember having done anything > > special for that to happen. > > Judging from an IRC conversation, I should note that I just did > a fresh install into VMware from the 2004-11-27 netinst ISO. The log > files are: I am just stepping through this an notice that the sysklogd postinst does: for LOG in `syslogd-listfiles` `syslogd-listfiles --auth`; do if [ ! -f $LOG ]; then touch $LOG fi chown root:adm $LOG chmod 640 $LOG done However, this will only be syslog and auth.log (the others are --weekly) As soon as sysklogd starts, it touches all files into place, but with a 0022 umask and thus mode 0644. Right after the installation, the following log files are present: -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 2095 2004-12-13 20:22 aptitude -rw-r- 1 rootadm1464 2004-12-13 20:23 auth.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 136465 2004-12-13 20:23 base-config.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 10283 2004-12-13 20:23 base-config.timings -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 0 2004-12-13 15:08 btmp -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot288 2004-12-13 20:23 daemon.log drwxr-xr-x 3 rootroot 4096 2004-12-13 15:09 debian-installer -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 5276 2004-12-13 20:22 debug -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 12360 2004-12-13 15:14 dmesg drwxr-s--- 2 Debian-exim adm4096 2004-12-13 15:19 exim4 -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 22765 2004-12-13 20:22 kern.log drwxr-xr-x 2 rootroot 4096 2004-12-13 15:08 ksymoops -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 292292 2004-12-13 20:23 lastlog -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 20:22 lp-acct -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 20:22 lp-errs -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 47 2004-12-13 20:22 lpr.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 15:18 mail.err -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 15:18 mail.info -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 15:18 mail.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 15:18 mail.warn -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 17211 2004-12-13 20:22 messages drwxr-sr-x 2 newsnews 4096 2004-12-13 15:18 news -rw-r- 1 rootadm 23476 2004-12-13 20:23 syslog -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 90 2004-12-13 15:19 user.log -rw-r--r-- 1 rootroot 0 2004-12-13 15:18 uucp.log -rw-rw-r-- 1 rootutmp 9216 2004-12-13 20:23 wtmp I see three solutions here. The first is to make the sysklog postinst touch all files into place, not just syslog and auth.log (probably what was intended). The second would be to run sysklogd with a 0027 umask and make /var/log setgid adm. I am not sure this is a solution at all, but maybe worth consideration? The third solution is to make /var/log 2750 with group adm. This would lock out all non-adm users. I like this myself a lot, actually. Why do users need access to log files? I am going to file a bug about this now. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
/var/log on Debian systems
On all my Debian systems, /var/log seems like a big pile of dumps without much consistency. Especially, while 0640:root:adm seems to be a commonly accepted guideline, proggies like aptitude, scrollkeeper, X, xdm, fontconfig, and many others basically just dump their files world-readable into there. There are very few files in /var/log that need to have world-read rights. Most log files do not, and probably should not, as they may contain sensitive information (mail.log's data is considered private in many EU states, for example). I would like to standardise /var/log on Debian systems. Having 0640:root:adm be the goal on all files (unless it needs to be otherwise), I therefore - first suggest to make /var/log group adm and setgid, so that any new files automatically belong to group adm. - second suggest to amend the policy (in the long run) to demand packages to umask to 0270 before writing to the directory. This would go for syslogd as well as any other programme and yield 0640 files by default. The main problems I see are with daemons not running as root, which can therefore not create adm-group-owned files. Pre-touching the files in the postinst and using logrotate's defaults seems to solve this. Other than that, however, I do not see any immediate problems. Please contribute your thoughts. PS: maybe we can also flatten news/* or deepen mail.* on the way. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: /var/log on Debian systems
also sprach Santiago Vila <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.0137 +0100]: > No, not again. Please google a little bit more before proposing > things. For example, read the complete logs for Bug #35504. I read the complete log, and I read the thread at http://lists.debian.org/debian-policy/2000/01/msg00273.html However, where's the consensus. Having 2775:root:adm is stupid, I agree. But where's the real argument against 2755:root:adm? It seems that Debian wants to take the "allow everything unless prohibited" approach to log files. The common approach given today's security requirements is the opposite, "allow nothing unless permitted". If Debian wants to go the first path, why not enable the standard inetd services throughout, to give just one example? Why not turn off rp_filter? Why not add every new user to the staff group? Why not make new homedirectories 775? Sorry, but I truly do not see a "consensus" here. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#285625: ITP: expocity -- An enanced Window Manager based on metacity
also sprach Marco Nenciarini <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1533 +0100]: > expocity is an effort to integrate an efficient means of switching between > applications into the window manager metacity, similar to Exposé(tm) on > Apple's OS-X. enlighten us non-Darwinists: what does Exposé do? How does this differ from tabs as provided e.g. by fluxbox. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#285625: ITP: expocity -- An enanced Window Manager based on metacity
also sprach Isaac Clerencia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1610 +0100]: > Similar to Kompose: > http://kompose.berlios.de/kompose_0.4.jpg I fail to see the innovative component. What am I looking for? also sprach Christian Surchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1643 +0100]: also sprach Steve Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1651 +0100]: > http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/expose/ quote: "Admit it, Mac OS X has you spoiled. Youâve become so used to its reliability that you donât hesitate to have a dozen applications running at the same time. Which means, of course, that you probably spend a fair amount of time each day poking through open windows and documents just to uncover the one you need at the moment." Damn, and I run about 60 applications simultaneously and never lose overview with fluxbox or ion. I must be doing something wrong. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#285625: ITP: expocity -- An enanced Window Manager based on metacity
also sprach William Ballard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1825 +0100]: > > Damn, and I run about 60 applications simultaneously and never > > lose overview with fluxbox or ion. I must be doing something > > wrong. > > This seems to me to be a sloppy way to work. If all these apps > are doing significant amounts of work, each one is going to run > very slowly. More than a few simultaneous compiles and you're just > thrashing. You forget that application != memory/performance hog. I did not say I run OpenOffice.org or KDE or Gnome or anything. If I do not use an application, it idles and consumes a PID and a couple of file handles and that's it. > I find it neater and cleaner to open and close the handful of > things I'm working on, and instead run hundreds of tasks serially > rather than in parallel. I leave the serialisation up to the scheduler. I would claim to range up in the 98% efficiency department with my computer use. Part of that is related to the way my apps and screen estate are organised. The other part is that I click the mouse button maybe five times a day. > I think this is just sloppiness. "i might disagree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it." -- voltaire You must have had horrible experiences with your computer. I am sorry. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: /var/log on Debian systems
also sprach Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2004.12.14.1955 +0100]: > > be a commonly accepted guideline, proggies like aptitude, > > scrollkeeper, X, xdm, fontconfig, and many others basically just > > dump their files world-readable into there. > > What's so private in these log files that they should not world > readable? Let me ask you the complementary question: what's so public in these log files that they should be world readable? I understand your question, and it's a very good one, and I wonder if this is a fundamental question about Debian. It reminds me of the decision to make /bin/su 4754:root:wheel instead of 4750:root:wheel. If you ask me, 4754 is a sane choice with a very pragmatic reason. Log files, however, are different, and claiming that they are non-private and thus world-readable is somewhat arbitrary to me. It makes no sense to chmod 4750 /bin/su or 0711 /sbin or anything of that sort, because that would be obscurity as any other Debian system could deliver the information. However, log files are specific to each system and no two log files will ever be the same. Whether the information therein is inherently public or private is not really the issue. I think the issue is rather whether Debian generally approaches security from a conservative or liberal position. Conservative maps to denying everything that isn't explicitly allowed, and liberal allows everything unless explicitly denied. Look no further than the security team... your policy (on critical bugs) is to hide information unless you have reason to make them public. Why should other parts of Debian do it the other way around? I claim the set of potential dangers, attacks, problems, and watchouts to be infinite. Thus, it's a Sysiphus job to attempt to protect the things known to be sensitive. Instead, unprotect those that are known to be save! This is standard security and safety procedure, this is what any sensible security person these days will advocate for a generic purpose. Information is the primary asset of a hacker (next to skill). Between X and fontconfig and other logs, a hacker (or malicious (or not)) user can map out behaviour patterns of users without being noticed (which may or may not be the case when using ps(1) or /proc). These can seriously augment social engineering attacks. Security cannot be perfect, but giving full access to information is outright careless. I really do not want to reopen cans of worms here, nor do I want to start a heated discussion. I screwed up in that I did not research before posting the first message of this thread. Santiago corrected me by mentioning a consensus that had been reached. I cannot find this consensus. Could someone please shove it in my face? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: shell script sniplets in /usr/bin?
also sprach Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.31.2019 +0100]: > You forget to notice one thing, these are debian specific. The gettext.sh > script, however, is meant to be used by just ". gettext.sh" by random > third party programs that can be expected to run on FreeBSD as well as See also #284637 (sorry if this is known...) -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
RFC: graph of Debian package cycle
Based on the work of Kevin Mark (URL not available, sorry), I have made a graph of the life cycle of a Debian package for inclusion in my forthcoming book (http://debianbook.info). You can find the sources and generated files at http://people.debian.org/~madduck/graphs/package-cycle/en/ Additional information is available at http://people.debian.org/~madduck/graphs/package-cycle/ABOUT The graph is herewith released under the Artistic Licence. Thanks to Goswin Brederlow, Bernhard Link, and Kenshi Muto, as well as Kevin Mark, Sven Müller, and Martin Schulze for the original work. Please send any comments or corrections my way. PS: right now it's really big in size. Sorry about that. If someone tells me how to reliably scale a dia diagram down, I will do so, gladly. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RFC: graph of Debian package cycle
also sprach Otavio Salvador <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.12.1842 +0100]: > I think you might change this: > > incoming -> package source -> buildds -> package upload -> incoming Given that incoming contains the source package (unless orig.tar.gz is pulled from unstable, should add that), the buildds really don't deal with the upstream sources or the unpacked source tree maintained by the developer. I am not sure what you mean. Sorry. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RFC: graph of Debian package cycle
also sprach Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.12.1908 +0100]: > Interesting, thanks. I believe the --->O arrays are confusingly > labled. "package installation" is probably a better choice. The > difference between "package propagation" and "package upload" is > not clear, at least to me. okay for the first. the difference between propagation and upload is whether it happens automatically by the archive scripts, or has to be manually instigated by the developer (uploaded). do you have a suggestion how to improve this? > I suppose you should split the diagram in two because the > before-incoming part and the after-incoming part are not too > strongly connected, and the result would be more readable. well, i guess you are somewhat right, although the split will be difficult. i guess just leaving out the incoming part altogether at the risk of not being absolutely correct may be an option. anyway, i am tempted to leave it as complex as it is and to add a note that it's not supposed to be any more overwhelming than reality is. :) upon careful study, the graph *can* be used to extract information, no? also sprach Kevin Mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.13.1031 +0100]: > > I suppose you should split the diagram in two because the > > before-incoming part and the after-incoming part are not too > > strongly connected, and the result would be more readable. > > This is something about which I will think. Yes, me too. If you have any suggestions on how to split, I would love to hear them. Kevin: I hope I did not step on your feet, but I was in a rush to get some version done, so I did not contact you. You are cordially invited to work from my sources, or we can maintain in parallel. In any case, I hope you are okay with the attribution I gave. Otherwise, please let me know. also sprach Otavio Salvador <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.12.1947 +0100]: > mfk> Given that incoming contains the source package (unless orig.tar.gz > mfk> is pulled from unstable, should add that), the buildds really don't > mfk> deal with the upstream sources or the unpacked source tree > mfk> maintained by the developer. > > Buildds deal with source package and not binary package. I thought > you mean with package source the .dsc, .diff.gz and .orig.tar.gz > files. Right, and incoming also contains them. The "sources" item is really supposed to be the upstream sources or the directory on the developer's machine holding the stuff, but inaccessible as such to the buildds. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: mplayer, the time has come
also sprach A Mennucc <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.14.1146 +0100]: > I have uploaded a new version of the 'mplayer' package for Debian, > namely version 1.0pre6-1 Great. At least in the eyes of our (prospective) users, this was one major hurdle. Now let's hope that the ftpmasters look into NEW at least once, eh, 3/4 months...? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Request for Help: apt 0.6
also sprach Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.14.1851 +0100]: > We need help by competent developers who work on apt 0.6 with the goal > to get it supported properly and eventually enter sid and sarge. Thank you, Joey! For the record, I am too strung up right now to be any use in coordinating this. However, I will help out. > - take into account that the archive key is rotated yearly Why? What argument is there against a per-release key, including keys for security, testing, unstable, and experimental? It would certainly make things a little easier... -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Request for Help: apt 0.6
also sprach Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.14.1933 +0100]: > You still need to deal with key revocation and a new key being > needed, anyway. Yearly changes will not make it more difficult, > it will make sure those codepaths are tested (and used at least > once an year). I am not sure a key needs to be revoked, it should just have an expiry that forces us to release in time. :) Do we have code paths for certificate management? In that case, I wonder why it took so long this year... -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: all new Debian diagram - now with less chaos!
Hi Kevin, Great work! I am glad to see you got down with dia; I love that tool. Here are some comments: a. I am not sure what the "process realm" is. b. Developers do not tag bugs, they sign packages. Is that what you meant? Also, note that at the moment, most only sign source packages and binary uploads, not the binary packages themselves. c. Upstream is not really a repository, is it? d. I am missing the link between buildd and unstable. They get the orig.tar.gz from unstable for any uploads in incoming that do not include the tarball. e. I think it's "M. Schulze", not Shultze. f. Sven's name has an Umlaut; here, to cut-n-paste: Müller g. "users processes" should be "users' processes", though I think you may want to use another word. Like plain "users" or "user systems" may be better. h. There are more rules as to when packages migrate from unstable to testing. i. You use both meanings of "priority" (changelog and control) without making it clear which one is meant. j. "updates propagate", not "updates propagates". I know you are talking about the collection, but it sounds weird. That's it for now. To get our graphs onto www.debian.org, I assume we file bugs against that pseudo-package. Let me know when you are ready, then we can submit one bug report together. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: all new Debian diagram - now with less chaos!
also sprach Kevin Mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.15.1314 +0100]: > > b. Developers do not tag bugs, they sign packages. Is that what you > >meant? Also, note that at the moment, most only sign source > >packages and binary uploads, not the binary packages themselves. > > NACK. you lost me. this is a gap in my knowlege. > differentiate source package, binary upload, and binary package. source package: dsc + (diff) + orig.tar.gz binary package: deb source upload: changes + list of files therein > where do they go? all to incoming. > what do developers do? twiddle our thumbs? nah, we turn software into debian packages by debianising them, and then using dpkg-genchanges to create the changes file. Please read its manpage, in particular about the -sa, -sd, and -si options to see which files the changes file will list. the upload consists of the source package and the binary package, unless the debian revision is greater than 1, in which case the orig.tar.gz file is not included. > > h. There are more rules as to when packages migrate from unstable to > >testing. > > ACK. I'm not familar with all possibilities and also not sure how much > space it would take to include it. maybe a 'subprocess' box? you could just say "meets requirements for testing" > > i. You use both meanings of "priority" (changelog and control) > >without making it clear which one is meant. > > NACK. I only used this word once in referense to high, medium, low > migration of packages from unstable to testing. yes, and as someone else pointed out, this should be urgency. sorry, i thought you used it elsewhere too. > > To get our graphs onto www.debian.org, I assume we file bugs against > > that pseudo-package. > > there is an existing package that could include these? or to make an > ITP? www.debian.org is a pseudo package: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/pseudo-packages -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: apt: replace /etc/apt/trusted.gpg with /etc/apt/trusted-keys/
also sprach Peter Palfrader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.16.1337 +0100]: > The following patch makes apt use a directory in etc/apt named > trusted-keys/. Keys are simply placed in that directory if the > user wants to trust them for signing the Release file. This is a great idea. I have briefly reviewed the patch, and it looks okay. Thanks! Florian, what's the status now? How do we proceed? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: [SoftwareSuspend-devel] 2.1-final for 2.6.8.1
[CC: the ITP bug #292479 (http://bugs.debian.org/292479)] also sprach Erich Schubert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.02.28.2009 +0100]: > The patch will not be included in Debian kernels, but will be used > by the user to build his own kernel. Which will likely be not pure > modular, but maybe just break swsusp. This is a problem anyone using the patch will face. And anyone using any patch faces this problem. Btw: can't the swsusp2 patch force USB module support? I see it with other kernel options. E.g. switching SCSI from y to m will automatically force all SCSI drivers to be m as well. > Heck, just let them get a recent kernel and be much better off! > Put the kernel and the swsusp patch into "volatile". I'll consider it. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: [SoftwareSuspend-devel] 2.1-final for 2.6.8.1
also sprach Erich Schubert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.01.1003 +0100]: > Hmm... I could be evil(tm) and just file an important bug against > your package. Being incompatible with usb-built-into-kernel is > certainly that severe. Breaks unrelated stuff would be even higher (it > completely trashes my firewire apps!) I will consider experimental and volatile, or file an RC bug against the package to prevent it from entering sarge. Point is that some people have asked for 2.6.8.1 support, so there. I am not trying to force my way. We'll see what it boils down to. If you are the sponsor of hibernate, maybe we should be working closer together anyway. :) -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: KD-Tree library
also sprach takis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.01.1943 +0100]: > I am a student from Belgium. And i have created a working kd-tree. > Can you please help me how you can add a 3D point to the kd-tree without > rebuilding it. insert(...). Please do not CC debian-devel, they have nothing to do with libkdtree++ -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH
Hi all, I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels, and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH, but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root. Thus, it tries to use /root/.ssh for configuration and node verification, which is not accessible to the normal user. The reasons seems to be that OpenSSH uses getpwnam to obtain the real UID's home directory, rather than $HOME. This is probably a security measure. Has anyone else run into this problem? How could I work around it? -- martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^."<*>"|tr "<*> mailto:"; [EMAIL PROTECTED] invalid/expired pgp subkeys? use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! spamtraps: [EMAIL PROTECTED] "even a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day." -- orbital signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH
also sprach Petter Reinholdtsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1225 +0100]: > > I am trying to use distcc to compile Debian packages and kernels, > > and am failing. The reason is that I need to use distcc-over-SSH, > > but the Debian compile process is run as (fake)root. > > Why isn't it enough to do 'make install' as root? Is there something > in the build process requiring root access? Weird; some packages have dh_testroot in the build target. I tried removing that and using fakeroot only for install. It seems like it works now, but we'll see... argh. It seems that some people (including myself when I wrote these scripts) think that `fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage` is the same as `dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot`). Thanks; it's too early in the day for me to have thought of this myself. :) -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH
also sprach Goswin von Brederlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1840 +0100]: > ssh -i usualy helps. not if you cannot influence how SSH is called. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: combining fakeroot and distcc/SSH
also sprach Michael Tautschnig <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.05.1901 +0100]: > Actually I don't really know, but maybe the environment-variable > DISTCC_SSH could be helpful. ... it was really too early in the day. Sorry to all. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: usbmount: udev script to automatically (un)mount USB mass storage devices: include in Debian?
also sprach Martin Dickopp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.07.2034 +0100]: > In the course of the discussion I got the impression that this way > of automatically (un)mounting USB devices was not percieved as > a good idea. Well, it can't be done... that's one thing. You can "remove knowledge of the medium from the system once it has been pulled out". You cannot unmount it because it will already be removed by the time that udev or any other user-space/kernel-space tool learns about this. This is a limitation of the USB port. The solution is to mount it 'sync', then automatically unmounting could worl > However, my package continued to remain useful for me despite the > existence of pmount, mainly because I don't use a desktop > environment. pmount develops its real power when used in > combination with HAL. As a standalone application, pmount requires > the user to know the filename of the device node, so IMHO it > solves a different problem than my package. You are using udev, so what's the big deal about having to know the filename of the device node? Or is /dev/little-green-usb-stick-with-red-flashing-light not good? Also see #286695. > So, the question is: Should usbmount be included in Debian? Since you and Rafael deem it useful, I guess that it should. I am not opposed to the package at all. I just think that there are other ways to do it. But that's just me. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: usbmount: udev script to automatically (un)mount USB mass storage devices: include in Debian?
also sprach Steve Greenland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.08.1423 +0100]: > While not perfect, using autofs with a very short timeout (5 seconds, > say) alleviates this problem. No it does not. You would be surprised how many people copy to and remove the stick the same second that cp returns to the shell. Point being: there is no reliable unmounting of USB storage devices short of user sensibilisation. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Switchconf: Orphaning or removing?
also sprach Gunnar Wolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.08.0232 +0100]: > Well... It could get back into Debian for sure, but there must be > somebody responsable for it. You can take the package, even not being > a DD, uploading it through a sponsor. You are, besides, the second > person who asked me about this, the first one was Martin Krafft > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, who _is_ a DD... He might want to resurrect it > and take it over or sponsor your uploads. Yes; It is probably better if I don't spread my resources thinner and take this package on as well, but I would be happy to work with anyone wanting to maintain it. I think switchconf is nice because it ties in well with guessnet, and because it's lean and mean and does exactly what it should, no more and no less. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Switchconf: Orphaning or removing?
also sprach Jose Manuel dos Santos Calhariz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.09.0124 +0100]: > If Martin Krafft don't try to put it back, I may try to find > a sponsor. I am searchinf for a good excuse to be a DD. I'll sponsor you. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
automake/autoconf in build-dependencies
I have often tried to argue my position on automake/autoconf in packages' build dependencies: I do not think they belong there. If a package does not build without automake or autoconf, it is broken and should be fixed. However, bugs like #298336 seem to suggest that other maintainers deem it entirely appropriate to "go the easy way" -- if I may call it that without being condescending towards Uwe. I seem to recall the devel-reference or some similar document to specifically address this issue, but I cannot find the location anymore. Thus I am interested in opinions of people who argue that automake/autoconf are perfectly acceptable as build dependencies. Also, are there technical arguments against these build dependencies? I am too inexperienced with the GNU autotools to come up with something. I am perfectly aware that there are (and should be) exceptions. For instance, if a package should be made available sooner rather than later, and the maintainer then sits down to work on the autotools configuration to fix the bug for the next upload. However, this always bears the danger that the maintainer then loses interest and the archive will contain what I claim to be a broken source package... even though it may well build. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Switchconf: Orphaning or removing?
also sprach Henning Makholm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.10.1309 +0100]: > > laptop-net also contains a configuration file switching > > mechanism. > > For that matter, so does ifupdown. I have a bunch of post-up 'ln > -fs' commands in the appropiate /etc/network/interfaces on my > laptop. Does switchconf do more than can be simulated easily by > that? It provides a helpful means of abstraction, I find. Rather than keeping n files for each of m locations somewhere, and adding n /bin/ln calls to m interfaces(5) stanzas, I prefer to add the n files to the filesystem (as I have to do in any case) and rely on switchconf to process them all with a single call. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach David Schmitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.16.1923 +0100]: > * relaxing "arch-specific" to also be able to exclude KDE/GNOME > from mips (until someone commits to properly support it for > whatever reason he has) Why do we make a package foo's entry to testing dependent on whether foo has been compiled for all arches, including all dependencies? Why can't we have separate sid->testing propagation for each arch, then freeze testing as before, get rid of RC bugs, and release? Sure, the package set will differ across architectures, but they do already... I see the main advantage of this approach to put a little pressure onto the maintainers of less popular arches, who will have an interest to make things work for their arch, and thus might try to persuade others *on an individual basis* to fix their packages for arches which are currently not supported cleanly. Am I making sense? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: *seconded* Re: Bits (Nybbles?) from the Vancouver release team meeting
also sprach Stephen Frost <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.16.1707 +0100]: > What about requiring a binary upload with the source upload, but then > rebuilding the binary on the buildd of the uploaded binary *anyway*? It would also address a security/trust problem with which some professional customers have expressed concerns: http://lists.debian.org/debian-security/2004/09/msg00014.html -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.17.1734 +0100]: > This it what I see as the attitude of *some* people: "It works on > x86, x86-64 & ppc. Who cares about lame old and/or arches like > m68k, arm, hppa & sparc?" Well, there seem to be no more than two ways to get rid of this problem: drop some architectures, or make people realise and embrace what Debian is all about. I am not in favour of the first, and the second seems utopic. So we're stuck. > 1. even more disparity between the popular arches and the tiny > ones. Supply and demand... > 2. difficulty with bugs. How do you close a bug, if it doesn't > work on some arches? The open bug count would go even higher. You don't close it, period. Or we introduce arch-dependent bugs and/or fixed-in-i386 etc tags... -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach Andreas Barth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.17.1827 +0100]: > * martin f krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [050317 17:10]: > > Why can't we have separate sid->testing propagation for each arch, > > then freeze testing as before, get rid of RC bugs, and release? > > Because than the security team may need to fix 11 different source > packages (or how many architectures we actually release) instead > of 1. This is a good point, but I wonder whether it should remain a show-stopper. Wouldn't the logical solution be to stock up the security team? That said, the chance of a package going out of sync on more than a few architectures is minimal, so even though your speculation is correct, it's likely not going to be in effect ever. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach martin f krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.18.1021 +0100]: > That said, the chance of a package going out of sync on more than > a few architectures is minimal, so even though your speculation is > correct, it's likely not going to be in effect ever. and if we have different versions for different arches, the differences are most likely minimal, so that security patches should apply with minimal additional effort. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach Marc Haber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.18.1053 +0100]: > It is, however, widely considered a feature that a package has the > same version on all released arches. I'd vouch for keeping that > requirement. Are we really to expect a lot of disparities if we loosen the requirement? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "our destiny exercises its influence over us even when, as yet, we have not learned its nature; it is our future that lays down the law of our today." - friedrich nietzsche signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Relaxing testing requirements (was: summarising answers to Vancouver critique)
also sprach Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.03.18.1145 +0100]: > > This is a good point, but I wonder whether it should remain > > a show-stopper. Wouldn't the logical solution be to stock up the > > security team? > > The security team is under-staffed *now*, AFAICT; and you want to increase > their workload for etch on the assumption that nothing bad will come of it? No, I said we should stock the security team, which I meant to read as: add more man-power. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "all women become like their mothers. that is their tragedy. no man does. that's his." -- oscar wilde signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: dpkg-sig support wanted?
also sprach Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.11.22.1650 +0100]: > As I'm responsible for most of dpkg-sig's code (and planned to do > some more work in the next two months) I'd like to know if anyone > cares about using these binary signatures or if I can invest my > time into something that's a bit more satisfying (== non-Debian > stuff). As the ftp-masters and the dpkg maintainers seem to have > no interest in the whole thing, I'm beginning to doubt that it's > sensible to work on dpkg-sig. I fully support dpkg-sig and do not appreciate having to hear that a decision was made without the giving the collective of developers a chance to voice their opinions before. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "man soll nicht in kirchen gehn, wenn man reine luft atmen will." - friedrich nietzsche signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Debian and the desktop (was: Re: Complaint about #debian operator)
also sprach Michael Banck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.12.12.1405 +0100]: > I don't understand why for Etch, if a user chooses "Desktop" during > tasksel, they shouldn't get the just works[tm] experience. Yeah, and let's draw from the work by the Ubuntu guys, rather than doing it a different way! > Ubuntu's excellence shouldn't be an excuse to sit back and not > make our Desktop the best possible. Very well put. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! it's as bad as you think, and they are out to get you. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Reminder: pre-Christmas bug squashing ends Wednesday
Dear fellow developers and contributors, This is a reminder that the bug squashing period I announced on 24 Nov 2005 is ending this coming Wednesday, 11:59 CET. For more information, please see http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2005/11/msg00019.html Kind regards, -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
RFH: kernel-patch-suspend2
Hi, I am the maintainer of kernel-patch-suspend2 in Debian experimental. Due to my tendonitis, I am unable to incorporate some necessary changes to the package, so it's hopelessly outdated. I am thus looking for people temporarily or permanently interested in helping with the package. If it is any motivation, then I can say that the package is rather clean and complex, so it's quite an enjoyable challenge to maintain. I have previously called it the most complex kernel patch package in the Debian archive, as it uses all kinds of kernel-package, mkinitrd, and kernel-image hooks. Here's an approximate TODO list, with priorities 1(highest)-3: - [1] upgrade to/incorporate latest versions (for 2.6.14) - [1] migrate from mkinitrd to yaird support - [2] migrate to debconf, like kernel-package has done. - [2] enable filewriter support * already done quick'n'dirty in my repo * ideally add debconf support and coordinate with hibernate package for better integration (shared debconf entries, filewriter location, swap file creation) - [3] improve patching system. right now, I include the original patch, and a patch against the patch to make it compile against Debian kernels. this can get hairy. ideally use dh_kpatches and add support for Debian and vanilla kernels without patching patches. Interested parties please reply privately. I'd enjoy working with others on this. We can create an alioth project if necessary. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "you don't sew with a fork, so I see no reason to eat with knitting needles." -- miss piggy, on eating chinese food signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: RFH: kernel-patch-suspend2
also sprach martin f krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.12.22.1129 +0100]: > Interested parties please reply privately. I'd enjoy working with > others on this. We can create an alioth project if necessary. My latest working tree is at http://madduck.net/~madduck/scratch/kernel-patch-suspend2_2.2-0.rc14.1.tar.gz Note that the package is already at 2.2-0.rc14.1, but I have not incorporated 2.2 yet. The latest version included is 2.1.9.9 for 2.6.12. The tendonitis came unexpectedly. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! * Overfiend came out of the womb complaining. -- #debian-devel signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: bits from the release team
also sprach Brian Nelson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.04.0043 +0100]: > Why don't we use RHEL's kernel, or collaborate with them to maintain a > stable kernel tree, or something? I doubt RH has the same concept of stability as we do, and I surely don't want a plethora of potentially untested or buggy hardware support patches in my productive kernels. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! gentoo: for when you finally find out that overclocking can kill your processor. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: APT public key updates?
also sprach Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.07.1132 +0100]: > This is inconsistent with Debian's past policies wrt stable releases, > namely, that it should be possible for a user to skip all point releases and > security updates (at the peril of their system's security...) and still be > able to upgrade when a new stable release comes out. This is necessary if > we're to accomodate the many Debian deployments which don't have a reliable > network connection and are only updated when a new stable release is > published. Please keep this use case in mind while designing solutions for > the apt key update problem. As JoeyH suggests on http://wiki.debian.org/SecureApt, a debian-archive-key package, which contains all keys up until the current one, would do. Then, whenever a new key comes along, a new package is distributed via security.d.o. If we do this, I strongly suggest to move to one-key-per-release cycles. There is no reason to have a new key each January. As a matter of fact, if etch comes out in Decembre 2006, the archive keys it distributes will be usable only for a little more than a month. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "never try to explain computers to a layman. it's easier to explain sex to a virgin." -- robert heinlein (note, however, that virgins tend to know a lot about computers.) signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Canonical's business model
also sprach Andrew Suffield <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.11.1644 +0100]: > > Could you be more explicit? I know there has been concern about Ubuntu > > amongst debian developers, and that Mark Shuttleworth has some doubts > > about working with DCC, although he is rather vague in my opinion. But > > what are the problems with Ubuntu? Is it an unecessary fork? Or is it > > not contributing back its changes to debian software? > > I think it's the pretending that pisses people off. IMHO, the border between contributing and employing people who also work on Debian is not entirely clear. How do you think Canonical could *better* work with Debian, ignoring whether they meet up to their promises at the moment or not. What would you like to see? And before you say: integrate stuff into Debian directly, not into Ubuntu and then expect others to backport, consider that we surely don't want everything in Debian that the Canonical folks stuff into Ubuntu... -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "in diving to the bottom of pleasure we bring up more gravel than pearls." -- honoré de balzac signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Development standards for unstable
also sprach Florian Weimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.12.1209 +0100]: > > If you'd like to make suggestions about ideas that would be useful, > > What about: stop threatening your fellow developers? Thanks, Anthony, for the heads-up. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! echo '[dO%O+38%O+PO/d0<0]Fi22os0CC4BA64E418CE7l0xAP' | dc signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
OT: quoting (was: Development standards for unstable)
also sprach Andreas Barth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.12.2135 +0100]: > * Frank Küster ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [060112 19:36]: > > Andreas Barth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > * Frank Küster ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [060112 18:11]: > > >> Andreas Barth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> > * Christoph Berg ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [060112 16:28]: > > >> >> Re: Thomas Viehmann in <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> come on, y'all! no reply necessary. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "for art to exist, for any sort of aesthetic activity or perception to exist, a certain physiological precondition is indispensable: intoxication." -- friedrich nietzsche signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: [ad-hominem construct deleted]
also sprach Matt Zimmerman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.17.0039 +0100]: > Ubuntu is a Debian derivative. The work that Debian developers do is merged > into Ubuntu as well. Most of the source packages in Ubuntu are identical to > the ones in Debian. The statement that you quoted is an expression of > gratitude and camaraderie. I believe it was Mark who originally said it, > but I agree with it. I would also say that Debian's upstreams are, in the s/Debian/Ubuntu > same sense, Debian developers. This is part of what makes free software so And yes, all of this makes sense. I guess the issue some DDs have with this model is that they aren't treated as Upstream because there's a lack of information exchange. Moreover, Ubuntu has moved ahead in a few areas, and Debian followed, which makes it difficult to think in simple upstream-downstream terms. Note that I don't hold the opinion, and I appreciate what Ubuntu is doing -- I am just trying to echo the picture as I see it. I concur that Scott's patches are not very useful since they have been clearly automatically generated and often include autogenerated files (see libhid for instance), but all in all, Ubuntu is a worthy addition to the distro field, and Debian has profitted *a lot* already: gcc4, python2.4, zope, xorg, you name it. > maintainer to notify them that their package is present in Ubuntu sounds > like spam to me, and posting Ubuntu-related announcements to Debian mailing ... not anymore than the migrated-to-testing-mails we get all the time. But anyway, we are not in need for more automated solutions. What should happen is that DDs should be able to find out who's responsible for their packages in Ubuntu, and the UD should treat the DD as upstream, discussing with her/him and planning out a strategy for changes. If a change is Ubuntu-specific, so be it. If it isn't, work with the DD to have it integrated into Debian. > The creation of Ubuntu was *very* widely publicized, as was the fact that it ... it's still not called "Debian for Humans" :) -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "education is an admirable thing, but it is well to remember from time to time that nothing that is worth knowing can be taught." -- oscar wilde signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: udev naming problems for eth*
also sprach Emilio Jesús Gallego Arias <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.18.1254
+0100]:
> As far as I can tell, network interface names are given by the
> kernel and they've nothing to do with udev.
>
> To get a stable naming you should use some package like ifrename.
ifrename is a hack and needed for 2.4 kernels only these days. udev
can certainly rename interfaces, though I don't know what the OP's
problem is. I'd suggest talking to a udev-related list, or at least
to debian-user, for this isn't really something to do with -devel.
Anyway, this is what I use on one of my machines, and it works like
a charm:
KERNEL="eth*", SYSFS{address}="00:10:dc:c8:85:07", NAME="lan"
I suggest not using NAME="ethX" because there may be name clashes.
Use a completely different name instead.
--
Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list!
.''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
: :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info
`. `'`
`- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system
Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver!
"if you are going to run a rinky-dink distro made by a couple of
volunteers, why not run a rinky-dink distro made by a lot of
volunteers?"
-- jaldhar h. vyas
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Re: KD-Tree library
also sprach Jacob Bensabat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.20.1703 +0100]: > Do you know about an implementation of libkdtree that works with > MS visual C++ (6.0 or 7.*) ? No. My library is ANSI C++ compatible. If MSVC can't handle that, there's another reaons why I've successfully avoided it for the past 10 years. Sorry. BTW: this has nothing to do with debian-devel, and even if, you don't need to CC me as I read the list. There's a libkdtree-users list on sourceforge. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! windoze is the one-night-stand of operating systems; you feel so cheap after having used it. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: NEWS.Debian abuse
also sprach Marco d'Itri <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.01.31.1936 +0100]: > Please remove the entry from NEWS.Debian and do not do this again. > Users should not care about who maintains the package. Why send this to debian-devel? I suggest talking to Chris directly first. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "we are like shop windows in which we are continually arranging, concealing or illuminating the supposed qualities other ascribe to us -- in order to deceive ourselves." - friedrich nietzsche signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Bug#350982: ITP: slimscrobbler -- SlimServer plugin that submits listening data to Last.FM
also sprach dann frazier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.02.0732 +0100]: > * Package name: slimscrobbler > Version : x.y.z > Upstream Author : Name <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > * URL : http://www.example.org/ > * License : (GPL, LGPL, BSD, MIT/X, etc.) > Description : SlimServer plugin that submits listening data to Last.FM > > (Include the long description here.) < peterS> #350982 is cute. < madduck> peterS: it's always longtimers who don't know how things are supposed to be done in debian. < peterS> madduck: and that always surprises me. (quoted with permission) -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! normaliser unix c'est comme pasteuriser le camembert. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Bug#351038: ITP: arpoison -- A program to send custom ARP packets
also sprach Pieter-Augustijn Van Malleghem <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.02.1403 +0100]: > (Include the long description here.) Maybe we could add some heuristic to debbugs to simply refuse incomplete requests/ITPs? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "our destiny exercises its influence over us even when, as yet, we have not learned its nature; it is our future that lays down the law of our today." - friedrich nietzsche signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: MIT License are DFSG complicant ?
also sprach José Carlos do Nascimento Medeiros <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.06.1746 +0100]: > I have a package (php-netcheckip) that was MIT licensed. > Debian suports this license ? Yes. http://wiki.debian.org/DFSGLicenses -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! la lune, c'est comme les canards il faut aimer caresser les chats pour avoir envie d'y aller. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Type1 fonts in Debian (was: TrueType fonts packages maintenance team proposal)
also sprach Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.20.1619 +0100]: > ... and sometimes in quite buggy versions. I don't recall the details > (but could look them up), but AFAIR the gsfonts package contains a > version of the URW fonts that has been labelled "experimental" and > actually is; especially in the Courier font there were severe problems. i recently purchased some non-free fonts and would like to make them into debian packages for internal use. Thus, I would be very interested in following such efforts to learn how to accomplish what i need. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "i started taking an online add test, linked from someone's blog. i never finished it; i got distracted, and clicked on random other shiny things" -- andres salomon signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Type1 fonts in Debian
also sprach Frank Küster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.20.1644 +0100]: > Hm, this is a general remark about a "font packaging/integration > policy", right? You hardly have bought non-free drop-in > replacements for Times, Helvetica, Courier and friends. But > Ralf's instructions were only for replacing these Base35 fonts. Ah, yes. General policy/instructions. Sorry. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "if builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization." -- gerald weinberg signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Ubuntu patches
also sprach Scott James Remnant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.21.1506 +0100]: > File a request here: > https://launchpad.net/products/nda/+addticket Scott, I appreciate your work and your mail to keep us up to date. It's good to see you back at the keys! This isn't a rant, but a serious wishlist request: if Canonical wants more cooperation from Debian developers, please do not make use go out of our ways, which means do not make use sign up with launchpad (I realise many are already), and let us use an email submissions service. I know I am preaching to the choir here, but maybe you can (once again) act as messenger and bring the Launchpad team's attention to this? > I hope that explains the situation well enough, if you have any > questions please ask me. Note that I'm not subscribed to this mailing > list, so you'll need to break list policy and Cc me on replies if you > want my attention. No breaking the policy; you requested it. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! humpty was pushed. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Ubuntu patches
also sprach Scott James Remnant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.21.1643 +0100]: > Launchpad does allow e-mail submission of support tickets and > bugs, but only if your e-mail address is registered against > a Launchpad account. I believe this is because they think it's > the best way to avoid spam (from both sides). Ah, this is new, or at least wasn't supported a year ago. Thanks for the info. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! apt-get source --compile gentoo signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: ITP: root -- An object oriented data analysis framework
also sprach Christian Holm Christensen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.23.1555 +0100]: > I intent to package this software for Debian. I think the package name is a little too broad. We already have three roots on Unix: / and the UID/GID 0. But it's an established software name. Maybe consider cern-root? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "all language designers are arrogant. goes with the territory..." -- larry wall signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Bug#325306: ITP: root -- An object oriented data analysis framework
also sprach Christian Holm Christensen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.23.1721 +0100]: > > also sprach Christian Holm Christensen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.02.23.1555 > > +0100]: > > What happened to Zaratustra? He's sitting up on the pole still. > > But it's an established software name. Maybe consider cern-root? > > For the meta-package, yes, but does it really matter? Also, > although the main development takes place at CERN, it would be > unfair to the large number of contributors from all over the world > to call it `cern-root'. Okay. I just wanted the issue thought over. I have no objections really. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "i wish i hadn't slept all day, it's really lowered my productivity" -- robert mcqueen signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: For those who care about stable updates
also sprach Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.09.1132 +0100]: > I'm sick of being left in the void. I'm sick of ftpmasters not > answering mails from the stable release manager to negotiate > a timeline. I'm sick of ftpmasters suddenly creating arbitrary > preconditions for stable updates. I'm sick of having to ask again > and again and being constantly blocked by them. Joey, I wonder where things are going now that you retract from various positions... LinuxTag won't ever be the same, and I always thought your handling of stable release updates was great. I am sorry to learn you had to fight so many battles doing it. It is sad to see you leave the stable release manager position because you don't see a solution to the problem. In the past, situations such as the one you got frustrated over, have happened within Debian in various places. Sometimes it's the ftpmasters, at other times it's the security team or DSA, and there are others. I don't blame you for pulling out at all. However, I am trying to appeal to your dedication to the project with the following request: As someone who has served (and continues to serve) on several core teams within Debian, would you be able to give us some insights into how the situation may be improved? You are tired of fighting the battles yourself. Even though you may have reasonable issues, very few people can step in to help because very few people know what's going on at the level of core infrastructural teams. Debian's core infrastructure is in the hands of very few people, who are often very busy. This results in bottlenecks, which have negatively affected the project several times in the past. Could you share with us your view on where the problem is, and what solutions you see? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "we have a firm commitment to nato, we are a part of nato. we have a firm commitment to europe. we are a part of europe." - george w. bush signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: NEW queue backing up again -- ftpmasters, any explanation or comment?
also sprach Olaf van der Spek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.13.1101 +0100]: > Has that not been announced in any public place? Not that I know. I got this information in the "hallway track" during FOSDEM. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "wickedness is a myth invented by good people to account for the curious attraction of others." -- oscar wilde signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: NEW queue backing up again -- ftpmasters, any explanation or comment?
also sprach Petter Reinholdtsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.13.0752 +0100]: > Could be, but I believe I heard that most NEW processing is done > by one of the assistants while the mirror split is done by someone > else. The mirror split is a complicated endeavour. From what I understood, the NEW queue was put on hold on purpose until the split is complete. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "all i know is that i'm being sued for unfair business practices by micro$oft. hello pot? it's kettle on line two." -- michael robertson signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: removal of svenl from the project
also sprach Gustavo Franco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.15.1512 +0100]: > It seems that the project is splitting in two groups basically: > The people that wants to work together and release Etch, and the > people that with a reason or not wants to see it delayed. The > minute after the release team announces that we're going to delay > our next release, we will stop with these weird threads and keep > arguing that we're all volunteers and are doing our best. oh, the > humanity! > > I'm asking myself what's behind all that ? Ubuntu ? Probably no. > Subconcious fear to delivery in time ? Probably yes. Stop thinking > about who you're going to ask to be expelled next and spend some > time considering not my words, but just Etch. Thank you! -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! security at micro$oft: how do we secure a billion dollar profit? signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
removing logfiles on purge
Hi all, Chapter 10.8 of our policy says that log files "should be" removed when a package is removed. I am writing this email to gather feedback prior to proposing that this be changed. Especially in the EU, I can imaging several situations in which removing the log files during package purge can put the administrator into an undefined (== unpleasant) legal situation. If you've ever administered a production machine with hundreds of users, you'll treat log files as valuable data. You'll kick and scream if they get removed from under your fingers. Why does the policy say that log files should be removed? What are the reasons against leaving them around? Thanks for any comments. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! it is ok to let your mind go blank, but please turn off the sound. signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: Bug#355443: please don't
also sprach Yaroslav Halchenko <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.16.0117 +0100]: > Dear DDs, Ah, sorry for all the noise, dear debian-devel. > Is my interpretation of Debian policy correct and I do have to > remove log files on purge? or there is a flexibility in > interpretation? Yaroslav, Your interpretation is more or less correct, although the wording in the policy is a bit fuzzy. I do not think that that log files should ever be removed. But as the last hour on IRC and [0] showed, at least three people disagree with me, so I am outnumbered. 0. http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/03/msg00688.html Thus, I am closing the bug. Sorry for the noise. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "women love us for our defects. if we have enough of them, they will forgive us everything, even our gigantic intellects." -- oscar wilde signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
Re: removing logfiles on purge
also sprach Marco d'Itri <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2006.03.16.0050 +0100]: > Then they should backup them before purging the package. Sure. > > If you've ever administered a production machine with hundreds > > of users, you'll treat log files as valuable data. You'll kick > > and scream if they get removed from under your fingers. > But when I purge a package I expect that log files will be > deleted. Hard to argue against that. This issue is becoming more minor the more I think about it. The main two problematic areas are mail and web. Removing the MTA will not purge mail.log, and any sensible web setup will have separate log files for virtual hosts, so it's less likely to affect people. Sorry, but the thought did strike me at the time I wrote the message, especially after seeing #355443 and remembering talking to Lars precisely about this issue at FOSDEM. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer and author: http://debiansystem.info `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP (sub)keys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! "it is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -- aristoteles signature.asc Description: Digital signature (GPG/PGP)
advice on a patch set
Hi all, I am trying to package the swsusp2 kernel patch, which comes in hundred little files. My thought was to simply concat these files into one large patch for use with kpatches... however, this does not work because some files are created by early patches and later modified. Since kpatches first tests the patch with --dry-run, it will fail when the later patches do not find a file to patch. What can I do? Is there a tool that can merge multiple patches into a single patch in a "recursive" manner (i.e. to produce the smallest patch that has the same result)? combinediff looks promising, but the approach I tried... 1 + 2 -> A A + 3 -> B B + 4 -> C ... did not work (it can only merge pairs). Thanks for any help. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: advice on a patch set
also sprach Jay Berkenbilt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.26.1724 +0100]: > Any reason you can't just make a copy of the unpatched source, apply > all the patches, and then diff -urN the original with the patched > version to create a fresh patch? Test by applying the newly created > patch with the original to make sure that your patch and the original > patch set produce the same result. also sprach Fabio Tranchitella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.26.1730 +0100]: > Hi Martin, why don't you apply all the patches to a clean kernel source > tree, and then diff that source tree from the original one? Obviously this is an option. However, I would prefer to ship the original patch within the source package, rather than a patch I created specifically for Debian. Also, it's much less work in the future if I can just drop in new versions of the patch without having to go through the process of patching and diffing the kernel source. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: advice on a patch set
also sprach Goswin von Brederlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.26.1754 +0100]: > Why not just put all the patches into > /usr/src/kernel-patches/swsusp2 and apply them in order? Because I like reusing wheels (as in: dh-kpatches) and it does not really allow multiple patches, surely not one hundred of them. Sure, I can make a custom kernel patch package without kpatches, but then I'd have to write apply and unapply scripts too. Why bother when kpatches does so already? -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: advice on a patch set
also sprach Goswin von Brederlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.26.2054 +0100]: > Improve kpatches to cope with multiple patches. Uh, yeah. When I get a free minute. > Just think of the hassle you have on updates when one of the > hundred files change and you have to remake the full patchfile > each time. cat does so for me automatically as part of the package's build target. > It's a lot easier to follow if you have the original upstream > sources to work with directly. Right, which is what I am trying to do. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#292479: ITP: kernel-patch-swsusp2 -- software suspend 2 for linux kernel patch
Package: wnpp Severity: wishlist @Bernard, I intend to package swsusp2 for Debian, just letting you know... * Package name: kernel-patch-swsusp2 Version : 2.1.5.15 Upstream Author : Bernard Blackham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> * URL : http://softwaresuspend.berlios.de * License : GPL Description : software suspend 2 for linux kernel patch Software Suspend is most easily described as the Linux equivalent of Windows' hibernate functionality. It saves the contents of memory to disk and powers down. When the computer is started up again, it reloads the contents and the user can continue from where they left off. No documents need to be reloaded or applications reopened and the process is much faster than a normal shutdown and start up. Packages should be available from http://people.debian.org/~madduck/packages/stage/kernel-patch-swsusp2 sometime today. -- System Information: Debian Release: 3.1 APT prefers testing APT policy: (600, 'testing'), (98, 'unstable'), (1, 'experimental') Architecture: i386 (i686) Kernel: Linux 2.6.10-1-k7 Locale: LANG=en_GB, LC_CTYPE=en_GB.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) -- .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: advice on a patch set
also sprach Cameron Patrick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.27.1045 +0100]: > Have you considered just using Bernard's apply script that is > included with the upstream swsusp package? I'm pretty sure it > takes care of testing with --dry-run and backing out previous > patches if one of them fails. Good idea, I will try this. Right now, my custom solution works. But you are right, stupid me not to have thought of this before... -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#292479: ITP: kernel-patch-swsusp2 -- software suspend 2 for linux kernel patch
also sprach Brian Nelson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.27.1301 +0100]: > Isn't Nigel Cunningham the primary author? Apparently. I have had a hard time to find this information on the webpage... therefore I took a guess. I seems that Nigel is the author and Bernard the webmaster. I have written to both. > Also, Bernard is in the NM queue, though he's been on hold for > quite a while... Okay, well, tough luck for him. That said, he can take over the package when he's a DD. I need it now, but I don't insist on maintaining it. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Bug#292479: ITP: kernel-patch-swsusp2 -- software suspend 2 for linux kernel patch
also sprach Matthew Garrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2005.01.27.1613 +0100]: > > Okay, well, tough luck for him. That said, he can take over the > > package when he's a DD. I need it now, but I don't insist on > > maintaining it. > > I'm curious - what functionality do you need that isn't present in the > stock kernel? swsusp in the stock kernel is very unstable. I have had better experience with swsusp2. That's all. -- Please do not send copies of list mail to me; I read the list! .''`. martin f. krafft <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : :' :proud Debian developer, admin, user, and author `. `'` `- Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing a system Invalid/expired PGP subkeys? Use subkeys.pgp.net as keyserver! signature.asc Description: Digital signature
